![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 24 to 48 of 64. Go back in thread:
Posted by SLS on January 6, 2009, at 10:26:57
In reply to Parnate one of the best meds I've tried.... » JadeKelly, posted by AdamCanada2 on January 6, 2009, at 9:00:37
For what it is worth, quite a bit of time was spent looking at MAOIs during a continuing education symposium that my doctor attended. He was happy to see this.
- Scott
Posted by JadeKelly on January 6, 2009, at 11:12:41
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried...., posted by SLS on January 6, 2009, at 10:26:57
> For what it is worth, quite a bit of time was spent looking at MAOIs during a continuing education symposium that my doctor attended. He was happy to see this.
>
>
> - ScottThats cool. The thread or the post? He's quick if it was Adam's post! Also, I'm pretty sure you've seen it but I was on Johns Hopkin's Psych site, looking into Pharmocology, did you see the article by that Executive that ended up at John's Hopkins? "Money was no object", they put him on Parnate. Thats what put him into remission. He was depressive/bi-polar so I'm sure there's a cocktail. Let me know if you havent seen it. I'm curious as to dose, etc. It didn't say.
~Jade
Posted by SLS on January 6, 2009, at 11:49:08
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried.... » SLS, posted by JadeKelly on January 6, 2009, at 11:12:41
I grew up teething on Parnate. It is still a strange feeling for me to look around and see that MAOIs have had to be re-discovered. People have suffered needlessly in the interim. I am still not so confident that MAOIs will return to mainstream clinical practice.
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on January 6, 2009, at 12:30:28
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried...., posted by SLS on January 6, 2009, at 11:49:08
I know about a year ago a past babbler looked for one for me from his doc who is elsewhere and only one in whole area that is quite large. Mine now kindda laughed when I mentioned a lot of people seemed to be on Mao's. She had one patient been on them so many years she'd forgotten her. She was prescribing at the time also as is quite old and wouldn't use them again. She was the one who gave me sample of EMSAM and then said no it was too stimulating for me. So I doubt that's my opinion they will come back. Especially with this economy and all the job losses so many in bad shape. Phillipa
Posted by JadeKelly on January 6, 2009, at 13:20:35
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried...., posted by SLS on January 6, 2009, at 11:49:08
> I grew up teething on Parnate. It is still a strange feeling for me to look around and see that MAOIs have had to be re-discovered. People have suffered needlessly in the interim. I am still not so confident that MAOIs will return to mainstream clinical practice.
>
>
> - ScottNo wonder you have gum problems. Just swallow the thing. Regardless of my outcome, I am confident they will come back. There are too many people with clout who are being prescibed MAOI's. I know, where's my proof. When I started thinking about a A/D, 1st depression, I tried one or two SSRI's that made me physically ill. Thats when I started reading Babble, and anything else I could get my hands on. I went to the library at Sheppard Pratt. I know its being used at JH. My own PDoc had no problem prescribing it, after I politely told him to. I saw too many people trying to many drugs to get to remission. I'm sure there might be some combination that would have eventually worked for a while.
Your right, I have no patience. It has served me well at times. First I looked at what the most powerful A/D's were, regardless of s/e's. When you're as depressed as I have been, those side effects mean nothing (to me). So I saw RobertDavid do well on the Patch. I did well on patch. But when dosing up, it made sense to switch to Parnate. Did you see that executive at JH I told you about? He's telling anyone who will listen, and he's an influential man. When he went into JH, he told them "give me your most powerful treatment". Parnate. So I respectfully disagree. I believe MAOI's are making a comeback, and if PDocs like their jobs, they will educate themselves and start prescribing MAOI's, IMHO of course.
BTW-I believe the challenge is not the drug itself, but discovering how best to individualize augmentation, etc. and get it prescribed.
I'm curious, is this an active personal mission? Or do you follow whats happening?
~Jade
Posted by JadeKelly on January 6, 2009, at 13:33:42
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried.... » SLS, posted by Phillipa on January 6, 2009, at 12:30:28
> I know about a year ago a past babbler looked for one for me from his doc who is elsewhere and only one in whole area that is quite large. Mine now kindda laughed when I mentioned a lot of people seemed to be on Mao's. She had one patient been on them so many years she'd forgotten her. She was prescribing at the time also as is quite old and wouldn't use them again. She was the one who gave me sample of EMSAM and then said no it was too stimulating for me. So I doubt that's my opinion they will come back. Especially with this economy and all the job losses so many in bad shape. Phillipa
Lets look at that. "This economy...job losses...so many in bad shape", equals what? Lots of depressed people. Alot of the jobs being lost are to educated people who still have good health insurance.
So once again, I respectfully disagree.
