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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by mack2099 on April 13, 2005, at 8:48:38
In reply to Re: Nardil and loss of appetite and diarrhea, posted by cosis on April 20, 2003, at 1:06:52
I have been taking Nardil off and on (mostly on) for 18 years! I have been taking it regularly for the last 6 years. I have found on several occasions during the last 18 years that when I exercise regularly (at least 30 mins. daily of aerobic exercise) that my appetite is greatly supressed and losing weight is very easy. However, during the last 2 years I have gained @ 80 lbs. and have felt very tired--getting very little exercise as I just didn't feel up to it. We moved out of state and before I could get an appt. with a new dr. I saw that my current supply of Nardil would run out, so I began tapering off from 60 mg. daily down to 45, 30, 15 and completely off after tapering off for @ 4 wks. Several days after I was completely off my appetite changed suddenly from ravenous (expecially for sweets and alcoholic beverages--especially wine) to normal. I began to lose weight and actually feel better and not as tired. My whole attitude has improved tremendously. Has anyone else experienced symptoms similar to these??? I'm thinking now that I don't want to return to Nardil--especially not for a while.
> > Hello
> > I took Nardil for 4 weeks and suffered loss of appretite, diarhea and lost 10 lbs. I was stopped by the police for driving while impaired. Has anybody else had any similar experiences. My doctor has vaguely suggested a hypoglycemic attack. He says the usual side effect is constipation not diarrhea but the diarrhea stopped when I stopped the Nardil and I are ravenously for several days after, so there does seem to be a correlation. Any help would be appreciated.
> > Mairwen
>
> Most of the people have a weight gain instead of loss... My appetite definately changed more towards sweet tasting foods which is responsible for about 10 lbs of weight gained...
>
> I am not sure I understand your police issue.. You were impaired from Nardil? When I drive sometimes I almost fall asleep.. It is kind of dangerous so I usually get out and move around then I am usually fine.. Or smack myself in the face a few times :)
>
>
Posted by ed_uk on April 13, 2005, at 9:45:11
In reply to Re: Nardil and loss of appetite and diarrhea, posted by mack2099 on April 13, 2005, at 8:48:38
Hi,
>I'm thinking now that I don't want to return to Nardil--especially not for a while.
Do you think you would try Parnate if you need an antidepressant in future? It's claimed to cause less weight gain than Nardil.
Regards,
Ed.
Posted by bill.e on April 23, 2005, at 9:04:55
In reply to Re: Nardil and loss of appetite and diarrhea, posted by cosis on April 20, 2003, at 1:06:52
> > Hello
> > I took Nardil for 4 weeks and suffered loss of appretite, diarhea and lost 10 lbs. I was stopped by the police for driving while impaired. Has anybody else had any similar experiences. My doctor has vaguely suggested a hypoglycemic attack. He says the usual side effect is constipation not diarrhea but the diarrhea stopped when I stopped the Nardil and I are ravenously for several days after, so there does seem to be a correlation. Any help would be appreciated.
>I've been taking nardil for 15 years so maybe I can help. I take the pills throughout the day, not more than one at a time. More than one 15mg pill at a time will give me some diarrhea the next day. Eating something around pill time can help alot. Increasing the dose gives me some diarrhea or constipation and some cycling between the two until I adjust to it.
When I first started nardil I lost 15 lbs but all these years later I've put it all back and then some... age catching up with me.
Too high a dose can bring symptoms of hypermania - could be the reason for your driving incident.
Posted by Rich340 on May 14, 2005, at 6:15:30
In reply to Re: hypertensive experiences? , posted by fritz on October 21, 2003, at 22:31:50
Last week I needed to unblock my nasal passages following radical radiation therapy to irradicate cancer from the lower half of my nose. Bought some Nyal nose spray in desparation. 2 squirts in each nostril.
90 minutes later , I had to pull over to the side of the road with a monstrous migraine, wet all over with sweats, needing to find a toilet, very fast.For me, it was a matter of trying to survive. I was taken to hospital by ambulance with, amongst other things, elevated blood pressure and a neckache like I 've never had before.
I have been on MAOIs for 25 years. First time crisis. Problem now is that I have persisting headaches and neckache with some continuing elavated B.P. some 6 days later and have been unable to work in the interim.
Hell of a price to pay for the only antidpressant that really works for me!
