Psycho-Babble Psychology Thread 693465

Shown: posts 12 to 36 of 47. Go back in thread:

 

Re: b » Dinah

Posted by alexandra_k on October 11, 2006, at 1:30:15

In reply to Re: b, posted by Dinah on October 10, 2006, at 11:49:32

> (((((Dinah)))))

 

Re: b » Poet

Posted by alexandra_k on October 11, 2006, at 1:32:37

In reply to Re: b » alexandra_k, posted by Poet on October 10, 2006, at 14:17:43

Hey Poet.

> I can tell by your post/poem that things are not going well for you right now.

I was pretty down yesterday. Not going to work was probably a really bad thing for me to have done. Staying at home... Reading stuff that hurt but feeling compelled to keep reading it...

> I wish you could find a T and pdoc who would be there for you for long periods of time.

I've found one. I just... Don't feel anything. I don't know. I feel cold sometimes. That is all. Cold. Numb. When the cold and the numb lifts there are only bad feelings. So... Back to the cold and the numb. I don't know. Thanks for listening.

 

Re: b » Jost

Posted by alexandra_k on October 11, 2006, at 1:44:22

In reply to Re: b, posted by Jost on October 10, 2006, at 20:34:20

Hey.

I guess that people being so far away... Is why I'm here. On Babble. If I lived in the US... I'm not sure... It might feel too close... I might... I might be way more concerned about confidentiality. I don't know. Hard to say. Hard to know. Something about the computer. Something about nobody being able to look at me. Something about nobody being able to see my facial expressions. Somethign about nobody being able to see my reactions. Even chat is harder. Real time. Say things you regret oops. Say them on the boards too, but there is the confirmation step. Can take your time with posts. I don't do IRL very well... Don't like it. Don't feel safe in it. Don't like being embodied. Babble is nice. Kind of... Disembodied...

I'm not sure about the nothingness...

People aren't born with a self. A self is something that develops. You internalise various things from your environment and what is unique about you is the particular combination of things you experienced and internalised.

I've internalised a lot of bad. Its a part of me now. Its a part of who I am. And if you pare back the bad then what is left?

I know I've had more experiences than that... But sometimes I get a bit lost in it all... It really wasn't good for me to have got to reading that stuff I was reading yesterday... It isn't quite like that you see. But it is easy to start seeing things that way. Toddlers. It was about toddlers. Rapproachment. Can I remember how it goes? Some of it rung so true...

Something about merging... Infants. They aren't really seperate from their caregiver. The caregiver mirrors. The infant is happy and the caregiver is too reflecting that. The infant is distressed and the caregiver is distressed too reflecting that. If you don't get mirrored... Then... You start to doubt your own internal states apparantly. The appropriateness of them etc. You don't learn how to regulate them. I think your caregiver is meant to mirror them and regulate their response so you kind of learn how to regulate yours. Or something. Not sure... Anyway then there is individuation. And that can be pretty scarey. Ages 1 to 1 and a half or something like that... maybe 2 i can't remember... Toddlers anyway. Fear of the abyss... Or something. Rapproachment is the longing for the merger again. For the mirroring. The security. Or something.

And projective identification... Is kind of a forced merger. A communication style of infants. Forced mirroring.

Because sometimes it is hard to express things in words...

________________________

Only this can't be right because... I had to have one of those harnesses becasue I was always running away apparantly.

I don't know.

Ugh.

See my t tomorrow...
We will see how that goes...

I'm scared.


 

Re: b

Posted by Lindenblüte on October 11, 2006, at 8:25:01

In reply to Re: b » Jost, posted by Lindenblüte on October 10, 2006, at 22:56:08

I clicked the wrong box last night by mistake. I meant for my post to be directed for Alex, not Jost.

I'm sorry for the confusion. I do this all the time.

I'm really confused.

well. jost- you're great too. I hope you feel better soon. and Alex- sounds like you've admitted that there is a beast in the room. now you've got to figure out what to do about it.

((((((Alex))))))

 

Re: b » alexandra_k

Posted by Lindenblüte on October 11, 2006, at 9:00:42

In reply to Re: b » Jost, posted by alexandra_k on October 11, 2006, at 1:44:22

Alex,
you ever get a chance to hang out with babies and preschoolers? Just for a little while?

In my opinion, they are the best antidepressants in the world. I have never found a single thing that can cheer me up more than tickling a smooshie baby foot, or getting a shy 3-year-old to come out of his shell and tell me something fun about his life.

And yes, we mirror them, but they mirror us back. Something about their babyness is very incredible, in terms of the way that it changes the way that I act.

