![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 24 of 24. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by willyee on April 4, 2007, at 19:09:50
I havent posted here as much latly,as much as i used to,or even would like to.
I took a step back recently and asked myself a few questions,id love some input,this post will probuably need to be re-directed but again i only post here so id like for the people i know to see it at least.
Here is my thinking,anyone who steps back,or can look at this site from a third party perspective should be in absolute jaw dropping AWE.
It is a grave yard of suffering,of people almost locked in a vault,left to suffer among themselves.
What do i mean by this? Well Dr.Bob puts his name on the site,also im willing to bet my soul that regardless of the type of man he is,he still has a purpose for the site,...i.e creditiantals,resume,in a class,etc,something,in some way this wite benifits him,it would anyone owning it,just because were not told of it does not mean he isnt.It is unlikly a person would run a domain,a very time taking process,for no gain,even if so,its likly the domain would eventualy go down as a person would not keep up with such a demanding task for no gain.
Do i wanna know the gain,finicial or other,no,none of my buisness.What i do want to know is how anyone ,especialy one in the medical field can overlook such a site,see such a impact of suffering,see how much work is needed in the field,see how far off we are and how many people are suffering,and simply not do anything with it.Here you have personal accounts daily of horrid suffering,and you at best come to moderate?
Dr.Bob are you doing anything with our personal horror stories?
Speaking to a friend i posed this suggestion,and scenerio,...Dr Bob how does the idea of a weekly or monthly bullentin sound,one where it can inform us of what you might be doing,or even attempting to do "FOR US" with our posts.
I like to hope we have both current and archived enough horror stories to make some fat cats jaw drop,and take note,please dr bob your in the high postision to at least try.
Posted by TheMeanReds on April 4, 2007, at 19:24:36
In reply to My concern about this site, posted by willyee on April 4, 2007, at 19:09:50
Dr. Bob is human. He cannot escape from his own ID. Im sure this site is used for purposes we do not know about. That is his ID.
Posted by football on April 4, 2007, at 19:34:02
In reply to My concern about this site, posted by willyee on April 4, 2007, at 19:09:50
Yeah, it would be nice if he could occasionally post, but he's probably a very busy man.
Have you ever been over to the WebMD message board?
Each board there has a professional expert who posts and provides support/advice very often.If you're interested...
Here's the link to the depression board...
http://boards.webmd.com/webx?50@@.5987f418and here's the link to the anxiety board...
http://boards.webmd.com/webx?50@@.5987f401
Posted by elanor roosevelt on April 4, 2007, at 20:03:43
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by football on April 4, 2007, at 19:34:02
Off course this board serves a purpose for Dr. Bob. I believe he has an intro.
If you feel this place is like a graveyard then it is not the site for you. There are many other sites out there and so very many doctors to answer questions.
If you look carefully here you wil notice that this is not a site visited by people who have much faith in the doctors they visit. Pdocs don't know much, the pharma companies fund the research and fund the PR and that's where the doctors get their info.
I come to this site because I need information about meds that my doctor does not have. I need information from my fellow guinea pigs.
Posted by flmm on April 4, 2007, at 21:01:59
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by elanor roosevelt on April 4, 2007, at 20:03:43
I feel like this site is just a place where people complain that drugs do not help them! I often wonder why they don't figure out the answer to anxiety and depression is not here. Only ideas on places to start..............
Posted by greywolf on April 4, 2007, at 21:52:15
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by flmm on April 4, 2007, at 21:01:59
I have "stepped back" from PB several times. In fact, I just returned to posting after taking a couple of months off.
"Graveyard of suffering" is an awfully strong term that I, personally, do not think characterizes this site fairly. Sure, there are people here who are in pain, but that's hardly surprising given the orientation of the site.
You know what I see when I "step back" and look at Dr. Bob's site? A community where an unusually large number of good-hearted people extend kindness and encouragement to others who may be unhappy, afraid, or even seriously ill. A place where people can "figure things out" when their doctors or therapists don't have the time or inclination to explain it all during the short time allotted.
When I step back and look, I see a Faith board with provocative and interesting exchanges. A Self-Esteem board where there's plenty of encouragement being offered. A Social board where there's an abundance of good humor (and an Administration board where this thread is probably headed ;)
I prefer to think of this as one of the few places where people who are suffering in an unusually private way can go for hope.
