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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 64 to 88 of 124. Go back in thread:
Posted by Dinah on September 8, 2004, at 20:42:54
In reply to It's seldom boring here. ;) (nm), posted by gardenergirl on September 8, 2004, at 20:29:28
You should see some of the IRL hobby clubs I've belonged to. Online ones too. And my husband's religious organization. He was utterly dumbfounded.
Whenever you get a diverse group of people together, it's usually lively. That was the common denominator, don't you think? The hobby clubs were a diverse group who shared one common interest. The religious organization had the religion in common, but was otherwise a diverse group. We all have mental health concerns in common, but are otherwise a diverse group. People see things differently and that leads to interesting situations. No one is necessarily right or wrong or good or bad. Just different points of view.
That's why I periodically tell my therapist I'm going to withdraw from humanity and go back to books and TV and movies. But diversity can be fascinating too, and it's one of the things I like best about Babble. Even if it does keep my therapist in new shoes.
Posted by partlycloudy on September 8, 2004, at 20:47:05
In reply to You think this is bad, posted by Dinah on September 8, 2004, at 20:42:54
Posted by Larry Hoover on September 8, 2004, at 21:26:39
In reply to Re: sorry!, posted by Dr. Bob on September 8, 2004, at 19:21:09
> Oops, sorry about that! It was books/paperwork, I was just being silly. It should be just the first picture now. Sorry if I worried some of you!
>
> BobI'm glad you apologized, Bob. Can I use the defense that I was just being silly? Oh, that would never do. You don't go by intent.
I'm just making a point about how subjective all opinions are, yours included.
Lar
Posted by verne on September 8, 2004, at 21:39:53
In reply to I have a theory, posted by partlycloudy on September 8, 2004, at 20:15:34
I like that theory. The suicide suggestion was made and many like me (probably with similar Dxs) were quick to see it that way. Others saw books or harmless objects.
I'm wondering, is this part of the experiment? (hee,hee) (I'm not actually laughing outloud at this moment but hiding a barely discernable grin while thinking "shrubbery" or "we are the knights who say..."
Verne
Posted by Dr. Bob on September 8, 2004, at 22:17:16
In reply to Re: Thanks for quickly explaining Dr. Bob!, posted by alesta on September 8, 2004, at 20:04:31
> whether or not it was paperwork, **it was meant to look like a weapon**... you seriously need some emotional help...
Please don't jump to conclusions about others or post anything that could lead them to feel accused or put down.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues, and replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by Susan47 on September 8, 2004, at 23:32:53
In reply to Re: sorry!, posted by Dr. Bob on September 8, 2004, at 19:21:09
and that you make mistakes like the rest of us. To me, it was obvious that you're not a person who thinks about suicide or SI very much. Any of us who do would never have done something like that lovey. (Sometimes *lovey* can be a bit hostile, please forgive.)
Posted by Susan47 on September 8, 2004, at 23:39:02
In reply to Re: please be civil » alesta, posted by Dr. Bob on September 8, 2004, at 22:17:16
from Dr. B.
Posted by Susan47 on September 8, 2004, at 23:41:26
In reply to Re: I don't see it either » partlycloudy, posted by All Done on September 8, 2004, at 15:39:12
trying to communicate with us! That's just a hilarious thought for me.
Posted by Susan47 on September 8, 2004, at 23:47:48
In reply to Re: dr. bob's freaking my chickens!, posted by Dinah on September 8, 2004, at 17:24:40
Bob, I'll bet he'd like to see this board archive soon. This would be just too too funny if it weren't so sadly triggering. A psychiatrist! I never would've thought I'd see the day. Honestly. (((Dr. B)))
Posted by Susan47 on September 8, 2004, at 23:48:52
In reply to Thanks for quickly explaining Dr. Bob!, posted by Dinah on September 8, 2004, at 19:30:26
Posted by Susan47 on September 8, 2004, at 23:56:27
In reply to Dinah's so sweetly supportive and trusting of Dr., posted by Susan47 on September 8, 2004, at 23:47:48
I meant to put a period in after I said you were supportive of Dr. Bob. I just re-read my lousy post and I want to reassure you that I meant you deserve kudos for maintaining your faith when all around you were crumbling in theirs. (((Dinah))) I hope you don't mind the hug.
Posted by Shadowplayers721 on September 9, 2004, at 3:32:56
In reply to Bob - Horrifying picture animation!!!, posted by TofuEmmy on September 8, 2004, at 13:43:04
Thank God, I didn't see what you all are talking about. If it was flashing, I would consider that a subliminal message.
The picture that I see on the computer screen is the faded one. How shadows interpretes it - There are two sides of Dr. Bob. There is the side he shows to the outside world. He is an intensive analyzer. He enjoys studying things. He likes to observe intensely. Then, there is a whole other side that no one sees. He pretends to the world this side doesn't exist. But, shadowplayers can see there is a shadow self to Dr. Bob that no one will ever see, because he denies this side exists to himself. Therefore, this thing that you describe that happened was no mistake. He sent his message, but only the shadow self know the true intention. The side Dr. Bob portrays is not conscious of the this process.
