![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 42. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 2:56:27
Okay, today is my birthday. I got to thinking and I have these two questions for everyone:
1. Have you ever gotten a birthday card from your therapist/pdoc?
2. Do you know his/her birthday? Would you/have you given them a card?
Elle
Posted by tabitha on January 11, 2004, at 3:55:21
In reply to Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 2:56:27
Never received a card, and don't know her birthday. I seriously doubt she would tell me her birthday if I asked. I have sent Christmas cards, and she brings it up in our session. She seems pleased to get it, and she thanks me. Then we have to discuss my card. I pick dancing snowmen a lot. This year it was dancing penguins. She tells me that's my inner child wanting to come out. Too bad she's trapped inside a depressive, reserved woman.
Here's another question.. has anyone taken a picture of their therapist? I asked mine if I could take her picture-- she agreed, but then I sort of chickened out and never did it.
Posted by pegasus on January 11, 2004, at 7:39:56
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by tabitha on January 11, 2004, at 3:55:21
On my last session with my old T, I asked him if I could take his picture. Actually I took a 30 second movie of him with my digital camera. He didn't really like it, but he let me do it. He is so cute in my movie! He's trying so hard to say something helpful and wise, and he's totally uncomfortable. At the end of the movie I tell him that time's almost up, and he says "good". I think he only let me do it because he was sort of abandoning me in the middle of my therapy and felt like he wanted to make the ending as good as he could make it.
Posted by Dinah on January 11, 2004, at 8:40:32
In reply to Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 2:56:27
Nope and nope. I have in the past known his birthday, because he's said something like, today is my birthday, but I never registered it beyond a week or so. If it comes up again, I should at least write "Happy Birthday" on his check. :)
Posted by Dinah on January 11, 2004, at 8:43:48
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by tabitha on January 11, 2004, at 3:55:21
I want a photo of mine. I've been watching the newspapers, but no luck yet.
I've taken photos of his old office, but didn't take a picture of him at the time. He stepped to the side of the office, outside maybe even. And he did make a relaxation tape for me (and I've been known to save his voice mail messages on my machine and put them together on a compilation best of phone messages tape.) Transitional objects. :D
Posted by lilmsbubbles07 on January 11, 2004, at 9:46:50
In reply to Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 2:56:27
well i would like to have a pic of my therapist at least my old one not my new one ... i dont know her bday and i dont knwo my old therapists bday either !!! i would like to know
Posted by fallsfall on January 11, 2004, at 9:56:39
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Client Questions » tabitha, posted by Dinah on January 11, 2004, at 8:43:48
Sometimes near my birthday, I would say something about it being near my birthday and she would open my chart and look and say "Oh, yes, it is near your birthday".
I don't know when hers (or his) is. Although, if your therapist works in a group, they might have a cake and you might find out that way.
I have a picture of my new therapist that was on the internet. I really like it, and I look at it when I'm feeling particularly needy. I also have a couple of voice mail messages that I transferred to a new tape (good thing because I lost power and lost the originals...). I listened to them last night and it helped.
I looked for 8 1/2 years for a picture of my old therapist and didn't find one. I didn't have the guts to ask if I could take one myself.
Posted by Karen_kay on January 11, 2004, at 9:57:08
In reply to Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 2:56:27
So today's your freaking birthday and you didn't tell me? For that I'm not telling you "Happy Birthday"! Hmmmm! Back to the question. I told him the week of my birthday. I said, "My birthday is this week, are you going to get me a present?" of course as a joke, I think sometimes he doesn't always get my sense of humor but I had only been seeing him for 5 months so I'll let it slide. He started on about this lecture about boundaries and I just rolled my eyes. And no, he didn't get me a card or anything. When I saw him, a few days after the big day, he told me happy birthday.
I asked him when his birthday was, but he said, "I'm not telling you because [and this is rather embarrassing BUT...] I know you're into Astrology (not that much, come on!!!) and you'll start reading up on my sign and looking into things too much (which wasn't wrong :)" Come on now! That makes me sound like some kind of a witch doctor or something! I couldn't even name all of the signs off the top of my head, but that is why I wanted to know his birthday (ooopsie, Busted!)I think he's a Taurus, if anyone's interested :)I'll figure out his birthday, just wait. He'll leave his wallet in the office one day or something, and I'll be like "Ah HA! So your birthday is -----!" Wait, do you think that would scare him away?Oh, yeah, if I knew his birthday, I'd send a card, no problem. And he'd appreciate it too!
