Psycho-Babble Psychology Thread 555919

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I'm very sorry! kerria

Posted by JenStar on September 17, 2005, at 23:12:58

In reply to Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( JenStar, posted by kerria on September 17, 2005, at 18:38:51

Kerria,
I'm sorry. I know I don't understand your situation. I genuinely hope that things get better for you. I'm wishing you all the best. And I'm sorry if my words hurt you in my previous post.

take care,
JenStar

 

Re: I'm very sorry!

Posted by kerria on September 17, 2005, at 23:19:14

In reply to I'm very sorry! kerria, posted by JenStar on September 17, 2005, at 23:12:58

it's ok JenStar.

Everybody's sorry but still no one will be my friend.

tears,
kerria

 

Re: I'm very sorry! JenStar

Posted by muffled on September 17, 2005, at 23:44:32

In reply to I'm very sorry! kerria, posted by JenStar on September 17, 2005, at 23:12:58

> Kerria,
> I'm sorry. I know I don't understand your situation. I genuinely hope that things get better for you. I'm wishing you all the best. And I'm sorry if my words hurt you in my previous post.
>
> take care,
> JenStar

Man, you just cared enough to try and call it as you saw it.I get tired of nicey, nicey b*llshit sometimes, lots of times. I told my T. to be the same way last week. I told her not to be nice and just lay it on the line. You do that for me too OK?
Thanks, Muffled

 

Be strong as you can :( (nm) kerria

Posted by muffled on September 17, 2005, at 23:47:22

In reply to Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :(, posted by kerria on September 17, 2005, at 23:01:45

 

Re: I'm very sorry!

Posted by rs on September 18, 2005, at 4:42:53

In reply to Re: I'm very sorry!, posted by kerria on September 17, 2005, at 23:19:14

Hi Kerria
I myself was sharing from experience and to support you that I understand being DID.
I did jump in here and do not post often so that is not right.
Again I just hope that you things work out.


 

Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( kerria

Posted by fairywings on September 18, 2005, at 6:40:57

In reply to Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( fairywings, posted by kerria on September 17, 2005, at 12:10:49

sounds to me like your T is perfectly happy to keep you dependant on him and not getting better, because he's being paid the full amount. i had a psychiatrist like that once. he didn't care either. i'm sorry you can't seem to break away from him and get going with another T, but i understand the attachment, even if it isn't a healthy one. i'm sorry. ; (
fw

 

Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :(

Posted by fairywings on September 18, 2005, at 6:57:15

In reply to Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( JenStar, posted by kerria on September 17, 2005, at 18:38:51

> JenStar how could you misunderstand so much?

what i heard is that you said it was a terrible match, and it is, you've admitted it so many times, but you've said you can't/won't find another T. everyone has encouraged you to get away from this T. he sounds like a beast, or it's your interpretation that he is. either way, he sounds very uncaring, and frankly a masters isn't that high a level of education to be an expert. maybe he is, i don't know, i'd be looking for a very kind, caring, person, with at least a masters, possibly a PhD.

You've also said that before therapy you were a student with a 3.8, and went camping every weekend, and were doing well. it seems to me that either this T has made you very ill, or you've regressed, or you've allowed yourself to become ill, or you have gotten worse. only you know the answer to that, and i'm not trying to pick on you, i'm just saying i guess is it's that it's one of those things.

i think that you've developed a very unhealthy attachment to this guy, you feel that you can't leave him, and he's manipulated you into believing that. after all if he's being paid 100% by ins. he has plenty of incentive to keep you on. i think the letter, cutting you off as a patient was meant as a threat, either you come back, or you're gone! i don't know, that's just my guess. i think he knows how threatened you'd feel by that. my guess is a good T, a caring T wouldn't do that.

i'm sorry your family won't help you, i'm sorry you're not up to calling. it does sound like you are very overwhelmed by life right now, and it sounds like this T has done you no favors kerria. one day i hope you can see that, admit it to yourself, and get out from under his thumb by choice.
fw

 

Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :(

Posted by kerria on September 18, 2005, at 8:06:31

In reply to Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :(, posted by fairywings on September 18, 2005, at 6:57:15

It so difficult to do anything when you have parts of you that you can't communicate with.

