Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 1093230

Shown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.

 

Why an SNRI for anxiety?

Posted by Prefect on November 23, 2016, at 18:35:45

A little confused, my doctor offered to switch me from Luvox to Pristiq to improve my anxiety, so I looked it up. Wouldn't something that increases norepinephrine in your brain make anxiety worse?

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?

Posted by rjlockhart37 on November 23, 2016, at 19:39:42

In reply to Why an SNRI for anxiety?, posted by Prefect on November 23, 2016, at 18:35:45

effexor is the best, yet i don't understand that either, because too much norepinephrine can cause anxiety, maybe it's certain sections of the brain, either serotonin and NE are low and cause anxiety as result....

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? rjlockhart37

Posted by Prefect on November 23, 2016, at 20:14:34

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?, posted by rjlockhart37 on November 23, 2016, at 19:39:42

You mean you've tried Effexor for anxiety with good results?

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?

Posted by linkadge on November 23, 2016, at 20:34:14

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? rjlockhart37, posted by Prefect on November 23, 2016, at 20:14:34

Pristiq and Effexor mainly affect serotonin.

Effexor (for me) is very good for anxiety, especially in lower doses.

Effexor has some significant anti-inflammatory effects, which may be behind its improvement in mood and anxiety. In addition, raising serotonin and norepinephrine can antagonize acetylcholine. Acetylcholine excess can cause anxiety.


Norepinephrine can cause anxiety (when released excessively), but it can also help initiate adaptive responses to stress (i.e. reducing avoidance behavior, and possibly improving cognitive engagement).

Linkadge


 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? Prefect

Posted by rjlockhart37 on November 24, 2016, at 0:46:56

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? rjlockhart37, posted by Prefect on November 23, 2016, at 20:14:34

no i'm on prozac and been on it a long time, but through babble, and reading sources on the net......venlafaxine has a superior profile compared with other SSRI's but it also has worst withdrawl, but it's good and is used for anxiety sometimes, that's one of it's indications to treat - anxiety

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? linkadge

Posted by Prefect on November 27, 2016, at 18:23:25

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?, posted by linkadge on November 23, 2016, at 20:34:14

Very interesting response at so many levels. Lately I've been really curious about the effect of inflammation on mitochondrial function of brain cells. Linkage, would you happen to know any natural supplements that would have the same type of anti-inflammatory effect on brain cells that you mentioned?

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?

Posted by linkadge on November 28, 2016, at 20:14:47

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? linkadge, posted by Prefect on November 27, 2016, at 18:23:25

>Very interesting response at so many levels. >Lately I've been really curious about the effect >of inflammation on mitochondrial function of >brain cells. Linkage, would you happen to know >any natural supplements that would have the same >type of anti-inflammatory effect on brain cells >that you mentioned?

Yes. The best I know of is ginger root. It is in the same family as turmeric, which have significant anti-inflammatory, antidepressant and neuroprotective effects. Ginger root also affects serotonin receptors (5-ht1a agonist and 5-ht3 antagonist) is a calcium channel antagonist, and may have some MAOI activity.

Lithium orotate might also be useful for mitochondrial neuroprotection. Others include, melatonin, omega-3, zinc and possibly green tea.


Hope this helps.

Linkadge


 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?

Posted by linkadge on November 28, 2016, at 20:15:34

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? linkadge, posted by Prefect on November 27, 2016, at 18:23:25

BTW, ginger root goes very well with Effexor. It seems to significantly augment low doses.

Linkadge

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? linkadge

Posted by Prefect on November 29, 2016, at 6:43:37

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?, posted by linkadge on November 28, 2016, at 20:15:34

It's interesting you mentioned ginger root, because lately I've been researching Golden Milk, a turmeric tea they make in India which apparently raises the circumin content from turmeric, but it was a shot in the dark (I haven't made any yet) because I wasn't sure circumin is neuro protective or not, just knew it was anti-inflammatory.

