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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 3 to 27 of 95. Go back in thread:
Posted by Phillipa on November 16, 2008, at 13:17:32
In reply to Anti-Semitism (Please Read), posted by Dena on November 15, 2008, at 19:27:59
I don't get it as I'm friends with Lou. My neighbors are Jewish dated Jewish men never once did anyone mention religion and lots of babblers are of the Jewish Faith. And I'm of German decent and have been to Dauchau and not it's a horrible thing that happened there. Sophies Choice to Movie was the most horrible movie ever saw. I guess I would be considered Arian in Germany if it were World War 11 but that was before I was born and 62 now. Sorry you feel others are anti-semetic I for one am not. Love Phillipa
Posted by Dena on November 16, 2008, at 14:54:27
In reply to Please be civil » Dena, posted by Deputy Dinah on November 16, 2008, at 11:52:55
> > I've watched over the years as Lou has steadfastly taken on anti-Semitism seemingly single-handedly -- only to be met, over and over, with blatant denials of any such intolerance happening. It sounds a whole heck of a lot like, "The Holocaust didn't really happen, so get over it and quit making such a big deal out of this."
> >
> > I've seen Lou handle these encounters with kindness, patience, and far more graciousness than he's been given. He's asked repeatedly for justice, for a response, for an acknowledgment that he's been heard -- only to be met with ridicule, shunning, patronizing comments, and even disrespectful silence.
> >
> > He's been shut down ad nauseam, while others are allowed to get away with the very same things he's been accused of.
>
> Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down. Please don't jump to conclusions about others.
>
> Your passion for justice and desire to support Lou is admirable. But Dr. Bob asks that such passion be expressed within the boundaries of the civility guidelines of this site.
>
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
>
> You might wish to email Dr. Bob with your concerns about older posts. His email is on the bottom of each page, and he is the only one in a position to address them at this point, as I've explained to you in previous posts.
>
> If you believe any more recent posts to be in violation of the civility guidelines, please use the contact administrators function on the bottom of each posting page to contact Administration directly. This is the current site procedure.
>
> Follow-ups regarding these issues, as well as replies to the above posts, should of course themselves be civil.
>
> Dr. Bob is always free to override deputy decisions. His email is on the bottom of each page. Please feel free to email him if you believe this decision was made in error.
>
> Dinah, acting as deputy to Dr. Bob
>
>
>
Could you explain, please, how my post was less than civil? Of whom did I make accusations? Who could feel put down when no one is mentioned? I made no assumptions -- my comments are based on observations of realities that have occurred over the years.Shalom, Dena
Posted by Deputy Dinah on November 16, 2008, at 15:17:54
In reply to Re: Please be civil » Deputy Dinah, posted by Dena on November 16, 2008, at 14:54:27
> Could you explain, please, how my post was less than civil? Of whom did I make accusations? Who could feel put down when no one is mentioned? I made no assumptions -- my comments are based on observations of realities that have occurred over the years.
Even if you do not name any specific posters, you still need to phrase your views of what has happened over the years in such a way as to not lead others, including unnamed others or group others, to feel accused or put down.
Dinah, acting as deputy to Dr. Bob
Posted by Dena on November 16, 2008, at 15:23:43
In reply to Explanation » Dena, posted by Deputy Dinah on November 16, 2008, at 15:17:54
So ... I should have *thanked* others for putting up with anti-Semitic statements and ignoring someone who was trying to rectify that...?
How does one point out an injustice in such a way that would not potentially lead someone to feel put down..?
And, are we not responsible for our own choices...? I can choose how to receive a criticism -- either as something constructive, or I can take it personally (& thus not learn).
Again, how does someone on this forum point out an injustice, for the good of everyone?
Shalom, Dena
Posted by Deputy Dinah on November 16, 2008, at 15:48:32
In reply to Re: Explanation, posted by Dena on November 16, 2008, at 15:23:43
Pointing out what you perceive to be injustice would be very difficult to do under the civility guidelines of this site. Since pointing out what you believe are injustices committed by other members of this site could lead them to feel accused or put down.
It might be better to address your concerns to Dr. Bob. Emails to Dr. Bob do not need to follow site guidelines, in my experience at least.
Also, you could consult with those who are familiar with civility guidelines prior to posting.
However, as the FAQ state,
Different points of view are fine, and in fact encouraged, but your freedom of speech is limited here. It can be therapeutic to express yourself, but this isn't necessarily the place.
