Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 1095906

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Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil

Posted by MightyKondrian on November 16, 2017, at 9:13:55

In reply to Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by MightyKondrian on November 16, 2017, at 8:06:01

I might just stay on 2mg for the time being. I feel great today, and it cant be a coincidence as I've knocked half the dose on the head!

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil

Posted by Christ_empowered on November 16, 2017, at 12:04:48

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by MightyKondrian on November 16, 2017, at 9:13:55

hi. clearly, you should do what works for you. I just...--hated-- my klonopin taper. I mean, it was hell on earth.

maybe since you're comfortable at 2mgs/klonopin, see about switching over to valium and maybe do a slow(er) taper off that? that's how some experts recommend doing benzodiazepine tapers. apparently, valium and Librium = easier, more comfortable tapers.

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil MightyKondrian

Posted by SLS on November 16, 2017, at 18:47:47

In reply to Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by MightyKondrian on November 16, 2017, at 8:06:01

Would your doctor go along with adding Lyrica (pregabalin) to Nardil (phenelzine) for anxiety?

Also, Lyrica might make it easier to discontinue Klonopin (clonazepam). That's just a guess, though. If you are having no luck getting off of benzodiazepines, you can find a few studies that found Trileptal (oxcarbazepine) effective to mitigate benzodiazepine withdrawal syndrome. Some people report having luck using Depakote (valproate).


- Scott

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil MightyKondrian

Posted by beckett2 on November 16, 2017, at 22:29:48

In reply to Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by MightyKondrian on November 16, 2017, at 8:06:01

I agree with you on the affect of klonopin on mood. Xanax brightened my mood; however it's wickedly addictive. Maybe someone can check me here, but I understand xanax to be more difficult than klonopin to withdraw from, even factoring in the difference in half life between the two. So a word of caution here. That said, klonopon was a depressant, and being BPll, I can't handle anything like that.

The hospital used phenobarbital when I withdrew from xanax. So, there's that :)

Stopping that much klonopin-- did I understand your post correctly, that you had no side effects other than anxiety?

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil Christ_empowered

Posted by MightyKondrian on November 16, 2017, at 23:22:47

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by Christ_empowered on November 16, 2017, at 12:04:48

>apparently, valium and Librium = easier, more comfortable tapers.
>
Librium (chlordiazepoxide) makes total sense, its what they usually use for alcohol withdrawal. I should know ;)
Pretty sure its also a direct metabolite of Vallium too. Interesting!

MightyKondrian

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil SLS

Posted by MightyKondrian on November 16, 2017, at 23:36:31

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil MightyKondrian, posted by SLS on November 16, 2017, at 18:47:47

> Would your doctor go along with adding Lyrica (pregabalin) to Nardil (phenelzine) for anxiety?
>
> Also, Lyrica might make it easier to discontinue Klonopin (clonazepam). That's just a guess, though. If you are having no luck getting off of benzodiazepines, you can find a few studies that found Trileptal (oxcarbazepine) effective to mitigate benzodiazepine withdrawal syndrome. Some people report having luck using Depakote (valproate).
>
>
> - Scott

Thanks Scott! Not tried the last 2. I've used both gabapentin & pregabalin for anxiety without luck. But its interesting that they might help me to come off Klonopin, if I so choose.

I think that I might just hold on at 2mg Klonopin tho. Of the benzos I've tried (most of them, short and long term) Klonopin just kicks A** for SA! Just that i personally know 2 fellow SA suffers who both went on to Klonopin and it changed them completely, only to need an anti depressant to enable them to carry on with the Klonopin! Such is life...

MightyKondrian

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil

Posted by MightyKondrian on November 16, 2017, at 23:40:44

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil MightyKondrian, posted by beckett2 on November 16, 2017, at 22:29:48

> Stopping that much klonopin-- did I understand your post correctly, that you had no side effects other than anxiety?

Yes. Made sense as Nardil increases GABA. And my doc at the time wasn't worried at all. And he knows his stuff. Just sayin ;)

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil

Posted by rjlockhart37 on November 18, 2017, at 22:10:15

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil SLS, posted by MightyKondrian on November 16, 2017, at 23:36:31

there's a also a off label med that's called Gabatril, which is a GABA rep take inhibitor, but still it could not be the best, I've read side effects on it

clonzaepam is good for anxiety, its strong, but for reason it made me depressed, i switched to lorazepam in 2005, lorazepam just made me just calm, it didn't really have other effects, general benzo for anxiety

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil rjlockhart37

Posted by MightyKondrian on November 19, 2017, at 12:08:33

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by rjlockhart37 on November 18, 2017, at 22:10:15

> there's a also a off label med that's called Gabatril, which is a GABA rep take inhibitor, but still it could not be the best, I've read side effects on it
>
Ah yes, the third GABA drug that dont work on GABA! lol but you say this ones a GABA re-uptake inhibitor?? Yep you are correct, had to check. Never realized a GABA re-uptake inhibitor existed. Extremely interesting! Know if its available in the UK?
I just wander why it isn't a first line med for anxiety...?

