Psycho-Babble Psychology Thread 545815

Shown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.

 

Complete Reversal - Long

Posted by cricket on August 23, 2005, at 19:30:31

First off, I want to thank everyone for their support this week. It was rough and I couldn't have made it without so many of you.

Now as far as therapy. Better but still strange.

First of all, it was like he didn't want to go there, didn't want to discuss it. He usually pokes and prods - any thoughts about our last session? And I always say no. Then he pokes some more. Remember we were talking about (insert subject) and you said blah, blah and he usually still doesn't get much out of me.

But this time nothing. He started asking about my son, about work. Like chit chat. Then he says you seem strange to me. Did you rush here?

Then I took the plunge. Well I guess maybe I am a little confused about last week. And I said that I didn't understand why the dream was so negative to him.

He said well I think it was a good dream because now it means it is time for us to get real.

I said I didn't understand real. I said the girl was just really wanting to talk to him and she feels like she failed and she felt sad. But she really, really wanted to so why was that negative?

He asked, "Where is she now?"

I told him that she was sleeping.

Then he said, "Well I know I said negative but negative doesn't really mean negative. It means positive."

Yes, he said just that.

I must have looked askance because he said, "Well maybe I was thinking more of the ways it showed me not being very helpful. She had to talk to this social secretary and then I'm making a speech in some formal spanish and saying some not very nice things."

"We don't care about that. We like to hear your voice even if it's goobledy g*ok."

Then he went off into lots of metaphors, about electrical voltage, newsrooms and some other stuff which escapes me. Mostly about therapy communication being too much for this little girl who never speaks to anyone.

At the end, he asked me if I was feeling better. When I sort of shrugged, he said "Are we still not in agreement on this dream?"

I said again, "she just wanted to talk to you. She didn't take offense at anything you said. She doesn't expect you to speak her language. She wanted to listen to you more but she didn't think it was appropriate for her to listen to something she didn't pay for."

Then he said, and I think that this is the most revealing of his own feelings as he has ever been (if they are his true feelings)

"Maybe I just try too hard sometimes. Sometimes I get so afraid that she's just going to disappear and not come back. I just don't want to do something that makes her go away. It's kind of like when your kids learn how to do something, it feels so momentous that you don't know how to react. You're ready for the video camera and everything and that's just intrusive sometimes."

So do I trust his words? I guess if I want to continue I have to try.

But what makes him go off like that? It's not the first time. Is it just frustration?

Is he really afraid that I am going to disappear? I can't really believe that.

I mean he has good reason to believe I might disappear. He knows how I dread therapy. He knows I have parts that think this whole therapy thing is sh*t for the birds.

But you would think he would be ready to get the party hat out if I disappear.

That's what I don't understand.

If I could understand that, maybe I would trust him. But I don't, not yet I don't.

 

Re: Complete Reversal - Long » cricket

Posted by Tamar on August 23, 2005, at 20:33:47

In reply to Complete Reversal - Long, posted by cricket on August 23, 2005, at 19:30:31

I’m glad it was better, even if it was still a little strange.

It’s interesting (and, I think, a very positive thing) that he said he doesn’t want to do something that makes the little girl go away. And I think it’s good that he said it’s time to get real. But, of course, getting real involves a lot of trust.

However, I still have the sense (from what you said) that he’s holding back a little. Maybe part of it is that he doesn’t want to scare the little girl. And I wonder if another part of the equation is that he wants to take time to make sure he’s ready. Maybe he’s both excited about the potential and a little anxious about what it will mean for your therapy. I suspect he knows he’ll have to be very careful with the little girl. I often think therapy involves trust on both sides, and perhaps he’s trying to be absolutely certain that he trusts you… and that your trust in him won’t be misplaced, when it comes.

> But you would think he would be ready to get the party hat out if I disappear.

I think he would get the party hat out if you can manoeuvre the relationship to a point where you can trust him. It sounds to me as if he’s preparing to take it all to the next level. I imagine that you’re picking up on his anxieties about it. But it seems to me that he’s trying quite hard to make it possible… which should be a good thing, right?

Tamar

 

Re: Complete Reversal - Long » cricket

Posted by Dinah on August 23, 2005, at 20:38:13

In reply to Complete Reversal - Long, posted by cricket on August 23, 2005, at 19:30:31

If I'm understanding correctly, it isn't a complete reversal as much as it was a misunderstanding. He wasn't in a good mood last week and may not have done his best communicating.

But he's trying. What more can they do really.

He sounds like a pretty good guy, Cricket. Do you feel a bit more trusting?