Dinah, acting as deputy to Dr. Bob
Posted by Sigismund on November 16, 2008, at 18:18:11
In reply to Anti-Semitism (Please Read), posted by Dena on November 15, 2008, at 19:27:59
The Semitic peoples include the Arab peoples, on whom displaced antisemitism has come to rest.
It is OK to use 'Islamofascism' here, but I'd be very careful about talking about the Christianist or Jewish forms of it.
Posted by Sigismund on November 16, 2008, at 18:35:16
In reply to Re: Anti-Semitism (Please Read), posted by Sigismund on November 16, 2008, at 18:18:11
As I see it the monotheistic (and for all I know some other) religions make exclusive claims, which, when repeated, can be hurtful to some people.
And as that is the nature of our reality there is nothing much we can do about it.But if Lou were to post exclusive claims revealed to him, I feel confident that it would be OK, in spite of the fact that he has been told otherwise.
The content of Lou's revelation is poetic and benign, surely?
That's how I see it.
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 18, 2008, at 12:27:33
In reply to Re: Anti-Semitism (Please Read), posted by Sigismund on November 16, 2008, at 18:35:16
Friends,
If you are considering responding here in this thread, or parallel threads, I would like for you to consider the following link's contents.
In the first link, Mr. Hsiung agrees that by him not addressing a post that could , let's say, arrouse anti-Semitic feelings, or have the potential to lead a Jew to feel put down or accused, that there is the potential for some to think that it is OK to post such here. He also states that since that is true, that he should doo more in situations like that. This was in December, 2004 when he posted that. (citation negtrt-13)
Then Mr. Hsiung posts that if something is brought to his attention and he does nothing about it, that he agrees that it means that what is in question that is brought to his attention is not against the rules of the forum here.
He also posts that he takes responsibility for what he posts, though. (citation negtrt 12)
Now I ask for that these statementsd by Mr. Hsiung be also incorporated in making your own determination about the issues involved here and I think that if you do so, that you could post a more informed response.
Lou
citation negtrt 13
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20041109/msgs/424336.html
citation negtrt 12
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20041109/msgs/423771.html
Posted by LostBoyinNCBecksDark on November 18, 2008, at 20:42:50
In reply to Anti-Semitism (Please Read), posted by Dena on November 15, 2008, at 19:27:59
I will say this much. A lot of the reason why better strides have not been made regarding treating severe mental illness has to do with the fact psychiatry was sidetracked for fifty years with Freudian psychobabble. jews jumped all over the Freud bandwagon and many in the mental health field are jewish. Many jews are strong believers in the environment versus genetics and biology when it comes to the subject of severe mental illness and this stems from the fact that jews tend to be leftist (thats a hard fact BTW), tend to vote Democrat, are more liberal than most other folks and like I said, many are STRONG believers in environment versus genes.
Its my belief that had psychiatry taken a more Neurology approach and not gotten sidetracked with what the Germans called "jewish science" AKA Freudian crappola, that some of us might be living better lives today thru better brain science.
Not all jews are *ssh*l*s, but too many of them are. I suspect its because of the way the world has treated them over the centuries. You might be an *ssh*l* too if you had been persecuted the way theyve been persecuted. Still, being persecuted religiously and politically does not give them the right for them to cop the bad attitude so many of them have.
And again, their overriding emphasis on the environment and negative early childhood experiences (Freud) doesnt help the rest of us with serious psychiatric problems.
LostBoyinNC
Posted by Deputy Dinah on November 18, 2008, at 20:57:45
In reply to Re: jews and psychiatry, posted by LostBoyinNCBecksDark on November 18, 2008, at 20:42:50
> Not all jews are *ssh*l*s, but too many of them are.
Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down.
You've been blocked before for violation of site guidelines, and per my calculations, this block will be for the maximum of one year.
If this is incorrect, Dr. Bob will correct it.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues, as well as replies to the above posts, should of course themselves be civil.
Dr. Bob is always free to override deputy decisions. His email is on the bottom of each page. Please feel free to email him if you believe this decision was made in error.
Dinah, acting as deputy to Dr. Bob
Posted by Sigismund on November 18, 2008, at 22:44:51
In reply to Re: jews and psychiatry, posted by LostBoyinNCBecksDark on November 18, 2008, at 20:42:50
For all its drawbacks and therapeutic limitations, psychoanalysis was one of the great achievements of the C20.
Posted by Dena on November 19, 2008, at 0:24:56
In reply to Blocked for a year » LostBoyinNCBecksDark, posted by Deputy Dinah on November 18, 2008, at 20:57:45
Thank you, Dinah, for that.