Greywolf
Posted by notfred on April 4, 2007, at 22:10:51
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by greywolf on April 4, 2007, at 21:52:15
It is troubling when a person is doing OK on their meds, then reads alot of antimed posts or just posts about people not doing well on meds and then they freak out.
On sites where the moderator is just a average joe, posters do not expect/treat/demand what I see happening to Dr Bob. Given that he makes it very clear he is just the moderator here people should not expect him to to be anything but that.
However, people are people, and this makes a good argument that docs should not be moderators of sites like this. Several medical ethics experts have made this point. Also see "duty of care".
Posted by willyee on April 4, 2007, at 23:51:35
In reply to My concern about this site, posted by willyee on April 4, 2007, at 19:09:50
> I havent posted here as much latly,as much as i used to,or even would like to.
>
> I took a step back recently and asked myself a few questions,id love some input,this post will probuably need to be re-directed but again i only post here so id like for the people i know to see it at least.
>
> Here is my thinking,anyone who steps back,or can look at this site from a third party perspective should be in absolute jaw dropping AWE.
>
> It is a grave yard of suffering,of people almost locked in a vault,left to suffer among themselves.
>
> What do i mean by this? Well Dr.Bob puts his name on the site,also im willing to bet my soul that regardless of the type of man he is,he still has a purpose for the site,...i.e creditiantals,resume,in a class,etc,something,in some way this wite benifits him,it would anyone owning it,just because were not told of it does not mean he isnt.It is unlikly a person would run a domain,a very time taking process,for no gain,even if so,its likly the domain would eventualy go down as a person would not keep up with such a demanding task for no gain.
>
>
> Do i wanna know the gain,finicial or other,no,none of my buisness.What i do want to know is how anyone ,especialy one in the medical field can overlook such a site,see such a impact of suffering,see how much work is needed in the field,see how far off we are and how many people are suffering,and simply not do anything with it.Here you have personal accounts daily of horrid suffering,and you at best come to moderate?
>
>
> Dr.Bob are you doing anything with our personal horror stories?
>
>
> Speaking to a friend i posed this suggestion,and scenerio,...
>
> Dr Bob how does the idea of a weekly or monthly bullentin sound,one where it can inform us of what you might be doing,or even attempting to do "FOR US" with our posts.
>
> I like to hope we have both current and archived enough horror stories to make some fat cats jaw drop,and take note,please dr bob your in the high postision to at least try.
>
>
>Look this defense mechanism is out of control,cant anyone here speak there damn opinion without people defending or acting as if they need to.
Im sorry my graveyard comment stuck people the wrong way,it was not my intent,and i understand the concept of this board,brklyn23 if u google is i am not a stragner to groups and boards.
The only point i was making was there are a lot of information here that can be useful in trying to bring us a step further,all these negative accounts,and yess i know they all arent,but the many including mine can be used for a deeper purpose,this is my belief.
There is such an abundant documantion here on how current meds and the industry as a whole is failing many people,and im not talking about other sites,im speaking of this one,and why i believe the again abundant amount of info couldent be useful.
My god i come back to read people jumping out of there skin,google brklyn23,im not a stranger to posting,and i dont understand why it seems at times a poster just speaks his mind in general and he is spoken down to,there is no need to defend urself i wasnt aiming nothing at no one,the graveyard comment was a metaphor,i post my downs here too,im not exlcuding myself,man im truly disapointed to come back and see basicaly the same responses,this isnt the board for me?Why because i have an opinion,god how do u think that makes me feel for someone to say that to me simply because im sharing my opinion,yeah ship me off to a different board,god i dont know why i do post here.
Posted by KayeBaby on April 5, 2007, at 1:28:08
In reply to My concern about this site, posted by willyee on April 4, 2007, at 19:09:50
I am taken aback by your perspective.
When I signed up here I remeber that I had to agree to allow any of my posts here to be re-printed or used by Dr. Bob. In return I get to use a well organized message board where I can meet people that have similar issues, where we can learn from each other.
I am not a therapy type person and this board serves me well. I do not feel so alone when I see people struggling the same way as I am. I gain hope reading of others' success.
I lurked for a long time before I ever posted and I have remarked often that this board is the cleanest run, with the kindest, most intelligent and helpful people out of all the various boards I visit. This is a board for people with mental illnesses!! This is the sanest spot on the net!
