Psycho-Babble Psychology Thread 603238

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One very gentle suggestion...

Posted by madeline on January 27, 2006, at 7:49:06

In reply to Had a bad/good day/session, posted by LegWarmers on January 26, 2006, at 21:52:39

LW,

I am so sorry that you are feeling bad right now, questioning oneself is really really not fun. Try to be especially nice to yourself during this time because, for me at least, the bad times are never permanent. You just have to weather them.

I agree with you that therapy can make you feel worse sometimes. In fact, I've even told my therapist that I thought this whole ordeal was so full of crap (and that he was so full of crap for pushing it on me) that I was just going to quit and forget it ever happened.

But, I have learned now that the badness is a part of the healing. Just as if you had sprained your ankle and the swelling and pain help the sprain to heel, the crying, the doubting, the mourning, the anger, the frustration in therapy all help the inner wounds to heal. It's like a transient inflammation of the soul. It passes and is stronger for it.

Please stick it out in therapy. You are absolutely right to bring this up to your therapist and yes, more therapy sessions will help you to resolve this pain quicker (it always has for me).

I completely understand your desire to just run as fast as you can, but, just for the next few weeks, try to stick in out in therapy.

For me, it was worth it.

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session LegWarmers

Posted by Daisym on January 27, 2006, at 10:33:13

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session, posted by LegWarmers on January 26, 2006, at 22:25:55

Your pain is almost tangible in your posts. I've been right where you are at least 100 times. I have to say that offering you more sessions speaks pretty highly of your therapist and his commitment to helping you work through. I know it sounds counter-intuitive, (go more), but instead of making you hurt more it actually helps to contain those feelings and hurt less. At least that has been my experience most of the time.

All that said, let me see if I can channel my therapist when I come in and say what you've said:

He would say, "let's talk about the reasons you started therapy in the first place. Have those been resolved?" And he would ask me if anything good has come out of our work together. And usually he'll ask if I need something from him that I'm not getting. We would then talk about what it might feel like to stop therapy and my safety.

You shouldn't feel pressured to keep going if it isn't helping. But I agree that you feel worse before you feel better and it cycles like this. Each layer that gets peeled off does make you question everything as you discover new information about yourself and your motives for doing what you do.

I know this is really complicated. I think this is where the attachment issue comes in strongly. If your are attached to your therapist, even when you hate therapy, you trust that this is worth it and there is an additional incentive to work through it.

Good luck with your decision. You are right when you say therapy isn't for everyone. Some things are best left unexplored.
Hugs,
Daisy

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session LegWarmers

Posted by Dinah on January 27, 2006, at 10:36:15

In reply to Had a bad/good day/session, posted by LegWarmers on January 26, 2006, at 21:52:39

Hmmm... Therapy doesn't help everyone. How were you functioning before therapy?

And feeling empty raises the question of whether it's therapy itself or this therapist. Maybe you want something more from therapy than she's giving you.

Are you feeling like "Is this it? Is this as good help as I can get? I felt better when therapy was an option that I could hold in reserve for when I really felt bad. And now I've tried it and I no longer have that option in reserve."

Or is it more that therapy is stirring up bad feelings that you'd just as soon keep quietly below the surface?

Do you feel frustrated, sad, enraged?

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session

Posted by gardenergirl on January 27, 2006, at 15:44:47

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session LegWarmers, posted by Dinah on January 27, 2006, at 10:36:15

I think Daisy's post is wonderful. Sounds like a good way to evaluate therapy and to make changes, including leaving if that's the right one for you.

And therapy does feel bad sometimes. I try to forewarn some of my clients that they may leave feeling worse than they came in, and that's okay in that it means that something is happening in therapy. I also tell them that if it feels bad to the point that it's interfering with their daily functioning, or if the feeling bad after a session lingers throughout the week, please tell me. That may mean that we need to ease back, dig deeper, or also work on some soothing, etc.

It all depends on the client and the T. Not a helpful answer, I know. But do talk to him about it, even if it's in a final session. And I also agree that increasing sessions can help, but it doesn't sound all that appealing when you're feeling bad.

