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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 7 of 7. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by rjlockhart37 on January 20, 2014, at 0:02:53
the medication bin i'm in is not working, but before i think about shock, it has to be approved by a doctor, and the only reason i would do it is to get me in better work to get into a university, or increase ability....i've posted at varius websites, i don't care i want the shock, and the doctors will not do it, they say its not needed. I'm already starting to move forward finally but i wanat to get the shock, i know it would benefit...
any feelings, or explanations on the shock in treatment?
anything.....and what are the requirements to get it done?
Posted by Jay_Original1 on January 20, 2014, at 9:26:03
In reply to shock, posted by rjlockhart37 on January 20, 2014, at 0:02:53
> the medication bin i'm in is not working, but before i think about shock, it has to be approved by a doctor, and the only reason i would do it is to get me in better work to get into a university, or increase ability....i've posted at varius websites, i don't care i want the shock, and the doctors will not do it, they say its not needed. I'm already starting to move forward finally but i wanat to get the shock, i know it would benefit...
>
> any feelings, or explanations on the shock in treatment?
>
> anything.....and what are the requirements to get it done?RJ,
Shock treatment can leave you with dilapidated memory...even erasing parts of your memory, sometimes permanently. I am not trying to sound like a scientologist, but these are proven side effects. No, not everyone gets this, but I personally think it is too big of a risk. Just make sure you do your homework before going this route.
Jay
Posted by rjlockhart37 on January 20, 2014, at 12:01:36
In reply to Re: shock » rjlockhart37, posted by Jay_Original1 on January 20, 2014, at 9:26:03
it's a old treatment, and its a barbaric way to treat but still, maybe it could help, but yes i am aware of memory loss, and some cognitive change....the only horror feeling i have is being strapped down and being given a barbiturate to keep me from realizing im having a convulsion....it just creeps me out...but still maybe in a way it would help but the side effects are not somethign to look forward too.
maybe someone could post their experience, do you know anything more about the shock Jay? it's succerss in people, or the side effects, which yes is the memory and cognitive change....i just want to know if it could help, but still i can't have it done untill the meds don't work, which is already in the picture, my meds do work at times, and then at other they don't, leave me in tormented depression....i told my psychiatrist about the spiritual stuff that i think that the forces of darkness or the devil making me sick, she always asks about it, she increased my Lamictal to 400mgs, and she said they would move to 450mg's slowly to 500mg's, and the zyprexa to 30mg's, see that's alot, i'm controlled by high doses of lamotragine...she said it should help with the hyper agitated states....my diagnosis with her is schizoeffective, manic depression, and she says i need to take what she prescribes for it....
but, enough yak, do you think shock would help with the meds, just maybe 2-3 times....i would have to talk to my doctor about this issue im posting about my meds not working....
but anyways, it's ok if you don't know, i just wanted to know if there's any benefit of the shock
Posted by baseball55 on January 20, 2014, at 19:28:06
In reply to Re: shock, posted by rjlockhart37 on January 20, 2014, at 12:01:36
They don't strap you down and give you barbiturates. You are given anesthesa and a paralytic agent so that the ECT-induced seizure affects only your brain, not your body.
Why anyone who is not catatonically depressed would want to try this is beyond me. First of all, they don't just do it once or twice - 9-12 sessions are recommended before you see any effect at all. It is creepy scary stuff. You wake up drooling and not knowing where you are.
Even when it works (and it often doesn't - though I don't know what you'd consider "working" since I'm not sure what you're trying to treat), its effects wear off pretty quickly and then it's back to meds.
If your p-docs say forget it, I would listen to them. ECT is absolutely a last resort treatment. I had both unilateral and bilateral ECT and neither did anything for me except make me forget where I lived, who my neighbors were, how to drive to and from places I went to all the time, etc. I'm fortunate that my memory came back after a couple of months and that I didn't lose memory about work stuff. For some people, memory never comes back.