Why do you care what Dr. Bob does? I think the development of this place has helped more people that he ever could have in any practice. It seems as if he keeps himself out of sight by design. He wants to let this experiment run, without impediment. Seems like he is making sure that it is not about him.
I have seen so many places that degenerate into chaos and bickering. Due to the strict rules about flaming etc. we can keep on track and really address the important things.
What do you want this man to do? Why does it matter what he gets out of this? I do not feel exploited, disrespected or used.
Am I missing something? Becuase, from his rare interactions with people that I have seen I can read nothing more of him than what I listed above.
He could be a robot for all I know.
All of you on the other hand seem very real to me and I am personally greatful for the person who provides us this place, whatever his reason.
Peace,
Kaye
Posted by bulldog2 on April 5, 2007, at 8:11:09
In reply to Re: My concern about this site » willyee, posted by KayeBaby on April 5, 2007, at 1:28:08
It seems like the tone of the site has changed in recent years.I rememember the days when scott and andrewb exchanged great info on their drug trials and their knowledge on the workings of the brain and the effects on meds on that process.
While some of that still happens their is more and more venting about worthless p-docs and worthless meds. That has to be discouraging to new people who come here for med info. We should look to Scott as one who has perservered through a severe illness and is making progress on meds.I noticed he has decided not to participate in Babble right now. I wonder if all the med bashing is influencing his decision.We have to work with the meds that are available. I don't think it's a plot to give us substandard meds.The pharama companies are working on new psychotropic meds all the time.
I'm not saying we all have to take meds but I thought the original design of this board was to have a place for people to come for med info.I personally think it's selfish for someone to start threads on the worthless meds and p-docs when things may not be working out for them. Do you realize how demoralizing and damaging that could be for someone just starting on a course of therapy and meds and having some hope. Why take away their hope.
If one does not believe in meds Dr. Bob has other boards that may be a better place to look for info.I'm sorry for anyone's suffering but it's not fair to take other people's hope's away by posting threads about MEDS DONT'T WORK and P-DOCS are horrible.I to will probably stop posting and just drop by now and than to see if there is some useful info. Right now I find all the ranting and negativity just confuses my situation. I think one has to find a p-doc they trust and stay the course. I think to many conflicting opinions makes it really difficult to determine and stay the course. Learn to trust your own judgement. Why have to ask other people what to do. What makes you think their judgement is of more value than yours.
Posted by willyee on April 5, 2007, at 9:39:45
In reply to Re: My concern about this site » willyee, posted by KayeBaby on April 5, 2007, at 1:28:08
> I am taken aback by your perspective.
>Shouldent be,its a perspective is all,nothing more,dont see why it brings on such fury,like to think perspectives are allowed.
> When I signed up here I remeber that I had to agree to allow any of my posts here to be re-printed or used by Dr. Bob. In return I get to use a well organized message board where I can meet people that have similar issues, where we can learn from each other.
>
> I am not a therapy type person and this board serves me well. I do not feel so alone when I see people struggling the same way as I am. I gain hope reading of others' success.
>
> I lurked for a long time before I ever posted and I have remarked often that this board is the cleanest run, with the kindest, most intelligent and helpful people out of all the various boards I visit. This is a board for people with mental illnesses!! This is the sanest spot on the net!
>
> Why do you care what Dr. Bob does? I think the development of this place has helped more people that he ever could have in any practice. It seems as if he keeps himself out of sight by design. He wants to let this experiment run, without impediment. Seems like he is making sure that it is not about him.
>
> I have seen so many places that degenerate into chaos and bickering. Due to the strict rules about flaming etc. we can keep on track and really address the important things.
>
> What do you want this man to do? Why does it matter what he gets out of this? I do not feel exploited, disrespected or used.
>
> Am I missing something? Becuase, from his rare interactions with people that I have seen I can read nothing more of him than what I listed above.
>
Well just want to make sure its clear my posts are always aimed to offer help,so not sure why you mentioned that,i always show encourgagment as well when im invovled in a thread of someone doing well,my goals in general from the board were to share,both give and take information,and thats prett much what i have done.If i cant speak my mind in general on something here,without people hyperventalatiing then that is how it is,regardless my curiosity still remains,and i still think it would be an asset to see a bullentin or newsletter available from time to time knowing that my personal stories are being used for a general impact would be a nice thing for me to hear.
