Psycho-Babble Psychology Thread 1466

Shown: posts 94 to 118 of 164. Go back in thread:

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by jennifer s on November 26, 2006, at 20:56:44

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by bird in the sky on November 26, 2006, at 19:53:50

negative

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by widget on February 2, 2007, at 8:03:11

In reply to Re: Love with therapist Stamper, posted by judy1 on November 9, 2002, at 18:50:39

Please tell me why it is so incredibly harmful for a patient to have a romantic/sexual relationship with a therapist? I do not understand when it feel so right.

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by Pippa on February 2, 2007, at 8:20:02

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by widget on February 2, 2007, at 8:03:11

Hi - I have been in a relationship with my therapist now for 5 months - he loves me and I love him. Its much more than sex (although the physical side is fantastic) We are in each others minds all day and night. I have told my kids and my husband. Sadly my therapist has yet to disclose our love to his family. Timing he says is everything. I am sure that his love and tenderness have saved me from myself. Pippa

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by widget on February 2, 2007, at 11:05:18

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by bird in the sky on November 26, 2006, at 19:53:50

Thanks for the reply, Pippa. How does your husband and family feel about this? How do you think it will be resolved? Do you love both men? I think it is possible to love two men.

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by caraher on February 2, 2007, at 11:09:41

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by widget on February 2, 2007, at 11:05:18

Welcome widget and pippa!

Please see this thread: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/psycho/20070119/msgs/727426.html

I fear that what "feels right" now won't feel so good in the long run.

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by widget on February 2, 2007, at 11:41:04

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by caraher on February 2, 2007, at 11:09:41

To Caraher, thanks for the comment but can you explain why you say this would turn out badly? Isn't love just love?

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by caraher on February 2, 2007, at 14:13:57

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by widget on February 2, 2007, at 11:41:04

> To Caraher, thanks for the comment but can you explain why you say this would turn out badly? Isn't love just love?

It's possible for it to turn out OK. But it's less likely to truly work out when you have two people entering a relationship from such different perspectives. I teach college students, and ethically (even were I not married) it's not a good idea to date a student because I'm in a position of authority. Maybe after a class is over... but definitely not during!

It's even more serious in therapy, because the way many therapies work, as therapy, the patient develops strong feelings for the therapist. If a therapist has multiple clients... well, I hope you can see the conflicts that can arise! Therapy is supposed to be a professional relationship despite its personal dimensions.

If a therapist really wants to have an intimate, non-professional relationship with you, the therapist needs, at a minimum, to stop providing your therapy.

Love is love. But mere attachment can feel like love. And worse, exploitation can also feel like love. Professional boundaries exist to prevent a mistaken feeling from harming a patient.

 

Re: Love with therapist Pippa

Posted by ElaineM on February 2, 2007, at 19:56:17

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by Pippa on February 2, 2007, at 8:20:02

Hi Pippa, I'm totally not judging here. I just have a few questions I was hoping you could give your opinion on (if you didn't feel weird about answering). Do you still have sessions with him, or did that stop once the sexual relationship started? And if you do, do you still do traditional therapy work? Is it possible?

Also, were you already estranged from your husband, or if not, was he angry or interested in filing a complaint against your T once you told him?

I too sometimes feel like my T's affection is saving me from something infinitely worse. That all alone, I wouldn't have lasted this long. I'm particularily interested in others perspectives on if the "therapy" has any real therapeutic benefits once the relationship becomes sexual, or even "just" social. Like, can you still get some psychological work done?

Sorry if I seem nosey -- I'm interested. In a vaguely similar situation. [Not lovers though]

I'm not one who can explain the technicalities about why it's usually harmful to the patient in the long run. But I do think you're brave for posting about something so taboo. [though I can't help but also be concerned for you :) ]
Best, Elaine

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by widget on February 2, 2007, at 20:39:29

In reply to Re: Love with therapist Pippa, posted by ElaineM on February 2, 2007, at 19:56:17

To caraher, you are obviously a very ethical and moral person. Thank you for the advice. However, I am still unclear about why this relationship would be so devastating. It is something to do with the power differential. Actually, I thought the more personal involvement would add some parity to the relationship. Can you explain further? The therapist in question is absolutely fantastic and beyond reproach.

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by Honore on February 2, 2007, at 21:28:42

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by widget on February 2, 2007, at 20:39:29

Hi, widget.

The power differential might be what makes the relationship so intense and compelling at this time.

You seem, to me, to be idealizing your T a great deal-- which is often a stage in the unfolding of therapy. However, eventually, one needs to learn that this idealization isn't reliable-- that it leaves out too much. The disillusionment can be painful, although manageable and eventually therapeutic- - in therapy.