Another for my not-yet-used arsenal :) Thanks

MightyKondrian

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil

Posted by rjlockhart37 on November 19, 2017, at 22:45:02

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil rjlockhart37, posted by MightyKondrian on November 19, 2017, at 12:08:33

it's mainly a siezure medication, but it can be used off label, i was reseraeching about it long time ago, it seems like a good alternative, but i read some of it's side effects, some of them are not good, but .... it all just depends on the person's reaction

it increases GABA to prevent siezure activity, similar to depakote and phenobarbital (used in siezure conditions) but it's not a depressant or sedative

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil

Posted by Christ_empowered on November 20, 2017, at 16:29:49

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by rjlockhart37 on November 19, 2017, at 22:45:02

I knew someone on gabitril, "off-label," for agitation and anxiety w/ Bipolar I as the main diagnosis. I don't know if it worked that well. She was forever swiping my Neurontin and Klonopin, lol, so...maybe not?

I'd just be scared to taper off a bzd too quickly. --not-- fun. when I had my taper from Hell, I ended up on Midrin for migraines. ugh. clearly, I'll never get on Mother's Little Helpers long term again, lol.

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil Christ_empowered

Posted by MightyKondrian on November 20, 2017, at 17:11:48

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by Christ_empowered on November 20, 2017, at 16:29:49

> I'd just be scared to taper off a bzd too quickly. --not-- fun. when I had my taper from Hell, I ended up on Midrin for migraines. ugh. clearly, I'll never get on Mother's Little Helpers long term again, lol.

Dont blame you.

Ive NEVER found klonopin addictive tho. Even when i stopped in the past it was anxiety that took me back, never craving. In fact I have NEVER craved klonopin.

Before, my doc obviously knew that nardil would help me stop. No side effects at all, just return of anxiety.
In my case, its obvious I think that klonopin was/is stunting my response to the antidepressants, esp nardil. Soon as I lower the dose I suddenly feel the Nardil and I've been on nardil almost a year now

Ive done my fare share of drugs, hard and pharms. I'm (thankfully) pretty robust against against withdrawals. And I've been taken off ALL meds + heavy alcohol use before, all at once. In hospital. Should have sued them bast*rds. All I remember Is it would have been the most powerfull LSD trip, had I taken it. But was worse as I hadn't taken it.

Mighty-Lucky!

 

Back to basics?

Posted by MightyKondrian on November 28, 2017, at 17:03:27

In reply to Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by MightyKondrian on November 16, 2017, at 8:06:01

One idea is growing. Parnate (Tranylcypromine) has been on my mind today. A year on Nardil answered my question- will is work again? Clearly not. I hate being on so many meds.
I dont know my chances but as I will have to wash out from Nardil I will request 2 weeks on a psych ward, for my own safety. The hospital my psych works at has very good wards, renowned as some of the best in the country.

Anyways, there ya go.

Not-so-'Mighty'Kondrian

 

Re: Back to basics? MightyKondrian

Posted by SLS on November 28, 2017, at 18:23:56

In reply to Back to basics?, posted by MightyKondrian on November 28, 2017, at 17:03:27

> One idea is growing. Parnate (Tranylcypromine) has been on my mind today.

> A year on Nardil answered my question- will is work again? Clearly not.

In my estimation, Parnate is less apt to "poop-out" than is Nardil, and does not become dramatically less effective with subsequent exposures.

> I hate being on so many meds.

Yeah. Me, too - especially when they don't produce a robust improvement. I'll take what I can get, though. It takes 6 medications for me to feel partially improved. I would consider drinking elephant piss t.i.d. if I were to achieve remission by doing so.

> I dont know my chances but as I will have to wash out from Nardil I will request 2 weeks on a psych ward, for my own safety. The hospital my psych works at has very good wards, renowned as some of the best in the country.
>
> Anyways, there ya go.
>
> Not-so-'Mighty'Kondrian

You still seem pretty mighty to me. It takes a positive and constructive attitude and great effort to accomplish what you have. You are fortunate to be blessed with resilience.


- Scott

 

Thanx! (nm) SLS

Posted by MightyKondrian on November 28, 2017, at 18:28:01

In reply to Re: Back to basics? MightyKondrian, posted by SLS on November 28, 2017, at 18:23:56

 

Re: Back to basics?

Posted by Lamdage22 on December 1, 2017, at 12:27:07

In reply to Re: Back to basics? MightyKondrian, posted by SLS on November 28, 2017, at 18:23:56

>I would consider drinking elephant piss t.i.d. if I were to achieve remission by doing so.

And you are so sure that your illness is biological. May i ask why?

 

Re: Back to basics?

