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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 4 of 4. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by BekkaH on July 28, 2002, at 17:50:30
Many psychopharmacologists are in bed with the greedy pharmaceutical companies, and the FDA is in bed with both of them.
Posted by Phil on July 28, 2002, at 20:41:39
In reply to Menage a trois, posted by BekkaH on July 28, 2002, at 17:50:30
We could become the psycho-babble watchdog group.
We could read everything they do, pull their records, infiltrate the Towers, then nail their asses in a congressional nationally aired broadcast.
Unfortunately, I think Congress provides the hotel for the other 3.
I read some about Forest Pharmaceuticals a few days ago and they put 10% of earnings back into research. I wonder if that's the industry average? And where the hell is our Lexapro?
Posted by LostBoyinNC1 on July 28, 2002, at 22:05:02
In reply to Menage a trois, posted by BekkaH on July 28, 2002, at 17:50:30
> Many psychopharmacologists are in bed with the greedy pharmaceutical companies, and the FDA is in bed with both of them.
The thing that irritates me is that a lot of pharmaceutical companies are telling psychiatrists that the new atypical anti-psychotics dont cause movement disorders. And that they can routinely put depressives and those with anxiety disorders on atypical anti-psychotics. Thats WRONG. Atypicals cause movement disorders just like the older typicals do.
And some psychiatrists believe the pharmaceutical companies. Another thing thats happening is the pharmaceutical companies are telling Pdocs and even family medicine doctors who treat run of the mill anxiety that they can put patients on atypicals instead of benzos and not risk benzo addiction. Oh...how convenient. So instead of benzo addiction you end up with a nasty case of EPS and have to take Cogentin for a few months. Some doctors would actually rather you develop a mild movement disorder than get hooked on benzos!!
Eli Lilly is trying to get zyprexa FDA approved for non psychotic treatment resistant depression! I dont know if that will make it thru the FDA, but if it does I believe it could be the eventual downfall of Eli Lilly, once all those affective disordered people without psychosis start developing EPS out the wazoo. They will be running to lawyers. The lawyers will love it.
I once had a Duke psychiatrist tell me that zyprexa works more on serotonin than on dopamine. 5HT2A receptor antagonism. But you still get some dopamine blockade with even low dose zyprexa. For some depressives, that small amount of dopamine blockade maybe too much for them to handle physically and they might end up with bad EPS. A schizophrenic could handle it easily, but a depressive I dont know about.
I call it the "Zyprexa numb tongue" syndrome.
Posted by cybercafe on July 29, 2002, at 1:35:53
In reply to Re: Menage a trois, posted by LostBoyinNC1 on July 28, 2002, at 22:05:02
> The thing that irritates me is that a lot of pharmaceutical companies are telling psychiatrists that the new atypical anti-psychotics dont cause movement disorders. And
hmmm.. i'm curious where you heard about this so i may cite the source as well
>who treat run of the mill anxiety that they can put patients on atypicals instead of benzos and not risk benzo addiction. Oh...how convenient. So
Yep... i had some docs in London UK try to put me on Melleril and another Chlorpromazine because they thought 1 mg of lorazepam a day was too much ...
they also told me the reason why they wouldn't perscribe an atypical like risperdal is because "it's not well studied" or when i mention lower EPS "they use complicated mathematical formulas to calculate the incidence of EPS.. and that formula is often incorrect" WRONG! they interview patients, and then count the total # ...it turns out they wouldn't perscribe an atypical because the british gov't wouldn't pay for atypicals back then :)
i have also met people who have take antipsychotics but find they still need benzos to control their anxiety
> I once had a Duke psychiatrist tell me that zyprexa works more on serotonin than on dopamine. 5HT2A receptor antagonism. But you still get some dopamine blockade with even low dose zyprexa. For
the thing is, 5HT2A antagonism disinhibits dopamine in the nigrostriatal system and nucleus accumbens... but it inhibits dopamine in the neocortex... so do you really want to decrease stimulation of your thought centers? ... i dunno... perhaps you can tell me what it feels like to be on an antipsychotic lostboy (in terms of ability to think)
>some depressives, that small amount of dopamine blockade maybe too much for them to handle physically and they might end up with bad EPS. A schizophrenic could handle it easily, but a depressive I dont know about.
... i think schizophrenics have more dopamine in the neocortex (thought centers), but not necessarily the motor cortex...
... as i understand it, the reason why non-schizophrenics have a higher incidence of EPS is because we take more medications, and these help to upset the balance of neurotransmitters in the motor cortex (nigrostriatal pathway) even more
> I call it the "Zyprexa numb tongue" syndrome.
... i know of a few people who were suicidal and after taking zyprexa very quickly became non-suicidal... it really seems like a wonder drug ... having said that, it wouldn't be my first choice
This is the end of the thread.
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