~Jade
Posted by JadeKelly on January 6, 2009, at 13:36:22
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried...., posted by JadeKelly on January 6, 2009, at 13:33:42
Posted by Phillipa on January 6, 2009, at 20:13:08
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried...., posted by JadeKelly on January 6, 2009, at 13:33:42
Jade that's fine to disagree. I wonder if there is a way to find out how many docs actually use MAOI's. Anyone have any advise? Love Phillipa
Posted by Phillipa on January 6, 2009, at 21:10:06
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried.... » JadeKelly, posted by Phillipa on January 6, 2009, at 20:13:08
One last note job losses doesn't always equal depression. As many neighbors have and their kids some are going back to school, some will ride it out and wait, some say they will rent their houses and scale down. A lady 2 years to retirement just says what are you gonna do? So some depressions are situational and these real people aren't depressed maybe upset but not in distress. Some look to God or whatever their belief is. So many ways to look at a lost job. Love Phillipa
Posted by AdamCanada2 on January 7, 2009, at 8:01:46
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried.... » AdamCanada2, posted by JadeKelly on January 6, 2009, at 10:03:37
For me parnate works pretty much after the first dose. That is when I noticed a benificial effect. The week prior being on no meds except ativan (switched back to valium because my lousy pharmacist finally returned... they sure love their prolonged vacations) I felt horrendous. My baseline depression would be constant often burning head pains, anhedonia, lack of emotions, poor mood, inability to enjoy things, I would be a zombie basically. I would feel as if I was only a tiny fraction of my real self.
Then parnate I started taking again with my valium. 10mg at first divided twice a day for 3 days. The first day... my best friend called me and I was amazed how well I could talk on the phone again. Unbelievable. The day prior I would be scared out of my mind to talk to anyone. Social anxiety along with the fact that a zombie version of me would have nothing more to say besides... ''hey, hope you had a happy new year''. But now I was finally talking again. Also during the first day I found everything to be a bit more enjoyable/interesting AND my burning head pains would begin to deminish.
Now for 2 days I been on 15 mg divided by 10 + 5 and gee Sleeping is a pain in the rear end. I need a sleep aid badly. When I started on this higher dose I felt an initial boost in my mood and I could probably still feel it if it wasn't for sleep exhaustion. How can I tell how a medication is really effecting me if I cannot get normal hours of sleep? I had zero hours of sleep the first day of 15mg and today I had maybe 6 hours after waking up so many times and having to fall asleep again and again.
Here in Canada we dont have general practitioners but... family doctors. Last time I tried to get a real sleep aid such as ambien or lunesta prescribed the jerk told me I need to do that through my pdoc.
So whatever. If my pdoc refuses to help when I may be taking the best medication that I have tried over these past 6 darn years then I will take it into my own hands and order a sleep aid online because I am sick of this nonsense. Why does it seem every pdoc is less knowledgable and less competent than I am?
Maybe I should start printing out a bunch of pages of people giving their own experiences of how they NEEDED a sleep aid with Parnate to finally get it through my doctor's head. I'm just frustrated because this is my health on the line here.
Augmentations.... Ritalin for a week worked amazingly well but the insomnia issue would not improve and perhaps even get worse to the point where I began to give up on Parnate due to having seemingly ''normal'' half days and horrendous evenings.
Also coffee seemed to work well despite the so called contradiction but... at 10mg back then I guess it wasn't able to contradict Parnate much anyway but certian other foods such as protien shakes would make me dizzy.
So I can't take those P shakes that's for sure.
Lamictal you mentioned.... I should add that to the list of possible augmentations.
> > Oh I have no problem with pdoc bashing. I have gone through several and the first I had convinced my family I was making it up because this baffoon couldn't believe that Accutane could possibly cause depression. A simple google search would reveal it has even killed a Congressman's son!
> >
> > Parnate.... is one of the best medications I have tried for severe treatment resistant depression. The problem is severe insomnia and the reluctance of my current pdoc (ironically the best I have found) to prescribe me a proper sleep aid along with it.
> >
> > I am at a loss for words almost at the world of so called psychiatry. When I know more about specific medications than my own pdoc there is a serious problem with how this so called pdocs are educated.
> >
> > Who in their right mind would prescribe Parnate without a sleep aid??
> >
> Hi AdamCanada,
>
> I feel your pain believe me. I think we talked before cause I recently remember saying that, its absurd to think that patients on Parnate are not going to need help for sleep problems. Your Doc just flat out said no? Did he give you a reason? Any other meds that would interfere maybe? Cause if not, I'd show him examples of every other Doc in the world prescibing them! Maybe you GP will prescribe them, although they don't like to interfere. I'll tell you what worked for me, this might sound lame but it DOES work. Buy over the counter 3mg Melatonin (or Plus for stress relief, but check with Pharmacist for contriadications). I take one at bedtime and one if I wake up. They only last 3 hours or so, so taking 2 at once won't help you stay asleep.