Try it sometime.

I'm addicted, personally. I think wee little ones are the most precious gift in the world. (except for the whole diaper/crying the middle of the night thing.

Alex, you're not defective. Try to go with the flow. Don't worry about the future, just worry about the very next thing you have to do. And do it. and so on and so forth. Reduce your cognitive load.

I'm going to go analyse my data now. I hope the descriptive statistics look promising, otherwise it could be a very long day.

((((alex))))

p.s. disembodied is fun- but don't you ever notice how your body might get tense when you're typing a response to a particular poster? or how you may laugh or cry on babble at times? Your body's along for the ride whether you like it or not.

I'm glad babble feels safe for you. IRL is scary. really scary. but mostly scary because we create the fear in our own minds.

Know any good exorcists in your area? Is it springtime there yet?

best happinesses and wallabies,
-Li

 

Re: b » alexandra_k

Posted by littleone on October 11, 2006, at 16:02:27

In reply to Re: b, posted by alexandra_k on October 10, 2006, at 1:17:39

Hey alex.

> i don't want to see my t because she is there.
> the only t's i've ever gotten along with made it clear
> right from the very first session
> that it was time limited.
> i only attach to people who aren't there
> if someone is there i can't attach
> because it isn't safe.

This is such a valuable insight. It can help you a lot. It’s really great that you can recognise this. The hard work of understanding is the first step to healing.

And even though time limited people *feel* safer, can you see that they aren’t really safer? Sounds like your pattern is something like:

* have the promise of short term, feel safer, allow attachment
* with the end nearing, your abandonment fears are triggered and this sets off your (using your words) “intense” reaction.
* the short term person leaves and this then re-proves to you that your “intense” reaction is unbearable, that you are unbearable and lots of other bad stuff about you.

Don’t you think this is a pattern worth breaking? It’s guaranteed to end in hurt every time. The “safe” option is really so so harmful and hurtful for you.

> i don't know that i can do this.
> just a couple more sessions...
> then i'm going to see her supervisor for a month.

I bet the insight felt pretty scary and just highlighted how unsafe your T feels. I can understand why the pull towards the short term supervisor would be so strong. Your escape hatch back to “safety”.

But remember how unsafe short term truly is for you?

Seeing as the supervisor is only short term, there’s a good chance you’ll attach strongly. You know this is your pattern. This may cause big problems for you at the end of the month. This may make it even harder to go back to your T.

It is so important you talk to your T about all this. It would be great if you could take this thread in to her. A much more helpful option may be to NOT see the supervisor. To work out strategies with your T to have a link with her. Maybe she can write a letter for you. Maybe you can send her emails. Something. It sounds so very important to find a way to break your cycle. To resist the pull of the “safer” option.

This is the only way to heal alex. You understand your unhealthy patterns and then find ways to break them. Then work on breaking those patterns. Over and over and over. Very very hard and scary and challenging and heartbreaking and hopeless and terrifying. But it is the only way forward.

> i wish... i wasn't like this. but what are you supposed to do when you don't feel anything? i don't feel anything for her. or when i do feel something... it isn't nice. it is all the bad feelings...

What are you supposed to do when you don’t feel anything? You keep working on it.

It took me a good year and a half before I could see that I was beginning to attach to my T. Before that he was just some guy I saw twice a week. I think he saw quiet signs of my attachment long before I did. But still, it took a long time for me to feel stuff for him. Even now, when I’m in the nothingness I think I have no attachment. He’s just nothing to me. Often he doesn’t even exist for me except when he’s right in front of me during a session.

Some people take a long time to work up to feeling a connection with someone. And it’s possible you deliberately don’t connect (I’m talking about on an unconscious level here) in an effort to defend yourself from the “unsafe” permanent T. It provides you with a good logical reason to leave, doesn’t it?

> i'm scared... i'm scared that i'll destroy her.

You won’t destroy her alex. You haven’t destroyed anyone yet have you? No one has vapourised in front of your “intensity”? No one has had to be lead away from you in a straight jacket babbling incoherently?

You need to do these things *in spite of* the fear. THAT is healing.

You said you see your T tomorrow? How about we sit amongst the flowers together until then. Give them a chance to sooth and calm your soul a little. We can watch the butterflies flit and the bees buzz and the birds twitter. We can smell the flowers and watch them nod their heavy heads in the breeze. I’d be happy to sit with you alex.