Posted by Lamdage22 on December 1, 2017, at 12:27:36

In reply to Re: Back to basics?, posted by Lamdage22 on December 1, 2017, at 12:27:07

Im sorry. I meant your "illness".

 

Re: Back to basics? Lamdage22

Posted by MightyKondrian on December 1, 2017, at 17:38:35

In reply to Re: Back to basics?, posted by Lamdage22 on December 1, 2017, at 12:27:07

> >I would consider drinking elephant piss t.i.d. if I were to achieve remission by doing so.
>
> And you are so sure that your illness is biological. May i ask why?

Who is that question aimed at? Its a pretty rude comment to whoever you are referring to.

 

Re: Back to basics?

Posted by Lamdage22 on December 3, 2017, at 5:20:53

In reply to Re: Back to basics? Lamdage22, posted by MightyKondrian on December 1, 2017, at 17:38:35

> > >I would consider drinking elephant piss t.i.d. if I were to achieve remission by doing so.
> >
> > And you are so sure that your illness is biological. May i ask why?
>
> Who is that question aimed at? Its a pretty rude comment to whoever you are referring to.

I was referring to SLS Scott. Rude? Why? I wasnt saying that it is his fault... I couldnt because i dont know. I must admit it is extremely hard to find the right therapist (or clinic) but it is worth it. Just my 2 cents. I didnt mean to be rude.

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil

Posted by MightyKondrian on December 5, 2017, at 13:47:22

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by Christ_empowered on November 16, 2017, at 12:04:48

> hi. clearly, you should do what works for you. I just...--hated-- my klonopin taper. I mean, it was hell on earth.
>
> maybe since you're comfortable at 2mgs/klonopin, see about switching over to valium and maybe do a slow(er) taper off that? that's how some experts recommend doing benzodiazepine tapers. apparently, valium and Librium = easier, more comfortable tapers.
>
>
I've had 2 alcohol detox's using Librium each time. It is indeed lighter. Unfortunately it has a very short therapeutic range and they both wear off too quickly (for me). Valium is said to have a half life similar too clonazepam but maybe. Well any Benzo seems to help SA but if its long term you need the longer halflife types. Fox example Idealy I'd like to try Klonopin with Xanax prn.
one way to kick a benzo maybe this: lets say ur on 3mg/day. Drop to 2mg. When (or if) anxiety returns go back up to 2.5
Then, after the anxiety subsides drop to 1.5mg.
If anxiety increases again go back up to 2mg. And on, and on, ...
So every time you increase again you are still decreasing overall. Take the time I need.

BTW, if you look at my signature, which meds will I have to stop during the detox? I'd like to keep aririprazole. Add Haloperidol during by hospital stay/home detox. I dont like it much but its a great calmer at least too start with.

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil MightyKondrian

Posted by SLS on December 5, 2017, at 15:04:28

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by MightyKondrian on December 5, 2017, at 13:47:22

Oxcarbazepine?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18821451

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16189750


- Scott

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil

Posted by MightyKondrian on December 5, 2017, at 15:39:20

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil MightyKondrian, posted by SLS on December 5, 2017, at 15:04:28

> Oxcarbazepine?
>
> https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18821451
>
> https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16189750
>
>
> - Scott

Problem with new meds docs & even psyches aren't keen on using them. how old is it? I know of another herbal choice for withdrawal. I haven't used herbs for a while, not for mental health anyway. I will definitely mention the Oxcarcbazepine to my doc.
Heres a book which shows step by step using a herbal concoction of Valerian & Kava Kava.
Author: Patrick Holford
Title: The Feel Good Factor.
Lost my copy must get another

https://www.holfordirect.com//the-feel-good-factor-patrick-holford.html

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil

Posted by MightyKondrian on December 5, 2017, at 15:52:15

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by MightyKondrian on December 5, 2017, at 15:39:20

Just purchased the book from eBay for 2.35, Amazon charges over a tenner! Pre owned!
Hope its the right book! He has written so many!
When it arrives I will scan the relevant pages and post a free link from my Gmail drive.

MightyKondrian

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil MightyKondrian

Posted by MightyKondrian on December 5, 2017, at 16:16:05

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil, posted by MightyKondrian on December 5, 2017, at 15:52:15

> Just purchased the book from eBay for 2.35, Amazon charges over a tenner! Pre owned!
> Hope its the right book! He has written so many!
> When it arrives I will scan the relevant pages and post a free link from my Gmail drive.
>
> MightyKondrian

https://www.patrickholford.com/advice/how2quit-sleeping-pills-benzodiazepines

 

Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil

Posted by MightyKondrian on December 5, 2017, at 16:28:06

In reply to Re: Reducing/stopping Klonopin while on Nardil MightyKondrian, posted by MightyKondrian on December 5, 2017, at 16:16:05

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1FrRuZ06CXp_qm-9qXSGLh6xeis8p5_LU/view?usp=sharing


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