Whatever you decide, I'm sure it will be the right thing for you.

(((((Legwarmers)))))

gg

 

Re: One very gentle suggestion... madeline

Posted by LegWarmers on January 28, 2006, at 7:56:40

In reply to One very gentle suggestion..., posted by madeline on January 27, 2006, at 7:49:06

> I agree with you that therapy can make you feel worse sometimes. In fact, I've even told my therapist that I thought this whole ordeal was so full of crap (and that he was so full of crap for pushing it on me) that I was just going to quit and forget it ever happened.
>

thats how I feel, and Im questionsing my T

> But, I have learned now that the badness is a part of the healing. Just as if you had sprained your ankle and the swelling and pain help the sprain to heel, the crying, the doubting, the mourning, the anger, the frustration in therapy all help the inner wounds to heal. It's like a transient inflammation of the soul. It passes and is stronger for it.

I know what you mean

>
> Please stick it out in therapy. You are absolutely right to bring this up to your therapist and yes, more therapy sessions will help you to resolve this pain quicker (it always has for me).

I will go talk to him, but it felt like I was insulting him, maybe my approach was? I don't know.

>
> I completely understand your desire to just run as fast as you can, but, just for the next few weeks, try to stick in out in therapy.
>
> For me, it was worth it.
>


Thanks! I will definately talk about it further

 

It's an idea, thanks (nm) muffled

Posted by LegWarmers on January 28, 2006, at 7:57:10

In reply to how bout just taking a break awhile? (nm) LegWarmers, posted by muffled on January 26, 2006, at 22:26:23

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session Daisym

Posted by LegWarmers on January 28, 2006, at 8:05:47

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session LegWarmers, posted by Daisym on January 27, 2006, at 10:33:13

> Your pain is almost tangible in your posts. I've been right where you are at least 100 times. I have to say that offering you more sessions speaks pretty highly of your therapist and his commitment to helping you work through. I know it sounds counter-intuitive, (go more), but instead of making you hurt more it actually helps to contain those feelings and hurt less. At least that has been my experience most of the time.

Yeah, I know what you mean, it's just, when I said I didn't want to come in as often it looked like I had literally fired him. He was like, no you need to work on this and that. I suddenly felt, like I was just a check. Maybe I was being totally sensitive but my gut reaction to him and what and how he said what he said, you don't care about me, you don't want to lose a patient!

>
> All that said, let me see if I can channel my therapist when I come in and say what you've said:
>
> He would say, "let's talk about the reasons you started therapy in the first place. Have those been resolved?" And he would ask me if anything good has come out of our work together. And usually he'll ask if I need something from him that I'm not getting. We would then talk about what it might feel like to stop therapy and my safety.
>
> You shouldn't feel pressured to keep going if it isn't helping. But I agree that you feel worse before you feel better and it cycles like this. Each layer that gets peeled off does make you question everything as you discover new information about yourself and your motives for doing what you do.
>
> I know this is really complicated. I think this is where the attachment issue comes in strongly. If your are attached to your therapist, even when you hate therapy, you trust that this is worth it and there is an additional incentive to work through it.
>
> Good luck with your decision. You are right when you say therapy isn't for everyone. Some things are best left unexplored.
> Hugs,
> Daisy

Maybe I do not let my self ever trust my t, I think I always have this feeling :( I never realized it before. Maybe it it is more my issue than his. I need to think about this more.

Thank you Daisy, you've given me some things to think about.

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session Dinah

Posted by LegWarmers on January 28, 2006, at 8:16:18

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session LegWarmers, posted by Dinah on January 27, 2006, at 10:36:15

> Hmmm... Therapy doesn't help everyone. How were you functioning before therapy?

I think I was less introspective and had less feelings of intense sadness and emptiness.

>
> And feeling empty raises the question of whether it's therapy itself or this therapist. Maybe you want something more from therapy than she's giving you.


Yeah, that is an issue. I am having a hard time being told what I already know, Im realizing he is very textbook oriented and There was a time I made a comment about my lack of connectedness and how it seemed unusual to me, in particular from reading here, and he said that therapy realtionships aren't as deep as I thought. hmm, I KNOW That isn't true.
And the worst part is I feel one step ahead of him sometimes. I don't know how to explain that...


