Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 613278

Shown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.

 

Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?

Posted by LizinManhattan on February 25, 2006, at 18:46:59

Hi,
My brother who suffers from depression and anxiety was recently prescribed hydrocodone by his doctor. (Hydrocodone is also known as Vicodin, Anexsia, Dicodid, Hycodan, Hycomine, Lorcet, Lortab, Norco, Tussionex and Vicoprofen). Has anyone heard of this before? He says it is supposed to help my brother's anxiety.
My mom, who lives with my brother says the hydrocodone makes my brother hostile and hyper which obviously makes her living situation even harder than it all ready is. Could he be taking too much (soory, I don't know his dose) and that is why these side effects are occurring, or are these common side effects of hydrocodone?
BTW, he is also taking Cymbalta.
Thanks, everyone!
Liz

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?

Posted by tessellated on February 25, 2006, at 19:43:08

In reply to Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?, posted by LizinManhattan on February 25, 2006, at 18:46:59

First, you either have a very cool doc, or a very questionable one.
Yes opiates relieve physical and emotional pain.
Yes, Hydrocodone is known to create agressive/agitated states.
Your doc is WAY OFF LABLE. not all bad necessarily...
I wouldn't say its the best for your purposes.
I have found it helpful during funerals, and tragic moments; so did aristotle.
Buprenophine is the only opiate i've heart of prescribed for mood disorders.
If anything Hydrocodone is gonna be a short term solution.
Tolerance will build, probably dependancy, etc...
Benzodiazapines are more common. Though also have similar problems.
If his personal habits get excessively weird tell his doc.
It's not a cool habit to pick up. Cheap tho!
Most Pdocs will go with SSRIs like prozac etc for long term.
If its short term, it could work just not any sort of long term solution.


> Hi,
> My brother who suffers from depression and anxiety was recently prescribed hydrocodone by his doctor. (Hydrocodone is also known as Vicodin, Anexsia, Dicodid, Hycodan, Hycomine, Lorcet, Lortab, Norco, Tussionex and Vicoprofen). Has anyone heard of this before? He says it is supposed to help my brother's anxiety.
> My mom, who lives with my brother says the hydrocodone makes my brother hostile and hyper which obviously makes her living situation even harder than it all ready is. Could he be taking too much (soory, I don't know his dose) and that is why these side effects are occurring, or are these common side effects of hydrocodone?
> BTW, he is also taking Cymbalta.
> Thanks, everyone!
> Liz

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?

Posted by med_empowered on February 25, 2006, at 20:21:42

In reply to Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?, posted by tessellated on February 25, 2006, at 19:43:08

opiates can help w/ depression. My guess is your doc has read up on opiates for depression, and has decided to use cheaper, commonly used opiates instead of the expensive opiates currently being used. Makes sense--sounds like an open-minded, very professional doc.

That said..some people react poorly to these drugs, so just make sure the doc is informed. It doesn't necessarily mean your brother is abusing the medication--speaking from personal experience, I've found that pain killers can sometimes make me cranky and moody even at low, as-prescribed dosages. Its just the nature of medications in general--weird reactions are more the rule than the exception.

Good luck!

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety? med_empowered

Posted by Phillipa on February 25, 2006, at 20:40:35

In reply to Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?, posted by med_empowered on February 25, 2006, at 20:21:42

Med, No wonder I was less depressed on percocet after some facial surgery. Fondly, Phillipa

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?

Posted by fenix on February 25, 2006, at 20:56:30

In reply to Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?, posted by LizinManhattan on February 25, 2006, at 18:46:59

This doctor must of visited the El Dorado in Candide!

Zounds... I am typeless.

> Hi,
> My brother who suffers from depression and anxiety was recently prescribed hydrocodone by his doctor. (Hydrocodone is also known as Vicodin, Anexsia, Dicodid, Hycodan, Hycomine, Lorcet, Lortab, Norco, Tussionex and Vicoprofen). Has anyone heard of this before? He says it is supposed to help my brother's anxiety.
> My mom, who lives with my brother says the hydrocodone makes my brother hostile and hyper which obviously makes her living situation even harder than it all ready is. Could he be taking too much (soory, I don't know his dose) and that is why these side effects are occurring, or are these common side effects of hydrocodone?
> BTW, he is also taking Cymbalta.
> Thanks, everyone!
> Liz

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?

Posted by Tanzanite on February 26, 2006, at 15:58:29

In reply to Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?, posted by LizinManhattan on February 25, 2006, at 18:46:59

Some of the adverse effects of Vicodin are mood changes, dysphoria, fear. So this prescription can be making his symptoms worse and I think a visit back to the doctor would be in order. Why? I was on vicodin just for pain for short term and it made me bananas. I cannot tolerate natural opiates and am also a chronic pain patient. I am also allergic to some. So, In my honest opinion getting some different treatment would be a better alternative. I hope everything gets straightened out.
Peace
Tanzanite

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?

Posted by med_empowered on February 26, 2006, at 16:34:51

In reply to Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?, posted by Tanzanite on February 26, 2006, at 15:58:29

I think this doc had good intentions, and probably has had good experiences using these meds before...

that said, you probably need to do some med adjustments. Talk to your brother, and get him to straighten things out with his doc ASAP.

