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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by MTNDOG on June 1, 2005, at 14:52:12
Hi All- I take 60 mg of Celexa and 2.5 mg klonopin. I was recently diagnosed as having Celiac's disease so I cannot tolerate wheat, rye, barley or oats (gluten). Unfortunately Wellbutrin has gluten in it and makes me very sick.
I stopped it about a month ago. I really liked the energy and pleasure it gave me- I'm starting to feel sad and unmotivated. So, I'm wondering if anyone knows of something to augment SSRI's and klonopin that will give me back some of that zip. Even when I was really physically sick, the Wellbutrin gave me enough zip to get through the day. thanks, B
Posted by tendency on June 1, 2005, at 15:15:14
In reply to Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin?, posted by MTNDOG on June 1, 2005, at 14:52:12
> Hi All- I take 60 mg of Celexa and 2.5 mg klonopin. I was recently diagnosed as having Celiac's disease so I cannot tolerate wheat, rye, barley or oats (gluten). Unfortunately Wellbutrin has gluten in it and makes me very sick.
>
> I stopped it about a month ago. I really liked the energy and pleasure it gave me- I'm starting to feel sad and unmotivated. So, I'm wondering if anyone knows of something to augment SSRI's and klonopin that will give me back some of that zip. Even when I was really physically sick, the Wellbutrin gave me enough zip to get through the day. thanks, Bwow, i didnt realize wellbutrin had wheat in it - are you sure? what form? the generic too? i too am allergic to wheat and take wellbutrin.
unfortunately wellbutrin is a norepinephrine/dopamine reuptake inhibitor and, as such, at least in the states, is in a class by itself.
have you looked into strattera - a norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor? or perhaps one of the stimulants?
im interested in looking into the dopamine agonists and combining that perhaps with strattera to custom tailor the norepinephrine and dopmaine tweaking.
good luck on this crazy f*cking med-go-round
Posted by MTNDOG on June 1, 2005, at 15:29:23
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin?, posted by tendency on June 1, 2005, at 15:15:14
Hi Tendency- I haven't been able to find a version of Wellbutrin that is gluten free. I've had reactions to all of them including the regular brand name Wellbutrin, the brand name SR and the generic SR. But, that doesn't mean that your brand has wheat in it. All I know is that for me it caused a reaction.
The only stimulant I've tried is Adderall and I only needed that when on Risperdal. Without the risperdal, it made me so anxious.
I'm going to wait a few days and see what happens and then talk to my pdoc. Thanks, B
Posted by TamaraJ on June 1, 2005, at 15:37:57
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin?, posted by MTNDOG on June 1, 2005, at 15:29:23
Hi,
This may sound crazy, but I wonder if a compounding pharmacy might be able to help you. Perhaps they can find out how to remove the gluten from the Wellbutrin or something. I really don't know anything about compounding pharmacies, but it might be worth talking to one to see if there are options so that you can stay on the Wellbutrin.
Good luck to you.
Posted by fires on June 1, 2005, at 15:50:19
In reply to Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin?, posted by MTNDOG on June 1, 2005, at 14:52:12
> Hi All- I take 60 mg of Celexa and 2.5 mg klonopin. I was recently diagnosed as having Celiac's disease so I cannot tolerate wheat, rye, barley or oats (gluten). Unfortunately Wellbutrin has gluten in it and makes me very sick.
>
> I stopped it about a month ago. I really liked the energy and pleasure it gave me- I'm starting to feel sad and unmotivated. So, I'm wondering if anyone knows of something to augment SSRI's and klonopin that will give me back some of that zip. Even when I was really physically sick, the Wellbutrin gave me enough zip to get through the day. thanks, B
Here are the ingredients in Well. XL. Which is made from gluten? Each tablet contains the labeled amount of
bupropion hydrochloride and the inactive ingredients: ethylcellulose aqueous dispersion (NF),
glyceryl behenate, methacrylic acid copolymer dispersion (NF), polyvinyl alcohol, polyethylene
glycol, povidone, silicon dioxide, and triethyl citrate.
Posted by The Resistance on June 1, 2005, at 16:01:25
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin? » MTNDOG, posted by fires on June 1, 2005, at 15:50:19
Quick list of possible alternatives to Wellbutrin
1. Dexedrine: apparently causes less anxiety than Adderall
2. Reboxetine: Activating antidepressant, can cause anxiety but if you can tolerate Wellbutrin then you might be able to tolerate this
3. Parnate/Tranylcypromine: MAO, Supposed to be quite stimulating
4. Sellegiline: Somewhat activating
5. Adrafanil: Easy to buy over the internet, helped me with motivation but I couldn't sleep
Posted by Phillipa on June 1, 2005, at 17:45:55
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin?, posted by The Resistance on June 1, 2005, at 16:01:25
Sounds like one for Larry or Chemist. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by MTNDOG on June 1, 2005, at 18:17:36
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin? » MTNDOG, posted by fires on June 1, 2005, at 15:50:19
None of those ingredients sound like gluten but I never did the XL because the SR was almost more than I could tolerate in terms of insomnia. I am thinking about compounding. The other option is to get it in Canada where only three drugs on the entire market have gluten in them. Thanks for all your help! I'll keep looking. B
Posted by fires on June 1, 2005, at 18:56:09
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin?, posted by MTNDOG on June 1, 2005, at 18:17:36
> None of those ingredients sound like gluten but I never did the XL because the SR was almost more than I could tolerate in terms of insomnia.<<
The XL is supposed to cause less insomnia. You can single dose in the morning.