This is the problem. No one can help. i need to try to commununicate somehow that it would be better for all inside if we find a new T or that T would find us a new T- even that would hurt a lot because we would feel so abandoned.

i was able to find a new T (a good T, someone speaking at the ISSD conference) once and then my parts needed to see T1 again and T2 was upset and terminated.

Thank you, fw, rs and JenStar. it's so hard to come in here. Please don't say you're sorry- even that has turned into a triggering thing because when T said it he meant that he wouldn't change to be more caring and supportive to help me.

please just forget it. i'm switching a lot and it feels bad for me to read my writing here.
everything is so hard.

Take care,
kerria

 

Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( kerria

Posted by fairywings on September 18, 2005, at 8:57:41

In reply to Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :(, posted by kerria on September 18, 2005, at 8:06:31

maybe when he goes on vacation you could have an appointment with another T. that's how i got going with the T i'm with now. i'm glad i made the change. i hope you can do it too kerria, i know it will be very, very hard, but i just don't think this T is going to help you get out of the place where you are now and help you get beyond this unhappy state. maybe i'm wrong, i hope i am. it seems you need a T who will be more intensive, and who has a more personable way. i only wish i could help you, i wish i could make those calls for you, and take you by the hand, and take you to the new Ts, and not let you go back to the mean T because i've been there before, and i know how hard it is to switch to a new one. the first time it took me at least several months to quit mourning, even though the guy was no good for me.

fw

 

Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( kerria

Posted by alexandra_k on September 18, 2005, at 16:24:07

In reply to T says he's sorry. That's all :(, posted by kerria on September 17, 2005, at 0:55:51

Okay. I'm going to be frank because I don't think b*llshit will help at this point either.

Take what you can / will.

The way you describe your therapist... It sounds as though he is ENCOURAGING you to remain split. It sounds like he is ENCOURAGING your different parts to communicate with him which is doing nothing whatsoever towards helping you develop internal communication.

And to me... That is precisely how to make someone worse, not how to encourage them to get better.

But with respect to what others have said about taking responsibility for the actions of your body... I have to say that I agree. It doesn't sound like you do that. But then, to be fair, from what you have said it doesn't sound like your therapist is doing much to encourage you to do that either. So it is a hard one.

> Lately i can't even manage to get to appts,

Okay, so that is a problem. It is a problem for you. It is hard for therapy to work if you don't even go. And I'm sure it is a horrible inconvenience to your therapist who has kept that time slot open for you.

> "Just identify with me."
> "I am with you in the pain"
> No, it's not good enough to just be here with me, Identify with me. How YOU would feel if you were me and had all these things happen.

He can't do that.
And if he did do that... Then he most probably wouldn't be able to help you because then he'd be overwhelmed by the pain - just like you are. Other people don't have to catch our feeling in order to be able to help us. They just need to be sympathetic. Empathetic, sure, but for your therapist to catch your pain... What good would that do? It won't take your pain away. Your therapist can't do that. No human being can.

> Tears. T says he's sorry and he won't, he can't identify with me. He "feels" for me, his "heart goes out to me in my pain" but he can't/won't identify WITH me.

Sounds to me like he does empathise. Pain isn't something that you can just give away to somebody else.

> How do you go to a T that can't imagine what it's like to be you?

Sounds like he can imagine what it is like to the degree that is possible. What he can't do is live through them for you so you don't have to deal with them anymore.

> and always blames me or my parts for sabotaging my coming to therapy

Who is responsible for your not turning up to therapy if your body is not?

> my littles like him because he's the only one who talks to them.

You need to talk to them.
If you talk them then they won't need your t to talk to them.

> i was able to find a new T (a good T, someone speaking at the ISSD conference) once and then my parts needed to see T1 again and T2 was upset and terminated.

Okay. So you started seeing a new t who you thought was quite good but then... Went back to see your old therapist so you were terminated by your new therapist. The reason for that... Is that if T2 is trying to get you to work on communicating with your parts yourself then your parts talking to your first therapist is only undoing all the work that the second therapist is trying to do with you.

Can you go back to the second therapist and say that the most important thing to do first is to promise not to see anyone else and work towards getting a contract with all your parts to keep that promise?

It is a hard one...
It sounds like your therapist says some fairly hurtful things at times. And that he isn't as sympathetic as he could be. And that he might not have the best strategies worked out with respect to helping you feel better.

For me... alarm bells ring when you talk about him.

I have said before that I think you would be better off working with someone else.

