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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 8 of 8. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Mistermindmasta on October 26, 2006, at 23:25:56
I don't post a lot here cuz I don't have severe problems, I just like to come in and out of this board and gather a little info, especially from the alternative board. I've never been diagnosed with anything and I've never been on any medications. I've always had some "issues", which mostly were lack of motivation, procrastination, sensation seeking, typical ADD (not really hyperactive). I am functional, but barely. Despite the fact that my school GPA is 3.5, that's only from last minute procrastination and self medication with caffeine and various herbs that are not as ideal as I'd like.
So anyway, this past Monday I tried Adderall from a friend who gave me some just to try cuz he had extra. I guess I took about 20 - 30 mg (half a 15 mg pill plus a whole 15 mg pill) and I couldn't even believe how I felt. It was amazing, literally. I didn't feel speedy or anything, though.
Normally in my science labs at school, I'm always the kid who doesn't know exactly whats going on and has to ask other people questions, but when I was on the Adderall, everything was so clear to me. I knew what I had to do and was efficient and organized. That was nice.
Normally I feel sort of awkward around people I don't know. I don't feel motivated to talk to them and when I do, I'm always second guessing myself, wondering if they're judging me. On adderall, I felt motivated to talk to people, to learn about people, and I had zero (!) feelings of awkwardness. It's amazing to feel clear headed and have no social anxieties... the only thing that made me feel like that was alcohol but this was totally different. Totally different. I never realised how much I avoid conversation with people just because I don't feel right. In fact, it's effects on my social skills was probably the most pronounced. I didn't have a whole lot of directed motivation to do schoolwork though - I still had to drag myself away from wanting to write poetry and such. But I just felt so connected to the world!
So is this what normal feels like?? I haven't felt normal since I was like 15 so I'm not sure. I'm always wondering if I was just on a heavy adderall buzz and that it's not realistic to think that I could actually feel that way all the time. But it SHOULD be realistic - I see how people around me like to socialize and how my classmates know what's going on... so why can't I feel like that?
Just that day totally changed my viewpoints on a lot of things and it made me realise I suffer a lot more than I sometimes acknowledge. Here I was thinking I was going through life ok, with some minor issues, but I think I'm just so used to have social issues that I've just accepted being dysfunctional - which, in a certain sense is good, but I'm still dysfunctional nontheless.
Since I can't keep bumming adderall from this kid forever, I'm checking out ordering reboxetine online. It's like $25 / month, no insurance which isn't bad. It's a NE reuptake inhibitor, similar to atomoxetine (concerta I think??). I don't have insurance and am looking to just feel a little more normal, since most antidepressant herbs are sub par. I don't really know if I have depression, since I rarely feel emotional and don't have any really bad problems with energy... it seems more like social anxiety and ADD, if I were to make a guess. So hopefully I'm find something that is somewhat close to being as good as adderall was. Just wanted to share my story.
Posted by christophrejmc on October 27, 2006, at 3:46:55
In reply to My experience with Adderall, posted by Mistermindmasta on October 26, 2006, at 23:25:56
You may have ADD or you may just be experiencing the typical effects of amphetamine. Responding to stimulants is not a litmus test for ADD. But it's certainly a possibility.
Atomoxetine is Strattera, not Concerta (Concerta is methylphenidate/Ritalin). A lot of people experience anxiety on Strattera so you may want to investigate reboxetine further (I wouldn't expect results similar to Adderall).
Even without insurance, you can find low-cost clinics that will be able to refer you to a physician who can determine what medication (if any) would be best. Where I live, the county provides very cheap mental health services to all residents; you should see if there are any health clinics in your area. The medications are reasonably inexpensive if you get the older generic forms.
As far as alternative treatments (please don't redirect this post), I have found a few things that have provided decent results for my (inattentive) ADD.
Acetyl L-Carnitine is becoming quite popular and does have modest effects at around 1000mg. You may want to also add a source of choline--CDP-choline and Alpha-GPC have the most noticeable effects, but lecithin (which is much cheaper) also helps. There are a few others that may be worth trying, but this conversation would be more appropriate on the Alternative board.
Posted by Meri-Tuuli on October 27, 2006, at 10:06:50
In reply to My experience with Adderall, posted by Mistermindmasta on October 26, 2006, at 23:25:56
Hey!
What happened to the rhodiola?? I would expect that'd be good if you have ADD...
Anyway I've tried reboxetine (but not adderal) - I get the impression that its not similar adderal.... hmm, I think the nice effects you have on adderal were due to its dopamine effects, and rebox only works on noradrenalin. So, it might not be what worth it for you.
Then again, it is an easy drug to come off/go on. But it does take 2-4 weeks for results to become evident, unlike adderal.
Kind regards
Meri
Posted by dbc on October 27, 2006, at 11:14:37
In reply to Re: My experience with Adderall, posted by Meri-Tuuli on October 27, 2006, at 10:06:50
Severe inattentive ad/hder here.
