Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 469091

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Re: cold meds and anxiety

Posted by krybrahaha78 on March 10, 2005, at 1:55:56

In reply to Re: cold meds and anxiety, posted by krybrahaha78 on March 10, 2005, at 1:51:58

> I would guess that the Tylenol Cold Daytime Relief caplets of which contain the pseudoephedrine hydrochloride might be the cause. Ephedrine is a stimulant.
>
>
> > Yesterday I took two Tylenol Cold medication, Daytime relief caplets.
> > I began to feel very anxious. So anxious that I took a clonazepam.
> >
> > The active ingredients include pseudoephedrine hydrochloride and dextromethorphan hydrobromide. And tylenol, of course. I have no probelm with tylenol.
> >
> > Which of those two meds would have caused the anxiety. I guess I am really just curious, but I would also like to know so I NEVER get another cold medicine with the culprit ingredient.
> >
> > Any ideas? I looked them both up and see the pure form of the Dex H has recreational uses. As if. That's all I need - more anxiety.
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> > ShortE
> >
> >
>
>

 

Re: cold meds and anxiety

Posted by med_empowered on March 10, 2005, at 5:59:33

In reply to Re: cold meds and anxiety, posted by krybrahaha78 on March 10, 2005, at 1:55:56

they can both cause anxiety. dex. is a med with some recreational uses...remember all the college kids "Robo-Trippin" in the mid-90s? (I grew up in a college town, so even though I was a kid at the time I knew all about it). Anyway, "Robo-Tripping" caught on with younger kids later on...it isn't now, and never has been, extremely popular, but lots of people do it at least once and some do it occasionally.
Pseudoephedrine is well-known to cause anxiety, increase blood pressure, and is also used to make home-cooked methamphetamine. More so than dex., it can cause pronounced anxiety, especially if you are anxiety-inclined or already take a stimulant. Dex. is better tolerated by most people, but can cause a sharp increase in blood pressure in sensitive people (like me) or those who already have a blood-pressure problem. Again, if you take a stimulant, please avoid both of these substances if possible. Personally, I find that colds can be handled with advil (I despise Tylenol b/c of its effects on the liver) tea and Benadryl. When I need something extra, I usually go to my doc, who either finds out something else is wrong (one time, pneumonia) or RX's for "stronger stuff" that I can handle...like cough-syrup with codeine (mild cold/flu) or hydrocodone (very, very bad cold/flu).

 

Re: Tylenol » med_empowered

Posted by ed_uk on March 10, 2005, at 10:07:07

In reply to Re: cold meds and anxiety, posted by med_empowered on March 10, 2005, at 5:59:33

Hi,

>I despise Tylenol b/c of its effects on the liver.

Acetaminophen, at recommended doses, has an excellent safety record. It is one of the best tolerated drugs of all time. Liver damage at therapeutic doses is exceptionally rare. Other serious side effects are also exceptional and it is associated with very few drug interactions.

In contrast, in the US, thousands of people every year experience life-threatening side effects from NSAIDs (ibuprofen etc) and aspirin. Gastro-intestinal haemorrhage may occur. Other side effects such as renal failure are a particular risk to the elderly. Also, NSAIDs are implicated in numerous important drug interactions. Despite this, the NSAIDs are a very useful and important class of drugs, but their safety record is poor compared to acetaminophen.

It is well known that acetaminophen is very dangerous in overdose, I do not need to emphasise this. Surely you wouldn't OD on Tylenol if you had a cold though! You are clearly very intelligent and I'm sure you'd stick to the recommended dose. It is not at all correct to assume that a drug which is dangerous in overdose is therefore dangerous at recommended doses. Drugs such as ibuprofen, while not particularly dangerous in overdose often cause serious side effects in the long-term. Rarely, ibuprofen causes serious side effects after only a few doses. Ibuprofen also has many more contra-indications than acetaminophen. Acetaminophen is a much maligned drug. Even if you search the journals you'll only find a few cases of serious side effects in people who took prescribed doses.

From PubMed...

'On average 1 in 1200 patients taking NSAIDs for at least 2 months will die from gastroduodenal complications who would not have died had they not taken NSAIDs. This extrapolates to about 2000 deaths each year in the UK.' .......That's in the UK, which has a much smaller population that the USA.

With very rare exceptions, the only people who die due to acetaminophen are people who overdose OR people who were taking acetaminophen despite the fact that it was contra-indicated eg. in severe malnutrition.

Best regards,
Ed.