If you've having a romantic relationship with your T, the disillusionment can be profound and even devastating-- esp. if it involves abandonment, or exploitation.

I notice that your T somehow hasn't told his family because the "time isn't right"-- I have to tell you, though, that that doesn't sound very promising to me. For one thing the "time is *never* and I do mean *never* right to tell one's wife and children that one is having a relationship with anyone, especially a patient. or-- if you're in love with someone-- the time is always right, because you feel committed to being with that person.

Also, I have to differ with you in one important respect-- you say your T is "beyond reproach"-- that, with all due respect, is precisely what he is not beyond. Even if your affair works out-- he has violated a very strong ethical duty-- to you, to his other patients, to the therapeutic community, and, on another level, to his family.

I'm concerned for you.

Honore

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by bird in the sky on February 2, 2007, at 22:45:21

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by Honore on February 2, 2007, at 21:28:42

I have identified with you all and i thank you for sharing so much. I don't write here much but read pretty often. Even though i have been in love with my therapist for a couple years now or so, and he has explained to me all this you also have explained, i still wish we could have sex. I mostly think about being held so close and imagine it often. I also think of sex which brings us even closer (in my mind). I am still a bit obsessed with the idea and when i am with him i sneak looks at his chest and imagine my head up against it. this desire is very strong and i wish i could get it fulfilled. maybe there should be a professional who would do that for people. hold them in a loving way. every day is hard cause i am always thinking of it , when i can let my mind go. someimes it makes me horny, and i dont understand this cause i thought it would be some kind of mother or father thing. I often masturbate before i see my T, so i will be more relaxed. does anyone do the same?

 

Message for Pippa, not widget, sorry about confusi

Posted by Honore on February 3, 2007, at 1:28:09

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by Honore on February 2, 2007, at 21:28:42

confusion.

Also, in conflated your statements, so what is relevant to Pippa excludes the part about her therapist being beyond reproach.

Again, sorry about the confusion.

Honore

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by Pippa on February 3, 2007, at 2:33:46

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by Honore on February 2, 2007, at 21:28:42

Honore

Thank you for your comments and replies.

I knew when I posted that I might be opening pandora's box.

Believe me, before we started our affair we talked about the implications that our actions would have on our families and damage that our love could have on his career and professional standing. Based on rational discussion and a deep trust for each other we started our future.

My T 's reason for not telling his wife and children is because she has a terminal illness and the children do not need the added grief of dealing with what we have started at this stage in their lives.

My husband and family do not know who I am in this relationship with. Leaving my home was the hardest decision I have ever made. It was the right decision because I had to be true to myself and them.

I dont believe I am idealising my T, but I will consider that opinion. We have something that is very hard to explain - a relationship based on total trust, physical compatibility and love!

I respect my T's decision not to tell his wife and family and understand why the time is not right. I am sad about it and have to admit that at times I have doubted that he would ever tell her. However, we have talked this through and despite the odd moments of insecurity can live with what we have decided.

I am in love - with an honourable, passionate and grieving man who has changed my life. Our route to finding each other has and will cause a great deal of pain. However it is something we have to go through to allow ourselves to be together for ever.

Pippa

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by Pippa on February 3, 2007, at 3:49:03

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by bird in the sky on February 2, 2007, at 22:45:21

Bird in the Sky

Yes is often masturbate before I have a session with my T, but there again I masturbate two or three times a day most days.

I find that the release of tension and the relaxing effect means that I can concentrate on the session and get the most benefit from our time together.

I think i also do it so that I know I am not totally reliant on him for my orgasms and sexual release.I want to know that our relationship is not just on a sexual level ... Masturbation allows me to do that.

Masturbation after a session, when we have not had sex, produces some of my most intense orgasms. Often I have to stop the car on the way home to bring myself off and to release the sexual tension that has built up during a session. Especially when we have talked about my libido and my past.

In the UK people still do not talk openly about "self-gratification" or "masturbation" or even sexual relations. I find it refreshing that I can talk on here and be open about about my sexual needs and what I do.

How refreshing it is to be open and honest with people other than my T

Pippa

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by Dis Traught on February 3, 2007, at 12:42:56

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by widget on February 2, 2007, at 8:03:11

Hi,
You have already chosen your path, and hopefully you can bear having to pay the price should it come to that.
There are several reasons why a relationship w a therapist can be harmful. Firstly, there is an imbalance; your therapist knows FAR more about you than you know about him (power). Secondly, you are in a vulnerable situation as you need him as a T, which is why you met him in the first place. Thirdly, you don't know if he's telling the truth. How do you actually KNOW his wife is ill? Is he saying that so you will not immediately take action to threaten his licence? If I were you, I'd drive by his house and take a good, long look at his wife to see how she seems.