>
> My PDoc didn't bother to check my BP. In retrospect, again, crazy! I wonder if anyone's does. I should be glad I geuss That I even got it but what happens when a patient comes in with unknown high BP? So how long after you took the med ACC. did you become depressed? Any ideas as to why? That really stinks. Sorry you have to deal with all that.
>
> I have the same as you TR/MDD. Can you tell me your Parnate history? When you felt "real" A/D effects and on what dose? Has A/D been constant or transient? Do you take augment ie lithium, lamictal, etc.? Another A/D with it? How long have you been on it? I'm asking for myself, I'm trying to decide what to add or maybe increase dose, which I hate to do cause I'm at 60mg. Any info about your experience would be really great. Btw- My next stop is to see a psychopharmocolgist, I understand they really know their s*it. Maybe a good place for you if your Doc doesn't wake up.
>
> Hope to hear from you, I'm running out of ideas! My effects at 60mg are transient at best, but had a ten day period of complete normalcy. Not that little "high" you get occasionally. So trying to figure out what caused that, and get back there!
>
> Good luck to both of us! Sounds like you are already in transmission? Let me know! Thanks.
>
> ~Jade
Posted by bleauberry on January 7, 2009, at 10:44:33
In reply to Long response, Augmentation exp at bottom.... » JadeKelly, posted by AdamCanada2 on January 7, 2009, at 8:01:46
Adam, your best augmentation is probably time. 3 to 6 months more. And maybe higher doses. And definitely something for sleep. I have never done an MAOI, but from reading posts over many years, it seems they really do take months to ramp up efficacy, with good days and bad days mixed in randomly along the journey.
Time and sleep are probably your best friends at this moment, not another drug. Just an opinion though. I know how it is to want something now, something fast.
Posted by JadeKelly on January 7, 2009, at 11:24:52
In reply to Long response, Augmentation exp at bottom.... » JadeKelly, posted by AdamCanada2 on January 7, 2009, at 8:01:46
Hi AdamCanada,
I'm afraid that in the beginning of treatment you are going to have to deal with some insomnia. My PDoc would probably give me something but I did well enough on the 6mg melatonin plus 1mg Klonopin. I Find also that if I am strict about my schedule my body will get used to that. Just know that in time yours will too. As for augmentations, we talked about lithium and lamictal I believe, but you'll want to talk to your PDoc first to find out when you'll get the most benefit from whatever you choose. Actually you CAN have protien shakes, but they need to be Whey, NOT SOY. Just check the ingredients carefully, ask if you're not sure. I drink the Whey but some ARE mixed with Soy so check 1st. Also, you can have coffee. They took that off the NO list. Best advice I can give you is patience. This isn't a quick fix. So do what you think is best for your sleep, but if you have insomnia, you will have it along with most others starting Parnate! I'm at 3 months+ and if I want to I can fall asleep at 7:30pm! Yours will mellow out too.
~Jade :*)
Posted by JadeKelly on January 7, 2009, at 11:39:46
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried.... » JadeKelly, posted by Phillipa on January 6, 2009, at 20:13:08
> Jade that's fine to disagree. I wonder if there is a way to find out how many docs actually use MAOI's. Anyone have any advise? Love Phillipa
Yeah, I'd be interested to know that. Seems there must be a group such as FDA that keeps track of that kind of info. Or how many pharmacys dispence MAOI's. I bet what you'd find right now is long term use by a select number of people. I've seen people on MAOI's, on other sites, with much longer use than other A/D's.
Now there's a test, of the current users of say 2+ years, how do MAOI's rate in terms of longevity. I think hands down, MAOI as a class would top that list. Just a geuss.
~Jade
Posted by JadeKelly on January 7, 2009, at 11:46:05
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried...., posted by Phillipa on January 6, 2009, at 21:10:06
> One last note job losses doesn't always equal depression. As many neighbors have and their kids some are going back to school, some will ride it out and wait, some say they will rent their houses and scale down. A lady 2 years to retirement just says what are you gonna do? So some depressions are situational and these real people aren't depressed maybe upset but not in distress. Some look to God or whatever their belief is. So many ways to look at a lost job. Love Phillipa
Yes there are, but that doesn't nullify the fact that "many" become depressed at losing their livelyhood. I would imagine especially breadwinners, men or women, who have children and families that rely on those incomes.
~Jade
Posted by Phillipa on January 7, 2009, at 20:00:02
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried...., posted by JadeKelly on January 7, 2009, at 11:46:05
I'm sure some do but not all. Like my brother in law just lost his and my Husband's twin is his wife and she needs insurance as constant back surgeries unable to work now and they just bought a farm and built stables to keep horses and were also buying and selling horses now the people can't afford. He's not depressed. And he also has thyroid issues like me. Depends on the person. Love Jan
Posted by Cseagraves on January 7, 2009, at 21:02:27
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried...., posted by JadeKelly on January 7, 2009, at 11:46:05
O.k. - i'm gonna jump into this one even though I haven't actually even started on parnate yet. (Am still weening off last week of Lexapro and then have to take my two-week break before starting the parnate). I've already posted a couple of questions concerning parnate because I am as concerned (probably overly) as the rest of you are who are new to this med. I research everything to the hilt and then some and I read every post.