 

Re: Complete Reversal - Long » cricket

Posted by Daisym on August 24, 2005, at 0:04:24

In reply to Complete Reversal - Long, posted by cricket on August 23, 2005, at 19:30:31

I think he is trying Cricket and it seems like he knows he goofed and wants to get things back on track. I'm glad he is going to be careful with the little girl, she deserves his care. And I think he knows that.

Trust is tantalizing and yet so hard to reach. I work on this all the time. Trusting myself, trusting my therapist, trusting the process. That is actually the hardest part for me, trusting the process. It is hard work to learn to trust but worth it. Keep trying.

 

Re: Complete Reversal - Long » cricket

Posted by alexandra_k on August 24, 2005, at 1:11:41

In reply to Complete Reversal - Long, posted by cricket on August 23, 2005, at 19:30:31

Yeah I agree with what other people have been saying. Trust is really really hard. Maybe... Thats what he meant about the dream being negative. That it was negative that she doesn't trust him.

But then after thinking some more... She trusted him enough to call. And so that is progress.

It really does sound like he is trying.

Trust is hard...

 

Re: Complete Reversal » Tamar

Posted by cricket on August 24, 2005, at 8:04:06

In reply to Re: Complete Reversal - Long » cricket, posted by Tamar on August 23, 2005, at 20:33:47

>
> However, I still have the sense (from what you said) that he’s holding back a little. Maybe part of it is that he doesn’t want to scare the little girl. And I wonder if another part of the equation is that he wants to take time to make sure he’s ready. Maybe he’s both excited about the potential and a little anxious about what it will mean for your therapy. I suspect he knows he’ll have to be very careful with the little girl. I often think therapy involves trust on both sides, and perhaps he’s trying to be absolutely certain that he trusts you… and that your trust in him won’t be misplaced, when it comes.
>
Yes, Tamar. I think you might be onto something there.

It's painful to think through. For my part, I haven't been a patient that inspires trust. I tell him very little. He knows next to nothing about my day to day life. No one, including my husband, knows I see him. Therefore, he has no contact information for me. I consistently arrive 15 - 20 minutes late for every session and am ready to bolt at the least nod.

So if therapy involves feelings on his part (and I'm not sure it does) but then yeah I can see that he might hesitate to risk them. Is that what you mean by being able to trust me?

But I think I can be trusted. I think I won't flee. I think I might be ready to tell him a bit more. But how? I can't risk too much too quick on my part either or I will shut down.

 

Re: Complete Reversal - Long » Dinah

Posted by cricket on August 24, 2005, at 11:32:00

In reply to Re: Complete Reversal - Long » cricket, posted by Dinah on August 23, 2005, at 20:38:13

Yes, I think he is trying. He was off that other week. I am able to accept that.

Trusting, I don't know?

It's hard for me to trust him when I think that he's telling me, albeit in a roundabout way, that he cares. I think that he is trying to trick me somehow.

Is that good instincts on my part or is it my f*cked up pathology?

 

Re: Complete Reversal - Long » Daisym

Posted by cricket on August 24, 2005, at 11:39:56

In reply to Re: Complete Reversal - Long » cricket, posted by Daisym on August 24, 2005, at 0:04:24

Hi Daisy,

I'm glad you think that trust is worth it. That encourages me.

I know that you've been struggling with over attachment and dependence on your therapist. I was wondering if you could perhaps sell me some of that? :-)

I think my therapist might appreciate it if I came in with a bit of attachment next week.

Anything I could barter for it?

I have plenty of cynicism and some extra anger available this week.

 

Re: Complete Reversal » alexandra_k

Posted by cricket on August 24, 2005, at 11:52:34

In reply to Re: Complete Reversal - Long » cricket, posted by alexandra_k on August 24, 2005, at 1:11:41

Yeah, trust.

And my issues with it seem to be different than most people's.

Most people are trying to trust their therapist not to abandon them. And I understand that. But abandonment is so familiar to me it feels almost comfortable.

But my issue is more trusting him enough to let him care a tiny bit. That is really hard for me to do.

Why? Why do most people long for caring, and I fear it more than anything else?

I mean I'm okay with caring about people. I really do care about my husband, my son, some of the people I work with, even my therapist. But I'm not okay with any of those people caring about me :-(

Except for Babblers. That's strange but I can take the care I get here and it even makes me feel better. Maybe because I know that you can all ignore me anytime you want, you don't have to look at me.

I don't know.

 

Re: Complete Reversal » cricket

Posted by Daisym on August 24, 2005, at 13:49:38

In reply to Re: Complete Reversal » alexandra_k, posted by cricket on August 24, 2005, at 11:52:34

Allowing someone to care for you and/or worry about you comes with a whole set of dangers, at least for me. First, it opens you up to the potential of perhaps liking the caring and then wanting the caring and then needing the caring and...what if it goes away? I think abandonment fears wear many different colors.