Shalom, Dena
Posted by BayLeaf on November 19, 2008, at 6:16:28
In reply to Blocked for a year » LostBoyinNCBecksDark, posted by Deputy Dinah on November 18, 2008, at 20:57:45
Thank you Dinah!
Posted by yxibow on November 19, 2008, at 8:27:10
In reply to My Vote for Best Block of 2008 » Deputy Dinah, posted by BayLeaf on November 19, 2008, at 6:16:28
Shalom aleichem.
I've never heard of so much anti-semitism.
Does one know why there is a brain-trust that happens to be partially Jewish in this country?
Because the last people, the generation of my ancestor line, to get out of Europe were not just peddlers and the like, they were scientists fleeing Europe and persecution.
I'm happy to have had an inventor for a Grandfather I never got to see because of heart conditions who would be proud of me.
New waves of immigration came from Russia and Iran fleeing after the Shah was overthrown.These aren't the only reasons but they are plenty of them for those who didn't make aliyah (become Jewish citizens of the state of Israel) and landed on our hopefully welcome shores. It wasn't a welcome time for some.
Anyway I digress, there is intelligence among all faiths in this country, doctors, etc, I'm just saying if one thinks there is a disproportional amount in one area, maybe there is a demographic reason.I encourage anyone to watch the Jewish Americans if they are interested in general faith and more importantly culture movies. Very well done PBS series.
Shalom.
-- Jay
Posted by Phillipa on November 19, 2008, at 12:25:36
In reply to Re: My Vote for Best Block of 2008 » BayLeaf, posted by yxibow on November 19, 2008, at 8:27:10
Didn't know that about Freud as he lived in Vienna Austria was there once and wanted to visit his home. Digressing her. Shalom from me too Love Phillipa
Posted by Sigismund on November 19, 2008, at 15:18:18
In reply to Re: My Vote for Best Block of 2008 » BayLeaf, posted by yxibow on November 19, 2008, at 8:27:10
That was awful and upsetting.
Thank you, Dinah.
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 19, 2008, at 16:01:24
In reply to Re: My Vote for Best Block of 2008 » BayLeaf, posted by yxibow on November 19, 2008, at 8:27:10
Friends,
If you are considering posting in this thread or a parallel thread, I am requesting that you click on the offered link here that brings up a thread for your examination.
I think that if you do, that there could be more understanding of the issues involved here which are comming out in this thread that may have been unbeknownst to some.
I would like for those interested in my perspective to email me if they like after reading the thread in question via this link.
Lou
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20041109/msgs/429282.html
Posted by obsidian on November 19, 2008, at 16:27:51
In reply to Re: jews and psychiatry, posted by LostBoyinNCBecksDark on November 18, 2008, at 20:42:50
wow...geez man
you really think that?As most everyone knows Freud was a neurologist, and I don't think that his departure to psychoanalysis made him leave it all behind
I think he really did try to understand the ways that things can manifest themselves physically as well as mentallyA lot of what is written about these days regarding neuroscience is not necessarily in contrast to freudian theories
"The Right Brain and the Unconscious"
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 19, 2008, at 16:59:13
In reply to Lou's response to aspects-phawstrheht, posted by Lou Pilder on November 19, 2008, at 16:01:24
Friends,
If you are considering responding here, I am requesting that you examine the thread that the following post brings up. If you could, I think that there could be a better understanding of the issues involved here.
Lou
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20041012/msgs/402039.html
and also;
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20041012/msgs/405068.html
Posted by Deputy 10derHeart on November 19, 2008, at 17:22:37
In reply to Lou's response to aspects-hudou, posted by Lou Pilder on November 19, 2008, at 16:59:13
a friendly caution for all....
While support and understanding of deputy actions is always *much* appreciated, please keep in mind that the guidelines apply to everyone, including blocked posters.
Posts which could be interpreted as 'celebrating' a block, or negatively characterizing what the blocked poster wrote, are likely to be in violation of the civility guidelines.
Any discussions of Freud or other non-administrative topics, should be held on the appropriate board(s).
Thanks in advance for helping keep Babble civil and [somewhat!?] organized...
-- 10der
Posted by BayLeaf on November 19, 2008, at 19:31:52
In reply to Please remember guidelines/keep it administrative, posted by Deputy 10derHeart on November 19, 2008, at 17:22:37
It is certainly worth the possibility of a block to do the right thing.
What we saw was vile hate speech - which should never be tolerated. I can't help but express gratitude that it was quickly stopped.
