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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 20 of 20. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by vbs on November 4, 2012, at 15:03:25
I'm experiencing a bad psychotic episode. Hearing a lot of voices. I take Saphris 10 mg and Zyprexa 10 mg. I've actually been taking more Zyprexa than what I'm prescribed, 20 mg a day, to keep the voices away but it doesn't seem to be helping that much. It's very frustrating. I saw my pdoc last week and he didn't make any changes. He knows that I've been hearing voices a lot. I don't see him again for another two months and I'm afraid of running out of Zyprexa. Should I try an old school AP like Haldol or Mellaril? I don't know if my pdoc would be receptive to that but it wouldn't hurt to ask. What other options do I have? I'm just tired of hearing voices.
Posted by rjlockhart37 on November 4, 2012, at 18:00:34
In reply to psychosis - meds not working, advice?, posted by vbs on November 4, 2012, at 15:03:25
the pet awnser for this situation is to go a psychiatric hospital....they will defintly get you stablized but the only thing is there EXPENSIVE...exepct state hospitals the fact about them is they are state funded, I don't know how to exactly put this... but the doctors are vary systematic and less enthusiatic than a private owned...they put you in a cell and basically you have to wait long periods unless there's a psychotic episode. Pale faces and souless eyes is how I view state hospital doctors and staff.
But to get back....a really good choice I know of would be clozapine...its usally used when other medications are not working, treatment resistance cases. Belive me when its bumbed up to 450mg you will defintely not have any psychosis and the voices will be suppressed, not all the way but most of it. And adding Lithium...that would make a good relief.
The older ones...really good one is stelazine...its anxiety relief and strong dopamine antagonism. And yes...the other ones too....the only thing is TD and nerve side effects....you know im not a doctor and I can't predict what there going to use, but i hope this suggestion helps....but still your just going to have to work with them...like your playing chess and think like they do.
You can actually buy Lithium orotate, its not lithium carbonate like you get in the presciption which is alot stronger...but you will get some lithium in to maybe help the unstableness until you see the doctor...they have it sold at these stores:
http://www.google.com/#hl=en&q=lithium+orotate&oq=lithium+o&gs_l=serp.1.0.0l2j0i46j46l2j0l5.178010.180757.0.182537.19.15.0.0.0.1.251.1749.4j6j2.12.0.les%3Beqn%2Cfixedpos%3Dfalse%2Cboost_normal%3D40%2Cboost_high%3D40%2Ccconf%3D1-2%2Cmin_length%3D2%2Crate_low%3D0-035%2Crate_high%3D0-035%2Csecond_pass%3Dfalse%2Cignore_bad_origquery%3Dtrue..0.0...1c.1.xmb-NKfFlLU&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=65ef074e50191ebe&bpcl=37189454&biw=1366&bih=584keep me updated if you can....
r
Posted by linkadge on November 4, 2012, at 18:10:30
In reply to psychosis - meds not working, advice?, posted by vbs on November 4, 2012, at 15:03:25
Add 500mg of vitamin C and 100mg of Niacin to the mixture.
Linkadge
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on November 4, 2012, at 18:54:07
In reply to Re: psychosis - meds not working, advice?, posted by linkadge on November 4, 2012, at 18:10:30
It might be worth adding a "typical" antipsychotic for a while to things improve, say haloperidol 1.5mg - 5mg twice a day?
Posted by vbs on November 4, 2012, at 19:13:25
In reply to Re: psychosis - meds not working, advice?, posted by rjlockhart37 on November 4, 2012, at 18:00:34
Yeah I've been to the hospital before, twice actually. I'm still in control of my faculties. I know the voices aren't real, and if I distract myself enough the voices are supressed. So I've been watching TV and listening to music as a distraction. So I don't think that I'll commit myself.
I've heard about clozapine. It can cause agranulocytosis if my memory serves me correctly. I'd like to try an older AP like stelazine. Maybe lithium orotate would help. Who knows...
I might play some Doom 3 to get my mind off the voices. Distraction seems to be the biggest help right now. Hopefully tomorrow will be better.