But I think that other people would be a whole heap less willing to let you avoid internal communication by meeting communication needs themself. And I think that other people will terminate you if you keep going back to your current therapist.

If I was you...
I'd try to contact the therapist who terminated you.
Because terminating you at that point sounds like the right thing to do...
They can't help you if you can't contract to see just them.
But they can help you make that contract with yourself.
And in that way... They are starting to teach you how to be responsible for your actions.
And that is what will ultimately help you get better.
Make sense?

 

Wow. Alex, cool post. alexandra_k

Posted by muffled on September 18, 2005, at 23:22:39

In reply to Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( kerria, posted by alexandra_k on September 18, 2005, at 16:24:07

Man you can think real good. I'm very impressed. I think its so cool how people come up with stuff from their own experiences. It just seems so much more valid to me.
Muffled :)

 

Re: Wow. Alex, cool post. muffled

Posted by fairywings on September 19, 2005, at 6:25:07

In reply to Wow. Alex, cool post. alexandra_k, posted by muffled on September 18, 2005, at 23:22:39

I thought those were really good points too.
fw

 

Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( alexandra_k

Posted by kerria on September 19, 2005, at 8:31:29

In reply to Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( kerria, posted by alexandra_k on September 18, 2005, at 16:24:07

Thank you for your ideas, for caring to write, Alexandra.
This is so difficult- coming back to a discussion where different parts have written their understanding about T and how everything is. There is so much unsaid, not a complete understanding of my situation at all displayed. The things i wrote are not complete truths at all. They give a distorted impression of what it's really like. i can't help it because i don't have communication with my parts. It's confusing to me exactly what's wrong and why i'm so upset with T whenever i see him.

Maybe if i stick to facts it will be more clear.
i can't go back to T2.
i found T2 about 2 years ago through the ISSD and started seeing him and it was going well. i talked in the session a lot about T1 and how upsetting therapy was with him and the good things about T1 too- that my child parts thought of T as their favorite teacher, that it was hard not to ever see T1 again. They cried because they missed him and T2 also wouldn't talk to them so that made them doubly unhappy. If only T2 had tried to form a relationship with them it would have helped so much not to have to go back once to see T1. i was only going back once- and i had told T2 that i was doing it. That's why i was so upset when all of a sudden T2 terminated me without warning. He never said that "you can never go to T1 again or that's it."

One really hot summer day two years ago i came home after working so hard in sun all day, my paycheck was covering therapy - that was before the insurance helped as much. There was a letter from T2 on the table. He wrote how he would not be responsible for me in any way any longer and would never see me or have anything to do with me. It said that there were copies mailed to T1 and to my psyDr.
i totally fell apart reading it. i even sent it back to him, explaining how it hurt me - asking him how he would feel if it were him that received a letter like that if he were seeing a new T and thought things were going well.

i think that T2 didn't want to have me for a client and jumped on the opportunity. i could be mistaken but it was never discussed that seeing T1 one isolated time would terminate therapy. Most Ts would understand, i would think, that the T relationship is hard to abruptly stop. He didn't or else he didn't care how upsetting it would be for me. i had even waited for an opening to see him for about two- three months before i started and he treated me so badly.
He wouldn't take me back. That's what he said in the letter.

i dislike some of the beliefs of the ISSD. Many in that organization don't believe that every person with DID can be helped. He probably thought that i was untreatable so he terminated me:( That was a very discouraging day.

Please, don't feel that you need to help fix things - i need support just to go on. The ideas are good- i need a capacity- i want to always take responsibility for what i do- but then what? It's not so much taking responsibility- i know that if anything keeps me from therapy or going anywhere is my fault but then what? It doesn't change anything at all that i know i'm to blame if i can't get better.

Take care

 

Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( kerria

Posted by gardenergirl on September 19, 2005, at 11:56:27

In reply to Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( alexandra_k, posted by kerria on September 19, 2005, at 8:31:29

> It's not so much taking responsibility- i know that if anything keeps me from therapy or going anywhere is my fault but then what? It doesn't change anything at all that i know i'm to blame if i can't get better.

Hi kerria,

I don't think anyone here is saying you are to blame if you don't get better. I think, instead, we are trying to help you find active things, things that might be within your control to focus on. You sound so hopeless and in such pain. I think that's what we are honing in on--the sense of hopelessness and perhaps helplessness that comes across in your posts.

