![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by baseball55 on September 6, 2016, at 19:50:29
I will post this once and then ignore the endless stream of posts from Lou it is bound to cause. Time has shown again and again and again and again that nothing, absolutely nothing, that people say to or about Lou changes Lou's behavior at all.
But the posts people make to or about Lou DO change the tone and feeling of psychobabble itself. Long strings of rants against Lou turn, in fact, into the destruction of this fragile structure which is psychobabble.
Scott has tried hard, with much success I think over the past year or so, to ignore Lou's posts. When Lou has entered a thread, Scott changes the subject line back to the original subject and respond to the original post. As more and more people have followed Scott's lead, Lou has become less of a problem - a nuisance, an annoyance, but not the beginning of the end of this forum..
LH asked what happened and Lou is not what happened. Reactions to Lou and others and people being completely unable to just drop the subject or ignore the inevitably difficult poster is what happened. And now it's all starting again....
Posted by linkadge on September 7, 2016, at 7:53:26
In reply to Dealing with difficult posters, posted by baseball55 on September 6, 2016, at 19:50:29
Ignoring it doesn't work either.
At least by responding, other people visiting this site understand that this is not the collective viewpoint.
You have to stand up to the bullies.
Linkadge
Posted by SLS on September 7, 2016, at 15:32:07
In reply to Re: Dealing with difficult posters, posted by linkadge on September 7, 2016, at 7:53:26
> Ignoring it doesn't work either.
I have to disagree with this. I have watched the troll all but disappear when people are vigilant in ignoring him. You must ignore him completely. Of course, he will try to poke around to find people who will interact with him. This will be particularly true early in the period of ignoring. It only takes one post to screw up the works.
> At least by responding, other people visiting this site understand that this is not the collective viewpoint.
>
> You have to stand up to the bullies.The troll is less of a bully and more of a narcissistic sadist. Standing up to the troll is exactly what he is counting on. Despite his pleas that he is somehow being hurt by the words of others, he is not at all hurt.
Don't feed the troll. It is okay to warn others of the presence of trolls. Of course, this will stimulate the troll to react with a flurry of posts. If no one pays any attention to the troll, he will very shortly move on to something or someone else who is willing to interact with him, especially if the troll can upset people.
- Scott
Posted by AlexCanada on September 7, 2016, at 16:01:06
In reply to Dealing with difficult posters, posted by baseball55 on September 6, 2016, at 19:50:29
I 100% disagree. Us standing up to Lou has finally enabled us to take real action and improve the chances of mental health success for the posters here since many of us will be migrating to a new forum.
Ignoring Lou has done Nothing but harm the forum for the past several years. Many people have lost their lives due to his abuse, many more have stopped posting.
When you refuse to stand up against such toxic individuals it enables them to continue their mistreatment of others. We need to be strong in this.
Doing nothing is not an option for some of us.
> I will post this once and then ignore the endless stream of posts from Lou it is bound to cause. Time has shown again and again and again and again that nothing, absolutely nothing, that people say to or about Lou changes Lou's behavior at all.
>
> But the posts people make to or about Lou DO change the tone and feeling of psychobabble itself. Long strings of rants against Lou turn, in fact, into the destruction of this fragile structure which is psychobabble.
>
> Scott has tried hard, with much success I think over the past year or so, to ignore Lou's posts. When Lou has entered a thread, Scott changes the subject line back to the original subject and respond to the original post. As more and more people have followed Scott's lead, Lou has become less of a problem - a nuisance, an annoyance, but not the beginning of the end of this forum..
>
> LH asked what happened and Lou is not what happened. Reactions to Lou and others and people being completely unable to just drop the subject or ignore the inevitably difficult poster is what happened. And now it's all starting again....
Posted by Tabitha on September 7, 2016, at 17:14:31
In reply to Dealing with difficult posters, posted by baseball55 on September 6, 2016, at 19:50:29
Even if ignoring him would work, I just doubt we could organize well enough to get everyone to do it. He preys on new posters the most, and they wouldn't know the plan. I think we'd have more success with imploring Dr Bob to give one of us Admin rights so we can block him and his sock puppets. Sadly, I think likelihood of success with that approach is also low.
