![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 208 to 232 of 350. Go back in thread:
Posted by BarbaraCat on September 8, 2003, at 23:49:06
In reply to Re: a thought of my own, posted by SF24 on September 8, 2003, at 16:08:48
Your ideas are very intriguing. I've often wondered about those delicious tingles from drugs that target different neurochemicals. The scalp/spine tingles from amphetamines, the whole body pulsing tingles from MDMA, the rapturous shivers of psychedelics, the rapid wiry rush from that first cup o' coffee, the lovely afterglow of sex that is so like the warm whole body pulse from MDMA, etc. What causes them? They all have the same 'pleasure/reward' dopamine similarity, but the targeted receptor sites are so varied. Or are they?
I've also wondered about the sadly neglected down-line electrical potential, the cAMP second messenger system that communicates with the neuronal nucleus and then sends it's electrical impulse down the axon to the terminal, which, from there, is chemically ferried across the synaptic cleft. Those zaps seem so electrical and this axonal communication/firing/ionic gates flux all depend upon electrical potential (calcium/sodium ion exchange).
There's so much speculation and research being put into the terminal and synaptic cleft theories, and not enough into the down-line second messenger system. Electric-feeling zaps = electricity in my mind. There must be a disruption in the electrical system because those zaps are so undeniably electrical in nature to those who have experienced them. I believe we're overlooking a huge part of the whole neuronal symphony by looking at the, what, only 3 major neuropeptides we've come to recognize as the alpha and omega of psychiatric medicine? But all those billions of potential research dollars are better spent on defending us against the terrorists, eh?
Or maybe it's a temporary homeostatic seeking neural re-routing to the temporal lobe strategy which could cause the vertigo/dizziness usually associated with inner ear (temporal lobe territory) problems?
OR how about this? As serotonin decreases, dopamine increases. Those tingles are all remarkably dopamine-like. 'Pleasure/reward' system = dopamine. Many of those 'tingle' substances spoken of above are dopamine releasers which usually incite craving for more of the tingly buzz. Only this dopamine surge, usually so pleasant, doesn't feel much like pleasure. So, anything thoughts? So many possibilities, so little time. Maybe in 100 years we'll have this thing wired. - BarbaraCat
Posted by KimberlyDi on September 9, 2003, at 8:23:31
In reply to Zaps - a thought of my own » SF24, posted by BarbaraCat on September 8, 2003, at 23:49:06
<one eyebrow raised>
you guys and gals are amazing with all the research you've done.
good work.
KDi in Texas
Posted by BarbaraCat on September 10, 2003, at 2:12:10
In reply to I'll just call you DrSpockCat from now on » BarbaraCat, posted by KimberlyDi on September 9, 2003, at 8:23:31
Would that be the baby Dr. Spock or the 'live long and prosper' Mr. Spock? Thanks for the atta girl. All this exploration is fun but also necessary. It's becoming clear that we mood disordered folks have to become our own researchers and doctors and we have to stick together to help each other find the answers. Our collective personal commitments to find the answers so we can GET WELL is far more powerful and effective than research funded by the pharmaceutical industry. Maybe we'll have one of those Hundreth Monkey phenomenons right here on this board. Know what I mean?
> <one eyebrow raised>
>
> you guys and gals are amazing with all the research you've done.
>
> good work.
>
> KDi in Texas
Posted by KimberlyDi on September 10, 2003, at 7:33:35
In reply to Re: I'll just call you DrSpockCat from now on » KimberlyDi, posted by BarbaraCat on September 10, 2003, at 2:12:10
100 Monkeys could pound out Shakespeare eventually. My ADD/ADHD brain wonders "Who taught the monkeys to type?"
Before, when going to a pdoc, I went quietly and didn't participate. Now, I go fully informed, to the best of my knowledge, and suggest medication based upon my research and symptoms.
I think the pdoc prefers my involvement.
> Would that be the baby Dr. Spock or the 'live long and prosper' Mr. Spock? Thanks for the atta girl. All this exploration is fun but also necessary. It's becoming clear that we mood disordered folks have to become our own researchers and doctors and we have to stick together to help each other find the answers. Our collective personal commitments to find the answers so we can GET WELL is far more powerful and effective than research funded by the pharmaceutical industry. Maybe we'll have one of those Hundreth Monkey phenomenons right here on this board. Know what I mean?
>
>
> > <one eyebrow raised>
> >
> > you guys and gals are amazing with all the research you've done.
> >
> > good work.
> >
> > KDi in Texas
>
>
Posted by BarbaraCat on September 12, 2003, at 15:14:58
In reply to Live Long and Prosper, of course » BarbaraCat, posted by KimberlyDi on September 10, 2003, at 7:33:35
> 100 Monkeys could pound out Shakespeare eventually. My ADD/ADHD brain wonders "Who taught the monkeys to type?"