 

Re: cold meds and anxiety » med_empowered

Posted by ed_uk on March 11, 2005, at 10:45:53

In reply to Re: cold meds and anxiety, posted by med_empowered on March 10, 2005, at 5:59:33

Hi Med,

Have I offended you? Hope not.

Ed.

 

Re: cold meds and anxiety

Posted by Shortelise on March 11, 2005, at 11:58:15

In reply to Re: cold meds and anxiety » med_empowered, posted by ed_uk on March 11, 2005, at 10:45:53

thanks all.

No offense taken at anything anyone has written.

Thanks very much for all the info. I so much appreciate the knowledge here.

ShortE

 

Re: cold meds and anxiety

Posted by Maxime on March 12, 2005, at 13:01:42

In reply to cold meds and anxiety, posted by Shortelise on March 10, 2005, at 1:20:51

I can't take anything that is "non-drowsy". I have tried on numerous occasion and my heart starts to race etc.

So I just put up with the symptoms until night time and then take something so I can at least sleep.

Oh, I have had some luck with Children's meds though.

I hope your cold gets better soon. :)

Maxime

 

Re: cold meds and anxiety » med_empowered

Posted by ed_uk on March 12, 2005, at 16:27:43

In reply to Re: cold meds and anxiety, posted by med_empowered on March 10, 2005, at 5:59:33

OK, I guess you're ignoring me.

 

Re: Tylenol » ed_uk

Posted by KaraS on March 12, 2005, at 16:52:48

In reply to Re: Tylenol » med_empowered, posted by ed_uk on March 10, 2005, at 10:07:07

Hi Ed,

Isn't acetaminophen dangerous when combined with alcohol?

K

 

Re: Tylenol » KaraS

Posted by ed_uk on March 12, 2005, at 17:14:02

In reply to Re: Tylenol » ed_uk, posted by KaraS on March 12, 2005, at 16:52:48

Hello,

>Isn't acetaminophen dangerous when combined with alcohol?

Yes, but it's not a problem if you don't drink! An occasional small drink is ok though. Why do you ask?

As I said in my post, when acetaminophen is taken at the recommended dose, by people who do not have any contra-indications (alcoholism etc) it has a safety record which is much better than most drugs. It is far less likely to cause side effects than any of the drugs used in psychiatry!

Ed x

PS. I am finding it difficult remembering to call it acetaminophen, it is called paracetamol in the UK. No one has heard of acetaminophen here! We don't have the brand Tylenol, we've got Panadol and many others.

 

Re: Tylenol » ed_uk

Posted by KaraS on March 12, 2005, at 17:20:00

In reply to Re: Tylenol » KaraS, posted by ed_uk on March 12, 2005, at 17:14:02

> Hello,
>
> >Isn't acetaminophen dangerous when combined with alcohol?
>
> Yes, but it's not a problem if you don't drink! An occasional small drink is ok though. Why do you ask?


I just wanted to get that into the conversation is all so people are aware that they shouldn't drink while taking it and alcoholics probably shouldn't take it at all.


> As I said in my post, when acetaminophen is taken at the recommended dose, by people who do not have any contra-indications (alcoholism etc) it has a safety record which is much better than most drugs. It is far less likely to cause side effects than any of the drugs used in psychiatry!

Agree totally.


> Ed x
>
> PS. I am finding it difficult remembering to call it acetaminophen, it is called paracetamol in the UK. No one has heard of acetaminophen here! We don't have the brand Tylenol, we've got Panadol and many others.

I don't know why they have to name the same drugs different names in different countries. What is the point? IMHO, it only serves to confuse things.

K

 

Re: Tylenol » KaraS

Posted by ed_uk on March 12, 2005, at 17:27:59

In reply to Re: Tylenol » ed_uk, posted by KaraS on March 12, 2005, at 17:20:00

Hello,

>I just wanted to get that into the conversation.

Thanks, I felt like I was talking to myself before. I think med_empowered is angry with me, I don't think he likes me. It's a shame really because I thought he was cool. Maybe he likes to be seen as the expert and won't have anyone disagree with him.

Ed x

 

Re: Tylenol » ed_uk

Posted by KaraS on March 12, 2005, at 18:15:39

In reply to Re: Tylenol » KaraS, posted by ed_uk on March 12, 2005, at 17:27:59

> Hello,
>
> >I just wanted to get that into the conversation.
>
> Thanks, I felt like I was talking to myself before. I think med_empowered is angry with me, I don't think he likes me. It's a shame really because I thought he was cool. Maybe he likes to be seen as the expert and won't have anyone disagree with him.
>
> Ed x


Or maybe he just hasn't been on the board recently?

