Psycho-Babble Psychology Thread 554523

Shown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.

 

Gut at birth has more brain cells than the brain!?

Posted by 64bowtie on September 13, 2005, at 1:18:33

Huh?

Yep! The neuroscience folks looked closely and found what has been suspected for decades...

Premise: From birth, we save information linked to our feelings... The repository of our feelings, the gut, the viscera...

As adults, age 15 and older (for certain), we store memories most effectively and efficiently as pictures... In order to flavor our motives for this storage, we add a feeling, an emotion, to the storage, the neuroscience folks tell us so...

However, with poor guidance, some of us continue to try storing the memory itself as the feeling... This causes disasterous results since as adults we are no longer wired to remember how a feeling feels... That all went away during our subtle puberty upgrading of faculties and attributes, skills and abilities; a trade off we may have not been properly guided into...

Clock yourself, I have!!! I suffer an injustice, it takes 4 hours for my gut to give me back my sensibilities... Why??? Because I forget to unhook from the feeling level and study my options... I can study my options... I simply and unwisely forget to... So, I uselessly stay 'highjacked' by my bad feelings for up to 4 hours... My expectations that I 'SHOULDN'T' be mistreated 'HIGHJACKS' my sensibilities and I spin in my own juices, for up to 4 hours!!! All those extra brain cells in my gut just keep firing the negative stuff!!!

Rod

 

Does YOUR gut manipulate YOUR brain??? (nm)

Posted by 64bowtie on September 13, 2005, at 1:26:54

In reply to Gut at birth has more brain cells than the brain!?, posted by 64bowtie on September 13, 2005, at 1:18:33

 

Whatsa Gut???

Posted by 64bowtie on September 13, 2005, at 1:43:32

In reply to Gut at birth has more brain cells than the brain!?, posted by 64bowtie on September 13, 2005, at 1:18:33

The visceral cortex in the brain controls and feeds back from the stomach, the intestines, the heart and the diaphram (pumps the lungs)... So if we get the fluttery feelings when we get smitten by the opposite sex, our heart and 'breathing' begin to race... See, no stomach or intestines... But still the viscera; the visceral cortex, communicating with the brain cells actually present as a feature of the heart and breathing...

So, that's LOVE!!!

Rod

 

Re: Does YOUR gut manipulate YOUR brain??? 64bowtie

Posted by sleepygirl on September 13, 2005, at 22:06:50

In reply to Does YOUR gut manipulate YOUR brain??? (nm), posted by 64bowtie on September 13, 2005, at 1:26:54

I think so. I really, really do.

 

Re: Does YOUR gut manipulate YOUR brain??? sleepygirl

Posted by 64bowtie on September 16, 2005, at 9:23:13

In reply to Re: Does YOUR gut manipulate YOUR brain??? 64bowtie, posted by sleepygirl on September 13, 2005, at 22:06:50

Thanx, SG,

So can you imagine a strategy for haenessing your gut?

Rod

 

Re: Does YOUR gut manipulate YOUR brain??? 64bowtie

Posted by gardenergirl on September 16, 2005, at 12:12:13

In reply to Re: Does YOUR gut manipulate YOUR brain??? sleepygirl, posted by 64bowtie on September 16, 2005, at 9:23:13

Hi Rod,
Do you mean harnassing as in reining it in? Or do you mean harnassing the information that comes from your gut and putting it to use?

gg

 

Re: Whatsa Gut??? 64bowtie

Posted by gardenergirl on September 16, 2005, at 13:00:18

In reply to Whatsa Gut???, posted by 64bowtie on September 13, 2005, at 1:43:32

Are you referring to the limbic system when you say visceral cortex?

Or the brain stem controlling the motor aspects of heart and lung function?

I'm confused.

gg

 

Re: Whatsa Gut???

Posted by alexandra_k on September 16, 2005, at 20:40:16

In reply to Re: Whatsa Gut??? 64bowtie, posted by gardenergirl on September 16, 2005, at 13:00:18

i wondered about those :-)

i will also put in a bid for the somatosensory cortex

(that sends info pretty quickly to lower level structures does it not???)

 

Re: Whatsa Gut??? alexandra_k

Posted by gardenergirl on September 16, 2005, at 20:57:37

In reply to Re: Whatsa Gut???, posted by alexandra_k on September 16, 2005, at 20:40:16

> i wondered about those :-)
>
> i will also put in a bid for the somatosensory cortex
>
> (that sends info pretty quickly to lower level structures does it not???)

Yep, but if I remember correctly, it's to the limbs and trunk, etc. for cutaneous sensation and proprioception (feeling your place in space).

gg
>

 

Re: Whatsa Gut???

