Psycho-Babble Relationships Thread 784918

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Narcissistic Mother/Parent + Dangers

Posted by jacs on September 24, 2007, at 19:49:20

Hello....
I wanted to know if anyone out there had any experience with a narcissistic parent. I mean a serious personality disorder...I ask because after the recent death of my step-dad I am watching my own mother re-enact how every death is all about her while those around her cannot mourn the loss for themselves. Though some of this is about grief, I guess my fear is that I don't know how to handle this person anymore (did I ever?). She is an 81 yr. old woman who I know will not change and I am 46 and I can change...so there is hope I guess. But I will give you a for instance: yesterday I had called because I was having a check up by my doctor regarding a possible chance I may have a tumor (breast cancer-- turns out, all is well) as I was talking my mother mentioned she had thrown out a bunch of my dad's writing which I had specifically asked for, but she threw it away as she threw him away and maintained that she needed to "get rid of things" - she was stern and angry and hostile towards me. I has asked for these things..it was attention towards him...she punishes me and his daughters.....

I was devastated that she threw these away...he was a writer...when I mentioned if I was sick I would go to a hospital 2 hours away she said " I cannot drive there" (she does not see well) I replied that I was not going to choose a hospital to make it easier on others and that this was about me not her. I never talked back to her, but what I have seen since this April has created so much pain and reminders of past pain. He took his own life and I am deeply sad by this and I do not see this as selfish like many do (my mother does) but I see it as a total loss of self and the saddest state to be in and I feel so much for my step-dad. I feel for her too, but my feelings are for many not "only." My mother has been furious with me since I spoke my mind (peacefully I might add). She said that everyone agrees with her "except you!" (meaning me) was the response towards me. I refuse to agree because I don't agree. I think the whole thing is sad and not about who takes sides with whom. I think she is very sick and dangerous. My therapist said she is a classic narcissist and that I have not learned to protect myself around her. I wonder how to do this...if I stay away for good this might work, but she goes through other family members to get to me....it is almost evil to me. She sets them up as props and they have no idea and she looks very good to everyone....this I know is classic behavior of a narcissist...the daughter is crazy.....I shake my head.

I don't get it. If I walk away and just want to live in peace and be away from her, why does a person have to needle the other especially under this type of duress? I am sorry this is so long, but it is only the tip of the iceberg....I am throwing this out there for any advice you may have...I am lost and I am hurt and I miss my step-dad. I am not allowed to feel unless it is for her-- ONLY.

Thank you for reading.....
jacs

 

Sorry about the post above

Posted by jacs on September 26, 2007, at 19:49:00

In reply to Narcissistic Mother/Parent + Dangers, posted by jacs on September 24, 2007, at 19:49:20

Sorry folks....guess this was a real social magnet for commentary. Albeit, it is a tricky one.
Oh well it was worth a shot.
J

 

Re: Narcissistic Mother/Parent + Dangers

Posted by Mal on October 4, 2007, at 4:35:27

In reply to Narcissistic Mother/Parent + Dangers, posted by jacs on September 24, 2007, at 19:49:20

I am so sorry to read about your losses. I don't know what else to say- sorry I dont' have any advice... I hope you get some peace with that relationship soon...

Mal

 

Re: Narcissistic Mother/Parent + Dangers

Posted by happyflower on October 6, 2007, at 8:08:11

In reply to Narcissistic Mother/Parent + Dangers, posted by jacs on September 24, 2007, at 19:49:20

Hi Jacs,

I have read your post awhile ago, but I identified with it so much, it was hard to respond. I too had a mother who has a major personality disorder. She sounds a lot like your mother in ways. Especially about making other relatives pawns in her game.

After my father died, I had no reason to keep in contact with her. She did something really awful to brother, and after that I had to take my personal safety and my DH and kids safety in mind. I have had no contact with her since early 2000. It was the best thing I ever had to do. It wasn't easy because relatives would call and say horrible stuff and write, etc. But they didn't know her true self, they only saw the mask she very wore very well.