Posted by Karen_kay on January 11, 2004, at 10:58:10
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by tabitha on January 11, 2004, at 3:55:21
I don't have a picture. I'm not sure if I would want a picture either. First of all, if I ask him if I could have a picture then that says something (I'm possibly into voodo, or I need some sort of a momento, or I want to be closer to him Yeck!). Also, I don't want to get into a long discussion of "what that means" ie. me asking for a picture. And I certainly don't want to be rejected. And another thing, what if he takes horrible pictures and I realize that he isn't nearly as attractive? Or what if he really isn't as attrative as I think he is? I think I'd rather just let the whole "therapy fantasy" continue in the office and not bring it home with me, outside of my thoughts, that is. And what if my boyfriend saw it? He'd never let me live that one down... No, no picture for me, thank you!
Posted by lookdownfish on January 11, 2004, at 11:09:35
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Client Questions » tabitha, posted by Karen_kay on January 11, 2004, at 10:58:10
Don't know her birthday. But I nearly fell off the couch a few weeks back when she told me she was 66. I thought she was about 10 years younger. Would love to have a photo but I wouldn't dare ask.
Posted by gardenergirl on January 11, 2004, at 11:39:45
In reply to Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 2:56:27
Posted by psychlover on January 11, 2004, at 12:36:22
In reply to Happy birthday Elle (nm), posted by gardenergirl on January 11, 2004, at 11:39:45
As someone who has spent time as both a client and a therapist, I find it interesting that so many of you are interested in your therapist's birthday. What is that really about?
It sounds like you are trying to make a personal connection with your therapist, and that is not really what the therapeutic relationship is about.
The job of the therapist is to help the client/patient to work out his or her own problems, not for the therapist to cure him or her or to replace some other person in the client's past or present life.
The role of the therapist is not that of a parent, or a boyfriend/girlfriend, a lover, or even a friend. That does not mean the therapist should not be friendly and warm -- he should --but the therapist needs to establish firm boundaries that make it clear to the patient that this is a professional, working relationship.
You should not go into therapy trying to make a new friend -- or more -- with the therapist. And a therapist should not go into practice thinking he is going to make friends or more with his clients. That is not what it is about. Of course, transference and countertransference are both normal parts of the therapeutic process, but they must be handled in a therapeutic way, which means examining what is behind what is said or done.
Generally speaking, I believe that a good therapist would not divulge his birthday when asked (of course it depends on the specific circumstances), but rather he should follow that up with asking why it is important for you to know his birthday.
Of course, a therapist cannot always avoid answering the questions, but really the therapy is about you as the client and not about him as the therapist. Anytime a therapist starts to disclose too much about himself to a client, it is time to find another therapist.
I think this may come as a surprise to some of you who have other expectations of what therapy should be.
Posted by Dinah on January 11, 2004, at 12:49:44
In reply to Re: Happy birthday Elle, posted by psychlover on January 11, 2004, at 12:36:22
I think much of what you say is perfectly correct. But the details of self disclosure are debated among therapists. And perfectly respectable therapists have different ideas about it.
Is knowing someone's birthday really establishing a personal relationship? I don't really think so. My therapist mentioned when his birthday was and it wasn't important enough for me to remember it! Nor does he remember mine. If he, or I, happen to mention it's our birthday, the other would probably say happy birthday and get back to therapy.
Boundaries should be set at the optimal distance for a particular client. Flexibility is the key to good therapy. Unless you're doing strict psychoanalysis, or strict CBT perhaps, the idea of a blank slate therapist has pretty much gone the way of the dinosaur. Most therapists who use a relational model would not be particularly surprised at what some of us think therapy should be. They may even think that a lack of curiousity about our therapist reveals as much as an abundance of it. And maybe it would.
Posted by Dinah on January 11, 2004, at 12:52:14
In reply to Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 2:56:27
I somehow missed that it was actually your birthday!
Happy Happy Birthday, Elle my dear. Happy things to come your way this year. If I had a wish then it would be, a very happy birthday to you from me!
Even if it is late.
Posted by Pandabear on January 11, 2004, at 13:34:39
In reply to Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 2:56:27
I dont know my therapist bday but, she did give me a christmas card...it was actually a thank you card because I had given her some cookies that I had mde for her for christmas...but i dont have a picture of her...and yes i do save some of her voice messages on my machine..although it makes me feel really weird that I do that...but, it does make me feel comforted when I listen to them...