Look out, Shadowsplayers noneducated psychiatrist is out for the evening..........Who is the doc and who is the patient? Flashing pictures with a cryptic messages that only the shadow self of Dr. Bob really knows was at the control switch. There was no mistake was there shadow self of Dr. Bob? I understand. .. What do books hitting you in the head symbolize to to you? Why did you choose to flash in this method? Did you get the reaction you hoped for? What reaction were you wanting? Is this an emotion that you feel or is it one that you have placed in your shadow self?
Posted by Dinah on September 9, 2004, at 9:23:14
In reply to For Dinah, posted by Susan47 on September 8, 2004, at 23:56:27
Nor was my support intended solely or even largely for Dr. Bob in this thread. I saw people getting increasingly distressed by the picture. I thought they were almost certainly distressed by a misunderstanding. I attempted to bring everything down a notch in distress level while I did my best to see that Bob came speedily to the board and resolved the matter. Not for Dr. Bob so much as for the distressed posters. The deputy can take leave of absence from the job easier than the the job can take leve of absence from the deputy's sensibilities I suppose. I can see where it might be taken otherwise, but that was my intent.
As for faith in Dr. Bob, I suppose that's true. I think I'd use the word trust more than faith. Faith implies a leap of faith. A belief in something unknowable. While trust is something earned.
I've "known" Dr. Bob through my participation in Babble for a bit over three years. During that time I've disagreed and applauded his decisions. I've been him frustrated by his communication style, utterly infuriated, amused by his wit, touched by his kindness, and highly impressed by his discretion and patience. I don't think he's perfect. I've brought in communications from him to my therapist while I'm dissolved in tears. My therapist looks at them, then me and says "He's an MD psychiatrist." as if that explained everything and no further words were necessary. Must be some sort of interdisciplinary joke, because I always find additional words necessary. :)
But in the three years I've known him, he has never given me any reason to believe that he has anything but the board's best interests at heart. He has never given me any reason to believe he would deliberately hurt us as a joke or use us in hurtful manipulative experiments. He has *earned* my trust, in that sense. Just as my therapist has earned my trust in some areas. Just as my husband has earned my trust in some areas. I may not trust Dr. Bob to interpret posts the way I think he should, or mete out justice the way I think he should, or to understand things the way I think he should. But I trust Dr. Bob implicitly to do those things the way *he* thinks he should, doing what he thinks is *right*. It would have been wrong of *me* to not trust that the man had not done what people were thinking he had done. He has earned that trust from me.
Which is no statement about anyone other than myself. Dr. Bob has earned my trust, I'm not implying that others should consider that he has earned their trust. That's a personal thing.
Posted by Larry Hoover on September 9, 2004, at 9:33:50
In reply to Make no mistake. I am not particularly sweet., posted by Dinah on September 9, 2004, at 9:23:14
> Nor was my support intended solely or even largely for Dr. Bob in this thread. I saw people getting increasingly distressed by the picture. I thought they were almost certainly distressed by a misunderstanding.
And that is the core issue. It does not matter how it came to pass. Bob doesn't assess intent.
I have been blocked for merely agreeing with a poster about the content of his post.
Here, Bob is being judged by his own construct. In so many words, we don't need an absolute definition of incivility. We know it when we see it. His images were not civil. How can his intent be a relevent criterion, when ours is not?
I'm more than happy to give him the benefit of the doubt. But Bob doesn't do that himself.
> But in the three years I've known him, he has never given me any reason to believe that he has anything but the board's best interests at heart.
In the time I have been here, I would make the same statement about myself, imperfect though I may be.
When Bob makes a mistake, it is not him who pays the piper. Zen getting 48 weeks for expressing distress is an act of power, not of judgment.
Lar
Posted by Dinah on September 9, 2004, at 9:43:09
In reply to Re: Make no mistake. I am not particularly sweet. » Dinah, posted by Larry Hoover on September 9, 2004, at 9:33:50
Lar, I also agree that you have earned my trust. Not only as a person, or as a person who has the best interests of the board at heart, but as a person who has respect for the civility rules and civility in general. I have long thought that Dr. Bob has misinterpreted your posts and I tell him so regularly. I have argued your blocks most vociferously.
I don't really see the parallel here though. I think Dr. Bob saw a photo of a man falling under an avalanche of paperwork, not the photo of a man with anything to his throat. His image was not inherently uncivil IMO. When my husband saw the photo, without any preconceptions of what it was, he saw books and papers. In fact he saw a date book at the top with writing at the top and bottom of the cover.
Moreover, Dr. Bob did in effect comply with a Please Restate. He apologized and explained the innocuous content of the photo.
But I have no desire to argue with you on the topic, Lar, and would be more than happy to agree to disagree.
