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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 106 to 130 of 130. Go back in thread:
Posted by Lamdage on July 11, 2011, at 10:58:01
In reply to Up to 67.5, posted by Lamdage on July 10, 2011, at 7:21:39
Ok my "lost excipient" formula so far is:
2 teaspoons of:
Kaolin
Gelatine
White wheat flour
Methocel
Calcium CarbonateThen:
Honey Powder (small teaspoon)
Potassium Carbonate (just a hint)
Bioperine (just a hint)
Carnauba wax (just a hint)
Magnesium Stearate (just a hint)Again like i said i mix this "lost ingredient formula" with nardil 1-2. 1/3 lost ingredients 2/3 nardil.
The coating with foodlac (food grade shellac-ethanol solution) works OK. Ive bought a nail-lac bottle and cleansed it thoroughly. This is where i put the shellac in and "paint" it on the capsules. I use a normal Capsule maker and put the capsules in there in a way so 2/3 of the capsules stick out. (you will figure out how to accomplish this).
Then i coat them carefully, let it dry for 24 hours and turn them 180 degrees and do the same again with the other end. I do this so that there are at least 2 films of shellac on each half. This means 2x coating the top and 2x coating the bottom. The top and bottom films are overlapping, this is important. After the 4 (or 2 if you will so) coatings, again i let it dry for 48 hours. This way the caps get nice and hard.
Whats also important is, that humidity is the enemy of enteric coating with shellac. This means excess air exposure is NOT good for the caps to dry. I put it in a carton and close it, only venting it once every 8 hours or so.Its a bit of a pain, for sure. Its kinda difficult and time consuming but once you get the swing of it its OK. I recommend getting "000" Pills and putting 45mg in each to make the effort worth it.
Id say that 2/3 of my caps reach the intestine intact or 90% intact. The remainder may have opened in advance BUT my formula is alot more alkaline than pfizers original and in this case the formula will not have been exposed to stomach acid for a very long time.I bought two very handy items and i recommend these to anyone trying to create their own interpretation of nardil :
A large 5 pound heavy granite mortar. Capable to crush like 10 pills at a time. (poor little nardil pills) :D
And a medium quality coffee grinder, capable of grinding espresso size particles.
Makes life alot easier.
I have alot of trouble figuring out about this "Acacia". Id like to have a CAS number or an accurate unmistakeable name.
There are lots of different products from Acacia Catechu. If i had to bet id say that the astringent action is why it was in nardil but i could be very wrong. Ive read somewhere that some catechu products actually block absorption of alot of substances. Maybe someone can enlighten me.Besides that id like to bring a hint of alcohol into the formula, but im not really sure how to do this. I dont want the inside of the capsules to be wet and sticky cuz i want them to have a good "shelf life". Any ideas?
On a quest to make the ultimate nardil!
Ld
Posted by zonked on July 11, 2011, at 15:36:34
In reply to Excipients/ Make your own nardil, posted by Lamdage on July 11, 2011, at 10:58:01
Very ambitious!! I hope you start to feel better soon... I'm rooting for ya. -z
Posted by hopefullynow on July 12, 2011, at 7:15:27
In reply to Re: Excipients/ Make your own nardil » Lamdage, posted by zonked on July 11, 2011, at 15:36:34
> I'm rooting for ya. -z
Mee too !!!The kind of people like you are the winners.
Those who take their fate (cautious) in their hands !!!
Posted by Lamdage on July 14, 2011, at 7:33:49
In reply to Re: Excipients/ Make your own nardil, posted by hopefullynow on July 12, 2011, at 7:15:27
I think its doing something..
its some feeling to the head.. light pressure, a hint of tingling.. feel a little drugged. Maybe 2-3 shots type of drugged.
Is that good?
Posted by Lamdage on July 14, 2011, at 7:42:10
In reply to I feel different, posted by Lamdage on July 14, 2011, at 7:33:49
Its not a pleasant feeling but not too unpleasant either. No insomnia, at all.
