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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 24 to 48 of 60. Go back in thread:
Posted by 10derHeart on April 19, 2005, at 22:13:13
In reply to Re: You're welcome, posted by alexandra_k on April 19, 2005, at 21:47:30
>>Am I digging myself in or out???
...just as long as you're here diggin'!
You go, girl!
Oh how I missed that sharp wit...! <big grin>
Posted by 10derHeart on April 19, 2005, at 22:22:09
In reply to You're welcome, posted by Dinah on April 19, 2005, at 16:52:14
I didn't think of it that way, but I see your potential conflict.
I have felt free to act before, as you know.
I will do it again, no doubt.Just lack of clear thoughts and low energy today stopped me, really. And you were quicker, too.
Thanks for the affirmation, though.
Posted by alexandra_k on April 19, 2005, at 22:23:29
In reply to Re:Oh, it doesn't matter... » alexandra_k, posted by 10derHeart on April 19, 2005, at 22:13:13
... And you guys are making me HIGH
oh wait, maybe its me meds ;-)
almost time for my afternoon nap <yawn>
no doubt you guys are getting ready for bed.
No doubt things will return to normal.
I think we need a form here for people to apply for leave ;-)
Just so everyone is accounted for and no-one goes AWOL.
Gee I am in a silly mood today
:-D
(must be that psychosis...)
Posted by Dinah on April 19, 2005, at 22:27:55
In reply to Re: You're welcome » Dinah, posted by 10derHeart on April 19, 2005, at 22:22:09
And I'm sure you'll do it in an exquisitely civil way, thus making sure the thread doesn't meet the formal escalation criteria. :-)
Everyone's been doing a great job of that lately. Answering posts with such restraint and civility that it's rare indeed for a thread to contain more than one post that meet the technical grounds for incivility.
Thanks, you guys!!
Posted by Phillipa on April 19, 2005, at 22:40:18
In reply to Re: Love is a drug..., posted by alexandra_k on April 19, 2005, at 22:23:29
Glad to hearing you sound so well Alexandra. Whoops I hope it's okay to say this. Well, meaning good, great, wonderful. I'm still not sure if it's okay. So if it's not a let's be civil to me by me okay? And call it even! I'm tired too. No nap. It's bedtime EST. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by alexandra_k on April 20, 2005, at 4:52:04
In reply to Re: Love is a drug..., posted by Phillipa on April 19, 2005, at 22:40:18
Night night Phillipa
Sleep well
Sweet dreams
I am feeling a lot better
Thanks.
Bring on another civil day tomorrow, ho!
:-)
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 20, 2005, at 13:40:07
In reply to Re: Lou's post. » Maxime, posted by Aryan Soldier on April 19, 2005, at 18:43:07
> Unfortunately
When you're blocked, you're not supposed to post, so I'm going to double its duration and delete that other post.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 20, 2005, at 18:51:37
In reply to Lou's request to Dr. Hsiung, posted by Lou Pilder on April 18, 2005, at 14:50:42
> I am requesting that you write what the difference is
I'm not sure, can you give me links to the other statements?
Bob
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 21, 2005, at 15:31:50
In reply to Re: Lou's request, posted by Dr. Bob on April 20, 2005, at 18:51:37
> > I am requesting that you write what the difference is
>
> I'm not sure, can you give me links to the other statements?
>
> Bob
DR. Hsiung,
You wrote in the above that you would like the link to the posts in question. Here is the link for the post from dancingstar.
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20050217/msgs/460440.html
In her post, she writes that she has a belief. Is what you wrote saying that her belief does not respect the views of others? If so, then comparing the post in question with the post by dancingstar, could that post also fall in the same catagory? If not, could you clarify what the difference is between the two posts?
In considering your reply, could you consider that dancingstar is stateing her point of view in the discussion and that your FAQ writes that different points of view are encouraged? Also, there are many doctors and psychiatrists that do not prescribe to the chemical imbalance theory of psychiatry.
Lou Pilder
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 21, 2005, at 15:54:09
In reply to Lou's reply to Dr. Hsiung's reply » Dr. Bob, posted by Lou Pilder on April 21, 2005, at 15:31:50
> > > I am requesting that you write what the difference is
> >
> > I'm not sure, can you give me links to the other statements?
> >
> > Bob
> DR. Hsiung,
> You wrote in the above that you would like the link to the posts in question. Here is the link for the post from dancingstar.
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20050217/msgs/460440.html
> In her post, she writes that she has a belief. Is what you wrote saying that her belief does not respect the views of others? If so, then comparing the post in question with the post by dancingstar, could that post also fall in the same catagory? If not, could you clarify what the difference is between the two posts?
> In considering your reply, could you consider that dancingstar is stateing her point of view in the discussion and that your FAQ writes that different points of view are encouraged? Also, there are many doctors and psychiatrists that do not prescribe to the chemical imbalance theory of psychiatry.
> Lou Pilder
>
Dr. Hsiung,
In the post that I have requested for your detrmination as to its acceptability in comparison with dancingstar's post, it writes,[...I believe strongly that western medicine does more harm than good...]