>
**The latest theory is that one day a FedEx box washed ashore an island beach containing one 'Mavis Beacon Teaches Typing' program originally meant for overnight delivery from Amazon.com. Tom Hanks was out cold on the beach but another box washed up on shore as well - this one containing a manual typewriter.Tom tried to teach the monkeys how to type since there wasn't much else to do, but it was difficult to convey a concept of such complexity to them and neither he nor the monkeys knew sign language.
Mavis Beacon did not help either, unfortunately, because the typewriter was manual and did not have a CD drive or even a monitor. So Tom eventually gave up because his hunger pangs were becoming insistant and learning how to spear crustaceons took precedence (little known fact - Tom did go on to type the first draft for Castaway on that typewriter using coco-palm papyrus!).
Being resourceful monkeys who DID NOT GIVE UP and were committed to doing their part for evolution, they looked at the pictures in the Mavis Beacon Users Manual and this was enough for those of superior simian minds to make the eye-hand coordination connection.
At night, when Tom was asleep in the cave, they took to teaching each other to peck and then finally got up to speeds of 45 wpm on that typewriter. Just try that on your old Olivetti at home! It wasn't a coincidence that the Maker saw fit to give them brute strength and opposable thumbs.Eventually Tom rigged together his makeshift raft and was ready to leave the island with his hapless friend, 'Wilson'. He made the difficult decision to leave the typewriter behind. It was rather cumbersome, although it would have passed the time while on that long ocean voyage.
You can imagine the monkeys' delight at now having the typewriter to themselves as they set about recreating one of the Bard's classics before moving on to their own opus. However, it must be said that the learning curve was steep. Discouraged with the verrrrrryyyyy slow progress of 'King Lear', one monkey while on typing shift thought it would be an amusing diversion to see if sweet potatoes, their staple foodstuff, could float - much like the raft that was observed carrying away Tom Hanks and Wilson.
Thinking to impress the other monkeys with the spiffy look of the first of the 'Tater Flotilla, as he called it, he washed and spit-shined it. Needless to say, the other 99 monkeys were indeed impressed to see this 'Tater Flotilla coming 'round the spit and sought to outdo each other with the creativity and cleanliness of their nautical spuds.
Monkeys communicate through 'hive' mentality, known in higher primates as ESP so it's not surprising that their enterprise was conveyed to other islands. The rest is history. Unfortunately, Shakespeare was abandoned - for now.
Psychologists are still speculating on the motives behind Tom's inexplicable choice of befriending a basketball rather than the company of the infinitely more interesting monkeys. Perhaps he thought they were a delusion, made up by his fevered brain. Perhaps they were.
So, you're ADD/ADHD,eh? How has that been for you and has anything helped? I tried that route recently thinking my manic disorganization was ADD, but Ritalin made me feel AWFUL, even though I enjoyed meth. - Ciao, BarbaraCat
Posted by Dr. Bob on September 13, 2003, at 15:56:52
In reply to How Monkeys came to type » KimberlyDi, posted by BarbaraCat on September 12, 2003, at 15:14:58
> > 100 Monkeys could pound out Shakespeare eventually. My ADD/ADHD brain wonders "Who taught the monkeys to type?"
> >
> **The latest theory is that one day a FedEx box washed ashore an island beach containing one 'Mavis Beacon Teaches Typing' program originally meant for overnight delivery from Amazon.com...Interesting theory, but since it doesn't involve the monkeys taking medication :-) I'd like to redirect follow-ups to it, and other theories, too, to Psycho-Social-Babble, thanks.
Bob
Posted by Dr. Bob on September 14, 2003, at 8:55:58
In reply to Redirect: How Monkeys came to type, posted by Dr. Bob on September 13, 2003, at 15:56:52
> I'd like to redirect follow-ups to it ... to Psycho-Social-Babble
Here's a link:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20030913/msgs/259876.html
Bob
Posted by KimberlyDi on September 15, 2003, at 8:13:17
In reply to How Monkeys came to type » KimberlyDi, posted by BarbaraCat on September 12, 2003, at 15:14:58
>So, you're ADD/ADHD,eh? How has that been for you and has anything helped? I tried that route recently thinking my manic disorganization was ADD, but Ritalin made me feel AWFUL, even though I enjoyed meth. - Ciao, BarbaraCat
>
I've only been prescribed Strattera so far, for about a week or so. I seem to be less overwhelmed by details at work. More focused. Researching more on ADD/ADHD has been the most interesting part. Reading a paragraph and realizing "that's me!" gives me hope that I'll recover. I've been frustrated my entire adult worklife.Back to monkeys... you have quite the imagination. :)
KDi in Texas
Posted by rickg on September 16, 2003, at 20:05:21
In reply to zoloft withdrawal symptoms, posted by Osama on April 20, 2003, at 10:56:19
I am a 44 year old male. I have been on 50 mg. of Zoloft for 12 years. I was put on the drug for panic attacks which began shortly after I was electrocuted. I was put on this drug after several others failed to stop the panic attacks. It does work!