So anything at all that you can do that's within your control to change might help you to feel a bit more hopeful about getting better.

((((kerria))))

gg
>
> Take care

 

Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( kerria

Posted by alexandra_k on September 19, 2005, at 20:31:19

In reply to Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( alexandra_k, posted by kerria on September 19, 2005, at 8:31:29

> Thank you for your ideas, for caring to write, Alexandra.

You are welcome :-)
I hope that you know that when I don't reply to your threads it isn't because I don't care - it is just that I find it hard to know what to say sometimes. And I have stuff going on too. And work. There is always the work that I should be doing...

> There is so much unsaid, not a complete understanding of my situation at all displayed.
The things i wrote are not complete truths at all. They give a distorted impression of what it's really like.

Sure. But everybody does this. We can't have a full understanding because we are limited to a perspective. And then our perspective is limited further still by all sorts of sh*t that is going on for us. Everybody does this. And the therapists case study reveals as much (if not more) about the therapist than it does about the client and conversely what we have to say about our therapists reveals as much (if not more) about us than it reveals about the therapist. But still... Some things can be worked out. Sort of, sort of...

> i can't help it because i don't have communication with my parts.

Its not a matter of 'helping it' because everybody does this to a greater or lesser extent. With respect to communication... Thats why I think it is important for you to work with a t who won't communicate to your parts and relay messages to you on their behalf. If your t is doing this then I reckon it would be next to impossible to get internal communication up off the ground. But at this point... That is the only way for you to get better. Thats where you need to contract to do the best you can to work towards internal communication with your parts. So your t can help you (all) contract to doing things that are going to help you all and improve your life. Without this... I don't see how progress can be made.

> i can't go back to T2.

Okay... Lets see...

> i found T2 about 2 years ago through the ISSD and started seeing him and it was going well. i talked in the session a lot about T1 and how upsetting therapy was with him and the good things about T1 too- that my child parts thought of T as their favorite teacher, that it was hard not to ever see T1 again. They cried because they missed him and T2 also wouldn't talk to them so that made them doubly unhappy.

Okay. So at that point T2 was faced with a decision... He could talk to your child parts and keep them happy that way... And what would the consequences of that be? That you wouldn't communicate with them, that they wouldn't try to communicate with you. That you will start missing sessions because of what your parts are up to etc etc. Sounds to me like T2 was trying to HELP you. And that he appreciated that sometimes the easy short term quick fix keep the client happy option is actually detrimental in the long run...

And now the crucial bit comes along...

Did you start to work to get internal communication up off the ground?????
(Sounds like you were just about there...)

>If only T2 had tried to form a relationship with them it would have helped so much not to have to go back once to see T1.

Ah. So you went back to your old therapist...

And that stuffed up what T2 was trying to do to help you. Can you see that?

> There was a letter from T2 on the table. He wrote how he would not be responsible for me in any way any longer and would never see me or have anything to do with me. It said that there were copies mailed to T1 and to my psyDr.

Yeah. I bet T2 was pretty pissed off with T1. I think it was fairly unethical of T1 to see you about then...

> i totally fell apart reading it. i even sent it back to him, explaining how it hurt me - asking him how he would feel if it were him that received a letter like that if he were seeing a new T and thought things were going well.

Yeah. It is hard when one doesn't understand why.

> i think that T2 didn't want to have me for a client and jumped on the opportunity. i could be mistaken but it was never discussed that seeing T1 one isolated time would terminate therapy. Most Ts would understand, i would think, that the T relationship is hard to abruptly stop. He didn't or else he didn't care how upsetting it would be for me. i had even waited for an opening to see him for about two- three months before i started and he treated me so badly.
> He wouldn't take me back. That's what he said in the letter.

It doesn't sound to me like things are irrevokable... I reckon that if you were to write him something about how you understand that internal communication has to be one of the main things to work on... And that you understand that that means that he isn't going to be relaying messages to you from your parts... And that you understand that that means that you can't keep going back to your old t because your old t is ENCOURAGING you to remain split... And that you are sick and tired of going around the same old cirles and that you are willing to do your best to try and get better... That he just might take you back.

Because I think that things are pretty confusing with T1. And I think thats a combination of where you are at (some of that confusion will be there with any t you see) and what your t is doing (and another t might be a bit confusing in some respects but long term with respect to your getting better...) I think you could still do a lot better than your current t.

