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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 31. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 15:08:08
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP7zlugkGCU
Put it to the stop.
Posted by dbc on February 23, 2007, at 16:29:27
In reply to Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 15:08:08
I want to see her response after withdrawing from 300mg of effexor.
Posted by Jay on February 23, 2007, at 16:54:56
In reply to Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 15:08:08
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP7zlugkGCU
>
> Put it to the stop.Na, don't believe the negative stuff. That's just as bias as the 'advertisments'. Xanax really saved my life many times over, as have most of the benzos.
Enjoy this instead...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IZVJ-4R7x1I
Posted by willyee on February 23, 2007, at 17:43:37
In reply to Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 15:08:08
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP7zlugkGCU
>
> Put it to the stop.
As seinfeld would say,to this video i say YADA YADA,im also not surprised she has written a book either.I see constant talk,& a posted thread on a video
regarding benzo,mainly xanax and the addiction potential.Ok lets see,we "cry" because we want drugs that work,when there are some we "cry" about not being able to get off,and how addicting it is.
Ok first,if something works,unless it treats and CURES,then it is very unlikly it WONT BE addicting,it works thats why its addicting,its the stuff that makes us sick,does nothing but empty our wallets,that we arent addicted to and keep forcing down our bodies cause docs tell us too.
Also the woman in the video,mentions she took it because she had minor anxiety.Ok benzos are a serious decision,and arent for that,aside from specific reasions,such as panic attacks etc,BENZOS should only be used when the anxiety being treated has made its way to plain disrupting severly ones life,making it hard for them to perform at work,possably even loosing a job as i once left for lunch on a very very great new job and couldent come back on training,...to affecting being around family friends etc,in this way choosing even not to use a benzo would be a hard life of coping with the anxiety,not a generaly nervous person who gets a lil jumpy but settles in a lotof situations,no full blown anxiety,these are the people who the drug benifits.
Also as she mentions i believe she uses it monotherapy,that to me is another bad idea,one site even recomends the general use of caffiene,mainly because monotherapy of a benzo will much more likly in my view to become a problem in the area of tolerance,and addiction.
Most people who choose to go on a benzo had life crippling anxiety,so knowing the drug wont actualy cure this,should not expect anything less then worsened anxiety on withdrawal,worsened from the brain having adapted to the drug,and worsened with the fact they forget which is the swallowed that first pill for a reason.
Its the docs place,hopefully competitant docs,to dig,explain this to the patient and make sure its the right move,something a 5 min med check is sufficient for.Main thing is to let the patient who is a candiate STILL understand regardless that it is likly they will be on this drug for the remainder of there life unless they later HAVE a alternative method to treating the anxiety,they wont however stop the drug and simply have the begining anxiety disappear.
Posted by saturn on February 23, 2007, at 18:23:06
In reply to Re: Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by willyee on February 23, 2007, at 17:43:37
>
>>> Ok first,if something works,unless it treats and CURES,then it is very unlikly it WONT BE addicting,it works thats why its addicting,I'd have to respectully disagree that it "works because it's addicting". It works beacause it works. Something can also not work and be addictive. There's not causal relation as I can see it.
>>>>Also the woman in the video,mentions she took it because she had minor anxiety.Ok benzos are a serious decision,and arent for that,aside from specific reasions,such as panic attacks etc,BENZOS should only be used when the anxiety being treated has made its way to plain disrupting severly ones life,making it hard for them to perform at work,possably even loosing a job...
I couldn't agree more. From her description she probably shouldn't have been on a benzo in the first place.
>> Main thing is to let the patient who is a candiate STILL understand regardless that it is likly they will be on this drug for the remainder of there life unless they later HAVE a alternative method to treating the anxiety,they wont however stop the drug and simply have the begining anxiety disappear.I second...well put.
Posted by saturn on February 23, 2007, at 18:24:08
In reply to Re: Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax » willyee, posted by saturn on February 23, 2007, at 18:23:06
Wow, I'd never thought about how pregnancy could potentially put someone in a withdrawal situation.
