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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by alchemy on January 31, 2013, at 13:05:21
In reply to My Ketamine trial + new pdoc, posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 9:48:34
Did you have to pay out of pocket? How much was it?
Posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 13:43:43
In reply to Re: My Ketamine trial + new pdoc, posted by alchemy on January 31, 2013, at 13:05:21
> Did you have to pay out of pocket? How much was it?
Unfortunately, yes, but you can get reimbursed through your insurance (I don't have any at the moment but my family is helping me w/ everything).
It's $250 per session which includes 2 shots.
Posted by bearinthewoods on January 31, 2013, at 14:42:25
In reply to My Ketamine trial + new pdoc, posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 9:48:34
Can I ask how you were able to find such a rare gem? I live in a fairly large metropolitan area, but can hardly find someone who does ketamine therapy for "legit" purposes like pain management, etc. I've had bad experiences before with doctors acting like I'm seeking to abuse prescriptions and when I asked my current doc they just said that it's experimental and I wouldn't even be able to find such a thing.
Posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 15:03:48
In reply to Re: My Ketamine trial + new pdoc, posted by bearinthewoods on January 31, 2013, at 14:42:25
I live in Manhattan and have had sh*t pdoc experiences. He does seem to be a rare gem, and I had the good luck of finding him as a poster on this forum mentioned him in a thread.
Maybe do a google search? There's a thread started above by Hugh on Ketamine trials and there's some valuable info in there.
-b
Posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 15:21:25
In reply to Re: My Ketamine trial + new pdoc » brynb, posted by Phillipa on January 31, 2013, at 10:36:35
hi p-
yeah, working fast here. it's been a bad run for me over the past 2 months (as you already know). I think my parents are onboard w anything at this point--no one really knows what to do or say anymore.
for now, I'm sticking to an AD, valium, deplin, supplements and Ketamine shots, but I think I'll be trying TMS soon. I'm exhausted :/.
b
Posted by SLS on January 31, 2013, at 15:34:18
In reply to My Ketamine trial + new pdoc, posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 9:48:34
I'm envious of your find!
> I'll report back tomorrow after my second round of injections.
Are they injections or infusions?
Good luck! You deserve it.
- Scott
Posted by SLS on January 31, 2013, at 15:55:51
In reply to My Ketamine trial + new pdoc, posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 9:48:34
> There was an assistant monitoring me throughout the entire trial (1 hour total, 2 separate IM injections).
Never mind.
:-)
- Scott
Posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 16:02:24
In reply to Re: My Ketamine trial + new pdoc » brynb, posted by SLS on January 31, 2013, at 15:34:18
> I'm envious of your find!
>
> > I'll report back tomorrow after my second round of injections.
>
> Are they injections or infusions?
>
> Good luck! You deserve it.
>Aw, thanks Scott :)). Fingers crossed...
-b
Posted by alchemy on January 31, 2013, at 17:08:24
In reply to Re: My Ketamine trial + new pdoc » alchemy, posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 13:43:43
> > Did you have to pay out of pocket? How much was it?
>
> Unfortunately, yes, but you can get reimbursed through your insurance (I don't have any at the moment but my family is helping me w/ everything).
>
> It's $250 per session which includes 2 shots.That's a good deal. I thought it was like $2500. And I'm pretty sure my insurance won't cover it for depression.
I have even called a nearby university to try and find someone who does it.
Posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 20:21:25
In reply to Re: My Ketamine trial + new pdoc, posted by alchemy on January 31, 2013, at 17:08:24
> > > Did you have to pay out of pocket? How much was it?
> >
> > Unfortunately, yes, but you can get reimbursed through your insurance (I don't have any at the moment but my family is helping me w/ everything).
> >
> > It's $250 per session which includes 2 shots.
>
> That's a good deal. I thought it was like $2500. And I'm pretty sure my insurance won't cover it for depression.
> I have even called a nearby university to try and find someone who does it.Hi Alchemy-
I guess the price isn't too bad. Also, I wanted to add that I felt good during the treatment, and after was so tired I was almost relaxed. While I felt ok this morning, I had a really rocky afternoon. (Non-stop crying.) I'll report back on round two tomorrow.
Also, according to my pdoc, the IM injections are just as effective and more controlled than IV.
Definitely google docs in your area and follow-up with the local universities.
Feel good,
b
Posted by Starsly on January 31, 2013, at 22:57:01
In reply to My Ketamine trial + new pdoc, posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 9:48:34
Thats great, I have tried every type of treatment essentially except things like RTMS and things that involve surgery. SSRI's, TCA's, MAOIS, antipsychotics, augmentors, suboxone, marijuana, ECT etc. So, I have been lucky in being able to try almost everything, but not so lucky in that it doesn't work!
I remember the infusions were fantastic & think they will prove effective in even the most resistant cases. Unforunately it's difficult to get them on a regular bases. I have tried the oral ketamine & been on the spray for 2-3 years. I am becoming tolerant too it, so that it stops the bottom from dropping out, but the depression is very bad & the ketamine is the only thing stopping it. I would like to get infusions since they are so powerful they will probably work indefinitely.