I tried to tell a few relatives on my dad's side of the family but because of their relgious beliefs, they can't except someone who doesn't "honor thy parents", even if she was an abusive monster. So I do feel somewhat abandoned by family members, but I am glad I have my own family, one that can hopefully grow without the outside influence of my "bad past".

I stopped the cycle of abuse when I had my kids, they will never have to know what it is like to grow up the way I did. In a way I had to disengage from my mother to keep my family and myself mentally and physically healthy.

I don't know if this helps, but I wanted to know you are not alone. Good luck

 

Thank you for writing » happyflower

Posted by jacs on October 6, 2007, at 9:02:29

In reply to Re: Narcissistic Mother/Parent + Dangers, posted by happyflower on October 6, 2007, at 8:08:11

Yes, of course your post helps. Thank you for writing. I only recently pinned the "diagnosis" on my mother because I could not for the life of me figure out what on earth was and had been happening all these years. Last night I had an interesting conversation with a friend. She said that I was in fact the "mirror" to the narcissist mother. She said that I mirror every value my mother does not have and that mirror sees through her actions and she will fight me forever. I was sorta stunned by the comment, but in many ways it made sense. These are values(mine) my mother does not have and they involve having empathy for others, for starters. My friend also said, because I was born in a family of three and I am the youngest, that from her experience as the middle child, the oldest or the youngest takes the "hit." My older sister disengaged long ago and that was her way of dealing with "it"...my middle sister, who we lost to cancer six years ago, found what my friend calls a "niche." She sister moved to the West coast as far away as possible (we all had different ways of dealing with this and I think some of it was on a subconscious level), but my middle sister got along with my mother, she never was a the pawn I was. And I didn't get far enough away and I became the resource for my mother...the responder...the one who feeds her narcissism and I have paid dearly for it. That relational bond, the first relational bond we all have, for me, was never there. I have grown so tired of a mother who has to compete with her daughters and then cross-compare them and reduce me to nothing, that I never discuss myself anymore and I have not spoken to her for several weeks. When you cannot talk about what brings you joy, or what your achievements are etc. etc. that is very sad to me. This is parent that never evolved and remained like child, a constant "me" centered child who, because she has not evolved, has missed out on some life's great wisdom....

The guilt is powerful as you well know, but I cannot bear to see her or be near it. I feel like it sets me back more and more. The hardest part is to detach without hanging on to the anger I have for her--it is fierce. The anger is repulsive to me and it sits there waiting to be re-worked and it's hard for me. Anger comes from pain doesnt' it? Some anger I guess. I am glad you wrote. Not an easy topic and here I fnd myself apologizing for even putting the post out there. I have spent my life apologizing for what I think and who I am; after awhile you are not sure who you are because you have allowed people to tell you who you are most of your life. This was the first year I finally told a "friend" who is the male version of my mother....that I hope someday he will stop telling me who I am, because it is not for him to decide. That was huge step for me.

Last night, I had a dream about a woman who is very much like my mother and the dream I had was that her house had been demmolished and the land was cleared and exposed earth was all you could see...all I can think about with that dream is "rebuilding" and starting anew....I have had several dreams in the past month as if my mind is purging itself of all this pain and forcing me to look at these people, at my choices, reminding me of how much they all have in common and then of course, I have to look at myself. What makes this hard, is that when you have not had the nurturance that a relatively normal kid has, you spend a lot of time seeking approval and you start to feel like the narcissist yourself and that concerns me..almost as if it was passed on and I have to fight that and put it in perspective, because I don't need all the air in the room, so to speak. I have a step-sister who is just like my mother...ugh...But I do feel let down when friends don't come through on promises, etc. it triggers the loss in my early years and so I am left to deal with them. Tough road. I am glad for you to have the guts to walk away and to protect your family. I have a friend you did the same thing and never regretted it...she has warned me often that sooner or later I will need to walk away and its hard to do it, because my mother's life has been very hard, but these are choices she made that impacted her children as well, but she does not see that. I have empathy for her, where she has none for me or her ailing late husband.