Posted by phillipa on November 4, 2012, at 19:46:27
In reply to Re: psychosis - meds not working, advice?, posted by vbs on November 4, 2012, at 19:13:25
I've seen clozapine work miracles with scizoprenics that had problems with other antipsychics. But you are correct. Blood draws weekly to check the Wbc count. Who is your doc there? Maybe I know him? Phillipa
Posted by rjlockhart37 on November 4, 2012, at 19:56:39
In reply to Re: psychosis - meds not working, advice?, posted by vbs on November 4, 2012, at 19:13:25
dopamine release is good when doing stuff you like to do...and that's why maybe it takes the deregulation off.....but still its like covering a fire with a blanket, it may go out, or it may just make the blanket catch fire too....i don't know my examples are silly.
Like when I take zyprexa....i lose my research intrest, it just totally goes away and i feel like just laying around and watch tv or something with no real drive to make things happen.. not It's kinda like a psychatric version of weed. It makes you kinda calm and blunt, not much motivatiion...but it depends because I take 20mg...to keep manic thinking out.still if your doctor won't give you lithium, order it or go to the healthfood store and get orate stuff.
plus i agree...psych hospitals the people don't have pdocs or they where substance abuse and their doc discharged them... they have to go deal with the lifeless eyes of psych doctors. Givng them lifeless meds in the unit...like talking to pale faced acountant that has bad news...
tell your doctor you need to increase zyprexa, but seriously clozapine even thought it may scary is a good med for this. The reason im saying that is because some doctors tend not to use typical APs, it just depends. But its potency is strong.
get a joystick too....i love this game called half life, and half life 2 ...im waiting for half life3 to come out...:/
r
Posted by Christ_empowered on November 4, 2012, at 23:31:47
In reply to Re: psychosis - meds not working, advice?, posted by rjlockhart37 on November 4, 2012, at 19:56:39
All I can think is that maybe you need some additional meds. Maybe get the zyprexa up to 20 (I mean, officially prescribed at that level) and add in some depakote. Or a soothing antidepressant, if psychotic depression is the issue. I'm not your shrink, clearly.
Sometimes, benzos can help. Neurontin, lyrica, too. When I had an out of control psychotic episode, I needed: abilify (20)+depakote+klonopin+ambien to simmer down. You trim the meds as you get better.
I'd seriously avoid an old school AP right now. Sometimes, all you get from a tranquillizer is...tranuilization. The voices don't go away. You have to add stuff. Talk therapy and Orthomolecular medicine work well as add ons, at least for some people.
Posted by vbs on November 5, 2012, at 9:17:45
In reply to Re: psychosis - meds not working, advice?, posted by rjlockhart37 on November 4, 2012, at 19:56:39
I remember Half-Life. That was a good game. It's kinda an old game, right? I recently bought Doom 3 BFG Edition for my PlayStation 3. Doom 3 was released in 2004, and Id Software remastered it for 2012 re-release. It's a rockin' good game and scary. I like multiplayer.
I'm doing better today. Not so many voices. I'll look into OTC lithium to augment my meds. I don't know if it's my meds but I'm lazy too. I just lay around listening to music most of the time. I was much more active when I was taking stimulants, before they made me crazy. I can't tolerate stimulants anymore. Provigil or Nuvigil would probably be okay.
Posted by vbs on November 5, 2012, at 9:25:23
In reply to Re: psychosis - meds not working, advice? » vbs, posted by phillipa on November 4, 2012, at 19:46:27
Dr. Leone at Mental Health and Substance Abuse division, aka Virginia Beach Community Services Board.
Posted by vbs on November 5, 2012, at 13:49:43
In reply to Re: psychosis - meds not working, advice?, posted by rjlockhart37 on November 4, 2012, at 19:56:39
I just ordered lithium orotate (200 count, 120 mg) from the Vitamin Shoppe. I should get it either tomorrow or Wednesday. I hope it works.