Posted by Maxime on June 1, 2005, at 22:17:40
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin? » MTNDOG, posted by TamaraJ on June 1, 2005, at 15:37:57
Parnate will help. I don't know if it's gluten free or now. Wow, I never thought of that problem for people who can't handle wheat products. I'm really sorry.
Maxime
> Hi,
>
> This may sound crazy, but I wonder if a compounding pharmacy might be able to help you. Perhaps they can find out how to remove the gluten from the Wellbutrin or something. I really don't know anything about compounding pharmacies, but it might be worth talking to one to see if there are options so that you can stay on the Wellbutrin.
>
> Good luck to you.
Posted by Chairman_MAO on June 2, 2005, at 9:48:28
In reply to Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin?, posted by MTNDOG on June 1, 2005, at 14:52:12
Man, I feel like a broken record: DA agonists. Dostinex/Cabaser, Mirapex, Requip, Amantadine (maybe memantine), etc. These will do exactly what you are talking about. I recommend cabergoline.
Posted by tendency on June 2, 2005, at 10:57:50
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin? » MTNDOG, posted by Chairman_MAO on June 2, 2005, at 9:48:28
> Man, I feel like a broken record: DA agonists. Dostinex/Cabaser, Mirapex, Requip, Amantadine (maybe memantine), etc. These will do exactly what you are talking about. I recommend cabergoline.
what about the dosing? i'm hearing from others that the doses required to alleviate symptoms can kick anxiety through the roof. what's been your experience with this?
have you taken cabergoline regularily?
Posted by MTNDOG on June 2, 2005, at 16:19:23
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin? » MTNDOG, posted by fires on June 1, 2005, at 18:56:09
Thanks! I never thought the XL would be better- if anything I thought the extended release would be worse. Good to know!
The problem with a lot of medications is that the companies change the fillers at whim (like Glaxo Smith Kline won't guarantee their fillers) and with generics, they rarely produce their own drugs so in terms of fillers, you never know what the heck you're getting! Other comapnies, like Forest who makes Celexa, guarantee that they will not use wheat as a filoler because so many people have problems with it. Food is more clearly labeled than drugs!
Posted by MTNDOG on June 2, 2005, at 16:36:56
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin? » MTNDOG, posted by Chairman_MAO on June 2, 2005, at 9:48:28
Chairman Mao- Why do you feel like a broken record? Also, I've never heard of any of those drugs. Are they MAOI's?
Posted by Phillipa on June 2, 2005, at 17:01:57
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin?, posted by MTNDOG on June 2, 2005, at 16:36:56
I haven't heard of them either, are they European? Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by Chairman_MAO on June 3, 2005, at 9:52:10
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin? » Chairman_MAO, posted by tendency on June 2, 2005, at 10:57:50
I take 1mg cabergoline per day, which is half of the common dose given for _Parkinson's_. With each dose increase there was some anxiety, but it went away completely. Also, if combined with a strong anxiolytic drug like phenelzine, it's not a problem at all.
The dose of cabergoline used for prolactin suppression is 500mcg TWICE WEEKLY; the halflife is 68 hours. Thus, there is a substantial amount of accumulation of the drug at 1mg/day. Perhaps sometimes I am SLIGHTLY more irritable than I would be off of it, but I think it's partly just part of my normal personality that is suppressed by phenelzine completely (along with much of my libido, etc). Overall, I suffer from little to no anxiety most of the time, despite the cabergoline.
Of course, I take buprenorphine, too, which is also anxiolytic.
Posted by SLS on June 3, 2005, at 10:27:03
In reply to Re: Need energy-anything similar to Wellbutrin? » tendency, posted by Chairman_MAO on June 3, 2005, at 9:52:10
> I take 1mg cabergoline per day, which is half of the common dose given for _Parkinson's_.
> Of course, I take buprenorphine, too, which is also anxiolytic.It sounds like you are having success with what you are doing. How would you rate yourself right now?
Besides the buprenorphine and cabergoline, is there anything else that you take? Nardil? How did you get your doctor to go along with these drugs?
I would consider adding a DA agonist to Parnate. I had previously tried bromocriptine. It worked for about 3 days and then quit. Mirapex and Requip seem like obvious choices, however, I never considered cabergoline because I haven't seen it mentioned before for treating depression.
What are the prominent features of your depression? Mine is bipolar and very anergic and anhedonic. I also suffer from severe impairments of concentration and memory.
I guess I won't know to what degree cabergoline is suited to my case unless I try it. Is there anything on the Internet I can bring in to show my doctor regarding cabergoline?
Thanks.
- Scott
This is the end of the thread.
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