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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 29. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by SLS on May 19, 2015, at 14:21:31
Has anyone experienced a worsening of depression while taking memantine?
Thanks.
- Scott
Posted by Tomatheus on May 19, 2015, at 14:47:58
In reply to Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse., posted by SLS on May 19, 2015, at 14:21:31
My anergic depression became worse when I took memantine, but I wouldn't say I gave the medication a fair trial. I think I only stayed on it for perhaps three or four days. I didn't want to keep taking memantine because of the effect that it seemed to have on me.
Tomatheus
Posted by SLS on May 19, 2015, at 15:48:10
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » SLS, posted by Tomatheus on May 19, 2015, at 14:47:58
> My anergic depression became worse when I took memantine, but I wouldn't say I gave the medication a fair trial. I think I only stayed on it for perhaps three or four days. I didn't want to keep taking memantine because of the effect that it seemed to have on me.
>
> TomatheusThanks. I deteriorated rather quickly the first time I tried memantine. I managed to get through one week before discontinuing it. I am afraid to take it again, but I am desperate. My doctor wants to move in the direction of brain stumulation treatments for me. I can't think of anything left to try. I will say this, though. If cariprazine comes out, I will attempt to use it to substitute for Abilify. Cariprazine is more selective for D3 receptors as a partial agonist. It might treat the negative symptoms of schizophrenia along with depressive disorders more robustly than Abilify.
- Scott
Posted by Lou Pilder on May 19, 2015, at 16:30:40
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » Tomatheus, posted by SLS on May 19, 2015, at 15:48:10
> > My anergic depression became worse when I took memantine, but I wouldn't say I gave the medication a fair trial. I think I only stayed on it for perhaps three or four days. I didn't want to keep taking memantine because of the effect that it seemed to have on me.
> >
> > Tomatheus
>
> Thanks. I deteriorated rather quickly the first time I tried memantine. I managed to get through one week before discontinuing it. I am afraid to take it again, but I am desperate. My doctor wants to move in the direction of brain stumulation treatments for me. I can't think of anything left to try. I will say this, though. If cariprazine comes out, I will attempt to use it to substitute for Abilify. Cariprazine is more selective for D3 receptors as a partial agonist. It might treat the negative symptoms of schizophrenia along with depressive disorders more robustly than Abilify.
>
>
>
> - ScottScott and friends,
The poster here writes that he is desperate and that his doctor wants to have him move toward brain stimulation treatments. If the poster is referring to what is known as deep brain stimulation or DBS, be advised that I would like for you to view the following video by a doctor concerning what this procedure entails before you accept that the treatment is supportive because Mr. Hsiung has not intervened to express his views on DBS here, so I would like for you to hear a different doctor and march to the music that you hear.
There is no denying that there are desperate people that will try anything that a doctor advocates. But beware of false doctors, for they could come to you ion sheep's clothing, but inwardly they could be ravening wolves.
When you key in this video, the first letter is has the number one (1) following it and the last character is zero, not the letter "O".
Lou
So bring up Google and type in:
[ youtube, E1WeC59r0 ]
you will see a pic of Dr. Dolan, and then you will know the rest of the story...
Posted by Tomatheus on May 19, 2015, at 16:39:22
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » Tomatheus, posted by SLS on May 19, 2015, at 15:48:10
I sure hope that something will work out for you, Scott, whether it's brain stimulation, cariprazine, or something else. In the meantime, if I ever find a treatment that successfully alleviates my own anergic depression in the long run, I'll be sure to post about it to let you and others here know.
Tomatheus
Posted by SLS on May 19, 2015, at 22:40:32
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » SLS, posted by Tomatheus on May 19, 2015, at 16:39:22
> I sure hope that something will work out for you, Scott, whether it's brain stimulation, cariprazine, or something else. In the meantime, if I ever find a treatment that successfully alleviates my own anergic depression in the long run, I'll be sure to post about it to let you and others here know.