Posted by rjlockhart37 on January 31, 2013, at 23:40:21
In reply to My Ketamine trial + new pdoc, posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 9:48:34
i would love to be in your place right now....ketamenine i've never tried it but i've read alot of about it here on babble...
r
Posted by brynb on February 1, 2013, at 16:05:58
In reply to My Ketamine trial + new pdoc, posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 9:48:34
Thanks for all the feedback and positive responses.
My first round two nights ago went well, and I felt ok yesterday morning, but later in the day I felt extremely melancholy and spent a good deal of the afternoon crying and anxious.
I went for my 2nd round of Ketamine shots today; again, they were IM and about 20 minutes apart. They upped the dosage this time (I don't remember what they were, but it's based on weight). Again, I felt good during treatment; weird, but pleasurable--actually euphoric. I was also very tired when I left (like last time), but I'm feeling better now. (And I haven't cried today!)
I think my mood tomorrow will be more telling. I'm going in for my next round of shots this Tuesday, and then my pdoc and I will discuss what to do from that point on.
I read this article today about Ketamine; nothing new, but I thought some people might be interested in it:
Hope everyone's doing well and again, thanks for the support.
-b
Posted by SLS on February 1, 2013, at 16:25:56
In reply to Re: My Ketamine trial-2nd round + article, posted by brynb on February 1, 2013, at 16:05:58
Thanks for the information.
I hope ketamine works magic for you. Although many people do feel better 4 hours after an infusion, it can up to 24 hours. I couldn't guess as to how one responds to injections.
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on February 1, 2013, at 18:11:05
In reply to Re: My Ketamine trial-2nd round + article » brynb, posted by SLS on February 1, 2013, at 16:25:56
I can't imagine it either. Phillipa
Posted by ChicagoKat on February 2, 2013, at 9:49:28
In reply to Re: My Ketamine trial-2nd round + article, posted by brynb on February 1, 2013, at 16:05:58
Bryn, so glad to hear that things may be slowly getting better. And thanks for the article; I saved it to read after my therapist appt.
Thanks to Hugh I now know of at least one clinic in my area that does Ketamine. I'm kinda waiting to see the results from my very un-scientific after my colonoscopy later this week - they use Ketamine for sedation! Take care my friend.
Kat
Posted by brynb on February 5, 2013, at 18:08:31
In reply to My Ketamine trial + new pdoc, posted by brynb on January 31, 2013, at 9:48:34
I just returned from my third Ketamine treatment. I received 3 IM injections today. During the treatment, I feel great, euphoric and, dare I say, happy.
I'm exhausted right now. It wipes me out. I'll be going in for another round this Friday. So far I've had a total of 7 injections. After Friday, we'll see where I'm at, and then determine how many more treatments are necessary to treat this current depressive episode (which has been plaguing me for a good 2 months) and what will be necessary for maintenance if it's determined that it is indeed the course to stay on.
I'll say this: the fog has lifted. I'm getting out of bed. I'm showering. I'm leaving my apartment for short walks. I still have a very short attention span, little patience and irritability, but for now, that's acceptable considering how bad off I've been.
Here's my current regimen, pdoc approved, which is working:
-2 Ketamine treatments a week (usually 2 injections), going forward tbd
-50-100mg of Tramadol in the morning (for pain and antidepressant effects; it works similarly to and perhaps synergystically with Ketamine)
-15mg of Deplin with breakfast
-20mg of Lexapro before bed
-20mg of Valium for sleep, 10 mg during the day if need be for anxietyIt's not as streamlined as I'd like, but it's working. And it's taking a lot of energy and effort on my part, but it's making a HUGE difference to work with an optimistic pdoc who thinks out of the box and isn't afraid to try and stick with what's working.
Hope my fellow babblers are faring well.
-b
Posted by Phillipa on February 5, 2013, at 21:08:31
In reply to Ketamine: it's working, posted by brynb on February 5, 2013, at 18:08:31
Bryn so glad you feel so much better. So the lexapro stays? I am betting you are asleep now. So you did get out to walk? Congrats Phillipa
Posted by Emme_V2 on February 5, 2013, at 22:20:13
In reply to Ketamine: it's working, posted by brynb on February 5, 2013, at 18:08:31
Excellent! I hope this is the start of a lot of wellness for you. Glad the new pdoc is really working with you.
Posted by jrbecker76 on February 5, 2013, at 23:24:16
In reply to Ketamine: it's working, posted by brynb on February 5, 2013, at 18:08:31
> I just returned from my third Ketamine treatment. I received 3 IM injections today. During the treatment, I feel great, euphoric and, dare I say, happy.
>
> I'm exhausted right now. It wipes me out. I'll be going in for another round this Friday. So far I've had a total of 7 injections. After Friday, we'll see where I'm at, and then determine how many more treatments are necessary to treat this current depressive episode (which has been plaguing me for a good 2 months) and what will be necessary for maintenance if it's determined that it is indeed the course to stay on.