Posted by alexandra_k on September 16, 2005, at 21:10:43

In reply to Re: Whatsa Gut??? alexandra_k, posted by gardenergirl on September 16, 2005, at 20:57:37


> Yep, but if I remember correctly, it's to the limbs and trunk, etc. for cutaneous sensation and proprioception (feeling your place in space).

ah okay :-)
brain stem then???

 

gardenergirl Both, when and where appropriate (nm) gardenergirl

Posted by 64bowtie on September 17, 2005, at 0:32:15

In reply to Re: Does YOUR gut manipulate YOUR brain??? 64bowtie, posted by gardenergirl on September 16, 2005, at 12:12:13

 

gardenergirl Sorry, I was in some kinda hurry

Posted by 64bowtie on September 17, 2005, at 1:40:37

In reply to gardenergirl Both, when and where appropriate (nm) gardenergirl, posted by 64bowtie on September 17, 2005, at 0:32:15

GG,

I am always 'at-awe' whe I see you have responded to me... I enjoy so much having you here... I hope all here see you for the treasure that you are... About reining-in or putting it to use, both, where apprpopriate... Re: limbic vs brain stem, I need to re-study the cortical connection stuff...

Part 'B' of the issue is that the results don't change by your settling your mind about the exactness of my representations of the etiology of the model... The outcome is that, with the population of neurons being actually more in the 'gut' than in the brain at birth, and feelings end up being stored in the gut, it's likely that reasoning via feelings can leave us missing a better big picture of our lives as adults...

Since I keep bringing up that sticky little point that toooo many folks with toooo many troubles end up by age 35 or 40 feeling a need to end it all, I am contiuing to connect this negative results to a propensity to hold on to a part of themselves that no longer exists, their childhood... I can be partly wrong when anyone wants to ignore the obvious... I'll take on that risk...

Along with childhood comes the accepted limitations of black and white reasoning, seeking of feel-goods instead of options when problem solving, and overall poor impulse-management... So, why would anyone seek the comfort of childhood???

I suggest its because of convenience... Laizefaire is always more convrenient, except when it isn't; anymore; when it's toooo late to change and adapt... Exempli gratia is the levees around New Orleans... It was easier to spend the moneys elsewhere, and now that was a big mistake...

I'm pointing out that poor impulse management is epidemic and getting worse... If the 'gut', whatever it really-really is, is the source of the poor impulse management in adulthood, then I'm choosing to continue to get the word out... As with my contact with Sleepygirl above, I seek folks strategies at overcoming the suffocating effects of holding onto what our 'gut' tells us inappropriately, inappropriately because we can do better than that!!! We're adults and no longer trapped by our childhood limitations...

I keep refering to the book, "The Second Brain" which expands the accuracy of this information... Go ahead and read the book... If I'm wrong, I'll eat my truck (my 1964 'Bowtie' pick-up).........lol

Rod

PS: I don't have academic accesses that I used to... Perhaps I accept the principle toooo early in the discussion when safety would dictate that I get my bibligrophy in place before I open my mouth.... Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm......

 

Re: neuroscience

Posted by gardenergirl on September 19, 2005, at 12:29:40

In reply to gardenergirl Sorry, I was in some kinda hurry, posted by 64bowtie on September 17, 2005, at 1:40:37

>
> Part 'B' of the issue is that the results don't change by your settling your mind about the exactness of my representations of the etiology of the model...

True, but if I could put what you are saying into the language I learned about neurology, then I could form a better opinion of what you are saying.

>The outcome is that, with the population of neurons being actually more in the 'gut' than in the brain at birth, and feelings end up being stored in the gut, it's likely that reasoning via feelings can leave us missing a better big picture of our lives as adults...

See, here's where I am confused. Are you talking about the connections from the autonomic nervous system to the internal organs and mesentery? If so, I wouldn't necessarily characterize that as neurons "in" the gut. Rather, I would call it a connection to the gut. As far as reasoning via the gut, surely taking in the "data" from feelings and integrating it with the rational mind would lead to better "outcomes" in understanding what's going on with us? They don't call intuition a "gut feeling" as a derogatory, but rather view it as a useful tool.
>
> Since I keep bringing up that sticky little point that toooo many folks with toooo many troubles end up by age 35 or 40 feeling a need to end it all, I am contiuing to connect this negative results to a propensity to hold on to a part of themselves that no longer exists, their childhood... I can be partly wrong when anyone wants to ignore the obvious... I'll take on that risk...