>
> Tomatheus
Thanks, big T.:-)
- Scott
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 20, 2015, at 9:23:05
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » SLS, posted by Tomatheus on May 19, 2015, at 16:39:22
You are serious
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 20, 2015, at 9:54:59
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse., posted by Lamdage22 on May 20, 2015, at 9:23:05
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZCgWmose3c
Pretty embarassing
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 20, 2015, at 10:52:05
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse., posted by Lamdage22 on May 20, 2015, at 9:54:59
Scott,
if it makes you even worse, what are you going to do??
Posted by SLS on May 21, 2015, at 0:00:19
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse., posted by Lamdage22 on May 20, 2015, at 10:52:05
> Scott,
>
> if it makes you even worse, what are you going to do??I guess I'll do what I always do. I will continue to keep an eye on new drugs that become available. However, I feel the need to explore various brain stimulation techniques - both electric current and magnetic field types. In the meantime, I am adding various vitamins and supplements. For now, I am focusing on D and B12 along with inositol. Deplin (L-methylfolate) was of no help.
- Scott
Posted by tom2228 on May 21, 2015, at 11:29:36
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » Lamdage22, posted by SLS on May 21, 2015, at 0:00:19
> > Scott,
> >
> > if it makes you even worse, what are you going to do??
>
> I guess I'll do what I always do. I will continue to keep an eye on new drugs that become available. However, I feel the need to explore various brain stimulation techniques - both electric current and magnetic field types. In the meantime, I am adding various vitamins and supplements. For now, I am focusing on D and B12 along with inositol. Deplin (L-methylfolate) was of no help.
>
>
> - ScottHave you tried Desoxyn yet? I'm not currently taking it but am asking for a switch back tomorrow. What's worse, the stigma/ fear of Desoxyn, DBS, or a life of TRD? What's in a name anyway, especially if you have no history of substance abuse?
Part of me wonders whether you're afraid to be happy and let go of the need to think about medication, which while necessary while one is struggling, is a pretty effective way to live in one's head and distract oneself from change or more helpful ways of coping that include a degree of uncomfortability. I only say this because I've struggled with this for quite some time now. I have tried 51 medications and FINALLY I am coming out of what seems to have been a decade of depression and a lifetime of unhappiness.
Are you in therapy or an outpatient or partial group setting? I highly suggest it. If we could do this on our own we would have already. I remember reading a post saying that you felt best when you were in a program. I know depressive symptoms hold one back but life itself needs to be approached as aggressively as medication treatment. This requires rigorous honest, open-mindedness, and willingness.
Posted by Lou Pilder on May 21, 2015, at 15:10:48
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse., posted by tom2228 on May 21, 2015, at 11:29:36
> > > Scott,
> > >
> > > if it makes you even worse, what are you going to do??
> >
> > I guess I'll do what I always do. I will continue to keep an eye on new drugs that become available. However, I feel the need to explore various brain stimulation techniques - both electric current and magnetic field types. In the meantime, I am adding various vitamins and supplements. For now, I am focusing on D and B12 along with inositol. Deplin (L-methylfolate) was of no help.
> >
> >
> > - Scott
>
> Have you tried Desoxyn yet? I'm not currently taking it but am asking for a switch back tomorrow. What's worse, the stigma/ fear of Desoxyn, DBS, or a life of TRD? What's in a name anyway, especially if you have no history of substance abuse?
>
> Part of me wonders whether you're afraid to be happy and let go of the need to think about medication, which while necessary while one is struggling, is a pretty effective way to live in one's head and distract oneself from change or more helpful ways of coping that include a degree of uncomfortability. I only say this because I've struggled with this for quite some time now. I have tried 51 medications and FINALLY I am coming out of what seems to have been a decade of depression and a lifetime of unhappiness.