How will you feel if he breaks off the relationship? What if his wife IS ill and he needs you to help him through her illness and then dumps you? Being dumped by anyone is hard, but being dumped by your therapist is absolute, bottomless hell.
I wish you all the best.

Penny

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by Dis Traught on February 3, 2007, at 12:54:07

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by widget on February 2, 2007, at 8:03:11

There is one, unethical aspect to this that you should seriously consider: If you are still in therapy with him after you've had sex, it's labeled prostitution. You are paying for sex and he is providing it. There is no Ethical Board on the face of the Earth who would judge it otherwise.

Penny

 

For Pippa, not Widget

Posted by Dis Traught on February 3, 2007, at 14:31:48

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by widget on February 2, 2007, at 8:03:11

Hi
Just to say that my previous posting is for Pippa, not Widget.

Penny

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by widget on February 3, 2007, at 15:22:17

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by Dis Traught on February 3, 2007, at 12:54:07

To Penny, while you may be correct technically about the charge of prostitution, don't you think you're being a bit vicious? Pippa has been very brave to talk about this so honestly and I'd hope we can be above such accusations and mudslinging.
Kindly, Widget

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by Pippa on February 3, 2007, at 15:38:01

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by widget on February 3, 2007, at 15:22:17

To Penny

My god .... its 9:30 at night here in England.

A minute ago I was a pretty normal person....

Suddenly I am a whore ... I became one neither by choice or through receipt of funds for sexual favours - just because I have fallen to be in love with a man who also happens to be my therapist...

I am a harlot ... a street walker ... a lady of the night .... you know what

love it and him ... I dont feel a whore, harlot or prostitute ... and with the benefit of thought ... if anyone in this relationship was a prostitute ,,, presumably it was my T not me!! All I am guilty of is procurement!

I know no offence was meant or intended and Penny please dont feel bad about what you said ... I am fine about it ... it is strange ... but I am happy that I am telling all sort of strangers about it as well

Pippa

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by widget on February 3, 2007, at 16:06:58

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by Pippa on February 3, 2007, at 15:38:01

Dear Pippa, I want to offer you support and you seen ok to me and that's great. What about your children? Will they see you, are they with their father? How do you feel about them in all of this? Widget

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by Pippa on February 3, 2007, at 16:18:18

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by widget on February 3, 2007, at 16:06:58

Hi Widget

- Thanks - I know you are being supportive. My children are still coming to terms with me leaving their father ... but we (husband and I) are being sensible and have agreed to make sure that no matter what else happens the children will be a protected, loved and involved as much as we can....

Pippa

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by caraher on February 3, 2007, at 16:34:00

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by widget on February 3, 2007, at 15:22:17

Penny slung no mud; she was simply pointing out the consequences to the therapist (who would be the one technically engaged in prostitution!). She didn't mean to put anyone here down.

Her point about not telling the wife he described as terminally ill is an excellent one. The worst manipulators are the ones who at first appear to have pure hearts and to be "beyond reproach." Imagine how devastating the betrayal would be if this all turned out to be a lie!

We just want you to be careful and protect yourself.

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by Pippa on February 3, 2007, at 16:53:29

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by caraher on February 3, 2007, at 16:34:00

Caraher

Hi

I know you are helping and protecting - many thanks for that.

My T is not a liar, a manipulator or the type of person who would lie about his sick wife.

His wife has MS - there is no reason for me to "drive past" and check up on him or indeed her ...

I agree I would be devastated if this was all a lie ... but it isnt ....

Pippa

 

Re: Love with therapist

Posted by bird in the sky on February 3, 2007, at 20:46:55

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by Pippa on February 3, 2007, at 16:53:29

it seems weird to me that you still call him your T. After al, isn't he your lover, your love, your friend etc. how can you just call him your T?
I fell in love with a teacher once and when we were together i would never think of calling him my teacher. how weird it must be to still be having therapy with him...

 

My T called it prostitution!

Posted by Dis Traught on February 4, 2007, at 2:25:51

In reply to Re: Love with therapist, posted by widget on February 2, 2007, at 8:03:11

When I started a relationship w my T he said we must immediately decide whether to continue therapy (and have NO relationship) or end therapy and have a relationship. He was very clear about it and HE TOLD ME that otherwise he would be a prostitute and I would become his "John", but I suppose I'd be a "Jane".
In hindsight I'm glad he made the distinction clear to me, because if I'd been his patient after our relationship I'd have been ready for a straightjacket. It would also have been virtually impossible for him to break off the relationship.
So I'm not being vicious, simply stating what my T/lover told me. He said any Ethics Board would view it that way.

Penny


Go forward in thread:


Show another thread

URL of post in thread:


Psycho-Babble Psychology | Extras | FAQ


[dr. bob] Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD, bob@dr-bob.org

Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.