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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 8 of 8. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by JonW on September 8, 2003, at 22:00:10
I am on moclobemide, and I find it very helpful. I recently started taking piracetam, and this has been very useful in combination with moclobemide for my ADD-like symptoms. I have a mix of symptoms that would best be summed up as Depression/Social Anxiety Disorder/ADD. My success with piracetam has peaked my interest in nootropics. I am interested in trying the drug pikamilon, possibly in place of piracetam as it is also a nootropic, or in addition to it for anxiety and irritability. Pikamilon is GABA bonded to niacin or something like that, but it is also a weak RIMA. My question should be obvious. Is it dangerous to combine two RIMAs? Does anyone know? Is this a big risk? I suspect it's not a big risk, but I really don't know. Any advice?
Also, has anyone here ever used Pikamilon before? What did you think of it?
Thanks,
Jon :)
Posted by Fireba11 on September 10, 2003, at 12:02:13
In reply to Moclobemide HELP!, posted by JonW on September 8, 2003, at 22:00:10
Hi Jon
Sorry I havent got any answers to your posting
Just a few questions regarding Moclobemide.
Ive been using it for 2 weeks now (300mg) for GAD and am not feeling any benefit yet (Just increased anxiety). Im already getting impatient and was just wondering how long it took for you to improve and how did it help you.
Any info would be appreciated
Nick
Posted by JonW on September 10, 2003, at 15:17:15
In reply to Re: Moclobemide HELP! » JonW, posted by Fireba11 on September 10, 2003, at 12:02:13
> Ive been using it for 2 weeks now (300mg) for GAD and am not feeling any benefit yet (Just increased anxiety). Im already getting impatient and was just wondering how long it took for you to improve and how did it help you.
Hi Nick,
It took at least 8 weeks at 450mg (I take 150mg three times a day) before I noticed any real improvement. It is most effective for my depression, but is also helpful with anxiety. My interest in picamilone was mostly to treat the anxiety and irritability piracetam caused me -- possibly as a replacement. Moclobemide alone has never been anxiogenic for me, and I have since stopped the piracetam and this has relieved the anxiety and irritability. Moclobemide isn't a very potent drug, and the 300mg you're on is a very low dose. You may require a dose in the range of 600mg-900mg. Your increased anxiety may not be a side-effect, but simply a lack of effect. I will say that it took much longer for me to respond to moclobemide than any other drug I've responded to. I concede that fewer people seem to respond to moclobemide than other drugs, and you may be unlucky. However, two weeks at just 300mg is meaningless in evaluating this drug's effect on you. Keep your pdoc informed with what's going on.
BTW, something I've been using recently and have found very helpful for anxiety is L-Theanine. You may want to try making yourself a strong cup of green tea (decaff is probably best if you have GAD) which contains some L-Theanine. This would give you an idea of how helpful it might be for you. Taking L-Theanine is much more potent than green tea, though. I used to think natural things were pointless, but was pleasantly surprised by L-Theanine. I open the capsule and dissolve it in green tea. L-Theanine increases dopamine in the brain, particularly in the striatum, hypothalamus, and hippocampus. It also increases GABA. If you do purchase L-Theanine, make sure it is Suntheanine which is the pharamceutical grade product. I obviously speak highly of it because it has helped me, but if you haven't tried it and you're feeling anxious and depressed waiting for the moclobemide to kick in, you might want to give it a try. It takes effect in 30 to 40 minutes. Anyway, just a thought...
Hang in There,
Jon
Posted by turalizz on September 10, 2003, at 16:25:51
In reply to Moclobemide HELP!, posted by JonW on September 8, 2003, at 22:00:10
> I am on moclobemide, and I find it very helpful. I recently started taking piracetam, and this has been very useful in combination with moclobemide for my ADD-like symptoms. I have a mix of symptoms that would best be summed up as Depression/Social Anxiety Disorder/ADD. My success with piracetam has peaked my interest in nootropics. I am interested in trying the drug pikamilon, possibly in place of piracetam as it is also a nootropic, or in addition to it for anxiety and irritability. Pikamilon is GABA bonded to niacin or something like that, but it is also a weak RIMA. My question should be obvious. Is it dangerous to combine two RIMAs? Does anyone know? Is this a big risk? I suspect it's not a big risk, but I really don't know. Any advice?
>
> Also, has anyone here ever used Pikamilon before? What did you think of it?
>
> Thanks,
> Jon :)
It is very unlikely that the combination would possess any danger.
As you said, moclobemide isn't very potent.
I combine 300mg moclobemide with 5 - 7.5mg selegiline and don't even notice the tyramine effect. I eat almost everything.
But it is good to be cautious.
Starting with a low dose, and then slowly going up is a good idea I think.Good luck,
Cem
Posted by JonW on September 10, 2003, at 18:06:43
In reply to Re: Moclobemide HELP! » JonW, posted by turalizz on September 10, 2003, at 16:25:51
> It is very unlikely that the combination would possess any danger.
> As you said, moclobemide isn't very potent.
> I combine 300mg moclobemide with 5 - 7.5mg selegiline and don't even notice the tyramine effect. I eat almost everything.
> But it is good to be cautious.
> Starting with a low dose, and then slowly going up is a good idea I think.
>
> Good luck,
>
> CemThanks for the reply! I'm curious what benefit you get from combining moclobemide with selegeline. How is it different than moclobemide alone? I've been on selegiline before and my mood seemed to cycle on it, but I'd be interested to hear what this combination does for you.
Thanks again,
Jon :)
Posted by jparsell82 on September 11, 2003, at 6:48:26
In reply to Re: Moclobemide HELP! » turalizz, posted by JonW on September 10, 2003, at 18:06:43
Hey Jon, I have about the same problems as you. Social Anxiety, ADD(not hyperactive), and Depression. I take Piracetam and found it helps with ADD but it also causes me to think a lot more. Sometimes too much where I get racing thoughts. Anyways, about Picamilon, it sounded really interesting to me. Gaba bonded to Niacin so Gaba could be absorbed. Unfortunately, I took it for a few days in a row and didn't get much effect. But who knows, it may work for you. I had more luck with Gamalate B6. Gamalate B6 contains Gaba, Magnesium, Vit. B6, and Gabob(chemically similar to GHB). I took Gamalate in combination with Selegilene and it helped me to be a lot more social. Good luck!
Posted by Dr. Bob on September 11, 2003, at 20:33:10
In reply to Picamilon, posted by jparsell82 on September 11, 2003, at 6:48:26
> Anyways, about Picamilon, it sounded really interesting to me...
Sorry to interrupt, but I'd like to redirect that aspect of this thread to the new Psycho-Babble Alternative board. Here's a link:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20030903/msgs/259215.html
Bob
Posted by turalizz on September 12, 2003, at 15:33:26
In reply to Re: Moclobemide HELP! » turalizz, posted by JonW on September 10, 2003, at 18:06:43
> Thanks for the reply! I'm curious what benefit you get from combining moclobemide with selegeline. How is it different than moclobemide alone? I've been on selegiline before and my mood seemed to cycle on it, but I'd be interested to hear what this combination does for you.
>
> Thanks again,
> Jon :)selegiline increased the antidepressant effect of moclobemide. The first time I added selegiline, I experienced a transient insomnia, but it didn't last more than two nights. It also increased my sexual drive (a little too much at the beginning :)
It also helps with motivation, drive and apathy.
(I have to mention that I also take 1.5gr dlpa and 10mg vinpocetine and I assume this post will also be directed to the new group for mentioning these :)best wishes
cem
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