 

Re: b » alexandra_k

Posted by muffled on October 11, 2006, at 21:51:27

In reply to Re: b, posted by alexandra_k on October 10, 2006, at 1:18:30

> i hate myself

**I don't hate you :-(
I see goodness and kindness in you.
Its there, even if you don't recognize it yet.
(((((((((((((Alex))))))))))))))

 

Re: b » alexandra_k

Posted by muffled on October 11, 2006, at 22:00:33

In reply to Re: b, posted by alexandra_k on October 10, 2006, at 1:18:30

Alex, is there any chance at all of you bringing this thread into your T?
There's alot of interesting 'stuff' that could be useful.
Btwn the lines stuff. Inner conflicts that peep out.
Dunno if T will see it. Not many would I suppose.
I can tell cuz I do it myself some of that stuff.
You need a T Alex, to sort out this stuff, the conflicts, make some semse of them. Its too hard to try and do it yourself. You try and try, but its too hard and triggering and frustrating etc.
I find I can't 'see' myself very well. My T helps with that.
Yeah, two steps fwd, one back, 5 steps forward, one back, 4 steps backward, two forward, 3 forward, 5 forward, 2 forward, 6 back! gack!, 4 forward....................but if you actaully COUNT, I still, SLOWLY, getting ahead.
(I'm slightly stoned, sorry)
I done alotta getting ahead. I due for a crash. Mebbe not though!!!!!!!!!!!LOL!
Take care Alex
Muffled

 

Re: b » Lindenblüte

Posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 5:18:44

In reply to Re: b » alexandra_k, posted by Lindenblüte on October 11, 2006, at 9:00:42

Hey. I'm sorry I didn't reply to your post, I can't figure what happened there... I haven't ever had anything to do with kids. Don't know anyone with kids or anything. Don't really know what to do with them...

Fish are kinda cool. Watching fish.

Good luck with your stats.

 

I messed up so bad

Posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 6:12:21

In reply to Re: b » Lindenblüte, posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 5:18:44

missed time
woke up down the hall...
got a towel got to my room
got some clothes and went to see my t
flashes
i messed up
i messed up real bad
saw my t
told her
scared about missing time
feel numb
things pass in waves
flashes
saw guy from CAT
morning after over the counter
need to call them tomorrow and tell them
i'm okay.
haven't seen him yet
what to say?
other people know
guys are going 'hey' in a way...
they know
they think i'm a slut
maybe i am.
i cringe from myself.
need to talk to him
and say what?
please don't tell anyone?
they know already.
not all of them...
yet
but it is just a matter of time
x has gone away for a few months
he liked me
i wasn't interested
but he will hear about this and be hurt
it is about
intimacy with no intimacy
i hate myself
i want to move out
but i can't
i want to die
but i can't
what happened?
why am i on self destruct?
i don't have anyone i can talk to...
i'm so sorry

 

Re: I messed up so bad

Posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 6:19:23

In reply to I messed up so bad, posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 6:12:21

and i do this. self destruct every now and then. why did i do it? i wanted to feel loved for a while. i didn't want to be alone. and i understand that. i understand the rules of the game. but now i feel ashamed. dirty. aching all over. don't sh*t in your nest. that is good advice. but i've broken that. and word... will get around. self destruct. that has to be it. no other explanation. i'm going to feel dirty every time they look at me like they are looking at me now. it will blow over, won't it? but first... word will get around. i think i've done something... irrevokable. but then... it always feels this way. but then when it feels that way... oftentimes... it is.

 

Re: I messed up so bad

Posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 6:21:04

In reply to Re: I messed up so bad, posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 6:19:23

all this so i didn't have to talk to my t?
is that what this is about?

i'm going to curl up in a little ball now
and try and will myself out of existence

i shouldn't live on campus
it is bad for me...
the blending of home and work
the inability to avoid
word will get out
i feel sick

 

Re: I messed up so bad » alexandra_k

Posted by Dinah on October 12, 2006, at 8:23:29

In reply to I messed up so bad, posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 6:12:21

I'm not underestimating how horrible it feels to have done something embarassing. Heaven knows how many times I've done it.

But reputations are repairable. People have enormously short memories, and are wrapped up with themselves and their own lives (which is not only fair enough, but wonderfully convenient at times). It's astonishing how fast things *can* blow over.

You do have someone to talk to, you know. I'm not a therapist, but you can contact me. And I do care about you, ever so much, Alex.

And there are many at Babble who feel the same.

We aren't substitutes for licensed professionals. But empathy and caring we have for you.