Posted by jedi on July 14, 2011, at 11:37:29
In reply to I feel different, posted by Lamdage on July 14, 2011, at 7:33:49
> I think its doing something..
>
> its some feeling to the head.. light pressure, a hint of tingling.. feel a little drugged. Maybe 2-3 shots type of drugged.
>
> Is that good?Lamdage,
Not sure if it is good or not. But I got that tingly sensation in the scalp when Nardil first kicked in for me. I assumed it was part of the hypomania I experienced. But you say no insomnia? I would say that is unusual when Nardil kicks in, but we are all different. If you can get the benefits without the insomnia, that's great.
Good Luck,
Jedi
Posted by Lamdage on July 15, 2011, at 4:54:16
In reply to Re: I feel different » Lamdage, posted by jedi on July 14, 2011, at 11:37:29
Pupils are growing.. somethings going on! xD
Man i remember back then people even commented on how my voice got more grounded and stable. Simply put more "alpha". How cool is that!? Lets hope it will have the same awesome effects.
Maybe my brain needs some time to recover from all this SSRI and antipsychotic garbage to respond to nardil properly. I remember in the hospital they put risperdal into my system after i told them how my parents abused me.. and then they saw me read a piece of the bible. That was sufficient to put me on a strong antipsychotic, risperdal, the next day. Its a crime sort of.
> > I think its doing something..
> >
> > its some feeling to the head.. light pressure, a hint of tingling.. feel a little drugged. Maybe 2-3 shots type of drugged.
> >
> > Is that good?
>
> Lamdage,
> Not sure if it is good or not. But I got that tingly sensation in the scalp when Nardil first kicked in for me. I assumed it was part of the hypomania I experienced. But you say no insomnia? I would say that is unusual when Nardil kicks in, but we are all different. If you can get the benefits without the insomnia, that's great.
> Good Luck,
> Jedi
>
Posted by Lamdage on July 18, 2011, at 12:31:43
In reply to Pupils grow!, posted by Lamdage on July 15, 2011, at 4:54:16
Its kicking in.. I feel VERY drugged though and i fall asleep during the day often.
Sometimes trouble to focus my eyesight on a point and with balance a little bit.I have to confess that i took humongous amounts of Phenelzine these last days.. I could not bring up the patience to wait anylonger.
Will move to a more reasonable dosage now.
Posted by zonked on July 18, 2011, at 13:40:47
In reply to Its kicking in, posted by Lamdage on July 18, 2011, at 12:31:43
Yay! I am glad for you man.:) I will be asking to go up to 90 my next appointment. Also I have found a pharmacy that will carry the Gavis generic for me (no more worrying about Pfizer/Greenstone sh*t Nardil) although others haven't reported a problem. What did it take for you to start responding? I just hope you can continue to get your Nardil without train rides to other countries lol! Keep us posted! You earned this man, I applaud you for being so proactive about your depression.
Posted by Lamdage on July 18, 2011, at 14:20:10
In reply to Re: Its kicking in » Lamdage, posted by zonked on July 18, 2011, at 13:40:47
> Yay! I am glad for you man.:) I will be asking to go up to 90 my next appointment. Also I have found a pharmacy that will carry the Gavis generic for me (no more worrying about Pfizer/Greenstone sh*t Nardil) although others haven't reported a problem. What did it take for you to start responding? I just hope you can continue to get your Nardil without train rides to other countries lol! Keep us posted! You earned this man, I applaud you for being so proactive about your depression.
Thanks man;)
Oh man the last 2-3 days must have been in the 200 - 250 range. I really wanted to destroy that MAO! And some carelessness in there, too, i got scared it wont kick in anymore and lost patience( + a piece of my mind i guess;)). I swear i would have destroyed that hospital place if they had f*ck*d up my nardil responsivity.