She was fed up with parenting by the time I was born and my step-dad used to tell me that for me, that was not necessarily the worst thing because he felt I would have had been less influenced by my parents and have more independence in many ways and I do defy most of all my mother stands for....I miss my step-dad and all his wisdom and trying to put a positive spin on the negative.

Thank you for sharing and if you read all of this....thank you for reading! I find most people who have the experience I have, cannot get to close to it-- that is how powerful and painful it is as if pieces of its "hook" are still in your skin, or the scar is so big your skin is pulled so tight it feels like it will break open.

have mercy on yourself....

jacs

Hi Jacs,
>
> I have read your post awhile ago, but I identified with it so much, it was hard to respond. I too had a mother who has a major personality disorder. She sounds a lot like your mother in ways. Especially about making other relatives pawns in her game.
>
> After my father died, I had no reason to keep in contact with her. She did something really awful to brother, and after that I had to take my personal safety and my DH and kids safety in mind. I have had no contact with her since early 2000. It was the best thing I ever had to do. It wasn't easy because relatives would call and say horrible stuff and write, etc. But they didn't know her true self, they only saw the mask she very wore very well.
>
> I tried to tell a few relatives on my dad's side of the family but because of their relgious beliefs, they can't except someone who doesn't "honor thy parents", even if she was an abusive monster. So I do feel somewhat abandoned by family members, but I am glad I have my own family, one that can hopefully grow without the outside influence of my "bad past".
>
> I stopped the cycle of abuse when I had my kids, they will never have to know what it is like to grow up the way I did. In a way I had to disengage from my mother to keep my family and myself mentally and physically healthy.
>
> I don't know if this helps, but I wanted to know you are not alone. Good luck

 

Re: Thank you for writing

Posted by happyflower on October 6, 2007, at 16:42:18

In reply to Thank you for writing » happyflower, posted by jacs on October 6, 2007, at 9:02:29

Hi Jacs,

I read your posts and it sounds so much like me, it is kinda freaky. But please don't be sorry for writing your posts, it helps a lot of people who are afraid to post about it. It seems like it is sort of a taboo to write about our parents or talk about them in a negative way whether on the boards or in real life.

YOu know I feel the same way with friends, that it is easy to feel left down by them if they don't put the energy into the relastionship that we do. I am just finding I need other friends. lol But I understand that feeling, I have felt it most of my life. But one thing I do know is that is usually isn't us, it is something on their end that doesn't make being a friend to them easy. So try not to be too hard on yourself, but I know easier said than done. lol

Ohhh, the anger! Yes of course you have anger! I still have anger, but therapy is helping. I am one that is okay with anger. You have ever right to be angry, so let that sh*t out and you will feel better. It is like poison
inside of you , if you can learn to let out a little bit at a time, it won't seem so overwhelming. But if you learn to let out more and more of what is building up inside of you , you will probably feel more lighter and feel better. The anger is there for a reason, so try to accept that you have a right to feel angry. It is better to get it out (in a safe way) than to let it eat at you. Take care of yourself!

 

Re: Narcissistic Mother/Parent + Dangers

Posted by MomAndStep on December 1, 2007, at 22:50:41

In reply to Narcissistic Mother/Parent + Dangers, posted by jacs on September 24, 2007, at 19:49:20

Jacs - I understand. I fortunately have a Mother that is what every one would want if they could pick their own parent. However, I know of 3 adults who had narcissistic parents and unfortunately my step children have a narcissistic mother as well. I married my husband 5 years ago and he has 3 children from a previous marriage. A friend slipped him a book called "Why is it always about you? The 7 deadly sins of narcissism." I sat down and read the sections that were not just the dry medical facts aloud and he confirmed that his ex-wife was in fact a narcissist. For an example of how it truly is all about her…for 6 months after he left her home, she was receiving sympathy cards and nightly casseroles. My husband was told by a family member of hers that it would have been better if he had died instead of just leaving her. It has been a struggle for him since they divorced to have equal time with his kids. He went to a mediator a judge, they both had lawyers and the kids were in counseling. The ex-wife was able to snow everyone (as I have come to witness for myself) and he has not been able to have equal time with his kids. He left her abuse to be able to provide a better, more stable life for them but, the only result was to take away the firewall that he was between her and the kids. If asked today if they would like to spend more time at Dad’s house, they start to shake, say NO, and if you push the subject one of them will start to cry. It’s a no win situation when dealing with the evil that is narcissism. In the above mentioned book it says your only option is to run and run fast. That is not always a possibility when the abuser is a relative. We have many more years to fight with this force. Wish us all luck!

