Psycho-Babble Psychology Thread 309943

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Re: The last few days Ľ Speaker

Posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 1:01:48

In reply to Re: The last few days (long), posted by Speaker on February 5, 2004, at 20:34:17

It would have been nice to have had someone to hang with in the Kitchen all that time!

Do you write things out? I actually have some fear around putting all this on paper. It makes it so real and permanent. Plus he wants me to write, like pen and paper write, not type. He tells me it uses a different part of the brain and is better at access deep emotion. I don't know about that. I get going pretty well typing. Then I think about reading out loud...it seems really hard now that I'm thinking more about it.

Maybe I'm just really tired.

 

I'm out of Cream of Wheat Ľ fallsfall

Posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 1:07:33

In reply to Re: The last few days (long) Ľ DaisyM, posted by fallsfall on February 5, 2004, at 21:46:38

Can you believe it?! I have a crisis and my comfort food is missing. Trust me, cookies are no substitute!

Thanks for letting me lean on you guys. I feel like I'm doing that too much these days. Things are just so hard but I know I'm not the only one struggling.

And yes, I have thought about what would happen if I ever ended up in the hospital. I would have to get stuff done, people HAVE to get paid, etc. Sounds crazy, right? That is half the stress...

 

Re: The last few days (long) Ľ DaisyM

Posted by Crooked Heart on February 6, 2004, at 6:20:17

In reply to The last few days (long), posted by DaisyM on February 5, 2004, at 19:36:15

Daisy, I'm sorry you're having such a rough time and all this sh*t is happening at once.

Your therapist sounds as though he is up to it. So he looks horrified at what you tell him -- well maybe you've always *needed* someone to be horrified at what's happened to you, and he's doing just that, bless him. He sounds as though he would be wise enough to get support for himself *if* he needed it.

Who was it on this board advised 'self-care, self-care, self-care...'? Please be kind to yourself and use whatever are your favourite methods of getting a good night's sleep. I know this is just repeating what's been said, but if you did get pneumonia or something, then people would just manage. You don't have to do everything.

Thinking of you ((((Daisy))))

 

Re: I'm out of Cream of Wheat - Crisis Ľ DaisyM

Posted by fallsfall on February 6, 2004, at 8:35:39

In reply to I'm out of Cream of Wheat Ľ fallsfall, posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 1:07:33

Daisy,

You have one really important task today. You need to ask someone to get you some Cream of Wheat. Can you ask a friend at work to get some on her lunch hour? Can your husband pick some up? Can one of your kids walk to the corner store? Can you ask a neighbor to leave some on your doorstep? Can your Mom get some for you?

I would mail some to you, but I don't know where you live.

I guess that, if worse came to worse, you could get some yourself at a store (but it would feel so much better if someone else got it for you).

Even if you decide that you don't want to eat any today, you need to have it in your house (and maybe in your office, too).

Now, the other issue: "And yes, I have thought about what would happen if I ever ended up in the hospital. I would have to get stuff done, people HAVE to get paid, etc. Sounds crazy, right? That is half the stress...".

I have been where you are. I managed a group of 42 engineers (plus 20 coop students). I had to be there, I had to get stuff done, things would fall apart if I wasn't there. This was VERY bad.

It is not good management to be indispensible. Just like you put contingency plans in place when you are working on an important project - "just in case something goes wrong", you need contingency plans for every task that you do. Are you the top boss? Do you have managers working for you? Do you have competent individual contributors? What happens when you go on vacation? Depending on how your organization is set up, you could ask either your boss or subordinate managers to cover your tasks - either ask one to "be" you, or spread the work out among them (this kind of decision is made by person 1, person 2 can sign this kind of documents, etc.). It is BAD business to have things set up so that they will collapse if you are not there. What if the Twinkie Truck hit you? You need to put processes into place so that your work can be covered if you are not there. Of course, you WILL be there all of the time that you can (and probably some of the time that you can't). But, for your company's sake, you need to have a backup plan.

 

Re: The last few days Ľ DaisyM

Posted by Speaker on February 6, 2004, at 9:29:32

In reply to Re: The last few days Ľ Speaker, posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 1:01:48

Daisy,

I have done writing about several events. I wrote about an accident that a little boy ran in front of my car and was killed. However, it took many years of distance before I was able to write it and it did bring out the deepest emotion (stuff I thought I had worked through). I have learned suffering is two fold 1)you go through it and 2)you look back over it and not until both process are done do we have a clear picture of it. Writing makes it very real...I find it very hard. There are things in my life I can't begin to think of having on paper. I hope this process is helpful and freeing for you. You are in my thoughts. P.S. I wish I had your cookies...I had to go through the kitchen and only found white chocolate bits...I ate half the bag :).