Posted by Larry Hoover on September 9, 2004, at 10:05:02
In reply to Re: Make no mistake. I am not particularly sweet. » Larry Hoover, posted by Dinah on September 9, 2004, at 9:43:09
I appreciate your support. I really do.
> I don't really see the parallel here though.
I didn't mean to draw a literal parallel. I meant to point out that there are likely to be two polarized sides to the perception. The particular side to which one falls is both personal and arbitrary. Judging a member of the opposite side from yourself is capricious and arbitrary. It is neither fair nor just. However, if intent is taken into account, then the situation takes on aspects of fairness and justice that would be otherwise be denied.
Lar
Posted by Dinah on September 9, 2004, at 10:17:30
In reply to Re: Make no mistake. I am not particularly sweet. » Dinah, posted by Larry Hoover on September 9, 2004, at 10:05:02
Hmmm... I think we're talking apples and apples here Lar, and are on the same page. Dr. Bob says he doesn't take intent into account, but what he and you are calling intent, I think I'm calling interpretation. I think Dr. Bob may *think* he doesn't take intent into account, but I don't see how that's possible. Intent is part of interpretation. A sentence or even a word can have so many meanings. It's impossible, IMO, to interpret what *anyone* says without some consideration of intent.
For example, many times teasing things are said on Social between posters who clearly know each other and are fond of each other. Dr. Bob doesn't hand out PBC's or blocks. Although on one occasion he invited anyone who felt uncomfortable to email him privately. Yet if the exact same things were said to strangers, with no underlying affection evident, it would definitely be flagged.
The intent behind the posts is clear and it is obviously taken into account in interpreting the posts. Just as context is obviously taken into account. And probably a host of other things that a communications expert would understand better than I. It can't be otherwise or communication would be impossible.
So what you're saying is that Dr. Bob is interpreting your posts correctly but ignoring intent. What I'm saying is that Dr. Bob is misinterpreting your posts by misinterpreting intent. And Dr. Bob is saying he doesn't take intent into account, but I think he means something totally different than either of us means by that.
Posted by Susan47 on September 9, 2004, at 11:30:33
In reply to I have the old picture that changes a bit, posted by Shadowplayers721 on September 9, 2004, at 3:32:56
Posted by alesta on September 9, 2004, at 15:00:32
In reply to Your post tickled my funny bone Shadow. (nm), posted by Susan47 on September 9, 2004, at 11:30:33
i really am sorry for what i said...attacking people is really not my style at all..in real life it takes a lot for me to even raise my voice (except when pms-ing :)). i suppose i was just frustrated...i saw the picture as representing a suicide gesture, and felt like my impression was invalidated..i totally handled this situation in the wrong manner...i sincerely am sorry...
amy:)
Posted by partlycloudy on September 9, 2004, at 15:19:22
In reply to i would really like to apologize....:), posted by alesta on September 9, 2004, at 15:00:32
Posted by alesta on September 9, 2004, at 16:02:53
In reply to We're all human. forgeddaboudit. (nm), posted by partlycloudy on September 9, 2004, at 15:19:22
Posted by Shadowplayers721 on September 9, 2004, at 16:51:23
In reply to We're all human. forgeddaboudit. (nm), posted by partlycloudy on September 9, 2004, at 15:19:22
I agree we are all human as the wise poster stated. However, (oh, oh here comes the noneducated psychiatrist on staff in Shadowplayers) this was a control study mind you. The frequency of the flash was designed to make one see into their subconscious. Some saw a razor, gun, etc. The response was overwhelming. To doc Bob conscious mind, "It was interesting." Hence, he (Dr. Bob) was doing a study of sorts. One he (his shadow self) does not realize is he is seeing into his own subconscious via proxy of Pschobabble world. Therefore, one doesn't do a study to others without doing a study for a self discovery of oneself. Perhaps, Dr. Bob is really trying to see the side that I see, but can't be seen with the eye. There is much to tell. But, I must get back to my readings or the book may fall into my lap or my head for that matter.
GEEES!!!! I don't know about you, but this noneducated psychiatrist is really scary. I don't think that I want to hang out with the noneducated psychiatrist. Whew!!!
Posted by Dr. Bob on September 9, 2004, at 17:39:59
In reply to i would really like to apologize....:), posted by alesta on September 9, 2004, at 15:00:32
Posted by TofuEmmy on September 9, 2004, at 19:21:52
In reply to Re: thanks (nm) » alesta, posted by Dr. Bob on September 9, 2004, at 17:39:59
...so we can buy Dr Bob a decent camera.... ;-)
Since yesterday Bob has sent me not 1, but 3 apologies. So, now I will tear up this plane ticket to Chicago. I had intended on going there and stomping the %&@# out of his little webcam.
All better now.
Emmy
Posted by Dinah on September 9, 2004, at 19:24:50
In reply to I'm starting a new donation fund...., posted by TofuEmmy on September 9, 2004, at 19:21:52
Glad you're feeling better, Emmy.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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