Jade - one of the sites I went to was askapatient.com and looked at the reviews on parnate in addition to the other maoi's and parnate got the best of all reviews even with all of the interactions. Someone there also made a post about what his pdoc told him to do when it felt like the effects were wearing off. Something about not taking it for a period of time (cold turkey) and then starting back up again. I can't remember everything exactly, but I'm sure you could find the post on there easily and also read some of the other reviews. As for me, I'm sure I will be an even bigger pain than you on here with all of the questions I have. AND SCOTT YOU CAN JUMP IN ANYTIME!!!!
I still have so many questions and concerns, because I am already being treated for HBP, so I'm not real clear about how that is going to be handled. I will be asking my pdoc about nifedipine. Can I still exercise to the degree that I used to (running five miles a day, weight training) I did this alot before the GAD got really bad and then I became agoraphobic. My hope is that I will be able to do this on the parnate at some point since all ssri's have failed. I just want my life back. I used to be fun, active, outgoing, very sociable and feared nothing (well except flying, but I was at least willing to get on the plane and try). Not now, you couldn't even get me to the airport at this point. Was in nursing school, had a career going, always doing things with my husband and kids. Have always been health conscious and tried every natural approach when the GAD hit a couple of years ago.
Also went to several therapist hoping that they would be the "magic person" that would help. Was told that it probably stemmed from a highly abusive and stressful childhood. (Whatever!!!) I've seen people who have had worse childhoods than mine and they are not like this. Desperate and trying to get through school and raise two sons I gave in to trying ssri's (reluctantly). Tried them all pretty much with the same effect. Great for a couple of months, then would poop out. Had a very active life and don't understand what flipped the switch. Please know that I am not whining, just venting a little. I'm not depressed, just highly pissed. :-)
I guess to, I'm just wanting everyone to now a little about me since I have been reading your post for quite some time and I will be posting here alot. Sorry. My point before I got on my wagon was that I'm the new parnate "virgin" here since I haven't started it yet and I'm sure I will be posting on a daily basis when I do. And at least I will know more of what to expect thanks to all of you who have already started this med or have taken it before. I am even amazed that my pdoc, knowing how much i was struggling, never suggested maoi's. I brought it up to him, which he was O.K. with, but he was not sure what to do when I asked him about me already taking meds for HBP. I had to call my GP for that one.
I am learning quickly that I will have to be the informed one and seek out most of my answers. Please be ready because I am sure I will be bombarding you with questions over the next couple of weeks and then some. I am thankful for all of the people here and the advice given in your posts to others. Hopefully I can be of some help to others when they first start this med. Didn't mean to babble so long, but I have been on a rollercoaster all day coming off this lexapro. Head won't stop spinning. Think I'll go lay down now. Nice to meet everyone. I'm sure you will be hearing from me again soon. Namaste'
Courtney
Posted by AdamCanada2 on January 8, 2009, at 12:42:10
In reply to Re: Long response, Augmentation exp at bottom.... » AdamCanada2, posted by JadeKelly on January 7, 2009, at 11:24:52
The problem was that even before when I was on Parnate 10mg for about a month (sensitive to meds), along with weeks on other dosages before that I would have ongoing insomnia to the point where I couldn't be reliable when it came to doing photoshoots or visiting friends.
Higher doses gave me too many side effects and even kneeling down to grab the conditioner would make me dizzy for almost a minute to the point where I would almost fall down in the shower... That would be on 30-40mg Parnate.
So now on 15mg... I tried 5mg melatonin right before going to bed and omg 8-9 hours of sleep? No way. lol. Normally 6 hours of sleep on Parnate would be a ''good'' day.
I hope this amount of sleep continues.
> Hi AdamCanada,
>
> I'm afraid that in the beginning of treatment you are going to have to deal with some insomnia. My PDoc would probably give me something but I did well enough on the 6mg melatonin plus 1mg Klonopin. I Find also that if I am strict about my schedule my body will get used to that. Just know that in time yours will too. As for augmentations, we talked about lithium and lamictal I believe, but you'll want to talk to your PDoc first to find out when you'll get the most benefit from whatever you choose. Actually you CAN have protien shakes, but they need to be Whey, NOT SOY. Just check the ingredients carefully, ask if you're not sure. I drink the Whey but some ARE mixed with Soy so check 1st. Also, you can have coffee. They took that off the NO list. Best advice I can give you is patience. This isn't a quick fix. So do what you think is best for your sleep, but if you have insomnia, you will have it along with most others starting Parnate! I'm at 3 months+ and if I want to I can fall asleep at 7:30pm! Yours will mellow out too.