Dancingstar's post writes,[...Personally, I do not believe that it is a "problem" with "symptoms or a "diagnosis"...]
You write to dancingstar,[...please respect the views of others and be sensitive to their feelings...].
Now if you are saying that dancinstar's point of view , since it is different than the person taking chemicals into their body that she writes,[...proves to be poisonous...]is a point of view that is deserving that the poster that writes that point of view be expelled from this community, then are you saying that in your FAQ in relation to[...different points of view are encouraged...], that the point of view that says that there is proof that psychotropic drugs are poisonous is a point of view that can not be written here? If so, could you put that in your FAQ?
In looking at the other post, is it not also saying that the medicine practiced in the west does more harm than good?
Lou Pilder
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20050413/msgs/485616.html
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 21, 2005, at 21:59:08
In reply to Lou's request to Dr. Hsiung, posted by Lou Pilder on April 18, 2005, at 14:50:42
> In the following post, the poster writes
> > I believe strongly that western medicine does more harm than good, and that more holistic approaches like the one you've found make much more sense, both physically, emotionally, and spiritually.
> I am requesting that you write what the difference is that could allow that statement to be acceptable here, if it is acceptable here, in relation to the guidlines of the forum, while the ststement
> > > I may have had situational/atypical depression when I was young, but I took strong anti-depressants.
> >
> > Personally, I do not believe that it is a "problem," with "symptoms" or "a diagnosis."> has been written by you as to be unacceptable here
One difference is that in the former, the other poster's being supported, while in the latter, she isn't...
Bob
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 22, 2005, at 6:03:43
In reply to Re: Lou's request, posted by Dr. Bob on April 21, 2005, at 21:59:08
> > In the following post, the poster writes
>
> > > I believe strongly that western medicine does more harm than good, and that more holistic approaches like the one you've found make much more sense, both physically, emotionally, and spiritually.
>
> > I am requesting that you write what the difference is that could allow that statement to be acceptable here, if it is acceptable here, in relation to the guidlines of the forum, while the ststement
>
> > > > I may have had situational/atypical depression when I was young, but I took strong anti-depressants.
> > >
> > > Personally, I do not believe that it is a "problem," with "symptoms" or "a diagnosis."
>
> > has been written by you as to be unacceptable here
>
> One difference is that in the former, the other poster's being supported, while in the latter, she isn't...
>
> BobDR. Hsiung,
In your above reply, you wrote that one of the statements in question supports the other poster while the other does not.
The goals of the forum are for support and education. Your FAQ writes that,[...different points of view are encouraged...].
Is not, then, a different point of view supportive by the nature of the goals of the forum?
Are you saying that reinforcment is the same as support? If so, then are you saying that different points of view are not supportive unless they are the same point of view?
Lou Pilder
Posted by AuntieMel on April 22, 2005, at 14:12:28
In reply to Re: Lou's request, posted by Dr. Bob on April 21, 2005, at 21:59:08
I don't see any difference in language, and you've mentioned before it's difficult to judge intent.
The one you found uncivil:
>>> Personally, I do not believe that it is a "problem," with "symptoms" or "a diagnosis."
was taken out of context. It was followed by
>>>I believe that this is and always has been a part of being alive. There are tears and laughter in every life. It is very recent to treat these tears as if they were a problem, though I'm not opposed to finding cures for things.
This was in response to:
>>>A person w/ situational/atypical depression is sad, cries, or grieves for a situation in their life, that may be fleeting, and not necessarily a situation in their brain.
So - I didn't think that saying she thought that crying and grieving in response to a life situation was a problem or needed a diagnosis was unsupportive at all. I would even venture to guess most people on the planet would agree.....
Not trying to be a pain, but I would like to understand the difference, too.
Posted by Gabbi-x-2 on April 22, 2005, at 15:04:44
In reply to Please be civil » Aryan Soldier, posted by Dinah on April 19, 2005, at 19:22:26
You know it cracks me up when someone whose posting name is "Aryan Soldier" asks someone else if they have mental problems..
Posted by Sarah T. on April 23, 2005, at 0:25:32
In reply to Re: Please be civil-Aryan Soldier, posted by Gabbi-x-2 on April 22, 2005, at 15:04:44
The word "Aryan" has several different meanings, not just the one meaning "Nordic" that was exploited by Nazis.
Posted by Gabbi-x-2 on April 23, 2005, at 0:28:01
In reply to Re: Please be civil-Aryan Soldier » Gabbi-x-2, posted by Sarah T. on April 23, 2005, at 0:25:32
> The word "Aryan" has several different meanings, not just the one meaning "Nordic" that was exploited by Nazis.
I'm aware of that, ( I know about the swaztika too!) I was referring to it in the context in which it was used.
Posted by Gabbi-x-2 on April 23, 2005, at 0:31:25
In reply to Re: Please be civil-Aryan Soldier » Gabbi-x-2, posted by Sarah T. on April 23, 2005, at 0:25:32
> The word "Aryan" has several different meanings, not just the one meaning "Nordic" that was exploited by Nazis.