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? linkadge

Posted by Prefect on November 29, 2016, at 6:55:38

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?, posted by linkadge on November 28, 2016, at 20:15:34

hmm. Your posts keep making me more curious about Effexor, because the 100 mg of Luvox I take don't seem to be doing all that much for my anxiety. My biggest concern about Effexor is I keep reading it increases Sleep Apnea (has it for you?), and lately I've been suspecting Sleep Apnea as a source of my mental illness (currently going through sleep study).

It's taken me a long time to come to this suspicion because I'm thin, fit, and don't wake up gasping for air. But I've been told I snore a lot, I wake up a million times a night, and some mornings I wake up from deep sleep seeing grey spots and feeling like I just came out of a coma, and have brain fog which clears up a little after lunch. This is why I'm curious about SNRIs because I'm wondering if increased Norepinepherine will reduce upper airway relaxation during sleep.

As for ginger root, you basically consume it daily? In what form?

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?

Posted by linkadge on December 2, 2016, at 16:27:56

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? linkadge, posted by Prefect on November 29, 2016, at 6:55:38

Effexor alone does cause some sleep disruption (for me). I too am thin and fit, but have had frequent sleep problems. Mind you, all antidepressants (except perhaps amitriptyline and mirtazapine) have caused sleep disruption for me. Amitriptyline is also an SNRI (much more potent on norepinephrine than Effexor). I don't get the sleep disruption on amitriptyline, perhaps because of its antihistamine / 5-ht2 antagonism. Actually, I get less sleep disruption on Effexor than I did on citalopram.

Effexor is mostly an SSRI in low doses. However, in my opinion it feels much different from an SSRI even in low doses, which (to me) suggests there are additional targets of Effexor that don't show up on paper. According to pubmed articles, it appears to have some significant effect on inflammation and the immune system.

By keeping the dose of Effexor low, and taking mirtazapine, when needed, I have minimized sleep disruption.

I take other supplements (magnesium and niacin) which help sleep.

As far as ginger root, I drink it in tea form. I get organic ginger root tea bags. I get more effect if I let them steep. Usually, I take this 3-4 times a week; more so, if I am under more stress. I have also taken it in capsule form, which works.


Linkadge


 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?

Posted by Tony P on January 4, 2017, at 23:30:49

In reply to Why an SNRI for anxiety?, posted by Prefect on November 23, 2016, at 18:35:45

I've often wondered this myself. In my experience, Effexor gave me intolerable anxiety, but Cymbalta (supposedly much more NRI) was cool and helped my social anxiety and agoraphobia. YMMV.

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?

Posted by SLS on January 5, 2017, at 9:34:20

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?, posted by Tony P on January 4, 2017, at 23:30:49

> I've often wondered this myself. In my experience, Effexor gave me intolerable anxiety, but Cymbalta (supposedly much more NRI) was cool and helped my social anxiety and agoraphobia. YMMV.

Paxil, a SSRI, might be even better for anxiety disorders than SNRIs. I wouldn't make it a first choice, though. The side effects are problematic.


- Scott

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? SLS

Posted by Tony P on August 2, 2017, at 1:21:51

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?, posted by SLS on January 5, 2017, at 9:34:20

I've had the exact same experience with Effexor vs Cymbalta -- Effexor drove me wild with anxiety, Cymbalta was effective and almost side-effect free. Unfortunately my govt. drug plan does not support Cymbalta, and I can't afford it, so I'm now on a combo of Escitalopram 20 mg/day (Lexapro, Cipralex) and a fairly low dose of bupropion (Welbutrin), 75 mg/day.

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? Tony P

Posted by SLS on August 2, 2017, at 6:00:08

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? SLS, posted by Tony P on August 2, 2017, at 1:21:51

> I've had the exact same experience with Effexor vs Cymbalta -- Effexor drove me wild with anxiety, Cymbalta was effective and almost side-effect free. Unfortunately my govt. drug plan does not support Cymbalta, and I can't afford it, so I'm now on a combo of Escitalopram 20 mg/day (Lexapro, Cipralex) and a fairly low dose of bupropion (Welbutrin), 75 mg/day.

How well do you feel with your current treatment?