>
> ~Jade :*)
Posted by JadeKelly on January 8, 2009, at 17:47:08
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried...., posted by Cseagraves on January 7, 2009, at 21:02:27
>Hi Courtney, I think I answered a post to you on another site, so if I repeat myself...
O.k. - i'm gonna jump into this one even though I haven't actually even started on parnate yet. (Am still weening off last week of Lexapro and then have to take my two-week break before starting the parnate). I've already posted a couple of questions concerning parnate because I am as concerned (probably overly) as the rest of you are who are new to this med. I research everything to the hilt and then some and I read every post.
The less surprises the better!
>
> Jade - one of the sites I went to was askapatient.com and looked at the reviews on parnate in addition to the other maoi's and parnate got the best of all reviews even with all of the interactions. Someone there also made a post about what his pdoc told him to do when it felt like the effects were wearing off. Something about not taking it for a period of time (cold turkey) and then starting back up again. I can't remember everything exactly, but I'm sure you could find the post on there easily and also read some of the other reviews. As for me, I'm sure I will be an even bigger pain than you on here with all of the questions I have. AND SCOTT YOU CAN JUMP IN ANYTIME!!!!AaahhH, did you just call me a big pain with my questions??!! Haha, you HAVE been following my posts! I'm not clear about your question. Do you want to know what to do at 40mg for 3 weeks and any effects you have thus far start to wear off? Personally, I would move on to 50mg and stay there for up to 3 weeks. If you mean consistant steady remission for years that finally wears down/off, I can't comment on that. If its a big concern, I would post that as a specific question. And talk to your PDoc.
>
> I still have so many questions and concerns, because I am already being treated for HBP, so I'm not real clear about how that is going to be handled.Me either, frankly. Did you say that you and your PDoc and cardiologist, or whoever you see for high BP have agreed on this line of treatment? As I think I mentioned before, Parnate is the least forgiving when it comes to BP problems. I would watch this VERY carefully with your Docs if they OK'd this.
I will be asking my pdoc about nifedipine.
Thats what I have.Can I still exercise to the degree that I used to (running five miles a day, weight training) I did this alot before the GAD got really bad and then I became agoraphobic. My hope is that I will be able to do this on the parnate at some point since all ssri's have failed. I just want my life back. I used to be fun, active, outgoing, very sociable and feared nothing (well except flying, but I was at least willing to get on the plane and try). Not now, you couldn't even get me to the airport at this point. Was in nursing school, had a career going, always doing things with my husband and kids. Have always been health conscious and tried every natural approach when the GAD hit a couple of years ago.
>
> Also went to several therapist hoping that they would be the "magic person" that would help. Was told that it probably stemmed from a highly abusive and stressful childhood. (Whatever!!!) I've seen people who have had worse childhoods than mine and they are not like this. Desperate and trying to get through school and raise two sons I gave in to trying ssri's (reluctantly). Tried them all pretty much with the same effect. Great for a couple of months, then would poop out. Had a very active life and don't understand what flipped the switch. Please know that I am not whining, just venting a little. I'm not depressed, just highly pissed. :-)
Courtney, not to cut you off, but if you're not depressed, (Parnate is generally prescribed for TR,depression), and you have high BP, why Parnate? You say you have GAD, Parnate is stimulating and seems an unlikely choice for your condition. Even Nardil is known to be a better MAOI for anxiety AND BP issues. I would re-think this choice, and maybe run a thread asking for best current meds for GAD for someone with High BP. Why do YOU think Parnate a good choice?
>
> I guess to, I'm just wanting everyone to now a little about me since I have been reading your post for quite some time and I will be posting here alot. Sorry. My point before I got on my wagon was that I'm the new parnate "virgin" here since I haven't started it yet and I'm sure I will be posting on a daily basis when I do. And at least I will know more of what to expect thanks to all of you who have already started this med or have taken it before. I am even amazed that my pdoc, knowing how much i was struggling, never suggested maoi's. I brought it up to him, which he was O.K. with, but he was not sure what to do when I asked him about me already taking meds for HBP. I had to call my GP for that one.
>
> I am learning quickly that I will have to be the informed one and seek out most of my answers. Please be ready because I am sure I will be bombarding you with questions over the next couple of weeks and then some. I am thankful for all of the people here and the advice given in your posts to others. Hopefully I can be of some help to others when they first start this med. Didn't mean to babble so long, but I have been on a rollercoaster all day coming off this lexapro. Head won't stop spinning. Think I'll go lay down now. Nice to meet everyone. I'm sure you will be hearing from me again soon. Namaste'
>
> CourtneyWelcome to Babble Courtney! Really hope you'll consider an alternative approach, and ask around about additional choices.