 

Re: The last few days (very long) Daisy

Posted by antigua on February 6, 2004, at 10:02:16

In reply to The last few days (long), posted by DaisyM on February 5, 2004, at 19:36:15

I wasn't online last night because I WAS MAKING COOKIES!! I needed to distract myself. But no one but me seems to be eating them!

Your post went straight to my heart, Daisy. I donít have flashbacks like that, or they donít hit me as hard. Itís more like they seep into my consciousness, as if theyíve always been there and I just become aware of them. I have moments of great fear of what Iím about to remember, but I havenít remembered what goes with that fear yet. I have some very strong memories that refuse to surface, no matter how hard I try, even though I know what they are. Iím still very disconnected from it all. I do have several actual memories, but Iím just not connected enough to them for me to feel terrified. EMDR has helped me to begin to connect to those feelings, though. As painful as the flashback is, at least you felt it, and thatís really progress, Daisy. It sounds like you were able to hold on and integrate the experience, which is really great (although I bet it sure doesnít feel like it!).

For years I focused on false memories and ďif I canít remember it exactly, it didnít happen, etc.Ē I would read and research incessantly to deny that my father, who I truly loved, had hurt me so badly. I finally had to give up the denial and accept it. Once I did that (and I still harbor some resistance) things started to loosen up a bit.

I also understand your feelings about the look on your Tís face when you tell him these things. Sometimes the look on mine is so tragic and heartbreaking, almost horror actually, that I feel so bad. I think itís part of the burden thing I was talking about in my other post. I feel like Iím burdening her, imprinting these horrible events into her mind. My T says these things arenít too horrible for her, they just make her feel bad for me, but to me, they make me feel ashamed because they are normal to me. Isnít that sick? These experiences are normal to me. I canít see that they are horrible to me, but I see it in her face. I donít think Iím ready to accept how horrible it was and what it has done to me because then I would really have to deal w/what it has done to my life.

Good luck with the writing exercises and let me know how it goes, if it helps. I refuse to do that for therapy, but my T accepts it. I am a writer/editor in my ďfunctioningĒ life and I canít write about this in that way. Itís too painful. I have written about it on several occasions to specific people, but I donít journal (except for here). Itís too tied up w/my sense or vision of myself as a writer. I canít explain this correctly. Writing only helps me at certain times; otherwise, my writing becomes diluted and loses its intensity. Maybe I just mean that I canít write about it very easily and to me it really matters what ends up on the page, and to discuss this issue it would have to be perfectly explained. (I give up, Iíll have to really think about why I refuse to write about it, except for here.)

Iím sorry itís so tough right now, but hang in there. Lean on your T; thatís what heís there for. He wonít leave you, and thereís nothing so horrible that you can tell him to make him turn away from you. We are also here to listen to you and to help.

antigua

 

Re: The last few days Ľ DaisyM

Posted by Dinah on February 6, 2004, at 10:40:43

In reply to Re: The last few days Ľ Dinah, posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 0:52:49

Daisy, have you talked to your therapist about the short term use of medications? I know some therapists think that they impede the progress of therapy by easing the pain. But I personally found that I couldn't do meaningful therapy when I was too affectively aroused. While I never take meds before going to therapy, I don't think I could manage to concentrate on the hard work, never mind the rest of my life, if my emotions were constantly in turmoil and I wasn't sleeping well. Honestly I get too irrational at those times to be effective at *anything*. Just something to think about.

 

Re: I'm out Ľ fallsfall

Posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 14:39:04

In reply to Re: I'm out of Cream of Wheat - Crisis Ľ DaisyM, posted by fallsfall on February 6, 2004, at 8:35:39

There are several things in your post that made me smile -- ummm, my kids "drive" except for the 12year old, so walking? Oh, no! And, this is rural California -- we don't have "corner stores" -- or good public transportation for that matter. We DRIVE everywhere. Slowly. In traffic. But it is on my list today to pick up. I don't mind being self-sufficient in this area.

You are totally right about work. We do need a better distribution and back up plan. I am the "top" boss (she shrugs) and do all of the "business" work of the Agency. My assistant though is very, very good. She could run this place. She just doesn't "know" everything, like how to rob Peter to pay Paul, etc. Or how to beg for people to Please, please pay you...*sigh* It is a control thing, you know? But I know I need to write it all down. In my spare time.