I have tried in the past to get off of the zoloft and when I was experiencing many of the symptoms described in previous postings I was told by my doctors that I was experiencing panic attacks again and needed to stay on the zoloft. It was strange that these symptoms were nothing like the panic attacks I had been experiencing previously.
I once again decided to try to go off the zoloft about a month ago. For one week I took 50 mg. one day and 25mg. the next. The next week I took 25 mg. all the time. The following week I took a 25 mg. one day and nothing the next. That is when I really began to notice the symptoms kicking in again. The "energy rush" or "shooting sensation" going across my head is by far the most troubling and intense. I also feel very edgy and less tolerant of others. Dizziness is another concern. I have not experienced the stomach problems be it nausea or diarrhea. Getting to sleep at night has been a problem.
Once again when I tried talking to my doctor about these symptoms he was quick to point out that there are no known side effects with zoloft and that I was experiencing "panic attacks". Once again, this is nothing like what my panic attacks were like.
Tonight, I went up to speak to a pharmacist and she reassured me that many people experience "symptoms" when they come off of Zoloft and other similar drugs. No one seems to understand what you are talking about when you try to describe the "energy rush" or shooting sensation" across your head. They look at you like you are from another planet. Maybe they should try this stuff for a while and then try to get off of it to see what we are talking about! It was refreshing to hear someone from the medical field affirm that there are withdrawal symptoms associated with this product. This was a first. It was at this point I looked things up on the internet and found this site.
I have seen many people mention suing the company who produces this drug. I for one would like to find out how to go about doing this. We have been misled and lied to. We have been used as guinea pigs. While the Zoloft has done its job of controlling my panic attacks, getting off of it is quite another story. I would recommend to anyone who has been prescribed this drug for the first time to seriously consider your alternatives. It is HELL getting off this stuff! Please post if you know of any pending lawsuits or know what the process would be to initiate one. Also if anyone has found anything to alleviate the withdrawal symptoms I would love to hear about them.
Thanks!
RickG
Posted by wendie on September 17, 2003, at 1:22:08
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms, posted by rickg on September 16, 2003, at 20:05:21
I went off zoloft gradually over the past two months after 10 years on the stuff. I must say in the beginning it saved my life, but over the past year or so, I began to slip into this sort of zombie existance where I was totally exhausted all the time and had no energy. I got through my days by sheer force of will and managed to keep doing what absolutely had to be done, but nothing more. Finally my physician's assistant - nobody gets to have a real doctor these days - told me that this might be Zoloft and that people often had this reaction after many years on the drug. Mind you this was after I had been complaining of these symptoms to her for about six months, and before her to my former P.A., who had kept upping my dosage of zoloft to cure them!
My current PA then recommended I take Prozac instead -- and here I am trying to wean myself from Zoloft, because I really believe that with menopause I have left a lot of the causes of my anxiety/depression behind. so instead she told me to continue the gradual cutback of zoloft, PLUS she prescribed 100 mg of Wellbutrin. She said that eventually I could get off the Zoloft, but said nothing of side effects. Well, I didn't like the idea of taking two drugs instead of one when my goal was to get off everything - so I decided to go from 50 mg of Zoloft to 25, and then from that to 25 every other day and then stop. So about 3 weeks ago I took my last dose of zoloft, while continuing the Welbutrin. Everything was fine for two weeks, and then the withdrawal set in. I didn't think at first that it was the zoloft because I had felt so good for the previous two weeks, so I suspected the Welbutrin. But after talking with some folks in the know, and reading websites like this one, I realize that it's the zoloft.
For the past five days, I have been getting worse and worse. Extreme and constant nausea now, headache that is heading toward a full blown migraine and constant dizziness. And intermittent weeping for no reason, plus a general all over achy feeling. And I can't concentrate on anything. I don't want to go back on zoloft at all, but if these symptoms are going to continue for much longer, I don't know whether I can take it. Lord, the medical profession needs to make everyone aware of this withdrawal stuff and treat it as a separate illness worthy of special attention. I am so angry - I will not go back to this PA or anyone else in this group practice. And the next doctor I see is going to get a piece of my mind on the first visit. That is if I survive this withdrawal without going completely over the edge.