Posted by rjlockhart37 on November 5, 2012, at 14:23:39
In reply to Re: just ordered lithium, posted by vbs on November 5, 2012, at 13:49:43
hope it helps....but its alot weaker than Lithium Carbonate....but if you doctor won't prescibe Lithium, just keep on taking the one you just ordered.
r
Posted by vbs on November 5, 2012, at 17:21:32
In reply to Re: just ordered lithium » vbs, posted by rjlockhart37 on November 5, 2012, at 14:23:39
Yeah, I know it's substantially weaker than lithium carbonate. I think 120 mg of orotate is roughly equivalent to 5 mg of carbonate. Still, I'm curious and eager to find out how it will affect my mood and psychosis. Overall, I'm doing much better now compared to yesterday. I'm hoping that the lithium orotate will balance me out so that I have fewer psychotic episodes. Time will tell.
Posted by Phillipa on November 5, 2012, at 18:24:07
In reply to Re: psychosis - meds not working, advice? » phillipa, posted by vbs on November 5, 2012, at 9:25:23
No this name is not familiar. Did you ever hear of Dr. Charles Parker out Witch Duck Rd? Phillipa
Posted by rjlockhart37 on November 5, 2012, at 19:16:36
In reply to Re: just ordered lithium » rjlockhart37, posted by vbs on November 5, 2012, at 17:21:32
hey i did a really search on the dose equivilent....got mixed stuff, but i did find this on the wiki and it states that it IS used for bipolar conditions...and others. So that obviously tells that there got to be some effect from it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_orotate
actually how i found this was i was going to vitamen shoppe about a year ago...i was looking for DLphenayline[misspelled] and some tyrosine...i was looking through the shelves and came across the lithium...i thought the FDA had flipped. LOL
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on November 5, 2012, at 22:28:09
In reply to Re: just ordered lithium » vbs, posted by rjlockhart37 on November 5, 2012, at 19:16:36
Most lithium ororate pills contain 5mg of elemental lithium - the theraputic dose range is about 100 times this amount
You are buying a placebo and nothing more unless you take dozens of pills a day
Posted by vbs on November 6, 2012, at 2:44:22
In reply to Re: just ordered lithium, posted by jono_in_adelaide on November 5, 2012, at 22:28:09
Well, I'm certainly not taking dozens of pills at a time. Perhaps the dose equivalent is all the lithium I'll need to achieve an effect. Anyway, it's too late to cancel my order. It's already been shipped via UPS next-day air.
I think all the vitamins and supplements I take are like taking placebos. I take a multivitamin, fish oil, magnesium, melatonin and St. John's Wort.
Posted by Christ_empowered on November 6, 2012, at 21:09:05
In reply to Re: just ordered lithium » jono_in_adelaide, posted by vbs on November 6, 2012, at 2:44:22
I'm holding out hope that it'll help you. Who knows, right? Plus, when you're on neuroleptics, you're more sensitive to lithium and vice versa, so...maybe the combo will be just the ticket?Personally, I'd go orthomolecular. That's what I do. The base program is a b-complex, niacinamide, c, either e or tocotrienol (which usually contain e anyway), zinc, and selenium. You can add in other stuff as you deem fit. Usually, you continue medication until/unless you improve enough to lower the doses or taper off completely.
Just a thought. Please don't despair. Psychosis sucks. I honestly think you'd benefit from lamictal, but that's just me.
Posted by vbs on November 8, 2012, at 13:29:06
In reply to Re: just ordered lithium, posted by Christ_empowered on November 6, 2012, at 21:09:05
I do take supplements in addition to my medication regimen. I take a multvitamin, fish oil, magnesium and melatonin. And right now, as you know, I'm experimenting with lithium orotate. I'm on my second day on it and so far so good; no adverse reactions and no psychosis. I'm going back down to 10 mg of Zyprexa, taken at bedtime. I've been taking 20 mg a day in divided doses, but I'm only supposed to take 10 mg.
Linkadge recommended 500 mg vitamin C and 100 mg niacin. It's not clear to me how that would help reduce psychotic symptoms. Maybe today I'll go out and buy some B-complex and vitamin C.
Posted by Phillipa on November 8, 2012, at 20:45:21
In reply to Re: » Christ_empowered, posted by vbs on November 8, 2012, at 13:29:06
I've taken 2000mg of vita c time release for years and years. Without it now I bruise. Phillipa
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