K

 

Re: please be civil » ed_uk

Posted by Dr. Bob on March 13, 2005, at 14:56:56

In reply to Re: Tylenol » KaraS, posted by ed_uk on March 12, 2005, at 17:27:59

> Maybe he likes to be seen as the expert and won't have anyone disagree with him.

Please don't jump to conclusions about others or post anything that could lead them to feel accused or put down.

If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:

http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil

Follow-ups regarding these issues should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration. They, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.

Thanks,

Bob

 

Re: please be civil » Dr. Bob

Posted by ed_uk on March 13, 2005, at 15:21:08

In reply to Re: please be civil » ed_uk, posted by Dr. Bob on March 13, 2005, at 14:56:56

I'm sorry, I felt put down myself.

Ed.

 

Re: Tylenol » KaraS

Posted by ed_uk on March 15, 2005, at 11:13:20

In reply to Re: Tylenol » ed_uk, posted by KaraS on March 12, 2005, at 18:15:39

Hi Kara!

I hope you're ok. Perhaps you should have an ECG (EKG) if you're worried. You'll need to get a recording when you're having the palpitations though.

Some arrhythmias such as atrial fibrillation are extremely common, it's easy to attribute an arrhythmia to a drug when it's not the cause.

Perhaps you could d/c the doxepin for a while and give hydroxyzine a try. What do you think?

>Or maybe he just hasn't been on the board recently?

He has, nearly every day. I just don't like being ignored, it's rude. I wouldn't ignore him.

Ed x

 

Re: Tylenol » ed_uk

Posted by KaraS on March 15, 2005, at 16:19:44

In reply to Re: Tylenol » KaraS, posted by ed_uk on March 15, 2005, at 11:13:20

Hi Ed,

>> I hope you're ok. Perhaps you should have an ECG (EKG) if you're worried. You'll need to get a recording when you're having the palpitations though.


I have a doctor's appointment next Monday so we'll see.


>> Some arrhythmias such as atrial fibrillation are extremely common, it's easy to attribute an arrhythmia to a drug when it's not the cause.


Yes, it's difficult to say for sure without going off of the doxepin and then getting tested again. I only know at this point that I became aware of the problem about a month after being on doxepin at 25 mg.


>> Perhaps you could d/c the doxepin for a while and give hydroxyzine a try. What do you think?


I have thought of that. It's a possibility. I think I get more from the doxepin than just the antihisamine effect though - even just being on 25 mg. I initially got just the histamine effect but after being on it a while another level of assistance became apparent.


>>Or maybe he just hasn't been on the board recently?

> He has, nearly every day. I just don't like being ignored, it's rude. I wouldn't ignore him.


Sometimes people just miss posts or lose interest in the topic and so they don't follow up on the responses. Or, sometimes people are rude. I don't like it when my posts are ignored either. I never intentionally do that but I worry that I may have inadvertently not answered someone. For whatever reason your post wasn't answered, it's his loss. You're one of the most knowledgable and supportive posters here at Babble. To not make use of that is just foolish!!!

Take care, Ed.

 

Re: Tylenol » KaraS

Posted by ed_uk on March 16, 2005, at 9:10:35

In reply to Re: Tylenol » ed_uk, posted by KaraS on March 15, 2005, at 16:19:44

Hi Kara!

>I have thought of that. It's a possibility. I think I get more from the doxepin than just the antihisamine effect though - even just being on 25 mg. I initially got just the histamine effect but after being on it a while another level of assistance became apparent.

Do you benefit from Remeron? I vaguely remember that you tried it and gained weight, I might be confusing you with someone else though.

Best regards,
Ed xxx

 

Re: Tylenol

Posted by Jakeman on March 16, 2005, at 12:01:42

In reply to Re: Tylenol » KaraS, posted by ed_uk on March 12, 2005, at 17:14:02

> Hello,
>
> >Isn't acetaminophen dangerous when combined with alcohol?
>
> Yes, but it's not a problem if you don't drink! An occasional small drink is ok though. Why do you ask?
>
> As I said in my post, when acetaminophen is taken at the recommended dose, by people who do not have any contra-indications (alcoholism etc) it has a safety record which is much better than most drugs. It is far less likely to cause side effects than any of the drugs used in psychiatry!
>

The night-time cold medicine Nyquil contains both alcohol and acetaminophen. I guess it's a relatively small amount of alchohol.
- J

 

Re: Tylenol » ed_uk

Posted by KaraS on March 16, 2005, at 12:05:49

In reply to Re: Tylenol » KaraS, posted by ed_uk on March 16, 2005, at 9:10:35

> Hi Kara!
>
> >I have thought of that. It's a possibility. I think I get more from the doxepin than just the antihisamine effect though - even just being on 25 mg. I initially got just the histamine effect but after being on it a while another level of assistance became apparent.
>
> Do you benefit from Remeron? I vaguely remember that you tried it and gained weight, I might be confusing you with someone else though.
>
> Best regards,
> Ed xxx


Hi,
I've never tried Remeron. That's a possibility if there's no other way. I'm afraid of the weight gain.