And I reckon... That T2 sounds pretty good :-)

> i dislike some of the beliefs of the ISSD. Many in that organization don't believe that every person with DID can be helped.

I would imagine... That they do believe people can be helped or they wouldn't have anything to do with the society.

I have read some of the ISSD stuff online and I have to say that I was fairly impressed. I didn't manage to get through all of it (or even most of it) but what I read sounded fairly sensible.

That being said....

My favourite philosopher Daniel Dennett was invited to the ISSD conference in Chicago in 1988 (so thats a little while ago now). Here is part of what he had to say

'... that is the cliquish - almost cultish - character of those who currently espouse the cause of MPD. In a world where those who are not for MPD are against it, it is perhaps not suprising that "believers" have tended to close ranks. Maybe it is not suprising either that at meetings like the one we attended in Chicago there is a certain amount of well-meaning exaggeration and one-upmanship. We were however not prepared for what - if it occurred in a church - would amount to "bearing witness". "How many multiples have you got?" one therapist asks another one over breakfast in Chicago, "I'm on my fifth". "Oh, I'm just a novice - two, so far". "You know Dr. Q - she's got fifteen in treatment; and I gather she's a multiple herself". At lunch: "I've got a patient whose eyes change colour". "I've got one whose different personalities speak six different languages, none of which could possibly have been learned". "My patient Myra had her fallopian tubes tied, but when she switched to Katie she got pregnant". At supper: "Her parents got her to breed babies for human sacrifice; she was a surrogate mother three times before her eighteenth birthday". "At three years old, Peter was made to kill his baby brother and eat his flesh". "There's a lot of it about: They reckon that a quarter of our patients have been victims of satanic rituals".

To be fair, this kind of gossip belies the deeper seriousness of the majority of therapists who deal with MPD. But that it occurs at all, and is seemingly so little challenged, could well explain why people outside the Movement want to keep their distance... Some therapists clearly consider it a privilege to be close to such extrordinary human beings (and the more of them in treatment, the more status the therapist acquired).'

'Speaking for Ourselves' "Brainchildren"

And that is why...
I am wary.
And that is why...
I am cautious because IMO it can be the case that the people who are keen to work with cases are a whole heap more dubious than those who are not keen initially. Make sense?

> i want to always take responsibility for what i do- but then what? It's not so much taking responsibility- i know that if anything keeps me from therapy or going anywhere is my fault but then what? It doesn't change anything at all that i know i'm to blame if i can't get better.

Its not about blaming you. Really. Its about improving internal communication which is precisely what will allow you to take proper responsibility for your actions. It is hard... I have periods of missing time. I don't know what the body was up to... It is hard to take responsibility for actions that I don't remember doing. But... It is my responsibility to give everything I have got to work on improving internal communication. Ultimately... Thats what works.

You just need to take the first step: Internal communication.

And I think you need to have a think about how much your current therapist is helping you out there. Because it sounds to me like he is not. Unintentionally... What he is doing is making things so you can continue to avoid communicating with them. I think you would get a lot more help with T2 and it sounds to me like you could get things sorted there. He just needs to see willingness. Agreeing to do your best to get an internal contract to solely seeing him would be a really positive first step. And he can help you figure strategies to get that internal contract made.

One thing I do for my little part...
I know she loves to swing.
I let her swing.
It does feel a bit odd being co-conscious with her.
And she does chatter so...
But she loves it.
She feels really happy.
And I feel some of that too.
What do your littles like to do?

 

CLEAR UP CONFUSION

Posted by kerria on September 19, 2005, at 22:56:06

In reply to Re: T says he's sorry. That's all :( kerria, posted by alexandra_k on September 19, 2005, at 20:31:19

Thank you for trying to help- for caring and writing, and for trying to be supportive- i can't thank you enough. So many times it keeps me.

There are a lot of things that are supposed that aren't true at all.

Communication with my parts- My T has always been strong on that point. The difficulty is within me- it's in my system. It's taking me longer to start communication with parts. That has been the #1 contention that i have with T. He always stresses communication. The program at his hospital hinges upon internal communication . It has been too hard for me to do. It's like taking a test in Chinese (and i don't speak that language). It's a terrible struggle to try to communicate. I know that communication is the only way that i'll get better- less losing time, less forgetting and symptoms. My personality needs it to be separate i think- it feels that way anyways. It's not T's fault at all. That's been his constant soapbox message.