I hope i wont have to take more than 60mg in the long haul.Is gavis nardil supposed to me consistent with potency or why do you strive to acquire it?
Posted by zonked on July 18, 2011, at 17:20:35
In reply to Re: Its kicking in, posted by Lamdage on July 18, 2011, at 14:20:10
> > Yay! I am glad for you man.:) I will be asking to go up to 90 my next appointment. Also I have found a pharmacy that will carry the Gavis generic for me (no more worrying about Pfizer/Greenstone sh*t Nardil) although others haven't reported a problem. What did it take for you to start responding? I just hope you can continue to get your Nardil without train rides to other countries lol! Keep us posted! You earned this man, I applaud you for being so proactive about your depression.
>
> Thanks man;)
>
> Oh man the last 2-3 days must have been in the 200 - 250 range. I really wanted to destroy that MAO! And some carelessness in there, too, i got scared it wont kick in anymore and lost patience( + a piece of my mind i guess;)).I don't blame you!! Wish I had the luxury of doing that; I have to go by what my insurance company will pay for (which doesn't allow for such experimentation; I'd need a surplus of Nardil to do that.)
>
I swear i would have destroyed that hospital place if they had f*ck*d up my nardil responsivity.
>
I understand. I've read your posts about the risperdal, etc. Psych hospitals love to put people on antipsychotics (Christ_Empowered pointed this out recently) regardless of complaint; luckily my one AAP experience was enough that when I've been in the hospital I have always refused them.
> Is gavis nardil supposed to me consistent with potency or why do you strive to acquire it?Ah, yes. It's a new generic available only in the US (new as of 2011), and it's what I started on this time. See:
http://dr-bob.org/babble/20110630/msgs/990818.html
It's what I started on, and started to respond to. I noticed a backslide a little bit after I'd mostly run out of the Gavis Nardil and started the Pfizer/Greenstone (the PD 270 ones).. the last two days, I dumped out the remainder of the pills and have the few Gavis pills I had left (no more left!) and surprise, felt better! Could be all in my head, but at least my refill this week WILL be Gavis.
There was some belief on another forum that croscarmellose sodium (an excipient present in Pfizer/Greenstone Nardil but not Gavis) might result in reduced efficacy or absorption or something.
The prescribing information for Gavis phenelzine sulfate, complete with inactive ingredients, is here:
http://dailymed.nlm.nih.gov/dailymed/lookup.cfm?setid=40483372-448f-4284-976c-8462ef256661
If anyone in the US is reading this, Rite-Aid was happy to order the Gavis for me. CVS promised me at my last refill that they would, but produced a mixture of Gavis and Greenstone (Pfizer) instead.
Nardil responders unite! :D
-z
Posted by Lamdage on July 21, 2011, at 8:43:13
In reply to Re: Its kicking in » Lamdage, posted by zonked on July 18, 2011, at 17:20:35
I had a middle class hypertensive crisis at midnight two days ago. it was high blood pressure of 110/165.
Strong headache with a bit of pounding, too. I immediately went to an urgent care center and they gave me 10mg sublingual nifedipine.. Resolved the issue. The next morning i felt more dizzy than usual and saw "white light" but a little salt resolved the hypotension.
Right now i have hypotension every morning though, i see some white light almost every morning when i walk from bed upstairs to the kitchen. Some salt takes care of the issue OK.I got one more nifedipine pill and i will split it so i have two times 5mg nifedipine. Put it in small gelatine caps and put a good layer of carnauba wax around it so the capsule wont "melt". This way i can take 5mg right away when i feel it "coming on" without having to fear of doing too much. If it wont get better in 20 minutes i can take another one.
I wont go out of the house without nifedipine in my purse anymore.Just saying this so others wont make the same mistake as i did. Gotta be careful with nardil, i just learned it aint a toy.
I dont think i ate something terribly wrong but i took 7 Pills all at once.. If your taking a high dose you have to be VERY careful with foods. More so than just cheese and salami.