Posted by willyee on February 23, 2007, at 19:23:05
In reply to Re: Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax » willyee, posted by saturn on February 23, 2007, at 18:23:06
> >
> >>> Ok first,if something works,unless it treats and CURES,then it is very unlikly it WONT BE addicting,it works thats why its addicting,
>
> I'd have to respectully disagree that it "works because it's addicting". It works beacause it works. Something can also not work and be addictive. There's not causal relation as I can see it.
>
>
>
You might still disagree,but i think i put it wrong,more to the likes of IF something does work,its likly to be addicting UNLESS it actualy cures,if it just treats it has a high chance of being addicting.But i agree too things that dont work are addicting as well,hence my horror from withdrawing off efexor at age 19 with no help or warning from the doc,ah first drug,such fond memories,i hear him now,...."dont worry,this new drug have u feeling great in 2 weeks" oh how i wish i missed that appt.Thanks for reading btw.
> >>>>Also the woman in the video,mentions she took it because she had minor anxiety.Ok benzos are a serious decision,and arent for that,aside from specific reasions,such as panic attacks etc,BENZOS should only be used when the anxiety being treated has made its way to plain disrupting severly ones life,making it hard for them to perform at work,possably even loosing a job...
>
> I couldn't agree more. From her description she probably shouldn't have been on a benzo in the first place.
>
>
> >> Main thing is to let the patient who is a candiate STILL understand regardless that it is likly they will be on this drug for the remainder of there life unless they later HAVE a alternative method to treating the anxiety,they wont however stop the drug and simply have the begining anxiety disappear.
>
> I second...well put.
>
>
>
>
Posted by halcyondaze on February 23, 2007, at 20:08:54
In reply to Re: Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by willyee on February 23, 2007, at 19:23:05
I've withdrawn from a lot of antidepressants. I've withdrawn from OxyContin. I've withdrawn from heroin.
Nothing - NOTHING - compares to the hell of what I went through during Xanax withdrawal. Benzo withdrawal can literally kill you. It almost killed me. It took two months with a Phenobarbital detox at an outpatient facility (the only one that does benzo detox outpatient, pretty much) for me to get off of it and it was still utter, absolute hell.
Posted by mattye on February 23, 2007, at 20:21:18
In reply to Re: Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by halcyondaze on February 23, 2007, at 20:08:54
What was it like?
> I've withdrawn from a lot of antidepressants. I've withdrawn from OxyContin. I've withdrawn from heroin.
>
> Nothing - NOTHING - compares to the hell of what I went through during Xanax withdrawal. Benzo withdrawal can literally kill you. It almost killed me. It took two months with a Phenobarbital detox at an outpatient facility (the only one that does benzo detox outpatient, pretty much) for me to get off of it and it was still utter, absolute hell.
Posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 20:25:09
In reply to Re: Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by Jay on February 23, 2007, at 16:54:56
I am on a very well, i take 6mg of Xanax daily.
I do agree what she was saying she was being a little to antidrug, but if it was a real story and she was addicted to it, maybe i agree. But need i say more, When people take Xanax, does it just stablize them, for me it relaxes, well calms down a panic attack, i dont know why it would be really abused, because its just really just tuning out reality. I can understand abusing amphetamines, and pain medication, they have a reward high.
So i didnt post this to cause conterversy i just wanted to see what you guys think.
Rj
Posted by halcyondaze on February 23, 2007, at 20:25:41
In reply to Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 15:08:08
I don't think that she qualified as "addicted" - that is characterized by drug-seeking behavior and dose escalations without the physician's approval, taking great measures to obtain the drug of choice, etc. She was physically dependent on Xanax, which is different.
It is not possible to be "addicted" to antidepressants [exceptions in literature: Parnate and Amentapine] or antipsychotics. Withdrawal is not addiction. If I stopped my beta blocker, I would experience withdrawal effects. This is NOT addiction.
Please note: My experience with Xanax was that it is a profoundly psychologically and physically addicting drug. I was truly addicted to it. It was not prescribed and I was up to 15 mg/day, all purchased on the street or obtained through other means.