For me personally, it's like dealing with the annoying solicitors who knock on your door or hang out at the grocery store entrance. Sometimes it just doesn't feel good to hide from them or scurry past with my head down. That's uncomfortable, and makes me feel not so good about myself. Cowardly, perhaps. It's "fun" to engage them in conversation and either debate whatever they're selling, or just try to get them to break character, or even to actually connect with the person under the sales pitch.
I think the real best option is to go start a new (moderated) forum. The downside is we might not get enough people to congregate there.
Posted by Larry Hoover on September 7, 2016, at 18:15:58
In reply to Re: Dealing with difficult posters, posted by SLS on September 7, 2016, at 15:32:07
Scott, I respect you a great deal, but I believe that you are 100% wrong on this subject.
I confronted Lou on the Admin board last night, and the post was gone in hours. A few months back, when I contacted Bob to refresh my password info (which I had forgotten), he supplied it to me within hours. The puppet master is not gone. He is simply hiding.
Lou Pilder may or may not affect the long-term posters here (even that is debated, you must agree). His primary impacts are two-fold with respect to new posters.
1. Potential poster googles one of a variety of keywords, and gets linked to Psychobabble. Posts from Lou the sociopath come up, and they turn away in disgust.
2. Actual new poster comes here, and Lou jumps on them instantly. Look at the jalapeno thread, just down the page. Lou was the firs to reply. Fresh meat.
Lou is a predator enabled by Bob, Bob is watching, and I am angry about both things.
Lar
Posted by Lou Pilder on September 7, 2016, at 19:07:24
In reply to Re: Dealing with difficult posters » SLS, posted by Larry Hoover on September 7, 2016, at 18:15:58
> Scott, I respect you a great deal, but I believe that you are 100% wrong on this subject.
>
> I confronted Lou on the Admin board last night, and the post was gone in hours. A few months back, when I contacted Bob to refresh my password info (which I had forgotten), he supplied it to me within hours. The puppet master is not gone. He is simply hiding.
>
> Lou Pilder may or may not affect the long-term posters here (even that is debated, you must agree). His primary impacts are two-fold with respect to new posters.
>
> 1. Potential poster googles one of a variety of keywords, and gets linked to Psychobabble. Posts from Lou the sociopath come up, and they turn away in disgust.
>
> 2. Actual new poster comes here, and Lou jumps on them instantly. Look at the jalapeno thread, just down the page. Lou was the firs to reply. Fresh meat.
>
> Lou is a predator enabled by Bob, Bob is watching, and I am angry about both things.
>
> Lar
Larry,
The poster in question is near death. But the defamation posted against me in that thread could lead the poster away from what I know that could save him/her.
You see, the poster is suffering from something unbeknownst to those here that the drugs and more of them could cause the poster's death. I am the only member that could save that poster as it has been revealed to me the source of the poster's near death.
So if the poster is killed from the advise here, the poster's blood will not be upon me.
You see, that poster has gone astray. There is a voice that could call the poster back to the green fields that he/she used to know. Now there are dark clouds and valleys where rivers used to run. BUt there is healing from above that I could have the poster drink of the Waters of Life if it was not for the members here defaming me like you.
I say to you that those that you persuade to hate me her have their life taken away for the hate can consume them like a fire.
Lou
Posted by linkadge on September 7, 2016, at 19:45:45
In reply to Lou's response-the fire of hate » Larry Hoover, posted by Lou Pilder on September 7, 2016, at 19:07:24
Posted by baseball55 on September 7, 2016, at 20:37:33
In reply to Re: Dealing with difficult posters, posted by linkadge on September 7, 2016, at 7:53:26
I don't quite see the "standing up to Lou" perspective. Maybe it's a guy thing. Insulting or arguing with someone we all know is impervious to insults or rational argument isn't standing up to them. It's allowing them to go from being a minor annoyance to becoming a potent destructive force.
I have seen this happen time and again on internet forums over the years. What kills the forums are not the periodic obnoxious posts of the troll, but the inevitable and endless litany of responses by those determined to "stand up to" the troll. Soon, the whole forum is nothing more than a forum on the troll.
As for the argument that newcomers must be protected and made to understand that the troll does not represent the viewpoints of most posters, what a newcomer in fact sees is a forum where every post becomes a post either by the troll, in response to the troll, in response to responses about the troll and on and on in an endless vicious cycle.