Posted by gardenergirl on May 14, 2005, at 15:19:19
In reply to Re: hypertensive experiences?, posted by Rich340 on May 14, 2005, at 6:15:30
Sounds like an awful experience. Did the nasal spray have psuedoephedrine in it?
gg
Posted by KaraS on May 14, 2005, at 16:09:59
In reply to Re: hypertensive experiences?, posted by Rich340 on May 14, 2005, at 6:15:30
> Last week I needed to unblock my nasal passages following radical radiation therapy to irradicate cancer from the lower half of my nose. Bought some Nyal nose spray in desparation. 2 squirts in each nostril.
>
> 90 minutes later , I had to pull over to the side of the road with a monstrous migraine, wet all over with sweats, needing to find a toilet, very fast.For me, it was a matter of trying to survive. I was taken to hospital by ambulance with, amongst other things, elevated blood pressure and a neckache like I 've never had before.
>
> I have been on MAOIs for 25 years. First time crisis. Problem now is that I have persisting headaches and neckache with some continuing elavated B.P. some 6 days later and have been unable to work in the interim.
>
> Hell of a price to pay for the only antidpressant that really works for me!
>
>
That sounds so horrible! The nose spray must have had pseudophedrine in it as gg suggested. It sounds like you've been very careful if you've never had a crisis in 25 years. Nyal is an Australian brand, isn't it? Do they list the ingredients on the package there or not?I'm so sorry you're still not feeling well. I've heard of the after-effects lasting a couple of days but not 6. Did they give you anything to help you keep the blood pressure down or anything to take for the continuing pain?
If you are in Australia I'm curious as to how you managed to get an MAOI prescribed. Do you mind if I ask you which one are you taking? I have a friend who lives in Australia who desperately wants to try Parnate but has not been able to get it prescribed. Maybe because you started on it so many years ago...
Sorry for all of the questions. I hope you feel better soon. It is definitely too high a price to have to pay for feeling normal but hopefully you'll never have another one ever again. I hope your nose is better soon too.Take care,
Kara
Posted by Declan on May 14, 2005, at 20:52:41
In reply to Re: hypertensive experiences? » Rich340, posted by KaraS on May 14, 2005, at 16:09:59
If I remember correctly Nyal contains phenylephrine, rather than, as many others do, oxymetazoline. And perhaps phenylephrine is fairly close to adrenaline. I'm interested because I'm thinking about a MAOI but take pseudoephedrine for an allergic thingo (high IgE). My sinuses get blocked. I take chinese herbs for it mainly, and they may be a problem with a MAOI too.
Declan
Posted by Rich340 on May 14, 2005, at 22:06:48
In reply to Re: hypertensive experiences? » Rich340, posted by KaraS on May 14, 2005, at 16:09:59
Posted by Rich340 on May 14, 2005, at 22:41:20
In reply to Re: hypertensive experiences? (nm) » KaraS, posted by Rich340 on May 14, 2005, at 22:06:48
Typed lengthy followup. Must have screwed up on submit process.
Can I retrieve the text or must I (uggh!)start again?
Help!
Posted by KaraS on May 15, 2005, at 2:14:50
In reply to Re: hypertensive experiences? » Rich340, posted by Rich340 on May 14, 2005, at 22:41:20
> Typed lengthy followup. Must have screwed up on submit process.
>
> Can I retrieve the text or must I (uggh!)start again?
>
> Help!
Bummer! I think you checked the box that says "no message" (because you have the "nm" in your message title) so the program erased all that you had typed. I appreciate the effort anyway.K
Posted by Dr. Bob on May 15, 2005, at 2:15:07
In reply to Re: hypertensive experiences? » Rich340, posted by Rich340 on May 14, 2005, at 22:41:20
> Typed lengthy followup. Must have screwed up on submit process.
>
> Can I retrieve the text or must I (uggh!)start again?
>
> Help!Sorry, but at this point you probably have to start again. Sometimes you can go “back” and your text will be there. Sometimes a new window will open with your text. Sometimes people compose in Word or something and cut-and-paste to post. Better luck next time,
Bob
Posted by Rich340 on May 15, 2005, at 6:55:20
In reply to Re: hypertensive experiences? » Rich340, posted by Rich340 on May 14, 2005, at 22:41:20
Its never as good the second time 'round, however here goes.
Regarding your request re the MAOI which I take, it is Nardil.
It is part of a cocktail of drugs for minimising the impact of Bipolar disorder 2 which has adversley impacted my professional career as a practicing international lawyer over the last 33 years.
Availability of the drug itself is no problem in Australia: rather, it is the avaiability of Psychiatrists who will prescribe it that is the problem.