Dr.Bob is a man,but more than that,he has a position to possably have more impact than the average person assuming they are not in the industry,so i appealed thoughts to dr.bob,big deal,no need for the hysteria really.
I have a heavy foot,so i break eggshells when i walk,this site isnt for me,ill lurk from time to time.Oh and remeber to blow into the brown bag to calm down,seems to be warrented with the intensity you responded with in my posts,GEEE ZUS.
> He could be a robot for all I know.
>
> All of you on the other hand seem very real to me and I am personally greatful for the person who provides us this place, whatever his reason.
>
> Peace,
> Kaye
Posted by notfred on April 5, 2007, at 9:59:45
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by flmm on April 4, 2007, at 21:01:59
> I feel like this site is just a place where people complain that drugs do not help them! I often wonder why they don't figure out the answer to anxiety and depression is not here. Only ideas on places to start..............
Good point. Where is the best place to get support and encoragement about meds ? Not a site where the majority do not do well, a site filled with anger and negativity.
Those who are sucessful with managing their illness have learned coping skills and other skills which are part of why they do so well. I sought out these people to learn what
they where doing right. With this knowlage and other skills I have worked hard to stay in remisson over 20 years. I am on several lists
for mental illness and this one is very negative, for more than any other list. This chases away those that many could learn from.
Posted by Caedmon on April 5, 2007, at 10:15:43
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by notfred on April 5, 2007, at 9:59:45
> Those who are sucessful with managing their illness have learned coping skills and other skills which are part of why they do so well. I sought out these people to learn what
> they where doing right. >You are very smart. :)
I wish there was more of that discussion on neurophysiology and meds too. Even if we don't know what we're talking about, lol.
Posted by flmm on April 5, 2007, at 21:16:01
In reply to Re: My concern about this site » notfred, posted by Caedmon on April 5, 2007, at 10:15:43
Thanx for the mention notfred! It never ceases to amaze me just how negative this site can be! People take a pill, wait a few days, and wonder why they are still depressed! I have been battling depression, anxiety 15 years and it is and will always be, up and down! Drugs are only part of the equation. I have said this many times! If you don't help yourself, you will not succeed. Believe it or not, I feel like i am a fairly negative person, until i come here! Then i feel optimistic compared to the chronic complainers on this site!
Posted by KayeBaby on April 5, 2007, at 22:10:43
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by willyee on April 5, 2007, at 9:39:45
Willyee,
I did not impugn your character. I don't know why you think that I consider your participation here lacking. I do not.Of course you have a right to your perspective and eggshells do break. Happily, I am not an egg.
As for the implication of hysteria, you expressed some potent thoughts and they evoked strong responses. The only thing worse than a strong response is no response at all, in my book.
I have no issue with anyone expressing their thoughts or feelings (except that that is the reason I;m here) I simply found them different enough from my own to be remarkable. So I remarked.
That's all.
Take Care,
Kaye
Posted by 10derHeart on April 5, 2007, at 23:06:22
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by willyee on April 5, 2007, at 9:39:45
>Oh and remeber to blow into the brown bag to calm down,seems to be warrented with the intensity you responded with in my posts,GEEE ZUS.
Please don't be sarcastic and please respect the views of others, even you think they're wrong.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues should be directed to Admin and should of course be civil. Dr. Bob has oversight over deputy decisions, and he may choose a different action.
Respectfully,
10derHeart, acting as deputy for Dr. Bob
Posted by 10derHeart on April 5, 2007, at 23:07:02
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by flmm on April 5, 2007, at 21:16:01
>Then i feel optimistic compared to the chronic complainers on this site!
Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down, and respect the views of others even if you think they're wrong.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues should be directed to Admin and should of course be civil. Dr. Bob has oversight over deputy decisions, and he may choose a different action.
Respectfully,
10derHeart, acting as deputy for Dr. Bob
Posted by greywolf on April 6, 2007, at 1:57:41
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by willyee on April 5, 2007, at 9:39:45
I think part of the issue is that complaining about negativity on Dr. Bob's site because of what one sees on the PB board is like complaining that the ESPN site is oriented to violence because it has a forum for boxing fans.The reality is that PB is just a portion of Dr. Bob's site and, when you look at the site as a whole, there's a balance to be found. It's not quite as rosy of a balance as you might find if you visit the boards at some general blog like Fark, but it's also not just a "graveyard of suffering." Mental health issues tend to involve sadness and pain, and sites devoted to helping people with these important issues are going to reflect that reality.