Just last year I restructured so that all of the programs have "program managers." I wanted staff in each department to feel supported so we also instituted "reflective supervision." Meaning, each person gets one-on-one time with a supervisor to problem solve, vent, brainstorm, whatever needs to be done. People love it because they feel heard.

I told my Therapist about this structure one day when I was ranting about a particular senior manager who doesn't do her job but always gets me twisted up to feel like I should be doing her job. Anyway, he said, "so you've set up this really progessive system where everyone has support, professionally and emotionally...but you? Hmmm..." I just never thought I needed it before. Man, was I wrong!!

So I hear you. I'll probably need to hear it again and again. I just feel so responsible all the time.

 

Re: The last few days Ľ Crooked Heart

Posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 14:53:38

In reply to Re: The last few days (long) Ľ DaisyM, posted by Crooked Heart on February 6, 2004, at 6:20:17

I'm not good at the "self" part in self-care. I always feel like I need to "do" something for someone else...

So, I'm gonna quote you, OK? (Clears her throat, looks intently at the group of employees) "Ahem: My friend, Crooked Heart, says I don't have to do it ALL. So someone step up...anyone? anyone?"

I'm still waiting...

funny, but sad.

 

((Antigua))

Posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 15:13:31

In reply to Re: The last few days (very long) Daisy, posted by antigua on February 6, 2004, at 10:02:16

Thank you for your long post. It helps a lot. I worry sometimes that I'm making too big a deal out of all this but then I get whammied by the pain and think, OK, it IS a big deal. But I get what you mean about it seeming normal...I hear myself say, "but parents did things different back then."

And, it seems both you and Karen have read about the false memory theories. It really hits a nerve. I think one of the biggest fears is not being believed. Well, that and causing even MORE bad things to happen by telling...it is so complicated.

I'm glad you are making the progess you want using EMDR. It sounds really scary to me. The flashback was definately different than the "movie-type" memories I've had all along. And it was loaded with the real feelings of fear. Among other things. Yuck. It was hard to tell about the flashback because that was like telling about the real event -- does that make sense? Double the pain, in a sense. I've read a lot about Hypnosis therapy, which is suppose to recreate the feelings too. I can't see myself giving up that kind of control.

I will let you know how the writing goes. I've never written about this stuff before last night. And I was a writer by trade also right out of college. I know what you are trying to say about your writing. At least for me, my writing can turn into an extension of myself. Copywriting is different, someone pays me to say what they want. But my stuff...it is personal. I'm a little worried that writing is actual a form of dissociating for me, which I never actually thought of before. So writing about this stuff may trigger...we'll see.

And I'm glad you understand what I was trying to say about the look on my Therapist's face. I KNOW that he has heard worse. And I know he will take care of himself (OK, I'm trying to know that one). But I don't want my stuff to cause pain for him, or stress, or whatever. It is hard to put into words what I mean. I don't want what happen to me to define me in his eyes. Something like that.

So, I'm not unique in the cookie baking department. Too bad we can't figure a way to share them with Babblers. Sounds like Speaker could use a few. :)

Keep posting, OK? You don't know how much it helps.
-D

 

Re: The last few days Ľ Speaker

Posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 16:00:37

In reply to Re: The last few days Ľ DaisyM, posted by Speaker on February 6, 2004, at 9:29:32

but when you look back over it, does it have to feel like you are going through it again? Sometimes I wonder if this isn't just self-inflicted pain at this point...

 

Medications Ľ Dinah

Posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 16:14:03

In reply to Re: The last few days Ľ DaisyM, posted by Dinah on February 6, 2004, at 10:40:43

Dinah,
I've never talked to him about meds. I know alot about them, having researched them before we put my child on them.

I'm not against them at all. But I guess it isn't consistantly "so bad" that he thinks I need them. If the anxiety continues, or gets worse, I'll bring it up. Not sleeping stinks.

Just recently I had a check up with my gynocologist. She delivered all my kids so I've know her a long time plus we work together on/off as our fields cross a lot. So we are friends of sorts. She told me at my check up that she was "worried" about me - too much stress, looked terrible, etc. She thought I was "depressed" and offered me a prescription if I wanted it. I thanked her and declined. I told my Therapist, who was outraged that she could have offered a prescription without more information and without suggesting therapy in addition, etc. It was cute that he was so protective. :)

 

Re: The last few days (long)

Posted by pegasus on February 6, 2004, at 16:56:18

In reply to The last few days (long), posted by DaisyM on February 5, 2004, at 19:36:15

Daisy, I can't think of anything very helpful to say, but I want you to know that I'm so sorry for all of your pain over the last few days. And I think it sounds like your T is among the best I've heard about. I'm sure he'll be able to take whatever you need to give. I understand about the horrified fact thing. It's so hard to even think that your anchor may not be able to hold your stuff. But really, really, from everything you've said here about your T, I'm sure he's going to be up to the task of hearing your story, and that he can take care of himself.