Zonked i wouldnt do that experiment that i did, its just way too extreme. Also i will never again take more than 4 pills at once!
Posted by Lamdage on July 23, 2011, at 9:39:47
In reply to Nardil Hypertensive Crisis, be careful with MAOI, posted by Lamdage on July 21, 2011, at 8:43:13
This stuff really works, im ready for psychology again! Will seek a therapist even though it will be hard to replace that beautiful person i had in the states.s
Im ready! Ready for life:)
Posted by Zonked on July 23, 2011, at 11:23:07
In reply to up to lala land again.. nardil is my guide, posted by Lamdage on July 23, 2011, at 9:39:47
Great news! Have you stabilized your dose yet? If so how much are you taking and how do you split them up? I wish I had the ability to self titrate, but I can't because of insurance restrictions. I want to go up to 90 at my next appointment. Response has been life altering but I want 100% remission :-)
Posted by Lamdage on July 23, 2011, at 16:50:46
In reply to Re: up to lala land again.. nardil is my guide » Lamdage, posted by Zonked on July 23, 2011, at 11:23:07
> Great news! Have you stabilized your dose yet? If so how much are you taking and how do you split them up? I wish I had the ability to self titrate, but I can't because of insurance restrictions. I want to go up to 90 at my next appointment. Response has been life altering but I want 100% remission :-)
No not yet.. Im taking everything on empty stomach 3 when getting up, 3 between breakfast and lunch and 2 between lunch and dinner!
Taking them on empty stomach with maybe some alkaline minerals in the water (i do this sometimes) is supposed to keep them from getting f*ck*d from stomach acid. With a good amount of water.
My next enteric coated nardil batch is in the makes it will take a week, thats why i do it.
I do only half an hour of enteric coating work a day to not get pissed off by it and i do 3 layers of coating now.I think 90mg will do the trick for you! Keep a healthy sleep regimen.
Posted by zonked on July 24, 2011, at 13:21:29
In reply to Re: up to lala land again.. nardil is my guide, posted by Lamdage on July 23, 2011, at 16:50:46
> Taking them on empty stomach with maybe some alkaline minerals in the water (i do this sometimes) is supposed to keep them from getting f*ck*d from stomach acid. With a good amount of water.Would calcium carbonate (Tums) suffice for this purpose?
> My next enteric coated nardil batch is in the makes it will take a week, thats why i do it.
> I do only half an hour of enteric coating work a day to not get pissed off by it and i do 3 layers of coating now.Ambitious! Have you thought about becoming a (compounding) pharmacist? Then you'd have access to the best equipment. :-)
> I think 90mg will do the trick for you! Keep a healthy sleep regimen.
I think so too!
What are you taking for sleep BTW? Any benzos during the day? I don't know how much longer I can take the antihistamine/anticholinergic hangovers... Looking into potential hypnotics to discuss at my next appointment. Will address in separate thread =)
One thing that Nardil does to me is make me wake up at Sunrise (I am not kidding) no matter WHAT time I go to bed. So weird as I have to busy myself until the world catches up with me...
-z
Posted by Lamdage on July 25, 2011, at 13:33:21
In reply to Re: up to lala land again.. nardil is my guide » Lamdage, posted by zonked on July 24, 2011, at 13:21:29
> > Taking them on empty stomach with maybe some alkaline minerals in the water (i do this sometimes) is supposed to keep them from getting f*ck*d from stomach acid. With a good amount of water.
>
> Would calcium carbonate (Tums) suffice for this purpose?Yes it would. Even better because its one of the "old" ingredients".
> > My next enteric coated nardil batch is in the makes it will take a week, thats why i do it.
> > I do only half an hour of enteric coating work a day to not get pissed off by it and i do 3 layers of coating now.
>
> Ambitious! Have you thought about becoming a (compounding) pharmacist? Then you'd have access to the best equipment. :-)I actually have;) But when i looked closer at the education for it i didnt want to do it anymore. Maybe in the states but not in lame germany.