~Jade
Posted by JadeKelly on January 8, 2009, at 18:14:58
In reply to Melatonin 5mg helped sleep! Hope not a coincidence » JadeKelly, posted by AdamCanada2 on January 8, 2009, at 12:42:10
> The problem was that even before when I was on Parnate 10mg for about a month (sensitive to meds), along with weeks on other dosages before that I would have ongoing insomnia to the point where I couldn't be reliable when it came to doing photoshoots or visiting friends.
>
> Higher doses gave me too many side effects and even kneeling down to grab the conditioner would make me dizzy for almost a minute to the point where I would almost fall down in the shower... That would be on 30-40mg Parnate.
>
> So now on 15mg... I tried 5mg melatonin right before going to bed and omg 8-9 hours of sleep? No way. lol. Normally 6 hours of sleep on Parnate would be a ''good'' day.
>
> I hope this amount of sleep continues.
>
>
> > Hi AdamCanada,
> >
> > I'm afraid that in the beginning of treatment you are going to have to deal with some insomnia. My PDoc would probably give me something but I did well enough on the 6mg Melatonin plus 1mg Klonopin. I Find also that if I am strict about my schedule my body will get used to that. Just know that in time yours will too. As for augmentations, we talked about lithium and lamictal I believe, but you'll want to talk to your PDoc first to find out when you'll get the most benefit from whatever you choose. Actually you CAN have protien shakes, but they need to be Whey, NOT SOY. Just check the ingredients carefully, ask if you're not sure. I drink the Whey but some ARE mixed with Soy so check 1st. Also, you can have coffee. They took that off the NO list. Best advice I can give you is patience. This isn't a quick fix. So do what you think is best for your sleep, but if you have insomnia, you will have it along with most others starting Parnate! I'm at 3 months+ and if I want to I can fall asleep at 7:30pm! Yours will mellow out too.
> >
> > ~Jade :*)
Hi Adam!Hope you are doin well, glad to hear you are getting some sleep! You are probably the one person who took my advice about the Melatonin. I think when other prescibed meds aren't even working, its hard to consider that something so easily aquired, off the OTC shelf at any pharmacy, could be so effective. It gives you a good sleep too, doesnt it?
Melatonin:
I doubt its a coincidence, but you may want to play around with it a bit as you need it:
~3mg bedtime (1/2 hour before)
~3mg bedtime, 3mg again if I wake-up
~6mg bedtime, if I know I'm gonna have troubleMy PDoc said 6mg was fine-I buy the Melatonin-Plus, if you do this check to see that added ingredients arent contraindicated with your meds.It could be another 3mg would be ok, that would need an ok from PDoc.
Keep me "posted"!
~Jade
>
>
Posted by Cseagraves on January 8, 2009, at 19:59:21
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried.... » Cseagraves, posted by JadeKelly on January 8, 2009, at 17:47:08
Jade,
LOL!!! Please know that I wasnt calling you a "pain". I think I read in one of your post, that "you weren't trying to be a pain". I was just stating that I will probably, be a bigger one because I am quite anal. Ha Ha!
I was refering you to that web-site because you were talking about those great days you experienced on parnate and then they went. I just remember seeing a post on there from someone who had been on parnate for awhile and when it stopped working as well, his doc told him what to try. Not real sure where I was going with that one.
Anyhoo, I suggested parnate to my pdoc because I have pooped out on ssri's and he mentioned possibly apathy syndrome (which I read about here also). I asked about parnate because nardil causes weight gain (which I know should not be a huge concern when peace of mind should be a priority), but I had also seen so many more positive reviews on parnate vs. nardil and I am tired of feeling like a guinea pig.
I saw several post of people trying nardil and then having to switch to parnate anyway. I have been reading some posts about sari's. Want to do some research on those, maybe they might be something to try before trying the parnate. I JUST WANT SOMETHING TO WORK!!!! Want my life back.
Just so you know, reading your posts have helped alot. If I should decide on parnate, you'll be the first to know. You're a sweety!!! Thanks for all the info. Think I'll start a thread and ask about info on sari's.
CS
Posted by JadeKelly on January 8, 2009, at 22:22:18
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried...., posted by Cseagraves on January 8, 2009, at 19:59:21
> Jade,
>
> LOL!!! Please know that I wasnt calling you a "pain". I think I read in one of your post, that "you weren't trying to be a pain". I was just stating that I will probably, be a bigger one because I am quite anal. Ha Ha!OMG-no, its fine!. If you HAVE been following my posts, you'll see that having a sense of humor is a survival mechanism for me, not everyone appreciates it. I can be just as miserable as the next guy and something will just seem funny to me, I don't know. FYI-I'm not sensitive, but some are, you'll have to judge for youself I geuss.