- p

 

Re: Medications Ľ DaisyM

Posted by Dinah on February 6, 2004, at 19:38:16

In reply to Medications Ľ Dinah, posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 16:14:03

My therapist is a big believer in medications. Just today I called him with some incoherent message that included the disclosure that I was going to take a Klonopin and go to sleep for a while. He told me he didn't call me back till later because it sounded like a Klonopin and some sleep would do me some good. :)

 

(((Daisy))) You are so strong!

Posted by gardenergirl on February 6, 2004, at 21:05:48

In reply to Re: The last few days (long), posted by pegasus on February 6, 2004, at 16:56:18

Daisy,
I believe someone may have already said this but here goes...I think the look on your T's face is a natural reaction. It shows that your T is feeling for you; has empathy. It does NOT mean that there is anything wrong with you, and you did NOT inflict this look on him. I think someone already said this, too, but perhaps if you are not used to someone feeling your pain with you about this (i.e. no one did at the time) then it is offputting. But I'm glad your T appeared to feel your pain. He will be able to cope with it. I'm confident that he is skilled and professional enough to get what he needs from others if necessary. But you did NOT CAUSE this.

I, too am feeling for you. I can't begin to imagine what it must be like for you. I can only reflect back to you based on my own life experiences and feelings. You are so strong for moving forward. I'm so sorry that you are faced with such a painful experience. I pray that you are able to take care of yourself as well as you do others, and that you let others take care of you. That, too is a sign of wisdom and strength.

Thinking of you,

gg

 

Re: The last few days Ľ pegasus

Posted by DaisyM on February 7, 2004, at 0:33:52

In reply to Re: The last few days (long), posted by pegasus on February 6, 2004, at 16:56:18

Thanks. I need to keep hearing that. I can use all the support I can get. There is so much to read about "bad" therapy and burnt-out Therapist. How can we not worry?

That said, I think he is pretty great too. Lucky me! (Pushy sometimes, but...)

 

Re: (((Daisy))) You are so strong! Ľ gardenergirl

Posted by DaisyM on February 7, 2004, at 0:38:28

In reply to (((Daisy))) You are so strong!, posted by gardenergirl on February 6, 2004, at 21:05:48

I don't feel strong right now, but thanks. I've thought about what you said about discharging the emotions between sessions a lot lately. It helps me to think I'm not dumping so much stuff that it interferes with someone else's time. Maybe you are right, maybe I need someone to be horrified for me. Fallsfall said about the same thing. It is just hard to not feel like part of perpetuating the problem. I can't find a clearer way to put it.

Thanks for the support and prayers. I'll borrow your wisdom and strength for now, if you don't mind. I don't trust mine.

 

Re: The last few days (long) Ľ DaisyM

Posted by Fallen4myT on February 7, 2004, at 1:23:09

In reply to The last few days (long), posted by DaisyM on February 5, 2004, at 19:36:15

Daisy, my dx is PTSD I have flashbacks now and then not often and do dissociate. I do sometimes well, often do written things for my T more journaling FOR and TO him. I think we are people pleasers because of trauma. I was told about the false memory thing by my T just in case but it is not false memory. These T's are very strong with our burdens. I wonder if you fear your T will see you as your abuse/dx rather than as YOU as a person? I find the writing to be good it is hard at *first* because it makes it more real and less removed. For me when telling my story ANYONE I have told I smile and lol and they look horrified and feel badly for me not AT me like I am defective. Its cause they care and that is why your T looks like he does. Once when I was in a session I did something I never did before I TOTALLY flashbacked and dissociated and man this is hard to explain but I WAS THERE ..back when REALLY like there...no longer in my T's office I had to fight my way back and he knew something was up..thought I was maybe distracted he was kinda stunned I left the room as I did and then just as fast said this can and may happen and its ok tell me and it was cool. Your T will take special care NOT to ever leave you till your work is done now as this is major and critical stuff you are working on and it will help you get better. I am also often given books by my T to read so youre on the right track with a GOOD T who knows his stuff...lean on him he knows what he is doing and up those sessions. Also easy said but you have to work on learning to say no I did too and have more free time now...maybe too much but I have it. Its late I hope I am making sense...Hugs

 

Re: (((Daisy))) You are so strong! Ľ DaisyM

Posted by gardenergirl on February 7, 2004, at 13:04:05

In reply to Re: (((Daisy))) You are so strong! Ľ gardenergirl, posted by DaisyM on February 7, 2004, at 0:38:28

> > Thanks for the support and prayers. I'll borrow your wisdom and strength for now, if you don't mind. I don't trust mine.