> > I think 90mg will do the trick for you! Keep a healthy sleep regimen.
>
> I think so too!
>
> What are you taking for sleep BTW? Any benzos during the day? I don't know how much longer I can take the antihistamine/anticholinergic hangovers... Looking into potential hypnotics to discuss at my next appointment. Will address in separate thread =)I hate these, too. I take 75mg serowuel. But then again i sleep alot of the day,too. Nardil is not what it was for me once thanks to these fuckfaces at the hospital (sry dr bob). Im gonna add Lamictal im gonna add tryptophan im gonna add 100mg bupropi and im gonna add neurontin against anxiety wich i still have. It sounds extreme but by now im REALLY too pissed off to experience anymore depression.
> One thing that Nardil does to me is make me wake up at Sunrise (I am not kidding) no matter WHAT time I go to bed. So weird as I have to busy myself until the world catches up with me...
>
> -zHehe wait until the world has evolved enough to keep up with you buddy! ;)
Posted by Lamdage on July 25, 2011, at 15:46:05
In reply to Re: up to lala land again.. nardil is my guide » Lamdage, posted by zonked on July 24, 2011, at 13:21:29
> > Taking them on empty stomach with maybe some alkaline minerals in the water (i do this sometimes) is supposed to keep them from getting f*ck*d from stomach acid. With a good amount of water.
>
> Would calcium carbonate (Tums) suffice for this purpose?Yes it would. Even better because its one of the "old" ingredients".
> > My next enteric coated nardil batch is in the makes it will take a week, thats why i do it.
> > I do only half an hour of enteric coating work a day to not get pissed off by it and i do 3 layers of coating now.
>
> Ambitious! Have you thought about becoming a (compounding) pharmacist? Then you'd have access to the best equipment. :-)I actually have;) But when i looked closer at the education for it i didnt want to do it anymore. Maybe in the states but not in lame germany.
> > I think 90mg will do the trick for you! Keep a healthy sleep regimen.
>
> I think so too!
>
> What are you taking for sleep BTW? Any benzos during the day? I don't know how much longer I can take the antihistamine/anticholinergic hangovers... Looking into potential hypnotics to discuss at my next appointment. Will address in separate thread =)I hate these, too. I take 75mg serowuel. But then again i sleep alot of the day,too. Nardil is not what it was for me once thanks to these fuckfaces at the hospital (sry dr bob). Im gonna add Lamictal im gonna add tryptophan im gonna add 100mg bupropi and im gonna add neurontin against anxiety wich i still have. It sounds extreme but by now im REALLY too pissed off to experience anymore depression.
> One thing that Nardil does to me is make me wake up at Sunrise (I am not kidding) no matter WHAT time I go to bed. So weird as I have to busy myself until the world catches up with me...
>
> -zHehe wait until the world has evolved enough to keep up with you buddy! ;)
Posted by jedi on July 25, 2011, at 15:53:20
In reply to Re: up to lala land again.. nardil is my guide, posted by Lamdage on July 25, 2011, at 13:33:21
>Im gonna add Lamictal im gonna add tryptophan im gonna add 100mg bupropi and im >gonna add neurontin against anxiety wich i still have. It sounds extreme but >by now im REALLY too pissed off to experience anymore depression.
Lamdage,
Please be very careful adding additional medications to Nardil. Slow, easy, one at a time, and research everything carefully before adding anything. You had the one hypertensive episode, but there is potential for other problems. I've added contraindicated meds to Nardil, including bupropion & nortriptyline, but only after days of intense research. It is your life. Taking MAOIs brings things to another level as far as eduction with self medication. Don't count on Nifedipine to counteract any mistake in procedure. I ended up in the hospital one night on IVs when the hypertensive crisis ended and the Nifedipine kept lowering my BP. Just go slow.