Even on a mental health site, I don't assume new posters are so fragile and naive that they are not aware that trolls inhabit any internet forum. But they are probably also aware that forums where people respond to the troll in this vicious feedback loop are not healthy forums.
To AC and LH, who have, in recent days, returned to babble and began "standing up to" Lou -- are you aware that Lou is now entirely dominating this forum without having to write another word? And that this had not been true before for a very long time?
Posted by Tabitha on September 7, 2016, at 23:53:55
In reply to Re: Dealing with difficult posters, posted by baseball55 on September 7, 2016, at 20:37:33
I think it will blow over. We might lose a couple of posters in the mean time.
I've seen forums where trolls regularly show up, yet don't manage to hijack the entire discussion. Some long side tangents will go on, but it doesn't stop everything. In those forums, there are a lot of strong members who deal with the troll with a combo of dismissiveness like "oh look, our favorite troll again", handily eviscerating the troll's arguments, and pointing to their history. I wish we could get that kind of approach going here.
This site's design works against us since it's not really multi-threaded. If there's a long sub-thread about Lou, it visually obliterates the other side-threads. I'm comparing that to Disqus, which captures sub-threads with indents. Of course indents have problems as well, but it makes it easy to ignore an un-interesting side topic.
Posted by Lou Pilder on September 8, 2016, at 6:35:14
In reply to Re: Dealing with difficult posters, posted by baseball55 on September 7, 2016, at 20:37:33
> I don't quite see the "standing up to Lou" perspective. Maybe it's a guy thing. Insulting or arguing with someone we all know is impervious to insults or rational argument isn't standing up to them. It's allowing them to go from being a minor annoyance to becoming a potent destructive force.
>
> I have seen this happen time and again on internet forums over the years. What kills the forums are not the periodic obnoxious posts of the troll, but the inevitable and endless litany of responses by those determined to "stand up to" the troll. Soon, the whole forum is nothing more than a forum on the troll.
>
> As for the argument that newcomers must be protected and made to understand that the troll does not represent the viewpoints of most posters, what a newcomer in fact sees is a forum where every post becomes a post either by the troll, in response to the troll, in response to responses about the troll and on and on in an endless vicious cycle.
>
> Even on a mental health site, I don't assume new posters are so fragile and naive that they are not aware that trolls inhabit any internet forum. But they are probably also aware that forums where people respond to the troll in this vicious feedback loop are not healthy forums.
>
> To AC and LH, who have, in recent days, returned to babble and began "standing up to" Lou -- are you aware that Lou is now entirely dominating this forum without having to write another word? And that this had not been true before for a very long time?BB,
You wrote,[...a potent destructive force...obnoxious posts...AC and LH standing up to Lou..].
What you have posted about me here is false and could decrease the respect, regard and confidence in which I am held and induce hostile and disagreeable opinions and feelings toward me. I am not a troll and your false characterization of me could cause the deaths of innocent readers here as Mr. Hsiung allows you to defame me with impunity.
You see, a psychiatrist is a powerful influence on vulnerable readers here to accept that what you are using his forum for is being supportive. This could poison the minds of our young people to think that ganging up on the Jewish member with the leader's approval is good for his community as a whole and that could also lead them to think that ganging up on a Jew will be good for their community as a whole for the psychiatrist's thinking is that it would. This could arouse anti-Semitic feelings in another group as the fire of hate spreads from here as Hsiung stokes the furnace of hate by leading readers that it is supportive for you to post defamation against the Jewish member that is trying to put out the fire of hatred toward the Jews in the psychiatrist's forum that he allows.
This creates and develops anti-Semitic feelings not only here, but wherever the embers of the fire of hate land through the internet that Hsiung feeds. By you being allowed by Hsiung to post such hate, he uses you and the others as his arm to develop hatred toward the Jews by allowing you to slander me, the Jewish member, with impunity from his enforcement policy. This makes his policy an anti-Semitic policy as it is against the Jew and allows the Jew to be put down and accused, all against his own rules.
The pitiful part about this is that our young people and those that cherish the God that the Jews give service and worship to could have their minds perverted to hate the God that the Jews cherish and worship. This is part of what I am trying to eradicate here for it is not good in my thinking for a psychiatrist to allow anti-Semitic hate to flourish by his allowing of it.