Posted by cubic_me on September 17, 2003, at 12:41:04
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms, posted by rickg on September 16, 2003, at 20:05:21
I came off Zoloft a few months ago because it wasn't working for me. I'd been on 100mg for about 3 months. I felt dizzy, sick, got head rushes and head shocks and could hardly walk without holding onto something sometimes. I was getting pins and needles in my fingers all the time too. I said this to my pdoc and he didnt really believe me, even though i had to hold onto the door frame to get myself through the door of his office. He said the normal period for taking someone off Zoloft was 2 weeks but he had tried to take me off it in 3 days. I went back on my normal dose for a few days and my symptoms disappeared.
Then I had to wean myself off the Zoloft. I took progressively smaller bites out of each pill every day. I still got pretty bad withdrawal but without the doc knowing I overlapped Zoloft with the Efexor they put me onto afterwards. That helped abit.
However I'm now getting the same symptoms with Efexor, however they even occur when I'm a few houurs late taking a pill. I can see its going to be hell getting off Efexor.
If you've had trouble with withdrawal in the past, I'd recomend thinking very hard before you try anything else, and only take meds when you are prepared for whatever problems they might bring.
_me
Posted by sarah1980 on September 21, 2003, at 4:31:44
In reply to withdrawal symptoms coming off zoloft, posted by Shelly on May 4, 1999, at 17:37:51
Size of dosage and duration of treatment may well have an effect on how the withdrawal places itself out, if ther is withdrawal in the first place. When I go off of zoloft it takes a month to be fully free of problems. I get these strange dizzy flashes and muscle aches. When I sleep I can have dreams in which I wake up into another dream and then wake up thinking I am really awake and so on and so on. At a certain point it just becomes annoying and i just start telling myself that I am dreaming and have to work on waking.
One really scary thing that happened one or two times is that I woke up but couldn't move... my body was still asleep. It was really horrifying. I also hallucinated that I could hear heavy breathing and someone holding down my arms. I finally began to really think that I had been drugged and someone was trying to molest/rape/atttack me (something which did actually happen once, making it all the more freaky). With all my mental energy I worked to try to scream but couldn't. Then I focused on just being able to open my eyes and turn my head to get a glimpse of the person since it seemed I couldn't fight him off. After minutes I was finally able to and when I did I turned to look at the wall and saw a spider which slowly walked up the wall and then disappeared. Weird.
But I have also had times where it was relatively mild. I think effects are fairly variable. How fast you stop probably has some effect, although zoloft has a very long half-life (this is the reason it is still in your system until a month later).
But, still, I am not sure that I would be alive today were it not for zoloft. Most peole that don't use SSRIs think that the side effects or withdrawal are serious enough to not try the medicines. No withdrawal symptom I have ever had from zoloft makes me wish I had never taken it or would stop me from taking it now.
Posted by nicholas on September 28, 2003, at 5:04:57
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms, posted by rickg on September 16, 2003, at 20:05:21
I'm glad I've come across this forum. I have been taking Zoloft now for the past four years and am considering getting off it.
I am a 41 yr old male. A doctor prescribed Zoloft for me as I was stressing out so much with life in general,(you know...work, teenage daughters and their rebellions, a bowel cancer operation, a very difficult childhood, etc). This resulted in constant fretting, stressing, depressions & fighting with my wife. Unfortunately it also resulted in me being physically abusive as well. I knew I really, really needed help.
That help came in the form of a Zoloft pill. Within a week the change was dramatic. From borderline beast to passive, loveable and easy going Dad.
Yes, I've lost most of my sex drive, for which I do feel bad about at times for my wife,[and me :-( ]but we both feel it's worth it as the postives seem to outweigh the negatives.
When I first started Zoloft, I got symptoms of nauseousness which lasted about 10 days. I started on 50mgs per day and dosed myself up to 150mgs per day as there were times I felt it wasn't as effective as when I first started. The higher dosage made me subconsciously grind my teeth(even in my sleep, the wife says)spontaneous weeping eyes, chills and if I was to forget to take my dose, the ever familiar chant of "head rushes" (like a dull head bang inside lasting 1-2 seconds occuring erratically & regularly, seemingly whirling in my head)and dizziness.
This made me nervous in relation to what was Zoloft actually doing to my brain, so I decided to start to "wean" myself back. I went back 100 mgs per day and then to 50 mgs per day all over a 6 mths period. Though a lesser dosage caused me to "lose the plot" sometimes, it actually helped me to "manage" reality a little better rather than being in some kind of chemical stupification all the time.
The trouble is, recently I tried to actually go off Zoloft but as I'm reading...it ain't easy!!. Any attempt to go below 50mgs per day, even staggering it on and off, resulted in even more of the aforementioned symptoms & more intense in some cases.
After a while, I put it into the "too hard basket" and resigned myself to being on 50mgs of Zoloft for evermore.