Good luck!

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety? LizinManhattan

Posted by Chairman_MAO on February 28, 2006, at 21:50:55

In reply to Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?, posted by LizinManhattan on February 25, 2006, at 18:46:59

Hydrocodone is an especially stimulating opioid. Buprenorphine is the first-line opioid for psychiatric uses--for many good reasons. It would likely work far better.

Have him as for a prescription for Subutex or Suboxone.

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?

Posted by jerrympls on March 2, 2006, at 6:40:39

In reply to Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety? LizinManhattan, posted by Chairman_MAO on February 28, 2006, at 21:50:55

> Hydrocodone is an especially stimulating opioid. Buprenorphine is the first-line opioid for psychiatric uses--for many good reasons. It would likely work far better.
>
> Have him as for a prescription for Subutex or Suboxone.

My psych added hydrocodone 5mg 4x daily to my med combo in December 2004. EXCELLENT antidepressant and I'd say Pretty good for anxiety. I've experienced NO tolerance to hydrocodone either and I have never, ever abused it. I just wish hydrocodone were available in a timed-released/extended release form because I don't like the multiple dosing.

It also is very stimulating - not stimulating like Adderall or Dexedrine but socially sitmulating and increased motivation - BIG TIME. My mind can get a little cloudy sometimes and it's hard to focus on studying - but it's nothing excessive.

Anyone know if there is an extended release form of hydrocodone? I don't understand why there wouldn't be.

Anywayy - here's my current med combo:

Hydrocodone - 5mg 4x daily
Lexapro 20mg
Adderall XR 20mg - 3x daily
Klonopin 1mg - 4x daily
Seroquel 100-300mg at night (for sleep)
Ambien CR 12.5mg (insomnia)

I don't know how much the Lexapro helps - but I want to get off the seroquel so bad - but my insomnia is so tough - and YES I still have insomnia OFF stimulants. Seroquel is such a zombie pill -plus I've gained over 100 pounds in 1 yr because of it - and I found out I'm pre-diabetic now because of it. GREAT DRUG - NOT!

I'm thinking of re-visiting Lamictal because I feel the need for some more stability in moods. Too many times during the day the bottom will drop out and my stomach will sink and I'll feel complete dysphoria and dread - and then things pop back to feeling OK. I'm NOT bipolar by ANY means. I think I do cycle within the unipolar ranges. If my memory serves me - I think the last time I tried Lamictal I had trouble verbalizing words - I could see them in my head but I couldn't get them out - is this one of the side effects? Does it go away? Maybe a 2nd trial will give me better results?

Any advice is appreciated. Thanks
Jerry

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety? jerrympls

Posted by Chairman_MAO on March 3, 2006, at 0:17:44

In reply to Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?, posted by jerrympls on March 2, 2006, at 6:40:39

another poster basically told me I was crazy for suggesting that opioids be used before antipsychotics in cases of anxiety.

Well, what do you thnk of the effects vs. side effects of each? :)

Keep in mind that your case is a TYPICAL response to use of opioids in psychiatry. Very few people end up "hooked". Why would you want to abuse something when you feel great sober?

The popular concept of addiction in the US, namely that it is the drugs that get you hooked because they're so amazing, that you get hooked the first time you try them, that once and addict always an addict...it's all such BS. When will people see the emperor has no clothes?

Have you considered using a DA agonist (ropinirole, requip) for the purpose you wanted to use lamictal for?

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety? Chairman_MAO

Posted by jerrympls on March 4, 2006, at 22:55:26

In reply to Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety? jerrympls, posted by Chairman_MAO on March 3, 2006, at 0:17:44

Chairman - you and I are on the same page!

Positive effects of opioids completely outweigh any side effects that I have encountered. My doctor did try my on the Fentenyl patch and 10mg Oxycontin - which was great except for mental cloudiness and not as stimulating as hydrocodone. Now mind you- I got my doc to Rx me an opiate from my impassioned accounts of how hydrocodone had helped my depression/anxiety in the past and ONE study. Of course he talked with collegeus as well.

Anyway - my mother works as na RN in a senior healthcare facility and she's told me accounts where doctors have prescribed opiates for psychotic behavior including anxiety mostly related to dementia - and the results were amazing. This was after trying various mood stablizers and anti-psychotics on the patients too!

I SHOULD be an addict - according to all the liturature, the media, etc because my parents were raging alcholics. My brother smokes pot, my sister is addicted to Ambien - so I should be on crack. But I have - and let me be perfectly clear here and TOTALLY honest - have NEVER abused a substance. The only "thing" I've done is take a couple more klonopin when my anxiety gets rough - but I don't run out of my prescriptions early.

Like you said - my repsonse to having an Rxed opiate along with my other psych meds is typical. You just don't read about this because OH NO! We can't be giving out "feel-good" pills to treatment-resistant foks - then they'll FEEL GOOD quickly - and instead we must follow the Serotonin theory of depression and wait 6-8 weeks while the patient suffers in order to be respectable psych docs! Bunch of BS.