>
> Are you in therapy or an outpatient or partial group setting? I highly suggest it. If we could do this on our own we would have already. I remember reading a post saying that you felt best when you were in a program. I know depressive symptoms hold one back but life itself needs to be approached as aggressively as medication treatment. This requires rigorous honest, open-mindedness, and willingness.tom,
You wrote,[...life itself needs to be approached...].
I think that's good. Thanks
Lou
Posted by SLS on May 21, 2015, at 22:29:25
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse., posted by tom2228 on May 21, 2015, at 11:29:36
Hi Tom.
I am grateful for your concern and the time you spent putting together a thoughtful post. From your perspactive, I would certainly question my self-described biological illness and its refractoriness to drug treatment. I know it is frustrating for people to see me complain about the same thing all the time. It's pretty damned frustrating for me, too. I have never been bashful about looking towards psychotherapies as modalities for self improvement. However, they have not proved to be of any help in ameliorating my depression. I'm not looking for happiness in a pill. I'm looking for the resolution of the mental illness that is more numbing than it is depressing. I do experience dysphoria, but anergia, cognitive and memory impairments, and the loss of interest and motivation predominate. I have the sort of illness that allows one to experience happiness despite being "depressed" at the same time. I wish that I could find resolution of whatever it is that I suffer from by having conversations with people in a psychotherapeutic milieu - talk therapy. I would love to have that kind of control.
- Scott
Posted by mogger on May 25, 2015, at 17:52:32
In reply to Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse., posted by SLS on May 19, 2015, at 14:21:31
This is the second time I have agreed with you in 10 minutes. Memantine made my suicide ideation and depression become much worse. Came right off it. Have you tried Rilutek? Best anti depressant I have taken but I couldn't put a sentence together after a few months so had to discontinue.
Posted by TriedEveryMedication on May 26, 2015, at 9:55:18
In reply to Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse., posted by SLS on May 19, 2015, at 14:21:31
> Has anyone experienced a worsening of depression while taking memantine?
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> - ScottIt made me feel weird. Very mildly unpleasant.
Really that's all it did - no benefits noticed at all.
Posted by Horse on June 3, 2015, at 20:26:33
In reply to Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse., posted by SLS on May 19, 2015, at 14:21:31
Scott, I'm sorry to read you haven't seemed to progress with your MI. As usual, your intelligence masks your presentation...I mean that as a compliment.
It's kinda crazy to say...I think DBS might be an effective treatment for your condition. I don't know the quaility of surgery available to you, and I have never researched it for myself...however, when ect was recommended, I had thought quite a bit about VNS. The video link was compelling...and if you could secure excellent care...maybe?
When I took namenda, I noticed nothing. There were med changes at the time, and I was responding to nothing...so I don't have any information to add...just support and encouragement. Beckett x
Posted by SLS on June 4, 2015, at 0:54:46
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » SLS, posted by Horse on June 3, 2015, at 20:26:33
> Scott, I'm sorry to read you haven't seemed to progress with your MI. As usual, your intelligence masks your presentation...I mean that as a compliment.
It was taken as one. :-)
I'm sure you can imagine how many people accuse me of wanting to be sick.
> It's kinda crazy to say...I think DBS might be an effective treatment for your condition. I don't know the quaility of surgery available to you, and I have never researched it for myself...however, when ect was recommended, I had thought quite a bit about VNS. The video link was compelling...and if you could secure excellent care...maybe?
>
> When I took namenda, I noticed nothing. There were med changes at the time, and I was responding to nothing...so I don't have any information to add...just support and encouragement. Beckett xThank you, thank you, thank you. I am encouraged by your impression of DBS and VNS. I was given the name of a neurologist in Washington D. C. by my current psychiatrist. She thinks that VNS is worth exploring. My previous doctor liked DBS. I am still resistant to having any of these procedures done. I am scared to move in this direction, but my doctor does not think that any medication will do more than produce a mild improvement.
The best Namenda did for me was nothing. During a second trial, I felt worse. I'll probably forgo a third.