I was a little taken aback with this post. You sound alot like I was.
>
> I was refering you to that web-site because you were talking about those great days you experienced on parnate and then they went. I just remember seeing a post on there from someone who had been on parnate for awhile and when it stopped working as well, his doc told him what to try. Not real sure where I was going with that one.Oh, well in that case, why didn't you say so!! I'll check that out tonight. The 10 days I had felt like what remission would feel like. Not the rush you get on and off on some meds. I just felt like myself. It was a little disappointing to have it do a disappearing act after 10 days, right when I was sure I was in remission. But if thats a taste of whats coming, I'm gonna be on this Parnate for a while.
>
> Anyhoo, I suggested parnate to my pdoc because I have pooped out on ssri's and he mentioned possibly apathy syndrome (which I read about here also). I asked about parnate because nardil causes weight gain (which I know should not be a huge concern when peace of mind should be a priority), but I had also seen so many more positive reviews on parnate vs. nardil and I am tired of feeling like a guinea pig.
At some point in my depression, not sure when, I became severely apathetic, suffered from anhedonia big time, and was generally just numb. Strange thing is, it was a relief. I didn't care about anything. I have a friend on here and she was freaking out about something I did or said, and I told her "I don't care". I had to tell her that alot. Of course I'm not saying don't care what you post, I'm pointing out how I felt at the time and wonder if its like that for you too. It was like I had no feelings so I didn't have to worry about anything. A dullness. I miss those days, sick huh? But we do have to get back to our lives. I think Parnate pulled me out of that stage, and I have to keep going until I'm myself again. Also, just wondering, did your depression or GAD come on kinda suddenly (mine was provoked by situational events) and you were normal/happy before that? Is this your first "episode"?
>
> I saw several post of people trying nardil and then having to switch to parnate anyway. I have been reading some posts about sari's. Want to do some research on those, maybe they might be something to try before trying the parnate. I JUST WANT SOMETHING TO WORK!!!! Want my life
back.Boy am I familiar with that refrain. haha! I thought I invented it. How dare some disease come and steal my life away!! One day I was me, and now this. I just want to be me again.
>
> Just so you know, reading your posts have helped alot. If I should decide on parnate, you'll be the first to know. You're a sweety!!! Thanks for all the info. Think I'll start a thread and ask about info on sari's.Do what you think is best, if thats Parnate, you'll get lots of support here. Just have a plan for your BP please. I'm sure you read somewhere about the problem early on I had with hypertension. Thats probably why it concerns me. If your Doc says its ok, I'm sure it is. I wonder too about your diagnosis. I see here Apathy. Makes sense to use Parnate for that. I thought you were taking it for an anxiety disorder, its generally not great for that. Wondering if our symptoms are similar.
Glad my posts have been of help, feel free to pass around the board what a "sweety" I am. LOL
I'll look for ya on the board!
~Jade
>
> CS
Posted by Cseagraves on January 9, 2009, at 13:31:07
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried.... » Cseagraves, posted by JadeKelly on January 8, 2009, at 22:22:18
Jade -
Hey ya!
Just wanted you to know after I read your post I started looking up info and reviews on trazodone. I called a friend of mine who is a nurse and she agreed that seemed to fit my situation better. Had heard of trazadone in school,(for insomnia) but not under the term SARI's. All I can think of is that the medical field must have just given this category of drugs a label. Tried to google sari's, got nothing as far as med).
I agree, I think I would feel better giving this a try as it seems to work on sleep AND anxiety AND agoraphobia. Called pdoc today and requested to give this a try, so I will definatley keep you posted as hopefully I will be starting it tonight.
Also wanted to mention that probably one of the contributors to my situation is that I had polycystic ovarian disease since I was a teenager, which finally resulted in a radical hysterctomy 5 years ago. So basically my hormones have always been on the low side which sent my body into adrenal stress syndrome. (I wouldn't take artificial hormone therapy. Didn't make sense to me to take horse hormones).
When I had my hormone levels tested about a year ago, I was in the negative on estrogen and progesterone. I was blown away when I googled low-estrogen effects. Anxiety, depression, panic disorders among several other things all came up. I wish I could stress to females who are 35 and older, (and my GP totally agrees)who start feeling these things, should have a full hormonal work-up.
Most of these symptoms will resolve themselves, once you get your hormones leveled. I started on bio-identical hormones about 6 months ago, hope they help, but will take time to build up and get body back straight. I also developed osteoporosis because of the inability to absorb calcium and vitamin D. (Couldn't figure out why I kept breaking so many bones so easily). Sucked!!