Personally i wouldnt waste your time with anything but stimulants or maybe emsam. Just go to a clinic and talk to a doctor.
Do not tell the doctor upfront at first you think you may have ad/hd. They hear this all day everyday from junkies.
Do not ever under any circumstances ever relate information about any recreational drug use to a doctor/nurse/counselor. You will instantly lose any chance of getting decent treatment and be stuck on some garbage like strattera.
If you find yourself with a prescription and end up abusing it just quit while you're ahead. You will end up strung out and will eventually get caught. Your medical record will reflect that you're a stimulant abuser and you will lose any possibility of getting decent treatment.
I take 45mg of dexedrine daily and 750mg to 1500mg of L-tyrosine daily (to help replenish stores of DA/NE).
Posted by christophrejmc on October 27, 2006, at 15:03:10
In reply to Re: My experience with Adderall, posted by dbc on October 27, 2006, at 11:14:37
> I take 45mg of dexedrine daily and 750mg to 1500mg of L-tyrosine daily (to help replenish stores of DA/NE).
I'm also taking Dexedrine (5mg immediate release 3 times a day--any more and the side-effects outweigh the benefits); I'm curious about your use of L-tyrosine. Are you noticing anything from taking it?
Also, are you taking the generic form of Dexedrine? Spansules or tablets?
Posted by dbc on October 27, 2006, at 16:08:15
In reply to Re: Dexedrine and L-tyrosine » dbc, posted by christophrejmc on October 27, 2006, at 15:03:10
>I'm also taking Dexedrine (5mg immediate release 3 times a day--any more and the side-effects outweigh the benefits); I'm curious about your use of L-tyrosine. Are you noticing anything from taking it?
>
> Also, are you taking the generic form of Dexedrine? Spansules or tablets?L-tyrosine is only as useful as you are deficent in it. With most people theres no need to supplement it but if you're using amphetamines it may not be a good idea since we tend to burn through it quickly trying to create all the dopamine our brains demand. If you decide to try it you need to take a small amount of vitamine b6 (25mg) with it. b6 is required for the tyrosine > L-dopa > dopamine conversion process.
I take the mallinckrodt generics. GSK contracts mallinckrodt to manufacture the d-amphetamine for their tablets so they're the same exact thing as the name brands.
Posted by dbc on October 27, 2006, at 16:14:36
In reply to Re: Dexedrine and L-tyrosine, posted by dbc on October 27, 2006, at 16:08:15
>but if you're using amphetamines it may not be a good idea since we tend to burn through it quickly
That should be "it may be a good idea". Also, i take the instant release tabs. My doctors old fashioned and doesnt have a high opinion of any of these "new fangled extended release pills".
Posted by Mistermindmasta on October 29, 2006, at 22:48:07
In reply to Re: My experience with Adderall, posted by dbc on October 27, 2006, at 11:14:37
> Severe inattentive ad/hder here.
Ok.
>
> Personally i wouldnt waste your time with anything but stimulants or maybe emsam. Just go to a clinic and talk to a doctor.
>Makes sense.
> Do not tell the doctor upfront at first you think you may have ad/hd. They hear this all day everyday from junkies.
Ok, so how do you think I should present myself in order to get stimulants and not strattera? I'm also kind of worried about having a "label", because I think that kind of ruins your chances of getting your doc to do what you want in the future, ya know? Like, if I want some medical test done for something that he thinks is unnecessary, he'll label me as not having clear thinking or some nonsense, if you get my point. I don't want a label, but maybe it's worth it.
>
> Do not ever under any circumstances ever relate information about any recreational drug use to a doctor/nurse/counselor. You will instantly lose any chance of getting decent treatment and be stuck on some garbage like strattera.I really didn't try it recreationally per se, since I was thinking that it might actually make me functional instead of getting a buzz.
I wouldn't mind trying strattera actually, from what i've read.
>
> If you find yourself with a prescription and end up abusing it just quit while you're ahead. You will end up strung out and will eventually get caught. Your medical record will reflect that you're a stimulant abuser and you will lose any possibility of getting decent treatment.
>Definitely no chance of me abusing it. I have no problem keeping my drug usage under control. If I had a prescription for something that made me feel as normal as adderall, I would care less about altering my state of mind further.
> I take 45mg of dexedrine daily and 750mg to 1500mg of L-tyrosine daily (to help replenish stores of DA/NE).
I've tried tyrosine, and it makes me really really annoyed at everything if I take more than 1,000 mg / day. But 1,000 mg isn't really that effective either cuz it wears off fast and like I said I get really pissed off, and I'm normally a pleasant person.Also, with regard to Rhodiola, it actually works very nice for the first few days of use for my add, but then it wears off and the antidepressant effects kick in I guess, cuz it makes me very foggy brained.
My family has a history of mild depression and add and my cousin was put on wellbutrin and responded dramatically to it, like 180 degree turnaround. Maybe I should consider that.
This is the end of the thread.
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