I could go on - but you understand me.

So on to you last suggestion of a DA agonist to help with my unipolar cycling - dips and drops resulting in a suckerpunch of dread and deep depression.....hmmm. I dunno? IN your opinion do you think a DA agonist would help to level things out and keep the floor from falling out?


> another poster basically told me I was crazy for suggesting that opioids be used before antipsychotics in cases of anxiety.
>
> Well, what do you thnk of the effects vs. side effects of each? :)
>
> Keep in mind that your case is a TYPICAL response to use of opioids in psychiatry. Very few people end up "hooked". Why would you want to abuse something when you feel great sober?
>
> The popular concept of addiction in the US, namely that it is the drugs that get you hooked because they're so amazing, that you get hooked the first time you try them, that once and addict always an addict...it's all such BS. When will people see the emperor has no clothes?
>
> Have you considered using a DA agonist (ropinirole, requip) for the purpose you wanted to use lamictal for?

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety? jerrympls

Posted by ed_uk on March 5, 2006, at 13:48:39

In reply to Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety? Chairman_MAO, posted by jerrympls on March 4, 2006, at 22:55:26

Hi J!

>she's told me accounts where doctors have prescribed opiates for psychotic behavior including anxiety mostly related to dementia - and the results were amazing

A trial of an opioid in agitated patients suffering from dementia seems like a very good idea to me. Many such patients are likely to be suffering from severe undiagnosed pain eg. due to osteoporosis or arthritis. Such patients cannot express how terrible their pain is......so analgesic trials are warranted if they are agitated and distressed. Antipsychotics increase mortality in elderly dementia patients and frequently cause severe side effects. Opioids, on the other hand, are often very constipating in elderly people and prophylactic laxative treatment is warranted.

Regards

Ed

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety? ed_uk

Posted by jerrympls on March 5, 2006, at 23:27:31

In reply to Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety? jerrympls, posted by ed_uk on March 5, 2006, at 13:48:39

> Hi J!
>
> >she's told me accounts where doctors have prescribed opiates for psychotic behavior including anxiety mostly related to dementia - and the results were amazing
>
> A trial of an opioid in agitated patients suffering from dementia seems like a very good idea to me. Many such patients are likely to be suffering from severe undiagnosed pain eg. due to osteoporosis or arthritis. Such patients cannot express how terrible their pain is......so analgesic trials are warranted if they are agitated and distressed. Antipsychotics increase mortality in elderly dementia patients and frequently cause severe side effects. Opioids, on the other hand, are often very constipating in elderly people and prophylactic laxative treatment is warranted.
>
> Regards
>
> Ed

Hey Ed!

You are exactly on target with your response! How are you doing? Still in school or...? Email me!

Jerry
Pre-Pharmacy Student

 

Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety? jerrympls

Posted by ed_uk on March 6, 2006, at 13:23:22

In reply to Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety? ed_uk, posted by jerrympls on March 5, 2006, at 23:27:31

Hi J :)

>How are you doing? Still in school or...?

No, I left university. I'm working 6 days a week in a pharmacy.

Ed xx

 

Thank you everyone

Posted by LizinManhattan on March 6, 2006, at 14:55:46

In reply to Re: Hydrocodone/vicodin/lortab/norco for anxiety?, posted by jerrympls on March 2, 2006, at 6:40:39

Hi,
Thanks everyone who replied! Well, my brother tried one pill a day for two days in a row and then 2 pills in one day. For the first hour everything was great; he was basically back to his old self! Then, he got agitated, depressed, confrontational and anxious. He has decided to go off the pills (he informed his pdoc). The poor guy needs a break all ready; he's suffered for so long.
We think my brother's pdoc was trying to recreate the effect alcohol has on my brother as he is basically well (not drunk, but actually back to his old self) when he has just a couple of drinks. Obviously the crash afterwards is bad so he doesn't drink anymore.
Back to the drawing board. I just don't know how much more my brother can take.
Liz

 

Re: Thank you everyone LizinManhattan

Posted by Chairman_MAO on March 7, 2006, at 11:05:19

In reply to Thank you everyone, posted by LizinManhattan on March 6, 2006, at 14:55:46

For anxiety and agitation, extended-release morphine, methadone, hydromorphone, or oxymorphone are all likely superior choices. I do not know what the doctor is willing to prescribe. Buprenorphine also may help--you never know.

Have you tried diazepam 2.5-10mg bid-qid (or other benzodiazepines) along with the opioid? Dextroamphetamine 10-30mg bid-tid? I am being completely serious here; if someone is suffering that badly, forget the classical prejudices toward using these drugs together.

The anxiolytic meprobamate occasionally can produce superior results in some people yet is still schedule IV so you don't have to bother making the case for barbiturates. It seems that making a case against a murder suspect is easier than that these days. However, if you are truly trying to recreate the effect of alcohol, barbiturates are the way to go. Pentobarbital or amobarbital are the drugs of choice here; if sedation is a problem add a psychostimulant or modafinil.


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