THAT BEING SAID, I went through a severe traumatic experience a month ago, took 0.25 to .5 mg for anxiety only, and had a totally different experience with it. It was very helpful in the short term and when not used to get high.
However, I still believe that Xanax can be a very dangerous drug - it is highly abused on the street, has a lot of street value, and is more profoundly euphoric (in my experience and the general experience of drug users and psychiatrists) than any other benzo.
I am not anti-benzo at all. I am just pro-careful prescribing and monitoring. Just like I wouldn't deprive a chronic pain patient of painkillers, I wouldn't deprive a severely anxious patient of benzodiazepines if they were indicated. However, I would be sure to watch out for signs of abuse in both cases because, in my opinion, both are highly addictive drugs that can be prescribed wrongly but that have a legitiate place in medicine.
Posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 20:33:48
In reply to She wasn't addicted. She was dependent., posted by halcyondaze on February 23, 2007, at 20:25:41
I take 6mg. For panic attacks. My doctor said Clonazepam, but ugh i hate that drug.
Are you serious that it is more worse, i have heard this but didnt believe it, that it is worse than herion like you said, so i guess Phenobarbital is the "methadone" for Xanax.
Oh God.
Posted by halcyondaze on February 23, 2007, at 20:34:44
In reply to Re: Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by mattye on February 23, 2007, at 20:21:18
> What was it like?
First I tried to get off by myself, cold turkey. Stupidly! I know enough to know not to do that but I was so desperate. I had a seizure. I was hyperventilating and having panic attacks (I've never had an anxiety disorder before). My muscles would randomly twitch and jerk. I could barely walk. I was disoriented and had hypersomnia and occasionally was able to stagger to the calendar and count how many days I had been detoxing and how many days until my break was over and I had to go back to work. Lights hurt my eyes. I felt like someone had hooked up electrodes to every part of my body, especially my brain, and were randomly shocking me (ten million times worse than SSRI/SNRI withdrawal). I couldn't eat. I was so constipated that my stomach bloated and stuck out like I was pregnant. I could barely speak in more than one-word sentences. Noises, even just a ticking watch, sounded like they were resonating in my head. Everything was too loud. I couldn't urinate. My heart was skipping beats. My hands were shaking so badly I broke half of my glasswear trying to pour a glass of water. I couldn't concentrate on anything. I couldn't shower. I couldn't get changed. It was all too much effort and too difficult to think about. Everything was distorted - it was like an acid trip, my bathroom door seemed to be a million feet tall, and then sometimes I would feel huge and then small, like Alice eating the wrong cookie. When I looked in the mirror I didn't recognize myself. I often didn't recognize anything in my own bedroom. I felt like I was watching this happen to myself. I couldn't go outside.
This lasted for one week, I bought some Xanax, and managed to stagger into detox the next day.
These symptoms, though not as severe, lasted throughout the Phenobarbital detox and for one month after getting off Phenobarb.
>
> > I've withdrawn from a lot of antidepressants. I've withdrawn from OxyContin. I've withdrawn from heroin.
> >
> > Nothing - NOTHING - compares to the hell of what I went through during Xanax withdrawal. Benzo withdrawal can literally kill you. It almost killed me. It took two months with a Phenobarbital detox at an outpatient facility (the only one that does benzo detox outpatient, pretty much) for me to get off of it and it was still utter, absolute hell.
>
>
Posted by halcyondaze on February 23, 2007, at 20:38:21
In reply to Re: Well it just so happens..., posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 20:25:09
> I can understand abusing amphetamines, and pain medication, they have a reward high.
>So do benzos. It all depends what you like. Xanax + alcohol, especially, is profoundly euphoric. There are people who don't like amphetamines and don't understand how anyone could ever abuse them (in fact, my first addiction was to Adderall, sold to me by a kid with ADHD in high school who HATED taking it). Some people hate the side effects of pain meds and don't experience enough euphoria to use it again. Many people hate cocaine. Just because you don't find it euphoric (because it really does help with your anxiety) doesn't mean that others - especially those of us who took it to abuse it - don't.