My T is also very experienced. T2 and every T who is at the top of the research know my T and would say that he's considered by experts to be an expert and has probably seen more patients for DID treatment than mostly anyone. People come from all over the world for treatment there.
Although it's so difficult to have therapy i think that it would be like that with everyone because it's too difficult to communicate. We're not ready and it feels like everything will fall apart. T is the one who keep trying to encourage communication the past five years.

When i saw T2, it was only for a month- four or five times. We were still attached to T1 as our T.
That is his point- that he has always been with me, throughout all this time when i kept trying other Ts. T2 wasn't the only one. T1 has stayed availab;le to me and didn't write any letters like T2.
About being considered untreatable (T2):
On the ISSD webpage there were Ts at the top of that organization - one was a past president- who have written about their presentations in the conferences or whatevr they have- and i read there that she didn't believe that everyone with DID was treatable. i was so upset when i read it that i emailed to say "Hey that's a discouraging statement for you to have on your(ISSD) site" and the president then wrote back, saying something like 'we do our best work when we realize/take account of, our limitations'.
So those at the top of the ISSD accept that idea- it upsets and discourages me.
i'm sure that T2 would never see me again- if you read the letter you would be sure also. He said that i was T1's patient in the letter also. All along T1 has been my T.

See how much is misunderstood- i'm a bad communicator because unlike most people, i don't have access to all of what i've gone through about the issues with T1 when i post. It's a confusing mess to read it for me because i don't remember writing it - they're not my words. i've learned to cope with the weirdness but still can't journal. i can't understand some of what i wrote at all. i have to read it again and again - sometimes aloud- before i can make any sense of it sometimes. That's the difference. There are separations between parts and it's always a mess to write in a forum. Everyone ends up misunderstanding and i end up misunderstanding because people respond to my parts and it gets to be a very bad mess. The same thing happened in another forum. People wrote to repond to my parts who wrote while they were triggered by a situation and people misunderstood, even thinking that i was in a domestic violence situation and i wasn't. The moderator suspended me then for being in crisis.
and i wasn't in any crisis at all.

That's another reason why it's so much better to keep separate. Even reading my parts writing here is upsetting because it makes my feel all split up. It's a confusing mess.

i hate how i am, i'm trying to work on communication but it's so difficult. It's not T's fault though. He doesn't like it that i can't communicate- that's the thing he always pushes and my parts push back- or think he doesn't care about them. Even though i know, i can't do anything about it. i can't take control and make them not write.

i'm sorry,
kerria:(

 

Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION kerria

Posted by alexandra_k on September 20, 2005, at 6:27:32

In reply to CLEAR UP CONFUSION, posted by kerria on September 19, 2005, at 22:56:06

> T is the one who keep trying to encourage communication the past five years.

It might be his soapbox message... But five years is one hell of a long time to have not made progress on that. And so I'm wondering how much he is saying one thing... And with his behaviour he is encouraging another...

> When i saw T2, it was only for a month- four or five times.

Which isn't long enough to feel attached. Most especially given that you were still seeing T1.

> i read there that she didn't believe that everyone with DID was treatable.

Was anything else said about that? I'm wondering because I think I've read somewhere that Linehan said that not all people with Borderline Personality were treatable either. She said that she couldn't / wouldn't treat someone who wouldn't contract to working on reduction of self harm (for example). I would imagine that a lot of therapists wouldn't work with someone with DID who wouldn't contract to work on improving communication (for example).

> i'm sure that T2 would never see me again- if you read the letter you would be sure also. He said that i was T1's patient in the letter also. All along T1 has been my T.

Yeah. And he is telling you that if T1 is going to continue being your T then he can't help you. Which sounds right to me. You have to choose who you want to work with. If he didn't know you were still seeing T1 when you started working with him... Then he may well have been a little annoyed when he found out you were still seeing T1. Because it is unethical for a T to be seeing someone elses client.

> See how much is misunderstood- i'm a bad communicator

I don't really see any misunderstandings... Maybe I'm still missing something...

> He doesn't like it that i can't communicate- that's the thing he always pushes and my parts push back- or think he doesn't care about them.