My original psychopharmacologist insisted I try Nardil for some years. The list of unacceptable foods contained many of my favourites! In the end, my absences from work dictated I had no option. He compared Nardil and the other MAOI avilable in Australia, Parnate, to a tried and true 'cannon' as opposed to the slick 'rifle shot' weapons that the later generations of anti depressants comprise.
Regarding the cocktail, just in case this may help someone- not necesarily the specifics, but the rewards for having gotten there: I have titrated the drugs comprising the cocktail, with the blessing of my current psych., to the point where I have reduced the Lithium and introduced carbamazepine. My present cocktail comprises the following:
Morning-4 Nardils + 1/2 Carbamazepine(400mgCR)+1 20 mg Propanalol.
Lunch- 2 nardils + 1 20mg Propanalol.
Bedtime- 1 Carbamazepine (400mgCR) + 1 Lithium (250).Now hear this! I have for almost all of my life suffered a depressive episode 1 week in every four. Since I began the present regime, I have now completed 26 weeks in a row (or 6 months or half a year!) without a significant depressive episode (not more than one day of questionable mood).
This has inevitably resulted in some cockiness on my part causing me to 'push the envelope' with foods,drinks, etc, ever so carefully. I thought I had the 'beast' under control. Hence the H.T.C. and my time in Hospital. Thankfully, no resultant depression , at all!
My G.P. suggested Adalat (Nifedipine/ Procardia to you?) 3 x daily yesterday. Headaches have gone. Blood pressure has returned to normal, for me.One unforgettable lesson.
Really value this support group in cyberspace.
Hope some of this helps someone else, somehow.
R.
Posted by awatts on May 15, 2005, at 12:01:26
In reply to Re: screwed up on submit process, posted by Dr. Bob on May 15, 2005, at 2:15:07
> Sorry, but at this point you probably have to start again. Sometimes you can go “back” and your text will be there. Sometimes a new window will open with your text. Sometimes people compose in Word or something and cut-and-paste to post. Better luck next time,
>
> BobDr. Bob,
I have tried to compose in Word and then cut and paste to babble. I lost all of the Word formatting. What's the proper was to do this and retain the Word formatting?
Posted by KaraS on May 15, 2005, at 18:10:35
In reply to Re: hypertensive experiences? » Rich340, posted by Rich340 on May 15, 2005, at 6:55:20
> Its never as good the second time 'round, however here goes.
>
> Regarding your request re the MAOI which I take, it is Nardil.
>
> It is part of a cocktail of drugs for minimising the impact of Bipolar disorder 2 which has adversley impacted my professional career as a practicing international lawyer over the last 33 years.
>
> Availability of the drug itself is no problem in Australia: rather, it is the avaiability of Psychiatrists who will prescribe it that is the problem.
>
> My original psychopharmacologist insisted I try Nardil for some years. The list of unacceptable foods contained many of my favourites! In the end, my absences from work dictated I had no option. He compared Nardil and the other MAOI avilable in Australia, Parnate, to a tried and true 'cannon' as opposed to the slick 'rifle shot' weapons that the later generations of anti depressants comprise.
>
> Regarding the cocktail, just in case this may help someone- not necesarily the specifics, but the rewards for having gotten there: I have titrated the drugs comprising the cocktail, with the blessing of my current psych., to the point where I have reduced the Lithium and introduced carbamazepine. My present cocktail comprises the following:
> Morning-4 Nardils + 1/2 Carbamazepine(400mgCR)+1 20 mg Propanalol.
> Lunch- 2 nardils + 1 20mg Propanalol.
> Bedtime- 1 Carbamazepine (400mgCR) + 1 Lithium (250).
>
> Now hear this! I have for almost all of my life suffered a depressive episode 1 week in every four. Since I began the present regime, I have now completed 26 weeks in a row (or 6 months or half a year!) without a significant depressive episode (not more than one day of questionable mood).
>
> This has inevitably resulted in some cockiness on my part causing me to 'push the envelope' with foods,drinks, etc, ever so carefully. I thought I had the 'beast' under control. Hence the H.T.C. and my time in Hospital. Thankfully, no resultant depression , at all!
>
> My G.P. suggested Adalat (Nifedipine/ Procardia to you?) 3 x daily yesterday. Headaches have gone. Blood pressure has returned to normal, for me.One unforgettable lesson.
>
> Really value this support group in cyberspace.
>
> Hope some of this helps someone else, somehow.