Posted by halcyondaze on February 23, 2007, at 20:45:03
In reply to Re: Ok, what happens when i withdrawl from Xanax?, posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 20:33:48
> I take 6mg. For panic attacks. My doctor said Clonazepam, but ugh i hate that drug.
>
> Are you serious that it is more worse, i have heard this but didnt believe it, that it is worse than herion like you said, so i guess Phenobarbital is the "methadone" for Xanax.
>
> Oh God.
>Why are you talking about going off it, if it helps you?
That being said, if you do decide to withdraw, you would do it differently than I did. I am polysubstance dependent. They could not slowly withdraw me using Xanax, because the Xanax was never Rx'ed to begin with. Nor could they use Klonopin, because I'd probably abuse that too. So they used Phenobarb, which has very minimal euphoria and which I was able to take multiple times a day without getting that "benzo feeling." Also, they wouldn't have been able to determine by my drug tests if I was off Xanax, if they had given me a benzo to withdraw with. Keep in mind this was a detox facility!!
I would say, if you ever want to get off, go down by 0.25 mg or 0.5 mg at first. Yes, that low. See how you feel for at least - AT LEAST - one week. If it's a go, reduce by another 0.25 or 0.5 mg. You can always go back up and stay at a higher dose for another few weeks if you need to. Or you can always speed up the withdrawal process if you're not having severe withdrawal effects.
Going too fast will just make you disheartened about ever getting off the medication, because you'll be in so much pain that you'll feel chained to your prescription. Remember, you have as long as you need. There is no reason to go fast with withdrawal. In fact, some people who withdraw this slowly, which sometimes takes over six months to one year, don't experience ANY withdrawal effects AT ALL.
I am an extreme case.
>
Posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 20:45:44
In reply to Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 15:08:08
This shows how bad amphetamines really can make you, they made fun of it in this. I didnt think it was funny, because it reminded me of when i was on adderall and i could function good. Now im not.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpeqCzIfFis
Tell me how stupid this is.
And no you not stuppost to feel good on adderall unless you abusing it.
rj
Posted by halcyondaze on February 23, 2007, at 20:50:59
In reply to Re: Ok watch this one on adderall, this is paraody, posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 20:45:44
> This shows how bad amphetamines really can make you, they made fun of it in this. I didnt think it was funny, because it reminded me of when i was on adderall and i could function good. Now im not.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpeqCzIfFis
>
> Tell me how stupid this is.
>
> And no you not stuppost to feel good on adderall unless you abusing it.
>
> rj
Ugh ... I still find stuff like that triggering. Xanax, give or take. Coke, give or take. But heroin or meth or Adderall .. sigh. At my worst I was using 400 mg of Adderall a day, injecting some of it, and doing very dangerous things to cook it since it's not water soluble. I was in amphetamine psychosis for six months. Thank GOD I came out of it. And yet I still miss it. I wonder why.By the way, I'm clean 2 months. [Longest clean time was three years] Had a relapse on heroin, ended up in the ER overdosing when someone called 911 after my heart and breathing stopped and hoping I can stay sober. It's hard working in medicine with access to everything. I really have to keep my priorities in mind.
Posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 20:54:05
In reply to Re: Ok watch this one on adderall, this is paraody, posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 20:45:44
im sorry this isnt like the lady interview on xanax at all.
This is like Saterday Night Live on adderall.
It was kindaof funny
"BABIES"!!!!!!!!!!!!
ROFL
rj
Posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 20:56:19
In reply to Re: Ok watch this one on adderall, this is paraody, posted by halcyondaze on February 23, 2007, at 20:50:59
yea i agree this does trigger me about thinking about it. It was funny in its own way, but i didnt really like it at all.
The Xanax interview was much more sophisticated.
Im sorry or posting that crap. (Adderall)
rj
Posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 21:04:55
In reply to Re: Ok watch this one on adderall, this is paraody, posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 20:56:19
It is stupid.
I dont know why i posted it.