 

Re: I messed up so bad » Dinah

Posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 8:42:40

In reply to Re: I messed up so bad » alexandra_k, posted by Dinah on October 12, 2006, at 8:23:29

((((dinah))))

 

messed up » muffled

Posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 8:43:30

In reply to Re: b » alexandra_k, posted by muffled on October 11, 2006, at 21:51:27

((((muffled))))

 

messed up » littleone

Posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 8:49:18

In reply to Re: b » alexandra_k, posted by littleone on October 11, 2006, at 16:02:27

((((((littleone))))))

my t was really good about this. really nice. i curled up on her couch and kind of drifted for a few hours waiting for CAT. listening to her tap tap tapping away on her keyboard. kinda soothing...

CAT guy gave me the name of a p-doc lady who bulk bills. i'll phone her tomorrow.

i need to get some more valium at some point. just a little teeny tiny bit more...

 

Re: messed up » alexandra_k

Posted by Lindenblüte on October 12, 2006, at 9:20:23

In reply to messed up » littleone, posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 8:49:18

(((((Alex)))))

My best friend in college (that's like the first 4 years of Uni) was frequently engaged in self-destructive behaviors. She would hook up with guys, spend a thousand dollars on fancy clothes, get wasted, etc etc. We were roommates for 2 years. I love her dearly. I knew that her destructive behavior came from a place that wasn't healthy. I also knew that she was an incredibly wonderful person. She had her "crises" on a very regular basis, and it was hard watching her do this, but many times she saved me from having my own melt-downs. She was warm, and intelligent, and vivacious, and had this certain je ne sais quoi....

I wish I could have taken away all of her insecurities. I wish I could have taken away all of her sadness and hurt that made her do these things. Finally, senior year, it was hurting ME so badly to see her start dabbling in hard-core drugs that I went to see a counselor. I realized that my friend's behavior had finally tipped the point where she was hurting me too much. Well, I organized an intervention to help my friend. We told her how much we loved her, and that we wanted to be there for her forever, and that she didn't need to run away from our caring, because she was afraid she didn't deserve it. She graduated, got married, got out of the drug scene, and is doing a lot better these days.

My point in telling you this story, Alex, is that you are NOT alone. Lots of young women do things that they regret-- things that are an expression of pain that they cannot communicate or share to anyone else. I don't know what your particular issues are, but if you are insecure about your body, or how loveable you are, how smart you are, or whatever--- well, those concerns are far more common than anyone will ever tell you.

Remember that you are out of your element a little bit. You may be feeling homesick, ungrounded. You didn't do permanent damage, I don't think. Many of the women who will look at you judgementally are either jealous, or they are ashamed, because they have done or wanted to do the thing that you did. It's a lot easier to condemn another's behavior than one's own.

Alex, you know that you are a very special person. You may be right- you're too immersed in the campus life. Try to get away whenever the chance arises. For me, when I was living on campus, I would take the train to downtown and study in a public library, or I would go to a new coffee shop every morning for a week.

Spring is coming. Is it a good time to start exploring the city parks?

Please stay in touch with your T and your substitute T. they can help you get through this crisis.

I'm so sorry you're struggling. You know, I would never judge you if you wanted to share something personal. You don't have to be alone and strong. You can tell us some of your stuff. I've done bad things too.

Sending you extra gentle hugs-- what kinds of things do you do for comfort? read? movies? chocolate? ice cream? nap? shop? art?

love,
-Li

 

Re: its ok

Posted by muffled on October 12, 2006, at 12:55:11

In reply to Re: messed up » alexandra_k, posted by Lindenblüte on October 12, 2006, at 9:20:23

(((((((((((((Alex))))))))))))))
Sorry you scared.
I get scared lots.
But it'll be ok again.
Sometimes its real bad, but then its not so bad awhile.
You can come to my cave, or I have a mansion now.
Underneath the f*ckedupness, there's a beauful Alex waiting to fly. Just like me. I gonna fly. I gonna not be f*cked up forever.
((((((((((((Alex))))))))))))))
Just wish I could sit with you in a park and watch the birds and tell the rest of the world to f*ck off.
Muffled

 

Re: its ok

Posted by Gee on October 12, 2006, at 13:16:51

In reply to Re: its ok, posted by muffled on October 12, 2006, at 12:55:11

(((Alex)))
Don't be too hard on yourself. It probably feels horrible right now, but I hope it will get better. You are such an incredible person, and I'm so sorry you're suffering so much right now.

 

Things will work out » alexandra_k

Posted by littleone on October 12, 2006, at 21:57:13

In reply to I messed up so bad, posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 6:12:21

Hey alex,

I can hear all the shame and pain and regret in your post. I'm sorry you're feeling badly. You know what? I would still be more than happy, overjoyed, if we could sit in the flowers together.