I am not a potent destructive force as you would like to portray me here. And unless you post here now what I destroy, you could lead those that I could have their lives saved, to ignore what I write here and think that the Jew will destroy them. This is not anything new as the persecution of the Jews that resulted in millions of Jewish children murdered and millions of other Jews also, was based on the same lie that you have posted here about the Jews as me being the Jewish member here. Anti-Semitism means against the Jew. But it could also mean posting defamation against the Jew with impunity form the leader here. He says that what he does will be good for him. Time will be the judge of that. Never again.
Lou
Posted by linkadge on September 8, 2016, at 8:46:21
In reply to Lou's response-time will be the judge » baseball55, posted by Lou Pilder on September 8, 2016, at 6:35:14
http://newbabble.freeforums.net/
Give it a try.
Posted by AlexCanada on September 8, 2016, at 23:31:05
In reply to Re: Dealing with difficult posters, posted by baseball55 on September 7, 2016, at 20:37:33
> I don't quite see the "standing up to Lou" perspective. Maybe it's a guy thing. Insulting or arguing with someone we all know is impervious to insults or rational argument isn't standing up to them. It's allowing them to go from being a minor annoyance to becoming a potent destructive force.
>
> I have seen this happen time and again on internet forums over the years. What kills the forums are not the periodic obnoxious posts of the troll, but the inevitable and endless litany of responses by those determined to "stand up to" the troll. Soon, the whole forum is nothing more than a forum on the troll.
>
> As for the argument that newcomers must be protected and made to understand that the troll does not represent the viewpoints of most posters, what a newcomer in fact sees is a forum where every post becomes a post either by the troll, in response to the troll, in response to responses about the troll and on and on in an endless vicious cycle.
>
> Even on a mental health site, I don't assume new posters are so fragile and naive that they are not aware that trolls inhabit any internet forum. But they are probably also aware that forums where people respond to the troll in this vicious feedback loop are not healthy forums.
>
> To AC and LH, who have, in recent days, returned to babble and began "standing up to" Lou -- are you aware that Lou is now entirely dominating this forum without having to write another word? And that this had not been true before for a very long time?Lou has dominated this forum for countless years. It's unfortunate that people like you cannot understand the collective damage a poster like this creates. This could have been a thriving community but Hundreds have been chased away literally by just one man.
If Lou isn't banned then we need to make changes. Plain and simple. It is quite frankly stupid and unhealthy to remain on a forum dominated by a toxic individual. Any respectable forum Bans sociopathic trolls like Lou. Obviously the rules do not matter here. Dr Bob fears a lawsuit and is blackmailed by Lou.
Thus we have to take matters into our own hands. We will be moving to a different forum. The best thing that could happen is for this forum to become a wasteland. We need to move on. It's a lost cause.We live in a world of cause and effect. To assume everyone is impervious to Lou's antics and that he has not caused anyone to leave is quite frankly Nonsense. Why do you insist on sticking up for him? Are you lacking human connection? Does it not concern you ever how he has treated people over the past 15 years? Sorry, but you might as well be sticking up for serial killer at this point.
Posted by Larry Hoover on September 9, 2016, at 18:50:21
In reply to Re: Dealing with difficult posters, posted by baseball55 on September 7, 2016, at 20:37:33
> I don't quite see the "standing up to Lou" perspective. Maybe it's a guy thing.
What are you, a bitch? Do you see how sexist remarks alter the focus of the discussion?
Lar
Posted by Larry Hoover on September 9, 2016, at 18:55:55
In reply to Re: Dealing with difficult posters, posted by baseball55 on September 7, 2016, at 20:37:33
> I don't quite see the "standing up to Lou" perspective. Maybe it's a guy thing.
What are you, a bitch? Do you see how sexist remarks alter the focus of the discussion?
Lar
Posted by Larry Hoover on September 9, 2016, at 19:00:34
In reply to Re: Dealing with difficult posters, posted by baseball55 on September 7, 2016, at 20:37:33
> Even on a mental health site, I don't assume new posters are so fragile and naive that they are not aware that trolls inhabit any internet forum.
I apologize for the double post. I'm having some internet problems.
I don't mean to be mean, but you come across as being emotionally detached, and rather lacking in empathy. I personally have observed a positive correlation between the apparent distress described by a newbie, and both the likelihood and the intensity of Lou's responses.
Your view is by no means the only view, and I'm not likely to change mine by being condescended to.
Lar
This is the end of the thread.
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