> Are you feeling like "Is this it? Is this as good help as I can get? I felt better when therapy was an option that I could hold in reserve for when I really felt bad. And now I've tried it and I no longer have that option in reserve."


Well maybe, I go there and feel like its such a waste of money unless Im upset. But then I go in sometimes feeling fine adn walking out the door feeling like the life has been sucked from me.

>
> Or is it more that therapy is stirring up bad feelings that you'd just as soon keep quietly below the surface?
>

And this too.

> Do you feel frustrated, sad, enraged?

Yes, not so much enraged but sad and frustrated.

Thanks

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session gardenergirl

Posted by LegWarmers on January 28, 2006, at 8:22:33

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session, posted by gardenergirl on January 27, 2006, at 15:44:47

> I think Daisy's post is wonderful. Sounds like a good way to evaluate therapy and to make changes, including leaving if that's the right one for you.

I agree

>
> And therapy does feel bad sometimes. I try to forewarn some of my clients that they may leave feeling worse than they came in, and that's okay in that it means that something is happening in therapy. I also tell them that if it feels bad to the point that it's interfering with their daily functioning, or if the feeling bad after a session lingers throughout the week, please tell me. That may mean that we need to ease back, dig deeper, or also work on some soothing, etc.

I think thats wonderful you do that. I mentioned concern to mine once about feeling really empty after a session and he said, you shouldn't feel that way so Im sure you will be fine. This was before we were about to get into something heavy... so I didn't go back for awhile, because the mere discussion of discussing it, made me feel terrible as well as the lack of insight as to how I might feel afterwards. I use to think this guy was great!

>
> It all depends on the client and the T. Not a helpful answer, I know. But do talk to him about it, even if it's in a final session. And I also agree that increasing sessions can help, but it doesn't sound all that appealing when you're feeling bad.
>

no, it doesn't, but I do undderstand the theory behind it. I think that's it, the t and the client, I don't think I allow myself to be in a realaxed state ever when Im with a t. Maybe Im terrrified of the power they have, or could have.

> Whatever you decide, I'm sure it will be the right thing for you.
>
> (((((Legwarmers)))))
>
> gg


Thanks

 

Re: One very gentle suggestion... legwarmers

Posted by madeline on January 28, 2006, at 8:57:31

In reply to Re: One very gentle suggestion... madeline, posted by LegWarmers on January 28, 2006, at 7:56:40

I'm sorry your T looked insulted. The thing is T's are supposed to show any emotion at all, it makes US feel responsible for how THEY feel, and we aren't. They are here to help us.

However, a "blank" T is pretty unrealistic.

Perhaps you could tell him that how he reacted and give them a chance to apologize or explain their reaction.

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session LegWarmers

Posted by fairywings on January 28, 2006, at 20:15:32

In reply to Had a bad/good day/session, posted by LegWarmers on January 26, 2006, at 21:52:39


Hi LW,

Is it possible this T isn't right for you? Or could it be that you're questioning all the things you consider wrong with yourself, and that's incredibly painful? I have those exact same feelings questions, esp. right now, but think it's bec. of starting to see things about myself more clearly, and I very much don't like what I see.

I would be concerned if a T was offended by something that's said. Maybe you could check out those feelings with him. Do you read him pretty well? I don't even look at my T enough to know what he seems to be feeling, but I feel it conveyed in his voice.
fw

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session

Posted by alexandra_k on January 28, 2006, at 22:48:49

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session LegWarmers, posted by fairywings on January 28, 2006, at 20:15:32

sounds like maybe your t isn't right for you...

about the harming not helping thing... i think that could be a little hard for anyone to take. like if you tell your hairdresser you hate your new haircut or whatever. and... therapy is supposed to help. and... 'do no harm' etc. BUT... most theories hold that you need to harm in order to help. or you need to hurt in order to heal. so... i suppose it is to be expected. that being said... what if they are wrong? what if they are?

sounds like... it doesn't feel right. and it is the fit between you guys that isn't working out so well.

maybe... time for a change?