Recently, I've got to a stage where I feel the 50mg isn't REALLY doing anything or helping me but just keeping me to a level of dependance due to the fact it's very difficult to go back to zero.
What a money spinner for Phizer eh??
Yet by reading through the various threads I have found new hope to "give it another go". I believe there is a lot to benefit from this:
1. More sex drive. (BTW- this is not necessarily in order!!)
2. Actually see if there is an emotional difference between 50mg and zero.(Has the worst past?)
3.Peace of mind knowing there is one less drug you are putting in your body as Zoloft hasn't REALLY stood the "test of time" to be unequivocally SAFE.
4. Money saved.
The way I figure it is, worse case scenario, if this 50mg IS really holding me together and I fall apart after going off it....I go back on. Simple. But I'll never, never know if I never,never give it a go.
Zoloft is a good antidepressant and the like. The drug did ease the torment I was experiencing at a dark time in my life for which I am grateful.
But is the price a lifetime of indirect dependancy and contributions to Phizers coffers?Hope not.
Anyhow, thanks to all who has shared their experiences in this forum. It's been a BIG help to read your situations and has helped me feel I'm not alone in all this.
And like one alluded to, 'Doctors..half of them don't have a clue what it's like or how to help unless they've maybe taken Zoloft themselves, the other half are happy to fill out the prescriptions and get that free holiday compliments of the phamaceutical giants.
Posted by katia on September 28, 2003, at 13:36:45
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms, posted by nicholas on September 28, 2003, at 5:04:57
Hi Welcome to psychobabble!
Do you still have a regular psychiatrist (pdoc)? I would definitely talk to her/him about the fact that you're going off first. Whether they provide support or not, it's an important first step.
I was only on Zoloft three months and it did nothing for me except made me a zombie AND I still had to endure the w/drawal right after enduring a similar w/d on Effexor. It's hard but doable. Those zappy electrical feelings and the dizziness feeling of going down an elevator sideways does end. Give it two weeks - one for the worst of it. Try even taking 1/2 of 50mg and then 1/2 of that and then 1/2 of that..... until it feels like you can let go totally.
the main thing is, it does go away with time and no one around you who hasn't gone thru' it won't have a clue what you're trying to describe and you'll feel even more frustrated due to lack of empathy. it's trully hellish, but it ends soon.
good luck with your stopping it. It may not be so bad if you taper and taper little by little.
Katia
Posted by lucasj on September 28, 2003, at 19:43:20
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms, posted by wendie on September 17, 2003, at 1:22:08
Hey Windie, today is 9/28/2033. How are you feeling now?
I am trying to decide if I want to try coming off Zoloft after several years.
John
Posted by Dragonfli on September 28, 2003, at 23:06:12
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms » wendie, posted by lucasj on September 28, 2003, at 19:43:20
> Hey Windie, today is 9/28/2033. How are you feeling now?
>
> I am trying to decide if I want to try coming off Zoloft after several years.
>
> JohnHello, my name is Dragonfli (nic name) and I am having tremors, and twitching of my right eye. My Dr. sent me for an MRI that came back negative and still doesn't believe it is the Zoloft even after the drugest said she would bet money the problem is with the 100mg a day I am taking. I have only been on it about three months... what do you reccommend as to how to get it across to the doctor this needs to be looked at as a cause of the tremors and twitches? Help.
Posted by BarbaraCat on September 29, 2003, at 0:39:16
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms » lucasj, posted by Dragonfli on September 28, 2003, at 23:06:12
Hi Dragonfli,
What you're experiencing is a fairly common side effect of SSRI's called akathisia, also referred to as 'extra-pyrimidal side effects'. It happens with most SSRI's, Zoloft being the one reported most. Akathisia causes teeth grining, muscle twitching, inner restlessness, tremors, tics, mouth and tongue movements, restless leg syndrome. As serotonin increases, dopamine decreases causing involuntary movements which don't go away on their own but increase as your med dosage increases. Some other meds help to minimize it, propanolol being one. I'm surprised your doc isn't aware of this.I was on 200mg zoloft for years and ground my teeth down badly, felt clenched inside, had twitches in my muscles that felt like little zings fired off now and then. It was annoying at best. They went away when I discontinued SSRI's.
Do a google search on akathisia+SSRI and you'll come up with loads of hits. Here's one from the horse's mouth:
http://www.zoloft-side-effects-lawyer.com/akathesia.htm
Take care, BarbaraCat
Posted by lucasj on September 29, 2003, at 8:57:55
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms » lucasj, posted by Dragonfli on September 28, 2003, at 23:06:12
> > Hey Windie, today is 9/28/2033. How are you feeling now?
> >
> > I am trying to decide if I want to try coming off Zoloft after several years.