We complain a lot here. It seems to me that we should express thanks when appropriate as well. :-)
Bay
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 19, 2008, at 20:43:40
In reply to Re: Please remember guidelines/keep it administrative » Deputy 10derHeart, posted by BayLeaf on November 19, 2008, at 19:31:52
> It is certainly worth the possibility of a block to do the right thing.
>
> What we saw was vile hate speech - which should never be tolerated. I can't help but express gratitude that it was quickly stopped.
>
> We complain a lot here. It seems to me that we should express thanks when appropriate as well. :-)
>
> BayBay,
You wrote,[...do the right thing...hate speech..never be tolerated...]
The aspect of tolerating generally means to allow without sanction.
Hate speech is generally directed at groups of people. This could include racism which could include anti-Semitism.
I would like for interested members here to examine the thread that the following link brings up and email me if you like concerning the Law of Moses and how the Jews worship their God concerning that, and if you are going to post in this thread to consider the aspects in the thread that the post in the link brings up.
Lou
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20070702/msgs/776479.html
lpilder_1188@fuse.net
Posted by Deputy 10derHeart on November 19, 2008, at 21:53:00
In reply to Re: Please remember guidelines/keep it administrative » Deputy 10derHeart, posted by BayLeaf on November 19, 2008, at 19:31:52
> It is certainly worth the possibility of a block to do the right thing.
Yes, everyone makes their choices, as each new situation dictates and according to their own conscience. I understand that.
> What we saw was vile hate speech
However, as Dr. Bob asks that the civility rules be applied to *all* posters, and the FAQ remind us "free speech is limited here," I'm going to ask you not to post anything that could lead others to feel accused and put down.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternate ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow ups regarding these issues should be directed to Admin, and should of course, be civil. Dr. Bob has oversight over deputy decisions, and he may choose a different action.
> We complain a lot here. It seems to me that we should express thanks when appropriate as well. :-)
Thank you, BayLeaf.
--10derHeart, acting as deputy for Dr. Bob
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 21, 2008, at 4:52:55
In reply to Please be civil » BayLeaf, posted by Deputy 10derHeart on November 19, 2008, at 21:53:00
> > It is certainly worth the possibility of a block to do the right thing.
>
> Yes, everyone makes their choices, as each new situation dictates and according to their own conscience. I understand that.
>
> > What we saw was vile hate speech
>
> However, as Dr. Bob asks that the civility rules be applied to *all* posters, and the FAQ remind us "free speech is limited here," I'm going to ask you not to post anything that could lead others to feel accused and put down.
>
> If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternate ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
>
> Follow ups regarding these issues should be directed to Admin, and should of course, be civil. Dr. Bob has oversight over deputy decisions, and he may choose a different action.
>
> > We complain a lot here. It seems to me that we should express thanks when appropriate as well. :-)
>
> Thank you, BayLeaf.
>
> --10derHeart, acting as deputy for Dr. BobDeputy 10derHeart,
I am unsure as to your rationale for what you have posted here to Bayleaf.
You wrote to what Bayleaf posted in,[...to do the right thing...]
[[Yes...I understand that...]]
I am unsure as to if you are wanting to mean that what BayLeaf posted is unacceptsble to you in relation to the guidlines of the forum or not and if it is not acceptab;e to you, could you post here a citation of the part of the TOS that BayLeaf's statement falls under to be unacceptable to you? If you could, then I could have the opportunity to respond accordingly, for it is unclear to me why you cited Bayleaf's statement when your subject line is concerning asking the member to be civil.
In Bayleaf's statement that is something like,[...What is seen...], you posted to Bayleaf's statement,[[...I'm going to ask you not to post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down...]].
I am unsure as to who the {others} could be in your statement here and what the criteria are that you used to write that the statemnt could lead another or others to feel accused or put down. Could you identify the {others}, and the criteria used, that are in your thinking by listing those here? If you could, then I could have a better understanding of why you posted to the forum here your statement in question concerning that BayLeaf identified what she thinks could be seen. And if that is done here, then I could also try to determine as to if there is or is not a question in your mind as to if what BayLeaf posted as to what could be seen is self-evident to you or not and then respond accordingly as to why Bayleaf is told by you to not post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down.
Lou Pilder
Posted by Deputy 10derHeart on November 21, 2008, at 13:34:44
In reply to Lou's request for identification/rationale » Deputy 10derHeart, posted by Lou Pilder on November 21, 2008, at 4:52:55
Sorry if the format of my post was confusing, Lou.
This:
> What we saw was vile hate speech
is the portion I was indicating was uncivil. Any negative characterization of what a poster posts is generally considered uncivil.
Hope that clarifies things.
-- 10derHeart
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