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session

Posted by alexandra_k on January 28, 2006, at 22:51:38

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session, posted by alexandra_k on January 28, 2006, at 22:48:49

or maybe... hurting does show progress. because... maybe you need to be a little vulnerable in order to get to the stuff that has the power to hurt (and results in hurt at other times).

kind of like... using a needle to dig for a prickle under the surface of the skin.

maybe...

hard to know. i always question myself around this stuff... if i stay am i being dependent? am i sticking with a relationship where there is a poor fit? am i letting them hurt me for no good reason?

if i go am i running away? am i avoiding what i need to do in order to get better?

i don't know. no idea.. sorry.

i think... only you could figure that out. maybe... in talking to your t about it the answer will become clear.

 

Re: One very gentle suggestion... legwarmers madeline

Posted by LegWarmers on January 29, 2006, at 0:15:23

In reply to Re: One very gentle suggestion... legwarmers, posted by madeline on January 28, 2006, at 8:57:31

> I'm sorry your T looked insulted. The thing is T's are supposed to show any emotion at all, it makes US feel responsible for how THEY feel, and we aren't. They are here to help us.
>
> However, a "blank" T is pretty unrealistic.
>
> Perhaps you could tell him that how he reacted and give them a chance to apologize or explain their reaction.
>
>

Thanks, Im going to bring it up to him, and yeah a blank t would bother me, a lot, and maybe I shouldn't be so bothered by his reaction because I most likely jsut caught him off guard

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session fairywings

Posted by LegWarmers on January 29, 2006, at 0:32:53

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session LegWarmers, posted by fairywings on January 28, 2006, at 20:15:32

>
> Hi LW,
>
> Is it possible this T isn't right for you?

Yeah

>Or could it be that you're questioning all the things you consider wrong with yourself, and that's incredibly painful?

it could be that too

>I have those exact same feelings questions, esp. right now, but think it's bec. of starting to see things about myself more clearly, and I very much don't like what I see.

:( yeah, its hard.
>

> I would be concerned if a T was offended by something that's said. Maybe you could check out those feelings with him. Do you read him pretty well?

Maybe this is my problem, I think I do. But, maybe I give my perception skills too much credit.

>I don't even look at my T enough to know what he seems to be feeling, but I feel it conveyed in his voice.
> fw

Im kinda weird with eye contact, I really need it with people

I think that I'm hard to please. After thinking about it and reading the responses...it's possible a lot of it is me and a big trust issue.

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session alexandra_k

Posted by LegWarmers on January 29, 2006, at 0:41:47

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session, posted by alexandra_k on January 28, 2006, at 22:51:38

>sounds like... it doesn't feel right. and it is the fit between you guys that isn't working out so well.

maybe... time for a change?

> or maybe... hurting does show progress. because... maybe you need to be a little vulnerable in order to get to the stuff that has the power to hurt (and results in hurt at other times).
>
> kind of like... using a needle to dig for a prickle under the surface of the skin.
>
> maybe...
>
> hard to know. i always question myself around this stuff... if i stay am i being dependent? am i sticking with a relationship where there is a poor fit? am i letting them hurt me for no good reason?
>
> if i go am i running away? am i avoiding what i need to do in order to get better?
>
> i don't know. no idea.. sorry.
>
> i think... only you could figure that out. maybe... in talking to your t about it the answer will become clear.

I think I have figured out that I don't trust the t's I have encountered. And this is preventing me from opening up and getting the most out of therapy. Maybe i should take a break for now.

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session LegWarmers

Posted by gardenergirl on January 29, 2006, at 15:09:41

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session alexandra_k, posted by LegWarmers on January 29, 2006, at 0:41:47

The more I read, the more I wonder, too, if it's a bad fit between you two.

If I were to pick someone to work with you, based on what I've read, I think I'd pick a woman who is warm and empathic, and helps you to feel safe and accepted, while also helping you talk through the things on your mind.

A man could also be like that. My T is that way, although he's also a blank slate, and that can be aggravating at times.