>
> R.
Yes, that helps a lot. Thank you for all of that information. I'm glad to hear that you're getting better. It's so inspiring to hear about someone having such success. Finding the right combination of medications can be so difficult. Depression has taken up my entire adult life. I think it's probably time to try an MAOI. As for my friend in Australia, do you have any advice as to how he can go about finding a doctor to prescribe an MAOI? He doesn't have a lot of money so that makes it more difficult. Would you mind telling me what city you're in and what your doctor's name is? If you're not comfortable posting that here, could you e-mail me the information at k8samms@yahoo.com ?
Thanks so much.
Cheers,
Kara
Posted by Dr. Bob on May 15, 2005, at 21:39:58
In reply to Re: screwed up on submit process - Hey, Dr. Bob, posted by awatts on May 15, 2005, at 12:01:26
> I have tried to compose in Word and then cut and paste to babble. I lost all of the Word formatting. What's the proper was to do this and retain the Word formatting?
Sorry, no fancy formatting in posts...
Bob
Posted by Levi on June 14, 2005, at 19:57:17
In reply to Re: MAOIs and Painkillers, posted by jsarirose on November 14, 2002, at 16:23:42
I stumbled upon this site and read about your problem regarding MAOI's and your options of painkillers and I think I may have a solution.
I take parnate (30mg/day) and a few months back my doctor prescribed me a quasi-narcotic painkiller which worked fairly well. It's called Ultram(tramadol).I was taking around 200mg/day for a significant time period and experienced no adverse reactions at all.
BUT, I did, however, read that there is some risk of hypertensive problems but let me add that my brother takes Parnate and also was prescribed Ultram and he experienced no adverse effects either
-Levi
Posted by Psychopharmaca on October 3, 2005, at 18:39:36
In reply to Re: MAOIs and Painkillers » jsarirose, posted by Levi on June 14, 2005, at 19:57:17
Just be careful. Tramadol is one of the drugs known to react with MAOIs. Some people are able to tolerate such combinations, but those who are not run the risk of hypertensive crises and/or seizures.
Posted by shasling on October 8, 2005, at 9:55:39
In reply to MAOI diet short list, posted by Elizabeth on August 17, 2001, at 13:43:12
Any experience out there with tegretol/parnate interaction? Literature all screams DONT, but I've also heard it is overstated. Also, it doesn't say why not to - i.e., does it affect the level of tegretol as many things do, (which I can manage), or does it lead to hypertensive crisis?
Thanks!!
Posted by Rich340 on October 8, 2005, at 16:57:58
In reply to Re: MAOI and Tegretol?, posted by shasling on October 8, 2005, at 9:55:39
> Any experience out there with tegretol/parnate interaction? Literature all screams DONT, but I've also heard it is overstated. Also, it doesn't say why not to - i.e., does it affect the level of tegretol as many things do, (which I can manage), or does it lead to hypertensive crisis?
>
> Thanks!!
I take Nardil (6x15mg p.d.) with 1/2 400mg CR Tegretol in the morning and 1 400mg CR Tegretol at night.
The objective was to reduce the amount of Lithium I was taking (3)and replace most of it (I still take 1 250mg Li at night)with the Tegretol.
It has worked well for me. Certainly NO hypertensive crisis!
Posted by shasling on October 9, 2005, at 15:52:20
In reply to Re: MAOI and Tegretol?, posted by Rich340 on October 8, 2005, at 16:57:58
> > Any experience out there with tegretol/parnate interaction? Literature all screams DONT, but I've also heard it is overstated. Also, it doesn't say why not to - i.e., does it affect the level of tegretol as many things do, (which I can manage), or does it lead to hypertensive crisis?
> >
> > Thanks!!
> I take Nardil (6x15mg p.d.) with 1/2 400mg CR Tegretol in the morning and 1 400mg CR Tegretol at night.
> The objective was to reduce the amount of Lithium I was taking (3)and replace most of it (I still take 1 250mg Li at night)with the Tegretol.
> It has worked well for me. Certainly NO hypertensive crisis!
>
> Thanks for the info!
Posted by peridown on January 11, 2006, at 8:29:27
In reply to Re: MAOI and Tegretol?, posted by shasling on October 9, 2005, at 15:52:20
Hello all,
I hope I'm doing this right -- I'm a first timer and I just typed it all in and then lost it somehow!! So here I try again!!I'm about start an MAOI (parnate) and have been looking at the MAOI diet and am feeling rather confused (a fairly state of affairs for me!) While I don't want to go to extremes, I do tend to be very sensitive to side effects and have a history of bp problems (hypotension -- low blood pressure). Without inundating everyone, let me ask a specific question which I haven't seen anywhere and which will come up for me on a regular basis.