:-/
- Scott
Posted by Lamdage22 on June 4, 2015, at 5:46:23
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » Horse, posted by SLS on June 4, 2015, at 0:54:46
Id rather be shot to mars than do DBS.
Just my 2 cents
Posted by SLS on June 4, 2015, at 6:48:17
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse., posted by Lamdage22 on June 4, 2015, at 5:46:23
> Id rather be shot to mars than do DBS.
>
> Just my 2 centsIt is a difficult decision to make. However, as the years pass me by, such extreme measures grow in their appeal. In my mind, it is definitely a treatment of last resort, but I'm pretty much there. I have pretty much exhausted pharmacological approaches.
We'll see.
- Scott
Posted by mogger on June 4, 2015, at 7:45:02
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » Lamdage22, posted by SLS on June 4, 2015, at 6:48:17
Scott,
Sorry to hear you are struggling. I do think that rTMS could be an option for you. I have been treatment resistant for 25 years and am finally finding relief with rTMS. They started on the left side of my brain and it aggravated my depression after a week. We have switched to the inhibitory right side treatment and I am feeling better every day. Still early days but I am keeping my fingers crossed. Interestingly enough my doctor says that the US start on the left side of the brain but in Europe they start on the right side! Interesting. Fingers crossed for you that something will give you some relief.
Joseph
Posted by SLS on June 4, 2015, at 8:03:16
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » SLS, posted by mogger on June 4, 2015, at 7:45:02
> Scott,
>
> Sorry to hear you are struggling. I do think that rTMS could be an option for you. I have been treatment resistant for 25 years and am finally finding relief with rTMS. They started on the left side of my brain and it aggravated my depression after a week. We have switched to the inhibitory right side treatment and I am feeling better every day. Still early days but I am keeping my fingers crossed. Interestingly enough my doctor says that the US start on the left side of the brain but in Europe they start on the right side! Interesting. Fingers crossed for you that something will give you some relief.
>
> Joseph
Thanks, Joseph.Do you know what frequency Hz is being used on the right side?
- Scott
Posted by mogger on June 4, 2015, at 8:26:28
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » mogger, posted by SLS on June 4, 2015, at 8:03:16
I think 1 hz but I'll check today.
Posted by mogger on June 4, 2015, at 23:20:48
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » mogger, posted by SLS on June 4, 2015, at 8:03:16
1 Hz, 1500 pulses totaling 25 minutes, 100 % of threshold. They might add pulses tomorrow or bring me up to 105 %.
Posted by phidippus on June 11, 2015, at 0:48:13
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » tom2228, posted by SLS on May 21, 2015, at 22:29:25
You know, maybe you need a little mania, unless your manias are no fun. But if they are have you ever considered backing off some of the mood stabilizers/antipsychotics?
Eric
Posted by SLS on June 11, 2015, at 9:46:23
In reply to Re: Memantine (Namenda) makes me feel worse. » SLS, posted by phidippus on June 11, 2015, at 0:48:13
> You know, maybe you need a little mania
Yes, yes, yes!!! One of my doctors said the same thing. If we can trigger mania, we could then treat the mania and leave the antidepressants in place. I think Trileptal would be the agent I would prefer to try first.
> unless your manias are no fun.
I am a variant of bipolar I, simply because my manias are so severe and include psychotic states.
> But if they are have you ever considered backing off some of the mood stabilizers/antipsychotics?
I have tried backing off of every single psychotropic I currently take in order to reevaluate its utility and reestablish their lowest effective doses. I feel confident that my regime is close to being optimized. Right now, I am on a dosage finding mission for Parnate. 120 mg/day was too much. It left me persistently fatigued and sleepy. I deteriorate at 80 mg/day. I am comparing my responses between 90 mg/day and 100 mg/day. Parnate is the last of the agents to be tested.
I am still somewhat attracted to trying memantine once more before going for rTMS. My guess is that it will produce an exacerbation of symptoms again, but I am not certain. Is it reaching? Yes.
I hope things are better for you.
- Scott
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