Be Well my Friend,
Jedi
Posted by Lamdage on July 25, 2011, at 20:24:35
In reply to Re: lala land again.. Please be Careful my Friend » Lamdage, posted by jedi on July 25, 2011, at 15:53:20
Oops im not sure i wanted this word to appear like that.. Usually there is an automatic censor in PB.
I hereby apologize for the explicit language!What i wanted to add: I get a very uncomfortable ructus, even acid regurgitation when i accidentally take nardil close by food.
Its like a sour/acidic burping and strange feeling down my throat. Feels almost like im getting burned down my throat. Wuae!!
I hate that feeling and it tells me theres something wrong with taking nardil non enteric coated especially on full stomach. Talking about acid is not good for phenelzine!It definitely doesnt happen when i enterically coat the caps, another sign that shows me they are working.
I hear ya jedi! Thanks. Its just im very very frustrated and i want to get out of this hell for good and NOW finally.
I have been in the past but thanks to these ...unkind... hospital people i had a very screwed year including six month in the hospital with crap like risperdal, seroquel ssri etc.. very suicidal and not getting my life forward. Strange thing when they got me to hospital in the first place, i was on complete REMISSION.
Look at me now on nardil!
I should seriously sue those ...unkind... ....I will spare the lamictal i heard its among the meds that can permanently screw ones mental state. Also, last time i started it at 25mg i developed a pretty ugly rash that needed to be treated.
I may wanna try the bupropion first because i cant really expect tryptophan to add to motivation and drive right?
That is what i need right now to move things forward. I really cant dropout right now. I NEED more drive, more goal directed activity.
Thanks for your postsLd
Posted by Lamdage on July 25, 2011, at 20:35:26
In reply to Nardil uncomfy ructus/burping when taken with food, posted by Lamdage on July 25, 2011, at 20:24:35
Alright cyproheptadine in the pocket for serotonin syndrome, nifedipine 5mg for hypertensive crises. Its getting pretty wicked talking self medication but i dont really have much choice.
A new med order is on the call anyway.. need new seroquel and new safety drugs
Posted by Lamdage on July 26, 2011, at 2:08:56
In reply to Nardil uncomfy ructus/burping when taken with food, posted by Lamdage on July 25, 2011, at 20:24:35
Go for it strategy:
105mg Nardil
400mg Neurontin in the morning
100mg Bupropion in the morning yes 100mg caps. It was 26 bupropion pills. 26 times 150 is 3900 mg. divided through 100 is 39.
Crushed the bupropions, added some carnauba wax for slower release and put it into exactly 39 capsules with a
capsule maker. Fit beautifully. Its just math, you could do any dosage you want.
125mg Tryptophan in the evening Same story as with bupropion.Raising the tryptophan when the cyproheptadine is here.
Think thats not too agressive.
Posted by Lamdage on July 26, 2011, at 6:07:01
In reply to New strategy, posted by Lamdage on July 26, 2011, at 2:08:56
Again, with the 125mg tryptophan it worked beautifully. 10 minutes. I can really recommend these capsule makers and a big mortar to anyone who is into nardil reproduction, who doesnt seem to get along with the standard dosages and everyone who wants to save money.
Very very much recommended!
Posted by Lamdage on July 30, 2011, at 0:10:41
In reply to Re: New strategy, posted by Lamdage on July 26, 2011, at 6:07:01
I want to vomit from the salt in the morning...
Think its better to have a big coffee ready to drink.Lower dosage? I take 105mg with no real effects yet.
Does the hypotension mean the med is going to work?
Posted by Conundrum on August 8, 2011, at 14:50:19
In reply to up to lala land again.. nardil is my guide, posted by Lamdage on July 23, 2011, at 9:39:47
> This stuff really works, im ready for psychology again! Will seek a therapist even though it will be hard to replace that beautiful person i had in the states.s
>
> Im ready! Ready for life:)
>
>So far all I've noticed is dizziness. Good Luck.
This is the end of the thread.
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