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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by 4WD on July 30, 2005, at 16:57:17
I get this feeling in my stomach and chest. I can't really call it anxiety because I'm not ruminating or scared or worried. It's a feeling like there is excess adrenaline coursing around in there. There is a mild feeling of fear associated with it, I think maybe because you get this feeling when you are scared - the adrenaline feeling. So when I feel the jittery feeling I associate it with fear.
But it feels more physical. Klonopin doesn't seem to touch it unless I take 1mg or so (I generally only take about .5 mg). The Klonopin takes care of the mental worry/anxiety stuff but not the feeling like I've had a hit of some kind of dirty stimulant or ephedrine or something.
That's it! It feels like I've taken ephedrine (to which I react very badly - wired and tired).
What can be causing this? Is it just another facet of anxiety?Marsha
Posted by ed_uk on July 30, 2005, at 17:11:51
In reply to Anxiety or nervous agitation?, posted by 4WD on July 30, 2005, at 16:57:17
Hi,
It could be due to activation of the sympathetic nervous system. A beta blocker might be helpful.
~ed
Posted by Glydin on July 30, 2005, at 17:30:54
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation? » 4WD, posted by ed_uk on July 30, 2005, at 17:11:51
My anxiety symptoms are 95% physical and 5% thought process involvement. It pretty much all I've ever known of anxiety.
Posted by 4WD on July 30, 2005, at 17:41:29
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation? » 4WD, posted by ed_uk on July 30, 2005, at 17:11:51
> Hi,
>
> It could be due to activation of the sympathetic nervous system. A beta blocker might be helpful.
>
> ~edI tried Inderal for a day or two when I was so caught up in the absolute terror. It didn't help. But now maybe that the terror is gone and the agitation is still here, the inderal might help. I'll give it a shot.
My acupuncturist gave me some supplements to take because he said 1. my sympathetic nervous system was dominant (according to a questionaire I filled out). It also said 2.I had foundational issues (vitamins, etc). The third thing it said was that my parasympathetic system was dominant.
Anyway the supplements were supposed to calm me. Instead they made extremely agitated, anxious and scared and depressed. They included bovine orchic Cytosol extract, bovine ovaryPMG extraact, bovine adrenal PMG extract, bovine thyroid PMG extract. I gather this was to stop the sympathetic dominance but it sure backfired. I don't understand how sympathetic dominance would make me scared. Parasympathetic either for that matter.
Anyway, I've got some really expensive vitamin supplements available for anyone who'd like them!
Marsha
Posted by 4WD on July 30, 2005, at 17:42:41
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation? » 4WD, posted by ed_uk on July 30, 2005, at 17:11:51
> Hi,
>
> It could be due to activation of the sympathetic nervous system. A beta blocker might be helpful.
>
> ~edWhat would cause activation of the sympathetic nervous system?
Posted by linkadge on July 30, 2005, at 17:57:57
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation?, posted by 4WD on July 30, 2005, at 17:42:41
What drugs are you taking ? I'd recomend some magnesium.
Linkadge
Posted by spriggy on July 30, 2005, at 18:04:11
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation?, posted by linkadge on July 30, 2005, at 17:57:57
When I had the worst anxiety (physical and mental), I would wake up in the mornings EVERY day with that horrible jumping around in either my stomach or my chest. It was so hard to describe, it was a very physical feeling.
It always was in one or the other- never in both. And once I got up, moved around, ate something, it would go away.
I was diagnosed with hypoglycemia (among 73 other diseases, ROFL), so I kind of wonder if my blood sugar was really low or something. It only seemed to happen in the morning.
I hated that feeling!
Posted by Deneb on July 30, 2005, at 18:05:20
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation?, posted by 4WD on July 30, 2005, at 17:42:41
> > Hi,
> >
> > It could be due to activation of the sympathetic nervous system. A beta blocker might be helpful.
> >
> > ~ed
>
> What would cause activation of the sympathetic nervous system?The sympathetic NS is active all the time, along with the parasympathic NS...it a matter of which dominates at a particular time.
Fearful/exciting stimuli or thoughts can activate the "fight or flight" response.
Deneb
Posted by Phillipa on July 30, 2005, at 18:33:42
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation?, posted by Deneb on July 30, 2005, at 18:05:20
I know with myself, that I can work myself into a panic with my thoughts. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by Squiggles on July 30, 2005, at 21:12:29
In reply to Anxiety or nervous agitation?, posted by 4WD on July 30, 2005, at 16:57:17
I used to get this feeling when my
thyroid medication was too high; i
also used to get it during the cycles
around my period.My 2 Cdn cents;
Squiggles
Posted by ed_uk on July 31, 2005, at 7:24:00
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation?, posted by 4WD on July 30, 2005, at 17:41:29
Hi Marsha,
>But now maybe that the terror is gone and the agitation is still here, the inderal might help.
I agree, try it! 10mg is a good place to start.
~Ed
Posted by ed_uk on July 31, 2005, at 7:44:40
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation?, posted by Deneb on July 30, 2005, at 18:05:20
Hi!
>The sympathetic NS is active all the time, along with the parasympathic NS...it a matter of which dominates at a particular time.