Members of the Aryan Nations, the white supremist group refer to fellow klansmen as "aryan soldiers"
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 23, 2005, at 16:30:39
In reply to Re: I don't see a difference » Dr. Bob, posted by AuntieMel on April 22, 2005, at 14:12:28
> I didn't think that saying she thought that crying and grieving in response to a life situation was a problem ... was unsupportive at all.
But she said she thought it was *not* a problem, didn't she?
Bob
Posted by 10derHeart on April 23, 2005, at 16:52:07
In reply to Re: I don't see a difference, posted by Dr. Bob on April 23, 2005, at 16:30:39
> But she said she thought it was *not* a problem, didn't she?
>
> Bob
Just my 2 cents...that's also how I read it - as her saying those behaviors are *not* a problem.
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 23, 2005, at 17:22:22
In reply to Re: I don't see a difference, posted by Dr. Bob on April 23, 2005, at 16:30:39
Dr. Hsiung,
You wrote,[...she said she thought it was not a problem...].
Are you saying that a person here can not write that they think it is not a problem?
Here is the whole statement by dancingstar.
She wrote,[...Personally, I do not believe that it is a "problem" with "symptoms" or a "diagnosis"...]
Is it not that statement by dancingstar saying that it is her point of view? I think that there is the potential to think that dancingstar wrote a sincere post about her point of view that she thinks that there is evidence that psychotropic drugs cause a premature death and that there is evidence that these drugs cause ill health and that there is evidence that these drugs are poisonous to our bodies.
She went on to write,[...if the "cures" are likely to cause ill health and lead to an earlier...death for having taken something that proves to be poisonous to our bodies, though, I think it's a bad idea to pursue them no matter who tells us that they are terrific...].
If the policy here in your FAQ is that different points of view are encouraged, then I think that there is the potential to think that dancingstar responded to your FAQ in writing her point of view. I have read many research articles confirming what dancingstar wrote about psychotropic drugs, many by notable doctors and psychiatrists. Now if you are restricting people here to have only one point of view as to the nature of psychtropic drugs, then could you put that in your FAQ?
Lou pIlder
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 23, 2005, at 18:01:19
In reply to Lou's response to Dr. Hsiung's reply to Auntie Mel » Dr. Bob, posted by Lou Pilder on April 23, 2005, at 17:22:22
Dr. Hsiung,
You also wrote that you[... had a fear that others...] in relation to what dancingstar wrote.
Was it your fear that others might think that psychotropic drugs do cause premature death and ill health and could be poisonous to our bodies?
If so, the other post in question writes about western medicine in a particular light that IMO has the potential to be in the same catagory as dancingstar's statement and does not another poster here think that there is not a difference?
Lou Pilder
Posted by Minnie-Haha on April 23, 2005, at 18:23:27
In reply to Re: I don't see a difference, posted by Dr. Bob on April 23, 2005, at 16:30:39
Well, I think there *is* a fine line here, but one thing that stands out in dancingstar's remark -- "Personally, I do not believe that it is a 'problem,' with 'symptoms' or 'a diagnosis.'" -- are the quotation marks.
Punctuation can affect meaning. So whether or not we use it properly, or whether it's use has more than one meaning, makes a big difference.
In addition to marking a quotation, quotation marks can also denote irony, which is a form of sarcasm. For example (from the Associated Press Stylebook), "The 'debate' turned into a free-for-all." They can be used to introduce an unfamiliar term too. (Again from the AP guide) "Broadcast frequencies are measured in 'kilohertz.'"
However, I think an informal use (especially in email and on message boards) is to use quotation marks to emphasize a word, but that's pretty close to using them for irony. Generally, I think people (myself included, especially if I'm in a hurry) just aren't as careful with composition in electronic messages, so you have to keep that in mind. I guess you have to look at the context. Myself, if I don't understand, I might ask the author, or if it doesn't involve me personally, defer to Dr. Bob's judgment.
Posted by Phillipa on April 23, 2005, at 21:38:57
In reply to Re: I don't see a difference, posted by Minnie-Haha on April 23, 2005, at 18:23:27
This has been an interesting discussion. I do believe Lou came to the defense of dancingstar. I also agree with Minniehaha that when we post it is sometimes not done with the scrutiny that you would use if let's say it were a letter or a paper that we were being graded on both emotionally and intellectually. In other words you don't get an A or an F. Let's just agree to disagree at times. This is a great place to come and I'm always amazed at the knowledge I gain here. Some of it I may not like or agree with, but it is food for thought. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by Phillipa on April 23, 2005, at 23:01:22
In reply to Re: I don't see a difference, posted by Phillipa on April 23, 2005, at 21:38:57
I would like to add that if a poster is ridiculed by others that he loses his ability to laugh and this is very unfortunate. Let's work together as a team to continue to keep this the type of safe place where all can air their differences without fear of ridicule. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by Sarah T. on April 24, 2005, at 1:28:54
In reply to To clarify » Sarah T., posted by Gabbi-x-2 on April 23, 2005, at 0:31:25
Hello Gabbi x 2,
Thanks for the information. I didn't know that about the klansmen. Your original post now makes much more sense to me!
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