Rod, my childhood certainly does still exist. It exists within me and is part of the sum total of who I am. I would absolutely HATE to think of what I'd be like if that were not there. That's not to say that I don't sometimes act from drives and needs from childhood. Learning to recognize what those drives and needs are, and finding ways to meet them in "adaptive for this time in my life" ways is a huge part of my therapy process. But even if I accomplish that on a more consistent basis, it does not mean that I am letting go of childhood. You CAN'T let go of it. You can't erase the past, you don't get a re-do, and the issues, needs, drives, etc. from childhood continue to be a force. It's how much else is a force in your life, how much more of you there is, that correlates with adaptive functioning.
>
> Along with childhood comes the accepted limitations of black and white reasoning, seeking of feel-goods instead of options when problem solving, and overall poor impulse-management... So, why would anyone seek the comfort of childhood???

Have you ever, as an adult: swung on a swing? Jumped in a pile of fall leaves just to hear their crunch and release that marvelous fall smell? Skipped stones on a pond or lake? Danced or sang from simple joy? Watched a cartoon? Eaten fish sticks and macaroni and cheese for dinner? Colored? Stared up at the stars and wondered how far they are or how they got there?

Being in touch with your child-like nature is a good thing. It affords balance in life, and it is a source of simple joy if you let it. And being able to regress at times, to connect with your child-like nature does not mean that you regress in your thinking to more concrete stages. It's possible to be child-like at times and still be a rational thinker.
>
> I suggest its because of convenience... Laizefaire is always more convrenient, except when it isn't; anymore; when it's toooo late to change and adapt...

I don't think this is fair to those who have not had the opportunity or environment to develop fully. It's not because it's more convenient. It's not because they choose not to. A plant needs a certain amount of light, water, nutrients, and shelter in order to thrive. Even if all that is needed is in place, the plant could still be less developed, diseased, or even die. I don't think you can make generalizatoins about why people are or are not they way the are when there are way too many factors in the mix.

>Exempli gratia is the levees around New Orleans... It was easier to spend the moneys elsewhere, and now that was a big mistake...

I think saying it was easier is too simple. There lots of political, social, and economic forces affecting that outcome. You also cannot quantify the contribution of the personal experience, character, intellect, etc. of the person's involved in the decision.
>
> I seek folks strategies at overcoming the suffocating effects of holding onto what our 'gut' tells us inappropriately, inappropriately because we can do better than that!!! We're adults and no longer trapped by our childhood limitations...

Okay, I get that you are referring to "inappropriate" use of the gut as a tool. But define inappropriate?
>
> I keep refering to the book, "The Second Brain" which expands the accuracy of this information... Go ahead and read the book... If I'm wrong, I'll eat my truck (my 1964 'Bowtie' pick-up).........lol

I'll have to add that to the list for post graduation. Did I link to the correct book?
>
> Rod
>
> PS: I don't have academic accesses that I used to... Perhaps I accept the principle toooo early in the discussion when safety would dictate that I get my bibligrophy in place before I open my mouth.... Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm......

That probably would help others more readily accept what you are saying .

gg
>
>

 

gardenergirl The wierd part

Posted by 64bowtie on September 21, 2005, at 3:06:43

In reply to Re: neuroscience, posted by gardenergirl on September 19, 2005, at 12:29:40

GG,

Thanks for the responses... What you see and think is important to me...

What may seem wierd is that adjusting client vision to seeking the rest of their life as an adult is very successful... They have been reporting years later that what I helped them discover, got them permanenetly off their 'treadmill'... Sadly I don't have the grant money to perform the definitive study yet, but I sense its coming... I am not certain yet about how to sell this to the 'powers-that-be' in order to get a project grant funded...

Most important to me, I am very pleased with my minor successes... Most responses to first hearing what I have to say, isn't rejection for the substance of what I am about, but rather that no one wants to get well because its toooo much hard work, and they fail to see any payoff to giving up all those bad habits... I don't share this view of futility...

This negative vision is curiously encouraging to me... I have witnessed toooo many successes to quit now...

Rod

 

Re: Re: neuroscience --- GG see new thread

Posted by 64bowtie on September 21, 2005, at 14:49:37

In reply to Re: neuroscience, posted by gardenergirl on September 19, 2005, at 12:29:40

GG,

I took some time to thoughtfully respond...

See the new thread below...

Rod

 

Ya gotta follow your bliss 64bowtie

Posted by gardenergirl on September 21, 2005, at 23:29:26

In reply to gardenergirl The wierd part, posted by 64bowtie on September 21, 2005, at 3:06:43

Sounds like you've identified it. That's great.

gg


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