So he relents and gives them what they think they want and you don't improve communication, don't seem to be improving in your functioning, don't seem to be able to manage to get to sessions...

How long has this been going on?
How long have you been seeing him?

Do you think therapy with him has improved your life at all?

Or are you going round and round the same old circles?

Because you post a lot about feeling helpless and hopeless and powerless and out of control...

And I'm wondering how much your T is actually DOING with respect to helping you move foward... Sure he seems to be SAYING the right things... But with respect to his ACTIONS your alters seem to be calling the shots... That might seem to work sort of sort of... But is it worth those feelings of helplessness etc? Maybe its time for a change.

But it has to be your call.

You need to be prepared to contract to work on improved communication and work really hard at getting everyone to contract.

And I would say... That if you aren't prepared to do that... Then most therapists wouldn't work with you.

Because you have to be willing to help yourself.

Otherwise they CAN'T help you


 

Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION alexandra_k

Posted by kerria on September 20, 2005, at 9:35:23

In reply to Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION kerria, posted by alexandra_k on September 20, 2005, at 6:27:32

When you say it has to be 'my' call, which part do you mean? i don't have the say in what the body ends up doing. i can't get it. That's my #1 problem. That's why i go to therapy.

Reality- T1 is the only T that i have. T2 will never see me again- that's a fact- even if there was some way that i could get agreement. That was made clear in the letter.

Please try not to be critical or assert one way over another in something like going to T1, that we're so divided about. It makes me hate my parts when i agree with you.

 

Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION kerria

Posted by Damos on September 20, 2005, at 17:17:26

In reply to Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION alexandra_k, posted by kerria on September 20, 2005, at 9:35:23

Hi Kerria,

I think Alex was referring to you Kerria; the 'host', the person who sought treatment, the one who the parts exist within.

Please don't think any of us is criticizing or taking sides with any particular part. We aren't. We are just trying to care for the whole you the best way we know how.

All of you are welcome here. Try and let those that know the road you're on help you, they know your pain. It hurts us all to see you hurting and confused, and we just want to help.

Please take care good care. Thinking of you.
Damos

 

Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION kerria

Posted by alexandra_k on September 20, 2005, at 18:57:54

In reply to Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION alexandra_k, posted by kerria on September 20, 2005, at 9:35:23

> When you say it has to be 'my' call, which part do you mean?

The one who is having a conversation with me.

> i don't have the say in what the body ends up doing.

You have a say in two respects:
When you are in control you surely have a say. You are choosing to have a conversation with me, for example.
The more you work to improving communication the more you become aware of. And the more you become aware of the more control you have over the things you have become aware of.
But choosing to work on improving communication is the first step there, and that is something that IS in your control.

Otherwise... Things would be fairly hopeless...

> Reality- T1 is the only T that i have. T2 will never see me again- that's a fact- even if there was some way that i could get agreement. That was made clear in the letter.

People are known to change their minds occasionally... I was trying to figure the reasons why he sent you such a sh*tty letter. And best I can figure...
He was pissed about you continuing to work with T1 when he was trying to work with you.
He was having trouble with getting you to progress (most probably because of the first point)

> Please try not to be critical or assert one way over another in something like going to T1, that we're so divided about. It makes me hate my parts when i agree with you.

I'm sorry if I have come across as critical. Really. I don't mean to be critical. I'm just concerned about the hopelessness / helplessness that you express fairly frequently. I want you to get better. I want your life to improve. And I reckon it can. It can improve a whole heap. We want things to be EVEN BETTER than they were before that teacher told you you had DID.

But 5 years...
Sh*t that is one hell of a long time to see someone and to persist in seeing someone when you say that things have gotten worse for you over time and not better.

I don't want you to hate yourself / your parts.
I don't want you to hate T1.

But I don't see that T1 is doing much toward helping you get better. And thats based on stuff you have written about things he has said, but even more importantly thats based on stuff you have written about the things he is doing and has done.

(and it doesn't matter particularly whether 'you' or 'they' wrote those posts because they are all just different aspects / things that your body has noticed)

I appreciate that it is hard...

It sounds like he nurtures your child parts.

But it sounds like thats about all he is doing.
And thats not really helping you in the long run.

You need to nurture your parts.
They need to talk to you - not him.
But if he is there for them to talk to then it is so much easier for you and them to continue to avoid each other.