>
> I'll say this: the fog has lifted. I'm getting out of bed. I'm showering. I'm leaving my apartment for short walks. I still have a very short attention span, little patience and irritability, but for now, that's acceptable considering how bad off I've been.
>
> Here's my current regimen, pdoc approved, which is working:
>
> -2 Ketamine treatments a week (usually 2 injections), going forward tbd
> -50-100mg of Tramadol in the morning (for pain and antidepressant effects; it works similarly to and perhaps synergystically with Ketamine)
> -15mg of Deplin with breakfast
> -20mg of Lexapro before bed
> -20mg of Valium for sleep, 10 mg during the day if need be for anxiety
>
> It's not as streamlined as I'd like, but it's working. And it's taking a lot of energy and effort on my part, but it's making a HUGE difference to work with an optimistic pdoc who thinks out of the box and isn't afraid to try and stick with what's working.
>
> Hope my fellow babblers are faring well.
>
> -bGlad to hear it's working. We're all cheering for you.
What meds did this new doc add in, if anything, besides the ketamine? I know you mentioned the Deplin but wondering if he prescribed the Ultram.
Are you finding that the irritability and attention span is worse since the treatment began or just the same as before? I recall reading in a report on bipolar depression case studies using ketamine treatment that irritability and cognitive dysfunction were reported side effects.
How long would you say the side effects that you might be feeling (including the sleepiness/exhaustion) are lasting after each injection?
Keep us updated!
JB
Posted by brynb on February 6, 2013, at 0:32:20
In reply to Re: Ketamine: it's working » brynb, posted by Phillipa on February 5, 2013, at 21:08:31
> Bryn so glad you feel so much better. So the lexapro stays? I am betting you are asleep now. So you did get out to walk? Congrats Phillipa
Thanks, Phillipa. Yes, Lexapro's in for now. I was asleep but now I'm wide awake. Side effect perhaps? As long as it doesn't become a pattern, I can deal...
-b
Posted by brynb on February 6, 2013, at 0:35:00
In reply to Re: Ketamine: it's working » brynb, posted by Emme_V2 on February 5, 2013, at 22:20:13
> Excellent! I hope this is the start of a lot of wellness for you. Glad the new pdoc is really working with you.
Thanks, Emme.
I vaguely remember you being on minocycline (I think). If so, are you continuing to use it and is it helping?
Hope you're well.
-b
Posted by brynb on February 6, 2013, at 0:57:59
In reply to Re: Ketamine: it's working, posted by jrbecker76 on February 5, 2013, at 23:24:16
> Glad to hear it's working. We're all cheering for you.
Thank you!
> What meds did this new doc add in, if anything, besides the ketamine? I know you mentioned the Deplin but wondering if he prescribed the Ultram.
Ketamine, Valium and Deplin (along with Vitamin D and the suggestion to cut out gluten--a bit hard for me as I'm a vegetarian and a picky eater).
My internist originally prescribed me Ultram last spring for leg pain (which seems to be somatic) and at the time it helped me out of a funk, too. Since then, I've used it as a prn and not very often, but I'm finding it's helping with the depression again.> Are you finding that the irritability and attention span is worse since the treatment began or just the same as before? I recall reading in a report on bipolar depression case studies using ketamine treatment that irritability and cognitive dysfunction were reported side effects.
Very interesting, actually. My irritability and reduced attention span have always seemed separate from my depression. They were initially bad, but I have a feeling that the Ketamine isn't helping in this area either (I feel irritable right after the treatment) and my cognitive dysfunction hasn't improved. Ultram makes me a bit "up" and energetic/chatty, which I like as it's better than my baseline of being down, but I realize is hypomanic. This observation kind of cements my feeling that I have bipolar 2 rather than MDD.
I plan to address this at my next appointment; however, mood stabilizers are out (they make the depression worse and make me flat), as well as AP's, which make me a zombie, too sluggish, and generally worse off. Perhaps I could do Ultram every other day, and at this point, I will never exceed 50mg, the smallest dose.
> How long would you say the side effects that you might be feeling (including the sleepiness/exhaustion) are lasting after each injection?
Well, it's almost 2 am in the morning now and I'm wide awake, so probably not that long :/.
> Keep us updated!
>
> JB
>
I will! Thanks, JB. Hope you're well.-b
Posted by Emme_V2 on February 6, 2013, at 5:54:31
In reply to Re: Ketamine: it's working » Emme_V2, posted by brynb on February 6, 2013, at 0:35:00
> > Excellent! I hope this is the start of a lot of wellness for you. Glad the new pdoc is really working with you.
>
> Thanks, Emme.
>
> I vaguely remember you being on minocycline (I think). If so, are you continuing to use it and is it helping?
>
> Hope you're well.
>
> -b
Hi Bryn,Yes, that's right. The minocycline does seem to be very helpful. Thanks!
emme
Posted by alchemy on February 6, 2013, at 14:55:35
In reply to Re: Ketamine: it's working » brynb, posted by Emme_V2 on February 6, 2013, at 5:54:31
Are infusions more likely to have a more effective response than injections? I know they are suppose to over the nose sprays.
Also, is the agitation and lethargy after the treatment common?
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