Posted by Christ_empowered on January 20, 2014, at 20:05:58
In reply to Re: shock, posted by baseball55 on January 20, 2014, at 19:28:06
I had intense, involuntary ECT at 23. Hardcore. God healed me later on, or I should say...took me on a healing journey which led to my repentance.Anyway, ECT is terrible. Looking back, mine was so hardcore, I was basically the living dead for a couple years there. Frontal lobe syndrome, no personality, I still don't have a lot of memories from my life BES (before electroshock).
Are you pursuing self-destruction and annihilation? Obliteration?
Posted by bleauberry on January 21, 2014, at 12:47:43
In reply to shock, posted by rjlockhart37 on January 20, 2014, at 0:02:53
Would the opinions and comments of someone who has studied ECT a great deal be of any help?
Would the opinions and comments of someone who has been through ECT be of any help?
I remember being where you are. Nothing else on my radar screen looked more attractive. Worse, there was a lot of marketing and advertising for it inside the psychiatric ward where I was. Talk about taking advantage of the disadvantaged! Wow, what an easy sale for them.
Anyway, there was minimal progress through shock #10. Somewhere in the #11 to #12 area, I did experience a profound improvement. It was short lived, maybe 2 days at the most. And then I was back to deep depression and suicidal thoughts again.
The literature on ECT, if you dig deep, doesn't look nearly as attractive as it is "perceived" by mainstream patients and doctors. Poopout is very common, and any gains are usually short lived....days to weeks. And, ECT does not fix things in such as way that you don't need meds....it still requires meds afterwards to stand any chance of hanging onto any gains.
Memory loss, in my opinion, is profound. There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to it. Trivial details of something decades ago....clear as a bell....some important person or event in your life....no recollection of it at all....might need a map to navigate your own town....names don't go with faces very well....on and on.
I didn't even recognize houses or streets in my town which I had driven by hundreds of times. I felt like I was in a town I had never visited. My house was right around the corner from that.
Some parts of memory healed a bit, but pieces of history are missing....sort of like the random holes in Swiss Cheese.
I do believe ECT has two good purposes:
1. Appropriate for those who are so handicapped by their psychiatric condition that they cannot live alone. Some of them can improve enough to be in half-way houses instead of institutions.
2. A new start, new chapter. Since the memory loss can be pretty significant, that actually might not be a bad thing for a long time depression patient! There is a lot maybe we don't want to remember!I found ECT to be sort of like turning the page in a book, exiting a chapter, entering a brand new chapter. The new chapter didn't look any more promising than the old one, but the fact is, it was indeed a new chapter. A new launching pad. New hope. ECT can shake things up enough to end up seeing it that way....preparation for the next round of war, turn the page. The point is....the old war....is gone, done....it's a new game now, ECT did change stuff in the brain, for better or worse.
Some people here have gotten more benefit than I did. They said it was the turning point for them. Sort of like what I just said about a new chapter. But none of them got a cure from it or anything like that. It was another tool, nothing more, nothing less.
Once in a while we see a miracle, such as ECT working fantastic and they lived happily ever after. Rare. I wouldn't count on that. I know of other strategies where that sort of goal is actually a realistic one. But with ECT, no. Psychiatry in general, probably not.
I've been following you for a long time. You remind me of me years ago. I only had one tool box. I trusted that psychiatry would heal. It doesn't. It doesn't even pretend that to be a purpose. It is about symptom reduction, period. Meanwhile, whatever is actually causing your symptoms, goes on to ravage more, unchecked and unopposed.
Maybe some new tool boxes would help?
Posted by Phillipa on January 22, 2014, at 18:00:02
In reply to shock, posted by rjlockhart37 on January 20, 2014, at 0:02:53
RJ I worked in psych hospitals and watched the whole procedure of ECT. It was horrible. Poor young guy was put under. Shock given, He wet his pants. I felt so bad for him. I had to wheel him in wheelchair back to his room. He had absolutely no memory at all. This patient was in and out of the hospital. He didn't get well at all. Phillipa
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