Further, with respect to the PB board itself, I don't know why anyone would expect to find anything but what we see here. From my long-term experience with the pharmaceuticals for depression, bipolar, and OCD, every new med my doctors prescribe throws me into a pretty vicious cycle of hope and despair. Far too many meds are simply not effective or impair daily living to such an extent that the costs far exceed their benefits. The proliferation of these experiences tends to be reflected in the atmosphere of PB. I got a sense from reading your initial post that you were, at least in part, commenting on that, but I'm not sure.
Greywolf
Posted by shasling on April 6, 2007, at 8:04:39
In reply to My concern about this site, posted by willyee on April 4, 2007, at 19:09:50
Im not sure the original post was complaining or attacking, so much as a question of what might be done with such potent information on the depths of our experiences and levels of despair we all know, since very few of our real-life docs have the time or inclination to really scratch the surface and understand our reality. I think its a reasonable question.
For example, last year there was discussion here of perhaps having babblers who were attending the Babble reunion/get-together/whatever it was in Canada, that members of us might be invited to speak with groups of p-docs at their p-doc conference, something like that. I did not go, so am sketchy on the details, but was very pleased to find that what happens on this board was going to be used to enlighten and hopefully improve at least some p-doc's understanding of what this experience is really like, as opposed to the 50-minute clips they get in their practice. It seems to me that the poster was really inquiring along these lines as to whether Dr Bob, in his unique position of being both a doctor, and holder of this information as to the level of suffering and frustration we experience, whether he might use that unique position to facilitate some kind of actual use of this information to help our cause.
Maybe I am misinterpreting, but again this did not in any way seem to be an attack, but rather a reasonable question by someone who has consistently tried to be of help here. And who of us knows? Maybe Bob does try to use this information for the greater good. I dont know that the original poster knew of the Canada thing. There may be other efforts we dont know of. Maybe its even just a matter of making note when efforts like this are made, so we can all feel like in addition to gaining support and information and helping each other, we can have some feeling that it also helps the greater good.
Disclaimer necessary because it really is getting contentious around here to state ones opinion, compared to a few years ago when one could do so without the inevitable dogpile, this is only my opinion of the matter - please dont bother to attack this post on my behalf, unless you feel you must, as I will not be reading the followups.
Willyee, Im sorry your post went off on such a tangent, and I understand your frustration at that. I think you made a reasonable point.
Posted by TheMeanReds on April 6, 2007, at 12:47:27
In reply to My concern about this site, posted by willyee on April 4, 2007, at 19:09:50
http://ftp.sunet.se/pub/pictures/tv.film/Wizard_of_Oz/Back_at_Oz.1.jpg
Posted by KayeBaby on April 6, 2007, at 21:45:54
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by TheMeanReds on April 6, 2007, at 12:47:27
HeeHeee.
Pay not attention to that man behind the curtain...
Peace,
Kaye
Posted by elanor roosevelt on April 7, 2007, at 22:58:53
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by TheMeanReds on April 6, 2007, at 12:47:27
hey
get out there and look around
lots of sites
if people are so unhappy with this site
why visit?
not meaning to be nasty
just why waste your energy?
Posted by willyee on April 7, 2007, at 23:56:32
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by elanor roosevelt on April 7, 2007, at 22:58:53
> hey
> get out there and look around
> lots of sites
> if people are so unhappy with this site
> why visit?
> not meaning to be nasty
> just why waste your energy?Wow,my thread was about suggesting that dr.bob use the info here since its so abundant,a reasonable curosity........how from that post you were able to make the above comment,just wow my post was taken,and twisted and spun into something it was clearly not,and personaly i dont think that is fair at all.
Also even if the post might have failed to get its actual point across,i dont see how reading it the outcome that i am not happy with the people or actual site is beyond me,very very unfair.
Posted by elanor roosevelt on April 9, 2007, at 22:51:50
In reply to Re: My concern about this site, posted by willyee on April 7, 2007, at 23:56:32
please do not take personal offense.
i read through all the comments and was surprised at how many seemed to be posted as if people were forced to be here.
there might be sites that will better serve their needs.Again, no offense intended.
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
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