That's what I meant - that the sympathetic NS was dominant.
Kind regards
~Ed
Posted by ed_uk on July 31, 2005, at 7:46:31
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation? YES! YES! YES!, posted by spriggy on July 30, 2005, at 18:04:11
>What would cause activation of the sympathetic nervous system?
AFAIK....... anxiety, hypoglycemia, hyperthyroidism, pheochromacytoma......
~Ed
Posted by ed_uk on July 31, 2005, at 7:47:20
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation? » spriggy, posted by ed_uk on July 31, 2005, at 7:46:31
Posted by 4WD on July 31, 2005, at 22:01:38
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation? » spriggy, posted by ed_uk on July 31, 2005, at 7:46:31
Well, I tried 10mg of Inderal today and it did seem to help.
My thyroid levels are normal (including T3 & T4) and my blood sugar is normal and I've had metanephrines tested and that was normal. I guess it's just from anxiety. But the thing is the Klonopin just doesn't seem to attach itself to that specific feeling.
It's so hard to describe to a doctor. When you say you feel like you have a bunch of lizards flipping around in your stomach and chest, I don't think they really get it. It's a sort of stage fright feeling. It doesn't go away after getting out of bed and eating either.
It is some better than it was, though. And the terror is gone and for that I am eternally grateful. Maybe with the Inderal I can take less Klonopin.
It freaks me out when I go to the gym though and work out on the treadmill and my heart rate doesn't go up like it normally would. It just seems scary. (Maybe it wouldn't seem scary to a non anxious person).
I've just switched from Celexa to Lexapro two days ago. My new pdoc seems to think this will help with the anxiety. I haven't really talked with him about the nervous agitation thing - the fear/anxiety was a lot more prominent in my mind.
Anyway, thanks for all the responses.
Marsha
Posted by Cairo on August 1, 2005, at 8:16:29
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation? YES! YES! YES!, posted by spriggy on July 30, 2005, at 18:04:11
A trial of Topamax caused outright panic attacks in me and after tapering off I'm left with the same feeling of physical anxiety as you described in the mornings and in the afternoons/evenings. Klonopin takes the edge off a only a bit, but I've got to be careful with dose - I can handle only 0.125 -0.25mg or it depresses me. And I feel hung over in the mornings when I take it at night with trazodone.
I don't like Klonopin but wonder what else to try to get rid of this nervous agitation without inducing some other side effect. I'm very sensitive to meds.
Cairo
> When I had the worst anxiety (physical and mental), I would wake up in the mornings EVERY day with that horrible jumping around in either my stomach or my chest. It was so hard to describe, it was a very physical feeling.
>
> It always was in one or the other- never in both. And once I got up, moved around, ate something, it would go away.
>
> I was diagnosed with hypoglycemia (among 73 other diseases, ROFL), so I kind of wonder if my blood sugar was really low or something. It only seemed to happen in the morning.
>
> I hated that feeling!
Posted by Bill LL on August 1, 2005, at 10:23:38
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation? YES! YES! YES!, posted by Cairo on August 1, 2005, at 8:16:29
Nervous agitation has always been my primary problem. Although raising my dose of Lexapro always helps, the higher doses leave me with more sexual dysfunction.
I have been having reasonable success with my current combination of Lexapro 15 mg and Provigil 400 mg. Both help with my agitation. Provigil counters the tiredness caused by Lexapro, and also has a certain calming effect on me.
Provigil also gives me more help with my ADD than I was able to get on 72 mg of Concerta, or 20 mg of dexedrine. Provigil gives more much longer ADD coverage than the other 2.
I might eventually see if I can switch from Lexapro to Lamictal to get rid of the sexual side effects. Or at least to lower the dose of Lexapro.
The sexual side effects I have from Lexapro are not terrible, but it would still be nice to reduce them if possible.
> A trial of Topamax caused outright panic attacks in me and after tapering off I'm left with the same feeling of physical anxiety as you described in the mornings and in the afternoons/evenings. Klonopin takes the edge off a only a bit, but I've got to be careful with dose - I can handle only 0.125 -0.25mg or it depresses me. And I feel hung over in the mornings when I take it at night with trazodone.
>
> I don't like Klonopin but wonder what else to try to get rid of this nervous agitation without inducing some other side effect. I'm very sensitive to meds.
>
> Cairo
>
>
> > When I had the worst anxiety (physical and mental), I would wake up in the mornings EVERY day with that horrible jumping around in either my stomach or my chest. It was so hard to describe, it was a very physical feeling.
> >
> > It always was in one or the other- never in both. And once I got up, moved around, ate something, it would go away.
> >
> > I was diagnosed with hypoglycemia (among 73 other diseases, ROFL), so I kind of wonder if my blood sugar was really low or something. It only seemed to happen in the morning.
> >
> > I hated that feeling!
>
>
Posted by ed_uk on August 1, 2005, at 13:55:41
In reply to Re: Anxiety or nervous agitation?, posted by 4WD on July 31, 2005, at 22:01:38
Hi Marsha,
>Well, I tried 10mg of Inderal today and it did seem to help.
:-)
>I guess it's just from anxiety.
I agree.
~Ed
This is the end of the thread.
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