This doesn't at all change what I think about you. You're still the same person. You still have the same wonderful qualities that I can see but that maybe you have some trouble seeing. You think you made a bad decision (even if the decision itself is lost to you in your lost time). Every single one of us makes bad decisions at times. It doesn't make us a bad person.

Try not to beat yourself up too badly. Doing that does not improve things for you, just makes things harder for you.

I know this may sound really strange and probably even inappropriate (I don't mean it to sound minimising), but I really do mean it so sincerely.

When I read your posts, I felt so proud of you.

1. You could see how your behaviour was linked to the situation with your t.
2. You could see the intimacy connections too.
3. You allowed yourself to feel safe in your T's office/area.
4. You were able to feel soothed in that area, close to your T.
5. You had a good positive experience with your T. She didn't let you down, discard you, treat you with disgust, etc (as you may have deeply secretly feared).

There are some really positive things in here alex.

There's a line I really like in Batman Begins that says:

"Why do we fall down? So that we can learn to pick ourselves up again."

It helps me remember that we *will* go backwards or fall down. But that we can learn ways to avoid those holes. Things *do* improve if we just keep on trying.

-----*

This is me holding my hand out to you to help you up again.

Things will work out alex. I think you did real good.

 

((((((((((Alex))))))))))

Posted by damos on October 12, 2006, at 23:18:39

In reply to I messed up so bad, posted by alexandra_k on October 12, 2006, at 6:12:21

I'm sorry you're hurting and scared, and would do anything to make the bad feelings go away.

Please know how much you are loved and cared about by so many of us, and how very much you mean to us.

Puppy asked if she could come and give you special puppy cuddles and sloppy dog kisses. She reckons they can pretty much make anything feel better.

You are stronger, braver and more courageous than I could ever be and it makes me very proud that you are my friend.

Sorry if my caring hurts more than it helps.

Gentle hugs from me too if that's okay.

(((Alex)))

 

Re: messed up » Lindenblüte

Posted by alexandra_k on October 13, 2006, at 0:02:10

In reply to Re: messed up » alexandra_k, posted by Lindenblüte on October 12, 2006, at 9:20:23

((((ll)))))

i'm not sure what to say... i've been taking it easy today... got some treats... had bacon and eggs for lunch :-) don't do that very often... had a couple of yummy chocolates too :-)

just trying to take it easy and being gentle.

thank you.


 

Re: its ok » muffled

Posted by alexandra_k on October 13, 2006, at 0:24:44

In reply to Re: its ok, posted by muffled on October 12, 2006, at 12:55:11

(((((((muffled)))))))
I'm feeling a bit better today.
Which is good. I was feeling pretty bad yesterday...

> Just wish I could sit with you in a park and watch the birds and tell the rest of the world to f*ck off.

Yeah, that would be good. We could walk down to the lake and find somewhere nice to sit...

http://www.vancn.com/travel/UploadFiles_7068/200507/2005777138924.jpg

 

Re: its ok » Gee

Posted by alexandra_k on October 13, 2006, at 0:25:27

In reply to Re: its ok, posted by Gee on October 12, 2006, at 13:16:51

thanks gee.

((((Gee))))

 

Re: Things will work out » littleone

Posted by alexandra_k on October 13, 2006, at 0:28:47

In reply to Things will work out » alexandra_k, posted by littleone on October 12, 2006, at 21:57:13

hey littleone.
you can come sit by the lake with me and muffled if you like.
i don't know if there are flowers...
otherwise we can come visit you.

> Try not to beat yourself up too badly. Doing that does not improve things for you, just makes things harder for you.

yeah. i know... i just... worry about this. haven't lost time like that since i arrived. thought... it had stopped. sometimes i get to thinking... that i was imagining things. that this never really happened to me. that i was making up stories or something. then something like this happens and i realise that it hasn't been dealt with yet. freaks me out a little...

> You allowed yourself to feel safe in your T's office/area.
> 4. You were able to feel soothed in that area, close to your T.
> 5. You had a good positive experience with your T. She didn't let you down, discard you, treat you with disgust, etc (as you may have deeply secretly feared).

yeah. i guess i did :-)

> It helps me remember that we *will* go backwards or fall down. But that we can learn ways to avoid those holes. Things *do* improve if we just keep on trying.

thank you. i'm trying... yeah.


Go forward in thread:


Show another thread

URL of post in thread:


Psycho-Babble Psychology | Extras | FAQ


[dr. bob] Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD, bob@dr-bob.org

Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.