Because the way it seems to be (based on my experience)
Is that mostly communication isn't an option.
I can't find them.
But sometimes I get something...
Words...
A picture...
And then I have a choice...
I can communicate back
Or I can push those words / pictures away
And communication is once again no longer an option.

And so one way to look at it...
Is that there are little choice points
Where it is possible.
Where communication is something that is within your control.

I know that communication is something that really frightens you.

It frightens me too at times.

But my little parts help me there.

Because of the things they like DOING

It really isn't so bad to go swinging.
Yeah it feels a little odd
But they feel so HAPPY and I feel some of that too.
And so that is just one example of a safe way to work on communication.
(Maybe not communication exactly but its a way of my feeling less afraid of them and more sympathetic towards them. I am thus in a better place to choose to listen to what they have to say when they do try and contact me).

I'm sorry if what I have said has hurt you.

I've been trying to help find you some hope...

I know you say a lot about your t being an expert...
But I have to say that these days... A Masters degree is not worth one hell of a lot.
Hell, I'm going to have one of those in a couple months!
20 years experience is a long time...
But none of that is worth anything if he isn't helping you to get better.

And... Are you getting better?

If he is an expert... I also would have thought that he would have had something to say to the doctors / specialists around your pain and your nerve block too. Because... And I know we have talked about this before... Psychosomatic pain is indistinguishable from physically caused pain from the point of view of the person experiencing it. So from the perspective of you (and all your parts) you really can't tell the difference... But psychosomatic symptoms are part of the diagnostic criteria for DID and so that really is important with respect to the Doctors and specialists figuring out whether invasive physical procedures are likely to help you or whether they are likely to have no affect on the pain whatsoever and just cost one hell of a lot of money and put you (and your parts) through yet another traumatic experience.

But he didn't have anything to do with all that, did he?

Alarm bells...

It is stuff like that for me.
The things he DOES and the things he fails to do.

I know its frightening.
I guess you have become pretty attached to him over the past 5 years.
But look at where you are now...
The hopelessness and helplessness you feel quite a lot of the time.
Is he worth it????

Because IMO
hell no

 

Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION Damos

Posted by alexandra_k on September 20, 2005, at 19:01:44

In reply to Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION kerria, posted by Damos on September 20, 2005, at 17:17:26

> the 'host', the person who sought treatment, the one who the parts exist within.

it is only in 'most' cases that the 'host' is the one presenting for treatment.

parts don't really exist 'within' other parts

but all parts exist within one body

and the body is what is crucial...

the body does the time
the body does the crime

and IMO it is far more terrifying to not know what the body has been up to than knowing

because when i don't know...

what if i've done something really really bad???

it is my responsibility to work hard to make sure that nothing like that ever happens...

 

Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION

Posted by alexandra_k on September 20, 2005, at 19:02:45

In reply to Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION Damos, posted by alexandra_k on September 20, 2005, at 19:01:44

sh*t.
tried to cancel that but...
too late.

 

Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION alexandra_k

Posted by Damos on September 20, 2005, at 19:30:27

In reply to Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION Damos, posted by alexandra_k on September 20, 2005, at 19:01:44

Sorry, that's kinda what I meant, but it didn't come out that way. As usual just openned my mouth to change feet. Trying to understand and failing badly. Sorry.

 

Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION

Posted by alexandra_k on September 20, 2005, at 19:53:35

In reply to Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION alexandra_k, posted by Damos on September 20, 2005, at 19:30:27

nah i'm sorry
thats why i tried not to post that
but...
a little too late.

 

well said :) alexandra_k

Posted by JenStar on September 20, 2005, at 21:06:16

In reply to Re: CLEAR UP CONFUSION kerria, posted by alexandra_k on September 20, 2005, at 18:57:54

Alexandra,
this was a well-thought out & in my opinion a very caring post.

Kerria, I think Alexandra is saying things that make a LOT of sense. They echo things that I've said before (things that upset you), about you needing to take more responsibility.

I hope you can see that people here CARE about you, and if we offer posts that seem critical, it's only because we feel that it would be a huge disservice to you and your health if we simply fed you pretty platitudes or didn't tell you what we really feel.

It sounds like Alexandra has been where you are, at least in some respects, and has been able to help herself. I think her advice is excellent!

I hope you're well, Kerria. Alex, thanks for writing such a courageous & helpful post. :)

JenStar


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