> >
> > John
>
> Hello, my name is Dragonfli (nic name) and I am having tremors, and twitching of my right eye. My Dr. sent me for an MRI that came back negative and still doesn't believe it is the Zoloft even after the drugest said she would bet money the problem is with the 100mg a day I am taking. I have only been on it about three months... what do you reccommend as to how to get it across to the doctor this needs to be looked at as a cause of the tremors and twitches? Help.Dragonfli,
Sorry, but I really don't have any good suggestions.
Posted by wendie on September 29, 2003, at 17:50:15
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms » wendie, posted by lucasj on September 28, 2003, at 19:43:20
> Hey Windie, today is 9/28/2033. How are you feeling now?
>
> I am trying to decide if I want to try coming off Zoloft after several years.
>
> JohnI'm fine,but I'm also taking 50 mg of zoloft every night and 150 mg of Wellbutrin every morning. Come hell or high water, I am going to get off zoloftby the end of the year and then start on the Wellbutrin and then I am never going to take any of this stuff again. I am taking the "taper off very very gradually" approach, timing things so I will have the week after Christmas to go through the worst of the withdrawal which seems to start about two weeks after you stop all together. All I can say is that if you go off, be prepared to feel bad. And if you can, get somebody to encourage and support you through it. My weeklong bout with withdrawal was so awful that I couldn't keep it up, and i am not a person who gives up easily!
Posted by Brenda T on September 29, 2003, at 18:02:53
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms, posted by rickg on September 16, 2003, at 20:05:21
I am a 33 year old female. I have been on a mixture of antidepressants and mood stabilizers for 7 years. The mixture that the doctors had me on was Zoloft, Wellbutrin and Lithium. I do have to say that I was able to get my life back on track while being on these meds, but now I am trying to stay on track and be healthy without the meds. I believe the body can heal itself and I will get my strength through zoga, meditation and diet.
Here's my story:
I successfully quit taking Lithium in December 2002 with few side affects. I slowly reduced the dosage in July of 2002 until I eliminated it completely in December 2002.
Then, I successfully quit Wellbutrin in March 2003. I went through several months of withdrawal symptoms, of which, I believe most of the symptoms I experienced were actual side affects from being only on the zoloft.
After about a month of stability in my mood, I began to taper off of Zoloft. In July 2003, I was taking 100 mg of Zoloft. I then took 75 mg. of zoloft for 3 weeks with no withdrawal symptoms. Then I took 50 mg a day for the next 3 weeks and only experienced headaches. Then in September for 2-1/2 weeks I reduced to 25 mg a day and sometimes I would forget to take the 25 mg. I began to experience many more withdrawal symptoms.
It has been 17 days since I last took zoloft and these are my symptoms: dizziness, lack of energy, easily fatigues, craving sweets, increased appetite at times, headaches, dry eyes, cold feet, hands fall asleep during the night if they are above my heart, less patient, more emotional, easily agitated, vivid and dark dreams, low mood and enthusiasm. I have found that taking a 1-2 hour nap mid-day after lunch is helping me get through the days of intense withdrawal symptoms. I allow my body and mind to shut down each day for a couple of hours so that I can reduce the feelings of being overloaded, overly fatigued and easily angered. It helps but doesn't eliminate all of these horrid symptoms.
I've read that withdrawal symptoms usually go away after 3 weeks or so, but because I had been on zoloft for over 5 years, I'm prepared to experience these symptoms for even longer.I did read that Vitamin B6 or B12 may help reduce the symptoms. Does anyone know for sure and which one may help?
Thanks for letting me share. And for everyone out there going through the withdrawls of any antidepressant, hang in there and journal everything that you are experiencing. Journaling every symptom will help you through this. You are not going crazy...your body just has to readjust itself and heal in time.
Have faith in your own ability to heal!!!!!!!!!
Posted by Donna Louise on September 30, 2003, at 11:27:37
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms, posted by nicholas on September 28, 2003, at 5:04:57
> I'm glad I've come across this forum. I have been taking Zoloft now for the past four years and am considering getting off it.
> I am a 41 yr old male. A doctor prescribed Zoloft for me as I was stressing out so much with life in general,(you know...work, teenage daughters and their rebellions, a bowel cancer operation, a very difficult childhood, etc). This resulted in constant fretting, stressing, depressions & fighting with my wife. Unfortunately it also resulted in me being physically abusive as well. I knew I really, really needed help.
> That help came in the form of a Zoloft pill. Within a week the change was dramatic. From borderline beast to passive, loveable and easy going Dad.
> Yes, I've lost most of my sex drive, for which I do feel bad about at times for my wife,[and me :-( ]but we both feel it's worth it as the postives seem to outweigh the negatives.