Posted by Phillipa on February 23, 2007, at 22:29:31
In reply to Re: Everyone dont watch this stupid adderall one., posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 21:04:55
All I know is that when I had my third child my OB-GYN know I was on a benzo and drank wine or beer nightly and took playcidyl a sleeper nightly two pills. And when the baby was born was not put back on the meds. I withdrew on my own cause I was young and they didn't know. I just felt like I was on a ship for two weeks . Then took 5mg of valium and was fine. No seizures none of this stuff you read about. Hence why I don't add mood stabalizers, up my antidepressant. I will stick with low dose benzos till something is better known. No drinking in ll years and take less benzos than 33 years ago when she was born. And at times was benzo free. Switched from one to another as my pdocs said a benzo is a benzo and no problems at all. So why should I fear them? Love Phillipa
Posted by djmmm on February 24, 2007, at 7:35:45
In reply to Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by rjlockhart on February 23, 2007, at 15:08:08
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP7zlugkGCU
>
> Put it to the stop.FWIW, these videos are all linked to other Scientology based youtube videos (ie gary null)
http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=psychtruth
keep that in mind when viewing...
Posted by valene on February 24, 2007, at 10:12:38
In reply to Re: Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by djmmm on February 24, 2007, at 7:35:45
> FWIW, these videos are all linked to other Scientology based youtube videos (ie gary null)
>
> http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=psychtruth
>
> keep that in mind when viewing...I was just about to comment on the above. Yes you are right these people I believe are Scientologists. I looked up that nice blonde woman's web site and she gives a link to "Label Me Sane" website where they claim to help people withdraw from psych meds, they are definitely Scientologists.
Val
Posted by Crazy Horse on February 24, 2007, at 10:14:02
In reply to Re: Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax, posted by willyee on February 23, 2007, at 17:43:37
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP7zlugkGCU
> >
> > Put it to the stop.
>
>
> As seinfeld would say,to this video i say YADA YADA,im also not surprised she has written a book either.
>
> I see constant talk,& a posted thread on a video
> regarding benzo,mainly xanax and the addiction potential.
>
> Ok lets see,we "cry" because we want drugs that work,when there are some we "cry" about not being able to get off,and how addicting it is.
>
> Ok first,if something works,unless it treats and CURES,then it is very unlikly it WONT BE addicting,it works thats why its addicting,its the stuff that makes us sick,does nothing but empty our wallets,that we arent addicted to and keep forcing down our bodies cause docs tell us too.
>
> Also the woman in the video,mentions she took it because she had minor anxiety.Ok benzos are a serious decision,and arent for that,aside from specific reasions,such as panic attacks etc,BENZOS should only be used when the anxiety being treated has made its way to plain disrupting severly ones life,making it hard for them to perform at work,possably even loosing a job as i once left for lunch on a very very great new job and couldent come back on training,...to affecting being around family friends etc,in this way choosing even not to use a benzo would be a hard life of coping with the anxiety,not a generaly nervous person who gets a lil jumpy but settles in a lotof situations,no full blown anxiety,these are the people who the drug benifits.
>
> Also as she mentions i believe she uses it monotherapy,that to me is another bad idea,one site even recomends the general use of caffiene,mainly because monotherapy of a benzo will much more likly in my view to become a problem in the area of tolerance,and addiction.
>
> Most people who choose to go on a benzo had life crippling anxiety,so knowing the drug wont actualy cure this,should not expect anything less then worsened anxiety on withdrawal,worsened from the brain having adapted to the drug,and worsened with the fact they forget which is the swallowed that first pill for a reason.
>
>
> Its the docs place,hopefully competitant docs,to dig,explain this to the patient and make sure its the right move,something a 5 min med check is sufficient for.
>
> Main thing is to let the patient who is a candiate STILL understand regardless that it is likly they will be on this drug for the remainder of there life unless they later HAVE a alternative method to treating the anxiety,they wont however stop the drug and simply have the begining anxiety disappear.
>I totally agree. Thanks for doing the hard work and writing the post for me. :)
-Monte
Posted by Joe Bloe on February 24, 2007, at 12:21:01
In reply to Re: Wow watch this youtube interview about Xanax » willyee, posted by Crazy Horse on February 24, 2007, at 10:14:02
I've taken adderall for two years and I've never felt like that once.
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Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
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