I also think that having someone care about you makes us vulnerable somehow, it is role I know I'm not comfortable with. I truly don't know how to regulate myself within someone else's caring. I can only tolerate it for so long and then I need to hide myself again. And I always wonder if they would care if they knew the real me, the real truth.

Mostly I think I'm imposing. I don't deserve the care, I'm intruding on their psyche some how, I'm a giant pain in the a** because they HAVE to care...

This is a really complicated part of trust for me. I wish I understood it better.

 

Re: Complete Reversal » cricket

Posted by alexandra_k on August 24, 2005, at 15:09:43

In reply to Re: Complete Reversal » alexandra_k, posted by cricket on August 24, 2005, at 11:52:34

> Most people are trying to trust their therapist not to abandon them. And I understand that. But abandonment is so familiar to me it feels almost comfortable.

maybe... it seems so inevitable that you just feel numb?

> But my issue is more trusting him enough to let him care a tiny bit. That is really hard for me to do.
> Why? Why do most people long for caring, and I fear it more than anything else?
> I mean I'm okay with caring about people. I really do care about my husband, my son, some of the people I work with, even my therapist. But I'm not okay with any of those people caring about me :-(

i'm not sure... maybe if they care about you... then it might be harder to feel detached / numb. then they might have more power to hurt you. especially if / when they leave.

> Except for Babblers. That's strange but I can take the care I get here and it even makes me feel better. Maybe because I know that you can all ignore me anytime you want, you don't have to look at me.

yeah. and maybe... its because you can ignore us if you want to too.

> I don't know.

me neither...

 

Re: Complete Reversal » Daisym

Posted by cricket on August 24, 2005, at 15:15:31

In reply to Re: Complete Reversal » cricket, posted by Daisym on August 24, 2005, at 13:49:38

Yes, Daisy that's exactly it.

So now what? How to change?

I guess I know the answer is in therapy. But I don't know. I can't quite imagine that.

Actually it makes me want to quit when I think about working on these issues with him.

 

Re: Complete Reversal » alexandra_k

Posted by cricket on August 24, 2005, at 15:56:42

In reply to Re: Complete Reversal » cricket, posted by alexandra_k on August 24, 2005, at 15:09:43

Yeah, detached and numb.

Old survival tactics.

So hard to give up.

Sometimes I don't even understand why I want to give them up.

 

Re: Complete Reversal » cricket

Posted by Daisym on August 24, 2005, at 16:06:36

In reply to Re: Complete Reversal » Daisym, posted by cricket on August 24, 2005, at 15:15:31

A wise friend told me that when I have an extreme reaction to something (like wanting to quit) it usually means I'm doing exactly the work I need to be doing. So I need to try and stay with it. And it is probably old.

It sounds like you are on to something here. Try to stay with it. But remember, those old coping skills kept you safe so you have to respect them and their purpose. They aren't just going to move aside because you want them to. I'm working towards peaceful coexistance not wishing annilation of the "other" part of me. It is very hard.

 

Re: Complete Reversal » cricket

Posted by alexandra_k on August 24, 2005, at 16:26:53

In reply to Re: Complete Reversal » alexandra_k, posted by cricket on August 24, 2005, at 15:56:42

> Sometimes I don't even understand why I want to give them up.

Because of all the reasons you started going to therapy in the first place.

I think its okay to feel detached and numb when faced with something thats really hard that you can't change. Thats beyond your power to change.

But it sounds like... It was in the past that things were beyond your power.

Trust is so very very very hard. Its something that I struggle a lot with too.

I have trouble looking... I think we have talked about this before. Typically it comes up on the agenda... And the therapist turns it into a major issue. I mean a major issue. I've been terminated before because I wouldn't look at a t. I emailed my t about a couple things this week and she said that is is okay. She understands that its hard enough for me to talk and she doesn't mind at all.

:-)

Trust is hard. I guess all I can say is that I think it is about taking little risks. Sharing something that is a little bit hard. And then if they respond positively then you trust them a little more. And then to keep on taking those little risks and after a while things seem safer. Then the risks can get a little bigger. Its hard too because along the way it is inevitable that there will be a miscommunication or something and your t won't respond in the most helpful way (like the bad session that you had). But... They are only human. And it does sound like he is really trying. And a little effort goes a long way in my book.

Baby steps.
It has to get better.

:-)


This is the end of the thread.


Show another thread

URL of post in thread:


Psycho-Babble Psychology | Extras | FAQ


[dr. bob] Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD, bob@dr-bob.org

Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.