> When I first started Zoloft, I got symptoms of nauseousness which lasted about 10 days. I started on 50mgs per day and dosed myself up to 150mgs per day as there were times I felt it wasn't as effective as when I first started. The higher dosage made me subconsciously grind my teeth(even in my sleep, the wife says)spontaneous weeping eyes, chills and if I was to forget to take my dose, the ever familiar chant of "head rushes" (like a dull head bang inside lasting 1-2 seconds occuring erratically & regularly, seemingly whirling in my head)and dizziness.
> This made me nervous in relation to what was Zoloft actually doing to my brain, so I decided to start to "wean" myself back. I went back 100 mgs per day and then to 50 mgs per day all over a 6 mths period. Though a lesser dosage caused me to "lose the plot" sometimes, it actually helped me to "manage" reality a little better rather than being in some kind of chemical stupification all the time.
> The trouble is, recently I tried to actually go off Zoloft but as I'm reading...it ain't easy!!. Any attempt to go below 50mgs per day, even staggering it on and off, resulted in even more of the aforementioned symptoms & more intense in some cases.
> After a while, I put it into the "too hard basket" and resigned myself to being on 50mgs of Zoloft for evermore.
> Recently, I've got to a stage where I feel the 50mg isn't REALLY doing anything or helping me but just keeping me to a level of dependance due to the fact it's very difficult to go back to zero.
> What a money spinner for Phizer eh??
> Yet by reading through the various threads I have found new hope to "give it another go". I believe there is a lot to benefit from this:
> 1. More sex drive. (BTW- this is not necessarily in order!!)
> 2. Actually see if there is an emotional difference between 50mg and zero.(Has the worst past?)
> 3.Peace of mind knowing there is one less drug you are putting in your body as Zoloft hasn't REALLY stood the "test of time" to be unequivocally SAFE.
> 4. Money saved.
> The way I figure it is, worse case scenario, if this 50mg IS really holding me together and I fall apart after going off it....I go back on. Simple. But I'll never, never know if I never,never give it a go.
> Zoloft is a good antidepressant and the like. The drug did ease the torment I was experiencing at a dark time in my life for which I am grateful.
> But is the price a lifetime of indirect dependancy and contributions to Phizers coffers?
>
> Hope not.
>
> Anyhow, thanks to all who has shared their experiences in this forum. It's been a BIG help to read your situations and has helped me feel I'm not alone in all this.
> And like one alluded to, 'Doctors..half of them don't have a clue what it's like or how to help unless they've maybe taken Zoloft themselves, the other half are happy to fill out the prescriptions and get that free holiday compliments of the phamaceutical giants.
This is my solution to withdrawals from SSRI's. I take 10mg of prozac while I quit the other one's that give me the withdrawal. Then, if I want to stop the prozac too, no problem, its half-life is so long that there are none with this drug. This is what I have recently done with the zoloft myself. And unfortunatley, even 25 mg was still helping me with the depression and anxiety. When I cut down to 12.5 mg of zoloft, all the anxiety and depression came back along with the beginnings of some good ol'SSRI "discontinuation effects". Taking the 10mg of prozac has halted all of that, so I may just keep on with the 10mg of prozac as I seem pretty stable at the moment. going on 4 weeks off zoloft and on prozac now.Good luck, we all need it!
Donna
Posted by lucasj on September 30, 2003, at 13:24:46
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms, posted by wendie on September 29, 2003, at 17:50:15
> > Hey Windie, today is 9/28/2033. How are you feeling now?
> >
> > I am trying to decide if I want to try coming off Zoloft after several years.
> >
> > John
>
> I'm fine,but I'm also taking 50 mg of zoloft every night and 150 mg of Wellbutrin every morning. Come hell or high water, I am going to get off zoloftby the end of the year and then start on the Wellbutrin and then I am never going to take any of this stuff again. I am taking the "taper off very very gradually" approach, timing things so I will have the week after Christmas to go through the worst of the withdrawal which seems to start about two weeks after you stop all together. All I can say is that if you go off, be prepared to feel bad. And if you can, get somebody to encourage and support you through it. My weeklong bout with withdrawal was so awful that I couldn't keep it up, and i am not a person who gives up easily!
>
>Wendie,
I have read several of the posts on this "thread" and am beginning to wonder: If coming of Zoloft is so terrible, why in the heck not continue the treatment.
The problems that Zoloft has cured for me were very debilitating. The only symptom of taking Zoloft for me is "feeling great". So I guess I really see no good reason for not taking one pill every day for the rest of my life, if it means the difference between feeling like crap and being able to feel good and live life like before.
Good luck to all who read this, and I will keep you in my prayers!