Posted by Dinah on January 11, 2004, at 13:34:43
In reply to Re: Happy birthday Elle, posted by psychlover on January 11, 2004, at 12:36:22
From "The Gift of Therapy" by Irvin Yalom, M.D. page 92
"If patients want to know whether I am married, have children, liked a certain movie, read a certain book, or felt awkward at our meeting at some social event, I always answer them directly. Why not? What's the big deal? How can one have a genuine encounter with another person while remaining so opaque?"
p. 93
"Thus, by no means does therapist self-disclosure replace the exploration of the process of hte patient's personal inquiries. Do both! Some therapists make a point of responding to questions with: "I'll be glad to answer that, but first I'd like to as much as possible about the asking of that question." Sometimes I use that approach, but I've rarely found particular advantage in insisting on any particular order ("You go first and then I'll respond").
Dr. Yalom is widely respected, and his approach is probably not fringe. We, as patients, have the option to choose our therapists on the basis of many qualities. Overly firm boundaries would probably be a deal breaker for me, unless the therapist was particularly gifted in other areas.
I don't think a patient/client should let anyone make us feel guilty about being human and wanting a level of connection, not even our therapists. They can draw their boundaries, we can draw ours, and if they aren't compatible we can look elsewhere.
Posted by Medusa on January 11, 2004, at 14:16:02
In reply to Re: Therapist self revelation » psychlover, posted by Dinah on January 11, 2004, at 13:34:43
thanks Dinah. I enjoy reading these threads, who knows why, and I didn't take the admonitions of the previous poster really seriously. I think most posters here are pretty aware of the dynamics involved.
The therapist who's being trained on my case is really really opaque. I'm not sure how much of that is because I've demanded it and how much is her training - she doesn't want to get shot down by her reviewing team. (They watch the whole thing by remote +and+ the session is videotaped.)
I happen to like "opaque" in this case ... not sure what it says about me that I'm not curious about her. At all. Is that scary? X and I were discussing our respective growth situations, and he was curious about how old she was. (Probably his age, but I hadn't thought about that before he asked.) In the same conversation, I realized that she often wears pants that resemble pants he often wears, at least in fabric, but I don't know if they're the same ones. (I mean every session, not the same pants he wears!) And she wears amber and silver jewelry, which is the sort of thing I notice on +everyone+ since I seem to be programmed to pick up on people's styles and preferences. I tend to be able to pick presents pretty well ... and in reading a previous Perfect Patient thread, I realized if I had any desire to give her something, I'd probably be able to pick out jewelry that she'd like.
During the first session, I sat so that I was facing the camera. I wanted to be able to get an impression of WHY I've gotten weird (to me) reactions from so many therapists ... and I thought that I could double-check that by seeing videos. Well, she made a face when I said something, so since then, I've been sure to sit so that she's facing the camera, in case she ever makes a face and I want to discuss it and she denies. No faces since then. (I'd said that I used to dress inappropriately, and had made big progress by getting it together to some degree. I don't think she really believed me, for whatever reason.)
Posted by Dinah on January 11, 2004, at 14:40:33
In reply to thanks » Dinah, posted by Medusa on January 11, 2004, at 14:16:02
That's why there are different therapists, I guess. Because we all have different needs. But as you pointed, even the most opaque therapists let us know something about themselves whether they mean to or not. And even the most opaque-therapist loving clients might want to know something - like whether they're having a reaction to what we're saying.
I, on the other hand, go through most of my sessions with my eyes closed. :) I'd be afraid to see his reactions.
On the other hand, I really don't need to know anything at all about my EMDR therapist other than that she knows what she's doing.
Posted by Speaker on January 11, 2004, at 15:13:41
In reply to Re: Happy birthday Elle, posted by psychlover on January 11, 2004, at 12:36:22
I would find it very poor judgement to go to a therapist that I didn't get to know somewhat. I am letting this T guide my thoughts and I sure want to know a bit about the person that is going to have my most intimate thoughts. I know they are professional but I want to know what drove them to their profession. To help people...to get rich...to have power...what is it? After I get to know their hearts a bit I might be willing to share mine. We are each so different and to think the boundries are the same for each would take the individuality out of therapy. We would only need self help books to apply and we would all get better. Sorry, you struck a cord!
Posted by Speaker on January 11, 2004, at 15:18:20
In reply to Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 2:56:27
HAPPY BIRTHDAY ELLE, 1. I did not get a birthday card from my T. but when I ended with him I got a card and a gift. He did always wish me a Happy Birthday.
2. Yes, I knew my T. birthday and always got him a funny card...I guess I even got him a serious card at times.I just started with a new T and I don't care enough to know his birthday yet. But if there is a long time relationship...I'm sure I would find out somehow and get him a card :).
Posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 18:20:17
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by Speaker on January 11, 2004, at 15:18:20
Well thanks everyone for responding and for saying happy birthday. I started this thread because I have become really curious about how old my therapist is. I googled him and if the stuff I read is about him, then he is about 44. Somehow, I wanted him to be older than that. I wanted him to be more 55ish.
My old doctor used to wish me a happy birthday every year, and I never appreciated it. In fact I used to get annoyed with her thinking, "like you care about my birthday," now I wish that my pdoc would say something.
I think it was Psychlover who said something about firm boundaries. As it is, my therapist doesn't share much about himself. He did disclose to me that he has SAD, and there was some satisfaction in knowing that he felt like he could tell me that. Maybe he tells all his patients that. I don't know. But I sure would like to know more about him.
:) I save all his messages on my voicemail until it automatically reaches the time limit and deletes them. I like to hear his voice, it's comforting. One time I decided to trip him up. I used to have a personal greeting on my phone and then I decided to switch it to an automatic one where the lady comes on and says something to the effect of, "555-555 is not available, please leave a message..." I loved his response. He goes, well I'm looking for Elle (long pause) please call me back. :) He never gets thrown off like that where he can't think of the perfect thing to say so I like it of course... :)
Elle
Posted by DaisyM on January 11, 2004, at 20:52:37
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Client Questions, posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 18:20:17
Happy Birthday Elle! My birthday is Thursday. My Therapist said something to me last week about being a Capricorn, fitting the profile (I do) and he wondered what my birthday might trigger for me. I was surprised that he noticed.
I do not know his but I bet he would tell me if I asked. He has answered all my questions except one but I rarely ask personal ones. I don't have a picture. I don't have a voice mail either. I'll have to think about that.
Posted by Karen_kay on January 11, 2004, at 21:36:42
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Client Questions » Elle2021, posted by DaisyM on January 11, 2004, at 20:52:37
A Capricorn, eh? Hmmm.. I'm a Cancer and if you look that sign up, I swear you'll find a picture of Karen! I SOOOOOOOO want to know when my therapist's birthday is! Just so I can find out for sure if he is a Taurus. I just want to know if I'm right or not. And I wouldn't think we were that close in age except that he keeps saying we are. I would guess he's somewhere between maybe 28 and 45???? I'm not good at guessing ages. Maybe I'll ask him? But then I may get the whole, "Why do you want to know?" crap that comes with every question. Or, maybe I can just ask him if he's a Taurus because he seems like he's full of crap sometimes! If he becomes defensive, then I'll know it's true? This is just normal curiousity, right?
Oh, I don't save his voicemail messages. His voice sounds rather boyish. Sometimes I listen to the message twice, but that's it. After that, it time to say goodbye!
Oh, and Elle, you asked if my therapist knew that I posted here----- HEAVENS NO! I don't trust that he wouldn't come on here and look. And he'd pick me out super quick, as um, the way I talk on here is pretty much the way I talk in "real life." I couldn't stand the shame of him possibly knowing the way I talk about him. I'm already paranoid that he found out that I post on here [you didn't, did you??? :)] and just hasn't said anything. I'd end up going to session every week and just explaining everything that I posted the previous week, to make sure I didn't hurt his feelings. OMG, I'm feeling anxiuos just thinking about him possibly knowing my "secret." He oculdn't possibly know, could he? OK, now's the time that everyone should jump in and reassure me that he doesn't know. I DON'T want to hear "It's OK if he does read this." NONE of THAT!Enough of this! Time for ice cream or something!
Posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 21:50:35
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Client Questions » DaisyM, posted by Karen_kay on January 11, 2004, at 21:36:42
No dear,
He can't possibly know that you post here. He's attractive and intelligent...but not clever enough to think of this.:)
Elle
Posted by Elle2021 on January 11, 2004, at 21:56:45
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Client Questions » Elle2021, posted by DaisyM on January 11, 2004, at 20:52:37
> Happy Birthday Elle! My birthday is Thursday.
Happy birthday to you too! Was it last Thursday or this coming Thursday?
My Therapist said something to me last week about being a Capricorn, fitting the profile (I do) and he wondered what my birthday might trigger for me. I was surprised that he noticed.
I hope mine says something about it being my birthday, cause then I can ask him when his is.
> I do not know his but I bet he would tell me if I asked. He has answered all my questions except one but I rarely ask personal ones. I don't have a picture. I don't have a voice mail either. I'll have to think about that.
:) I just liked throwing him off by changing the message. It had been the same for over a year.
Elle
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Psychology | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.