You are welcome to mine if it will help you find your own again.

Take care,

gg

 

Re: The last few days Ľ DaisyM

Posted by noa on February 7, 2004, at 14:57:54

In reply to Re: The last few days Ľ Speaker, posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 16:00:37

I think it can be kind of like when a kid is watching a horror movie--can't look but can't look away.

What is hard to do, but so important, is to work on ways for you to feel like you have some control over the opening and closing of the portal to these memories and feelings. Sure, it's good for therapy, in the long run, to try to process how these affect you. But in the short run, if you expose yourself to them too quickly, you can get overwhelmed.

And I relate to the difficulty verbalizing. Some memories don't lend themselves to words very well because maybe they are early memories encoded emotionally, tactily, kinesthetically, visually? Or maybe the emotional experience is just too overwhelming that verbal logical parts of our brain aren't connected to them very well?

I think you are strong--perhaps in a place of strength now that some of this stuff could surface.

Best wishes.

 

Re: The last few days Ľ noa

Posted by rs on February 7, 2004, at 17:48:10

In reply to Re: The last few days Ľ DaisyM, posted by noa on February 7, 2004, at 14:57:54

Hi. This is my first time here so sorry if I make errors and let me know. Also english is not the best when it comes to writting.
I would like to tell you how sorry I am for you about the difficult time you are having. This is hard work and understand where you are. Please know that I care for you and how you are doing. Have read your posts.
Your T sounds wonderful and this makes the big difference. Do not worry about the false memory stuff.
I am working on much of this stuff in T and yes I am very fourtanate to have a understanding T.
Again thoughts are with you.

 

Re: The last few days , Ľ DaisyM

Posted by noa on February 7, 2004, at 21:27:18

In reply to Re: The last few days Ľ noa, posted by rs on February 7, 2004, at 17:48:10

rs's post, I think, was meant to be specified to Daisy, not me.

Posted by rs on February 7, 2004, at 17:48:10

In reply to Re: The last few days Ľ DaisyM, posted by noa on February 7, 2004, at 14:57:54

Hi. This is my first time here so sorry if I make errors and let me know. Also english is not the best when it comes to writting.
I would like to tell you how sorry I am for you about the difficult time you are having. This is hard work and understand where you are. Please know that I care for you and how you are doing. Have read your posts.
Your T sounds wonderful and this makes the big difference. Do not worry about the false memory stuff.
I am working on much of this stuff in T and yes I am very fourtanate to have a understanding T.
Again thoughts are with you.

 

I'll share! (nm) Ľ noa

Posted by DaisyM on February 7, 2004, at 23:57:39

In reply to Re: The last few days , Ľ DaisyM, posted by noa on February 7, 2004, at 21:27:18

 

Re: The last few days Ľ DaisyM

Posted by Crooked Heart on February 8, 2004, at 4:15:32

In reply to Re: The last few days Ľ Crooked Heart, posted by DaisyM on February 6, 2004, at 14:53:38

>
>
> I'm not good at the "self" part in self-care. I always feel like I need to "do" something for someone else...
>
> So, I'm gonna quote you, OK? (Clears her throat, looks intently at the group of employees) "Ahem: My friend, Crooked Heart, says I don't have to do it ALL. So someone step up...anyone? anyone?"
>
> I'm still waiting...
>
> funny, but sad.

Um, yes, I get the picture of people with sudden interest in their feet, remembering that they must urgently make appointment for the cat's 5-yearly manicure, etc...

How about... "Right, OK, failing that then, my friend Fallsfall says, could someone pop out and get me some cream of wheat?" Rush of relieved employees volunteering, thankful to keep intact perception of totally capable invulnerable boss:)

You'll be seeing your therapist tomorrow, is that right? Thinking of you. (((Daisy)))>

 

Re: I'll share!--LOL Ľ DaisyM

Posted by noa on February 8, 2004, at 9:28:29

In reply to I'll share! (nm) Ľ noa, posted by DaisyM on February 7, 2004, at 23:57:39

I just wanted to make sure you didn't miss it! : )


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