Hoping you find what you need either with him, with someone new, or in another direction.

gg

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session LegWarmers

Posted by fairywings on January 30, 2006, at 0:08:41

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session fairywings, posted by LegWarmers on January 29, 2006, at 0:32:53

I would want a T that's warm and caring, like GG said. It's so worth it. I hope you'll do that for yourself. I'd share my T if you lived close.

fw

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session FW and gardenergirl

Posted by LegWarmers on January 30, 2006, at 8:35:36

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session LegWarmers, posted by gardenergirl on January 29, 2006, at 15:09:41


> If I were to pick someone to work with you, based on what I've read, I think I'd pick a woman who is warm and empathic, and helps you to feel safe and accepted, while also helping you talk through the things on your mind.

Thats a thought. I think you may be right. Of ocurse, Im thinking its me, but maybe Im looking in the wrong section of the phone book ;) Or actually, going to the wrong referal source, didn't really look in phone book. When you guys look for your Ts did you find out what their specialty was? And/or did you choose according to that?

Thanks guys

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session FW and LegWarmers

Posted by Dinah on January 30, 2006, at 10:15:37

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session FW and gardenergirl, posted by LegWarmers on January 30, 2006, at 8:35:36

My area hospitals used to give public service type seminars on different mental health issues. I found my therapist at an anxiety seminar, and my second pdoc at a depression seminar. And although I terminated said pdoc in a fit of Wellbutrin induced madness, he was actually a pretty good doctor.

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session FW and LegWarmers

Posted by fairywings on January 30, 2006, at 18:50:49

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session FW and gardenergirl, posted by LegWarmers on January 30, 2006, at 8:35:36

>>Im thinking its me, but maybe Im looking in the wrong section of the phone book ;)

That must be it!

>> When you guys look for your Ts did you find out what their specialty was? And/or did you choose according to that?
>

Well, you know my first one wasn't a good fit, and it took me awhile to admit it, give it up, and move on. The one I have now is wonderful, but of course, being who I am, sometimes I'm sure he can't possibly like me, I couldn't possibly a "Jessica" to him. (hey dinah, I think you should coin that phrase) Anyway, he was a referral from my pdoc - and I really like him too. Maybe talk to another doctor who you like and trust?
fw

 

thanks (nm) Dinah

Posted by LegWarmers on January 30, 2006, at 20:22:17

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session FW and LegWarmers, posted by Dinah on January 30, 2006, at 10:15:37

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session FW and fairywings

Posted by LegWarmers on January 30, 2006, at 20:28:39

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session FW and LegWarmers, posted by fairywings on January 30, 2006, at 18:50:49

> >>Im thinking its me, but maybe Im looking in the wrong section of the phone book ;)
>
> That must be it!
>

:)

>
> Well, you know my first one wasn't a good fit, and it took me awhile to admit it, give it up, and move on. The one I have now is wonderful, but of course, being who I am, sometimes I'm sure he can't possibly like me, I couldn't possibly a "Jessica" to him. (hey dinah, I think you should coin that phrase) Anyway, he was a referral from my pdoc - and I really like him too.


a jessica? I must get caught up, but Im sure you are not a jessica! And Im sure he thinks you are great!

>Maybe talk to another doctor who you like and trust?

yeah, thats a good idea, Im going to talk to my pdoc.

Thanks FW

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session FW and LegWarmers

Posted by LegWarmers on January 30, 2006, at 20:33:29

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session FW and fairywings, posted by LegWarmers on January 30, 2006, at 20:28:39

> The one I have now is wonderful, but of course, being who I am, sometimes I'm sure he can't possibly like me, I couldn't possibly a "Jessica" to him.

um, ok a jessica is a good thing lol I read this wrong.

 

Re: Had a bad/good day/session FW and LegWarmers

Posted by fairywings on January 31, 2006, at 10:07:41

In reply to Re: Had a bad/good day/session FW and LegWarmers, posted by LegWarmers on January 30, 2006, at 20:33:29

Hi LW, I'm sorry. I was referring to Dinah's post about feeling special:

http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/psycho/20060121/msgs/604227.html

fw


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