Posted by nicholas on September 30, 2003, at 15:54:52
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms » nicholas, posted by katia on September 28, 2003, at 13:36:45
> Hi Welcome to psychobabble!
> Do you still have a regular psychiatrist (pdoc)? I would definitely talk to her/him about the fact that you're going off first. Whether they provide support or not, it's an important first step.
> I was only on Zoloft three months and it did nothing for me except made me a zombie AND I still had to endure the w/drawal right after enduring a similar w/d on Effexor. It's hard but doable. Those zappy electrical feelings and the dizziness feeling of going down an elevator sideways does end. Give it two weeks - one for the worst of it. Try even taking 1/2 of 50mg and then 1/2 of that and then 1/2 of that..... until it feels like you can let go totally.
> the main thing is, it does go away with time and no one around you who hasn't gone thru' it won't have a clue what you're trying to describe and you'll feel even more frustrated due to lack of empathy. it's trully hellish, but it ends soon.
> good luck with your stopping it. It may not be so bad if you taper and taper little by little.
> Katia
Hey Katia,Thanks for your words of encouragement. I think I will actually follow the method you've outlined above. It seems to make sense to tread slowly and cautiously whilst trying to get off Zoloft. If I can minimise the intensity of the "zapping" then the rest I feel I can manage.
The first time round, after about 6 days into reducing my dosage, it was like I got scared thinking, "these zaps and dizzy spells aren't going to go away and they're damn intense!!" I ride a motorbike weekends for relaxation ( a cruiser,- great for stress relief) and so I'm thinking, "What would happen if I got a zap whilst riding?"
But, true to my form, (an extremist) I can see my method was too much. ie: 50mg one day, then zero the next then 50mg then zero, zero, etc. At the time it was more of a personal test to see what would happen rather than an out and out decision to go off Zoloft.
Re: Doctors. No I don't have a pdoc. Zoloft was prescribed to me by the local GP on duty that day. I probably should've consulted first, but as I mentioned, it was more of a curiousity test at the time. Nevertheless I will heed your advice and inform whoever's on when I visit about my intentions now that I've decided I don't want/like to keep taking Zoloft. It is better safe than sorry.
Again thanks. It really is encouraging to be able to share these issues with others in similiar circumstances.Nicholas
Posted by nicholas on September 30, 2003, at 16:26:21
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms » nicholas, posted by Donna Louise on September 30, 2003, at 11:27:37
Hey Donna Louise,
Thanks for replying to my post.
The 10mg Prozac idea is definately something I will discuss with the GP when I visit. It seems to make sense to take something that may help to "balance" any withdrawal symptons that may be associated with Zoloft.
I've never taken Prozac before so I'm wondering if you experienced any initial effects when you first introduced yourself to it. (all I need is another set of effects to monitor and deal with!! Ha!).
Also as I mentioned in another post, I think I was too "keen" to wean myself from Zoloft and jumped in all gung-ho, going to extremes. I obviously need to 'take it slow' and expect it to take some time. My current challenge now is: trying to break up a 100 mg Zoloft pill 4 x ways. Wish me luck. Ha!
Again, thanks for the advice.
Nicholas
Posted by Donna Louise on September 30, 2003, at 17:43:41
In reply to Re: zoloft withdrawal symptoms, posted by nicholas on September 30, 2003, at 16:26:21
> Hey Donna Louise,
>
> Thanks for replying to my post.
>
> The 10mg Prozac idea is definately something I will discuss with the GP when I visit. It seems to make sense to take something that may help to "balance" any withdrawal symptons that may be associated with Zoloft.
>
> I've never taken Prozac before so I'm wondering if you experienced any initial effects when you first introduced yourself to it. (all I need is another set of effects to monitor and deal with!! Ha!).
>
> Also as I mentioned in another post, I think I was too "keen" to wean myself from Zoloft and jumped in all gung-ho, going to extremes. I obviously need to 'take it slow' and expect it to take some time. My current challenge now is: trying to break up a 100 mg Zoloft pill 4 x ways. Wish me luck. Ha!
>
> Again, thanks for the advice.
>
> NicholasNicholas, maybe your gp can give you some 25mg samples. You can then break those in half too.
i had no side effects from the prozac at this low dose. Prozac is activating for me and the zoloft was sedating so it just made me feel normal. Although I don't feel activated or sedated at this dose. I have always like prozac the best, it just pooped out on me a few years ago. Also I was taking 20 mg then. I am feeling very good right now on the 10mg prozac, 150mg provigil and 10mg buspar BID. Hope it lasts awhile this time.
i may be able to drop the other two drugs, the provigil and buspar as I needed add-ons with the zoloft. Since it made me a sleepy zombie and didn't work too well for the depression and anxiety.The very best of luck to you,
Donna
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