K

 

Re: Tylenol » Jakeman

Posted by ed_uk on March 16, 2005, at 13:42:48

In reply to Re: Tylenol, posted by Jakeman on March 16, 2005, at 12:01:42

A small amount is ok :-)

Ed.

 

Re: Tylenol » KaraS

Posted by ed_uk on March 16, 2005, at 13:44:10

In reply to Re: Tylenol » ed_uk, posted by KaraS on March 16, 2005, at 12:05:49

Hello,

I think it might help you and it's not cardiotoxic. If you started to gain lots of weight in the first few weeks you could d/c it fast!

Ed x

 

Re: weight gain » ed_uk

Posted by KaraS on March 16, 2005, at 18:54:02

In reply to Re: Tylenol » KaraS, posted by ed_uk on March 16, 2005, at 13:44:10

> Hello,
>
> I think it might help you and it's not cardiotoxic. If you started to gain lots of weight in the first few weeks you could d/c it fast!
>
> Ed x

Ed,

It's a strong possibility at this point. How does it contribute to weight gain by the way? Does it slow metabolism as well as increase appetite? It seems that some people here claim to not be eating more and they may even be exercising, yet those pounds are piling on. I wonder how doxepin compares to Remeron in this respect as I'm already gaining weight. (These last two years I have been thin. For many years before that I had extra weight from these meds. I hate having to give up one of the very few good things in my life now!)

Also, if you don't mind my asking, how do SSRIs contribute to weight gain? Is it through increased appetite only? They don't have anihistaminic effect so I wonder what the mechanism is. I find it confusing that taking 5-htp or tryptophan has the opposite effect.

Thanks,
Kara

 

Re: weight gain » KaraS

Posted by ed_uk on March 17, 2005, at 9:30:46

In reply to Re: weight gain » ed_uk, posted by KaraS on March 16, 2005, at 18:54:02

Hi Kara!

There's hasn't been much research done into why ADs cause weight gain. Remeron probably causes weight gain mainly through increased appetite and decreased 'fullness' after meals. It might also decrease physical activity since it can be sedating. SSRIs often decrease appetite in the short term but may tend to increase it in the long run, it's *not* been well researched. With Remeron, weight gain tends to be rapid early in treatment, if you're going to gain weight you'll soon know about it! SSRIs are more insidious, many people loose a small amount of weight initially but pile on the pounds in the long run.

>I wonder how doxepin compares to Remeron in this respect as I'm already gaining weight.

Doxepin can be quite bad in the weight gain department so Remeron might not be much worse!

Ed x

 

Re: weight gain » ed_uk

Posted by KaraS on March 17, 2005, at 15:50:35

In reply to Re: weight gain » KaraS, posted by ed_uk on March 17, 2005, at 9:30:46

> Hi Kara!
>
> There's hasn't been much research done into why ADs cause weight gain. Remeron probably causes weight gain mainly through increased appetite and decreased 'fullness' after meals. It might also decrease physical activity since it can be sedating. SSRIs often decrease appetite in the short term but may tend to increase it in the long run, it's *not* been well researched. With Remeron, weight gain tends to be rapid early in treatment, if you're going to gain weight you'll soon know about it! SSRIs are more insidious, many people loose a small amount of weight initially but pile on the pounds in the long run.
>
> >I wonder how doxepin compares to Remeron in this respect as I'm already gaining weight.
>
> Doxepin can be quite bad in the weight gain department so Remeron might not be much worse!
>
> Ed x


That's what I've been wondering - how much worse could it be than doxepin. Doxepin is bad enough. We'll see what the next doctor I see recommends. I'm leaning towards Remeron for the short-term. Thanks for your help.

Kara

 

Re: Mirtazapine » KaraS

Posted by ed_uk on March 18, 2005, at 7:06:25

In reply to Re: weight gain » ed_uk, posted by KaraS on March 17, 2005, at 15:50:35

Hi!

>how much worse could it be than doxepin??

If you weight yourself regularly, you should be able to tell in the first few weeks of treatment. With Remeron, people usually seem to gain weight practically straight way or not at all. If you don't like it, you can always just dump it after a few weeks!

Ed x


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