 

To Mom and Stepmom...... » MomAndStep

Posted by jacs on December 18, 2007, at 4:37:14

In reply to Re: Narcissistic Mother/Parent + Dangers, posted by MomAndStep on December 1, 2007, at 22:50:41

Thanks for your post ... sorry for the delay...I have been in the midst of finals...though "midst" makes it sound like a fun thing..."middle" or "agony" would be better....."treacherous task"..you get my point.

You have your hands full. I will keep this book in mind though given your experience and my own, and many others no doubt, a large anthology could be written. A sort of "Mommy and Daddy Dearest"... it is early and my brain has spent all its precious cells on papers ( I am a theology major of all things....not as in "religious" and getting a degree as a minister, just religious studies as they relate to culture) My parents were totally non-religious so it makes sense that I study something they were not even remotely interested in.... :)

Yes, the advice I hear all the time is "run fast"...it makes me very sad. I want to call my mother (she is 81) but I am afraid I will get hurt. Afraid that I cannot protect myself from her...if I knew how to build a hardshell around myself, then I could do it, but I can't. The thought that I need to do that is also painful. I feel guilty for not seeing her (she knows this for sure and would play it up if she could). I spent Thanksgiving by myself and heard from no one. That is pathetic isn't it? Maybe it was safer, But it made me real sad.
But if I see her.... I know what will happen...just more pain and I am tired of it. I set myself up every time.

A friend once said that people like this have a "black hole in the 'need' department" -- so true. You will never fill it and they will do anything to fill it..... even at the expense of their children who I think at times they see as mere instruments --- not human with their own needs, like "love." My father was not much better, but he had the ability to show some affection for his kids, but he died when I was young. I remember him little, but I do remember my mother coveting him like a piece of property...she was not going to share him -- not even with his own children....that is beyond me.

Thank you for writing. Tough subject that I noticed has little commentary, which makes it interesting in that respect. I wonder why. I don't think it is just because people don't like to talk about their parents or that it is not socially acceptable, that is what many if not most ,seem to talk about these days. We like blaming them!... Papa Freud was on to something.....I am teasing, though he was. I don't blame, I just wonder how one can walk through life that blind and seem so unscathed emotionally or otherwise, while I walk with a chronic limp from the injuries...

The only thing I know, is that I need to do some work for myself and take a look and keep pushing forward and doing well in my studies and try to be a little more outgoing and have people in my life... I am so afraid of them...the feeling of being let down all over again it the part that prevents me from engaging. I can come to the rescue if there is a problem-- the urgency is a camouflauge (sp) of sorts-- getting near pain, but knowing you can leave it. This was not the case when losing my sister, that has been the hardest---- it is beyond my comprehension---that is another thing that there is little written on-- sibling loss...there is a little here and there-- web sites I would never go near, but when I lost her 6 years ago? Not even hospice could help....there was nothing and as you might have guessed....I could NOT go to my mother because the loss was strictly my mother's and no one elses.....

I do wish you luck and you sound like you have support. I don't have much of that, but I am trying to figure things out so that the next half of my life here is not as horrible as my parents has been.....ending some cycles is a good thing. I think the most important at this stage, though it has motivated me to speak up more, is to get rid of anger-- it is a killer-- a plague-- has a purpose at times, but there also comes a time when it is time to stop.

Good luck to you-- enjoy the season, such as it is.

Best,
Jacs


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