- Scott

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? SLS

Posted by Tony P on August 2, 2017, at 14:16:07

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? Tony P, posted by SLS on August 2, 2017, at 6:00:08

> > I've had the exact same experience with Effexor vs Cymbalta -- Effexor drove me wild with anxiety, Cymbalta was effective and almost side-effect free. Unfortunately my govt. drug plan does not support Cymbalta, and I can't afford it, so I'm now on a combo of Escitalopram 20 mg/day (Lexapro, Cipralex) and a fairly low dose of bupropion (Welbutrin), 75 mg/day.
>
> How well do you feel with your current treatment?
>
>
> - Scott

So-so. I've been discharged as a psychiatric patient (triage) and have a new, young GP. She is very insistent on only changing one med at a time, & due to pressure from the CMA right now that med is the diazepine. I agree with her in principle, but meanwhile, I suspect my escitalopram is pooping out -- I've had one major depr. episode recently, although masked with Kava-kava (great stuff) there was no mistaking that psychic pain that furrows my eyebrows and makes me feel weepy & hopeless.

I am angry that the BC Government Pharmacare committee apparently base their financial support for particular meds on gross percentages in the meta-literature and not on individual needs and doctors' expertise (my pdoc's request for an exception for Cymbalta was turned down twice).

Day-to-day, though, I am doing pretty well. I suspect a lot of the behaviours I am having trouble changing (& the feelings that go with them) are due to the HABIT of depression.

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?

Posted by SLS on August 2, 2017, at 16:34:21

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? SLS, posted by Tony P on August 2, 2017, at 14:16:07

> > > I've had the exact same experience with Effexor vs Cymbalta -- Effexor drove me wild with anxiety, Cymbalta was effective and almost side-effect free. Unfortunately my govt. drug plan does not support Cymbalta, and I can't afford it, so I'm now on a combo of Escitalopram 20 mg/day (Lexapro, Cipralex) and a fairly low dose of bupropion (Welbutrin), 75 mg/day.
> >
> > How well do you feel with your current treatment?
> >
> >
> > - Scott
>
> So-so. I've been discharged as a psychiatric patient (triage) and have a new, young GP. She is very insistent on only changing one med at a time, & due to pressure from the CMA right now that med is the diazepine. I agree with her in principle, but meanwhile, I suspect my escitalopram is pooping out -- I've had one major depr. episode recently, although masked with Kava-kava (great stuff) there was no mistaking that psychic pain that furrows my eyebrows and makes me feel weepy & hopeless.
>
> I am angry that the BC Government Pharmacare committee apparently base their financial support for particular meds on gross percentages in the meta-literature and not on individual needs and doctors' expertise (my pdoc's request for an exception for Cymbalta was turned down twice).
>
> Day-to-day, though, I am doing pretty well. I suspect a lot of the behaviours I am having trouble changing (& the feelings that go with them) are due to the HABIT of depression.

I had a thought. Paxil is probably the best of the SSRIs for treating anxiety disorders. Unfortunately, it is the SSRI most apt to produce sexual side effects and weight gain. As for Cymbalta and depression, you might have luck combining a SSRI with nortriptyline. Wellbutrin was a good choice, though. I'm wondering how you react to Zoloft.


- Scott

 

Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety? SLS

Posted by Tony P on August 3, 2017, at 0:20:34

In reply to Re: Why an SNRI for anxiety?, posted by SLS on August 2, 2017, at 16:34:21

I reacted badly to Paxil - the first A/D I ever tried: sweats, shakes. I've avoided Prozac & Zoloft partly based on that experience & partly based on my ex-wife's: She called Prozac the "mad" drug (like permanent PMS), Zoloft the "sad" drug, and Paxil finally worked for her, to the point that she has not needed it for some years now (maybe since we separated? ;-)

Serzone was my initial salvation, Lexapro is the only SSRI I've tolerated well, but none of the SSRI's and SNRIs deal adequately with my GAD, Buspar helped (esp. w/Serzone) in reducing stress-triggered depression, but it didn't seem to work with Cymbalta, so I dropped it. May be time for a fresh look.


This is the end of the thread.


Show another thread

URL of post in thread:


Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ


[dr. bob] Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD, bob@dr-bob.org

Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.