Every MAOI diet I've seen mentions fresh meat and fish. I live in an orthodox Jewish community where one doesn't buy or cook meat from sundown Friday until sundown Saturday. The following is the normal, or "good case" scenario, of the meat traveling for a Saturday (Sabbath) lunch:
Tue-Wed: arrives in store
Wed-Th: buy
Th-Fr: cook
Friday: place in crockpot overnight (slow cooker)
or
Saturday: place on hot plate (where it might sit several hours before eaten -- think Thanksgiving dinner every Saturday.)Can I eat this on a regular basis?? (I emailed my doctor and received a one word answer: yes. I am waiting for a reply to my request for further explanation/basis.)
This is all of course assuming the meat wasn't bought earlier and frozen, also fairly common, perhaps especially due to kosher meats more limited availability and higher expense. In fact, I have meat, chicken & fish in my freezer, including a $25 roast I'm planning to make for friends this weekend -- I just hope it's okay for me to also eat it! Speaking of which...
One more question: what's the safest way to defrost meat?
Thank you in advance for any help
confused
Posted by Kneeko on January 14, 2006, at 3:09:34
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list, posted by peridown on January 11, 2006, at 8:29:27
K, just started the MAOI Nardil and must have your valued feedback on this.
Is it ok to eat foods containing Soybean oil or Partially hydronated Soybean oil? Fast food is good every once awhile, not everyday of course. Most of it contains one of these ingredients: Soybean oil, partially hydrogenated soybean oil, or processed American cheese(ex:french fries, burger, Big Mac and so forth). What is your opinion of them?
The list is right here: http://www.dietriot.com/fff/mcd/mcd.html#SANDWICH
If Nardil helps, giving these up will be no problem, but just wondering what Fast Food is Go and what isn't from the Major Chains. Obviously straight soy products and many cheeses are out. One additional question is whether Whey protein is ok! Thank you for your valuable input
Posted by musky on March 20, 2006, at 23:14:19
In reply to Re: Success with Marplan? » tansy, posted by ZeeZee on April 13, 2003, at 16:31:28
>just reading this old posting.. hmmm wonder if this is true as my experience with paxil was hell.
made me psychotic and wanting to get out of my body. extreme anxiety.. ended up in pyche ward .. never had any of these feelings ever!!
you say you feel great??? interesting .. wondering if you are just "high"... and you can honestly say you have NO side effects.. anyone ive ever talked to on this has had the same side effects as me and also sexual dysfunction.. now thats really scary...sorry, I dont support paxil.. maybe your body chemistry is different...
I always wonder what people will be like down the road from long term use of this drug... worries me
Thanks Tansy. I am now on Paxil and am doing fabulously!!!!! I feel GREAT!!! and am back to doing things and going places I previously feared (panic disorder and agoraphobia) In addition, I'm having absolutely NO side effects and enjoy the fact that I don't have to restrict my diet or medication. I'm so glad I stuck this one out, it's really paid off for me.
> Thanks anyway for your input and am glad you're doing well!
Posted by jkshrews on May 16, 2006, at 23:21:11
In reply to Re: hypertensive experiences?, posted by cybercafe on July 21, 2002, at 1:10:30
Eliminate Migraine Sideeffects And Misery (EMSAM)
That's my mnemonic phrase to help me remember the name of a new MAOI delivery system called EMSAM. It is a transdermal Selegiline (l-deprenyl) patch. When taken in smaller doses, this drug is specific to the brain MAO rather than the digestive MAO. When taken in larger doses (and the MAOI diet is then recommended), it probably is still safer due to the fact that it is delivered via the skin rather than the digestive system. By this method, the digestive system is not exposed to the high concentrations of the drug that occur with oral administration.
Posted by elanor roosevelt on June 2, 2006, at 8:40:26
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list, posted by djmmm on January 15, 2002, at 23:04:54
Thank you all.
This has all been very helpful as far as parnate no-no foods. I still do not understand the extremes.
If someone puts a salad in front of me that has feta cheese tossed in -- do I just avoid the feta cheese or do I go without salad?
I am starting parnate in 5 days.
Stopped taking pseudophedrine for seasonal allergies and have to see my MD about options. Any suggestions?
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