I guess you could say when I thought I had most things figured out and how to fix them, the GAD and agorophobia set in. (if its not one thing its another, lol). My pdoc says it was a combination of my health, a highly stressful childhood, watching my mom pass away from pancreatic cancer, being with my sister as she goes through cervical cancer (we are very tight) and just the high levels of stress that we put ourselves through on a daily basis, finally just came to a head.
But, I have a game plan, as I WILL get out of this place. I just need to find a med that can stabilize the anxiety enough so that I can re-train my brain.
Wanted to thank you again for bringing it up. Like I said, in med school I only remembered it as a med for insomnia. Wish we could meet, seems like we would hit it off well.
Good luck with all that you are going through and I'll be close by for support. Remember to try and stay true to who you are. This condition DOES NOT define who you are. I try to believe that everything that happens to us is a blessing (although it may not seem that way), but it teaches something about ourselves and we become stronger.
Courtney
Posted by JadeKelly on January 10, 2009, at 19:22:00
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried...., posted by Cseagraves on January 9, 2009, at 13:31:07
Hi Courtney,
We WILL get outa this da*n place!! Haha. I, too, along with my family, got slammed with so many losses and hard times, all at once, that it sure isn't a surprise I'm depressed I geuss. It just really caught me off guard because I've never been depressed before, and frankly? I didnt know a person could feel so bad. And for so long. I thought it would pass as a situational thing. I now believe if I dont hit this hard, with the right A/D, it'll do anything but get worse.
So you are gonna go another route for now? Is that based soley on BP issues? Whatever you decide I HOPE it works for you. Let me know. I'm assuming you'll start this treatment soon? Excuse me if I've missed anything I'm a little tired (thats my default excuse when I'm feeling cognitively impaired, try it, it works pretty well) haha. Anyway, I hope your sister is doing well, thats a pretty treatable form of cancer, isn't it? I pray for a good outcome for her and some peace for you while you go through it with her. I, too, am very close to family, seeing them in pain, or losing someone is devastating.
So actually, that we both seem to be able to keep a sense of humor, you seem to stay cheerful? is that the word? And I stay sarchastic, well, whatever gets us through, eh?
Btw-I had an emergency "female" surgery just before all the other stuff happened, the only real things I've done was one follow up, for labs that came back normal, (low end normal for thyroid) and OB-gyn told me to continue my bc pills for the estrogen and that would cover it. I tried adding thyroid and estrogen, both made me very irritable so I stopped. I'm clueless. If you know anything please share!! Babblemail me if you want to talk about the "girl" stuff. I'm curious to know what you know.
Keep in touch and let me know what works for ya. You'll probably have just as many questions about your new medication(s) as you did Parnate. So I will "talk" with you soon!
~Jade
Posted by JadeKelly on January 16, 2009, at 21:16:54
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried.... » SLS, posted by Phillipa on January 6, 2009, at 12:30:28
> I know about a year ago a past babbler looked for one for me from his doc who is elsewhere and only one in whole area that is quite large. Mine now kindda laughed when I mentioned a lot of people seemed to be on Mao's. She had one patient been on them so many years she'd forgotten her. She was prescribing at the time also as is quite old and wouldn't use them again. She was the one who gave me sample of EMSAM and then said no it was too stimulating for me. So I doubt that's my opinion they will come back. Especially with this economy and all the job losses so many in bad shape. Phillipa
Gosh, I'm sorry your PDoc lives 8 hours away, seems like you must live in farm country! Lucky you! So she laughed about the medication that I take, Parnate? The one that has officially pulled me out from he*l and given me my life back? Wow. I'm really sorry Phillipa, are you sure you are getting proper care? Don't settle for less. I got lucky today, I'm quite thrilled actually, I have an appt. with a Johns Hopkins PDoc (MAOI expert) who has quite a reputation for keeping his patients in remission. I think they call it "thinking outside the box". This way, should I have any problem, I'll have the best care.
"So I doubt thats my opinion they will come back"
I'm a little slow this eve....what?
And the coorelation of "job losses and so many people in bad shape" to decline in use of MAOI's is?
Thanks, hope you have time to clarify!
Love, Jade
Posted by JadeKelly on January 16, 2009, at 21:28:13
In reply to Re: Parnate one of the best meds I've tried.... » JadeKelly, posted by Phillipa on January 7, 2009, at 20:00:02
> I'm sure some do but not all. Like my brother in law just lost his and my Husband's twin is his wife and she needs insurance as constant back surgeries unable to work now and they just bought a farm and built stables to keep horses and were also buying and selling horses now the people can't afford. He's not depressed. And he also has thyroid issues like me. Depends on the person. Love Jan
You know you are so right! Some people just suck it up and do what they have to do without a lot of complaining. Now those people have some things they could go on and on and on about, and thyroid issues to boot. But they aren't depressed? I geuss you probably talked with them about that being family and all. Well I say more power to em.
And I so agree, Phillipa, it always depends on the person, too ;-)Love, Jade
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