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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 12 to 36 of 36. Go back in thread:
Posted by Shalom34Israel on November 16, 2004, at 18:36:05
In reply to Re: how do I support the brain's glia ????, posted by linkadge on November 15, 2004, at 10:42:05
> http://biopsychiatry.com/subgenual.html
>
>
> I'd go for ECT, but the doctors have a hard time administering it to a 21 year old.
Thats a bunch of bull. Youre just making up excuses to avoid ECT. Edocs will give ECT to a 21 year old just as they will to a 70 year old. Youre just plain scared of getting better.Shalom
Posted by Larry Hoover on November 16, 2004, at 22:56:09
In reply to Re: how do I support the brain's glia ????, posted by Shalom34Israel on November 16, 2004, at 18:36:05
> > http://biopsychiatry.com/subgenual.html
> >
> >
> > I'd go for ECT, but the doctors have a hard time administering it to a 21 year old.
>
>
> Thats a bunch of bull. Youre just making up excuses to avoid ECT. Edocs will give ECT to a 21 year old just as they will to a 70 year old. Youre just plain scared of getting better.
>
> ShalomPlease be civil in your posts to others. I wish I'd have mentioned it in regard to your last post, too. Please read the FAQ: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Posted by Dr. Bob on November 17, 2004, at 5:41:25
In reply to Re: how do I support the brain's glia ????, posted by Larry Hoover on November 16, 2004, at 22:56:09
Posted by linkadge on November 17, 2004, at 15:36:51
In reply to Re: thanks (nm) » Larry Hoover, posted by Dr. Bob on November 17, 2004, at 5:41:25
No they won't just give it to anybody around here. When mentioning it to my psychiatrist, he said the following. "You're too young. I want to try other drugs before I am responsible for some of the side effects that might follow"
It's not that they *won't*, they don't want to. It's not my decision, just like I can't walk into a dr.'s office and demand prozac.
By the way, do you know the poster named
"Psychquackery" ???Linkadge
Posted by Shalom34Israel on November 17, 2004, at 16:44:16
In reply to Re: how do I support the brain's glia ????, posted by Larry Hoover on November 16, 2004, at 22:56:09
> > > http://biopsychiatry.com/subgenual.html
> > >
> > >
> > > I'd go for ECT, but the doctors have a hard time administering it to a 21 year old.
> >
> >
> > Thats a bunch of bull. Youre just making up excuses to avoid ECT. Edocs will give ECT to a 21 year old just as they will to a 70 year old. Youre just plain scared of getting better.
> >
> > Shalom
>
> Please be civil in your posts to others. I wish I'd have mentioned it in regard to your last post, too. Please read the FAQ: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
>
>
It is just the honest truth that ECT is the best treatment for many of the severe mood disorders posters here have. The longer one puts it off, the more one suffers. There is no need for it.Shalom
Posted by Shalom34Israel on November 17, 2004, at 16:46:17
In reply to Re: thanks, posted by linkadge on November 17, 2004, at 15:36:51
> No they won't just give it to anybody around here. When mentioning it to my psychiatrist, he said the following. "You're too young. I want to try other drugs before I am responsible for some of the side effects that might follow"
>
> It's not that they *won't*, they don't want to. It's not my decision, just like I can't walk into a dr.'s office and demand prozac.
>
> By the way, do you know the poster named
> "Psychquackery" ???
>
>
>
> Linkadge
>
>
>
>Move out of Canada then. Come to America, get on welfare and medicaid and go to an American Edoc and get ECT.
Shalom
Posted by linkadge on November 17, 2004, at 18:55:39
In reply to Re: thanks, posted by Shalom34Israel on November 17, 2004, at 16:46:17
"Move out of Canada then. Come to America, get on welfare and medicaid and go to an American Edoc and get ECT."
These are some very challenging things to do. To make such drastic sacrifices it puts a lot of pressure and hope into the treatment. This does not help if it does not work.
Linkadge
Posted by Larry Hoover on November 17, 2004, at 22:33:03
In reply to Re: thanks, posted by linkadge on November 17, 2004, at 18:55:39
> "Move out of Canada then. Come to America, get on welfare and medicaid and go to an American Edoc and get ECT."
>
> These are some very challenging things to do. To make such drastic sacrifices it puts a lot of pressure and hope into the treatment. This does not help if it does not work.
>
>
> LinkadgeECT is quite readily available in Canada. It's not to be taken lightly, however. ECT seldom works for very long. The effects wear off in months, if it works at all.
Lar
Posted by Shalom34Israel on November 18, 2004, at 18:09:47
In reply to Re: thanks » linkadge, posted by Larry Hoover on November 17, 2004, at 22:33:03
> > "Move out of Canada then. Come to America, get on welfare and medicaid and go to an American Edoc and get ECT."
> >
> > These are some very challenging things to do. To make such drastic sacrifices it puts a lot of pressure and hope into the treatment. This does not help if it does not work.
> >
> >
> > Linkadge
>
> ECT is quite readily available in Canada. It's not to be taken lightly, however. ECT seldom works for very long. The effects wear off in months, if it works at all.
>
> LarSee...this guy could get ECT if he wanted, but he's scared like most are. Scared to get better. Stuck in nowheresville. What would you know about ECT, Larry?
Shalom
Posted by Larry Hoover on November 18, 2004, at 18:54:42
In reply to Re: thanks, posted by Shalom34Israel on November 18, 2004, at 18:09:47
> See...this guy could get ECT if he wanted, but he's scared like most are. Scared to get better. Stuck in nowheresville. What would you know about ECT, Larry?
>
> ShalomNow that's kind of an open-ended question, isn't it?
I know it has never been approved in the United States. It was grandfathered in, just as was trans-orbital frontal lobotomy. I know that the biggest proponent of ECT in America also sells the machines for giving it. I know that permanent damage to the brain is far from a rare event. And I know enough to have a "do not ECT" contract on file with my doctors. No matter how bad I get, even if I lose the capacity for consent and a substitute decision-maker steps in to consent to treatment, they may not use ECT. It is a document similar to a DNR "do not resuscitate" document. I have weighed the benefits and the risks, and for me, no ECT will be considered, under any circumstances.
Lar
Posted by Shalom34Israel on November 18, 2004, at 18:58:12
In reply to Re: ECT » Shalom34Israel, posted by Larry Hoover on November 18, 2004, at 18:54:42
> > See...this guy could get ECT if he wanted, but he's scared like most are. Scared to get better. Stuck in nowheresville. What would you know about ECT, Larry?
> >
> > Shalom
>
> Now that's kind of an open-ended question, isn't it?
>
> I know it has never been approved in the United States. It was grandfathered in, just as was trans-orbital frontal lobotomy. I know that the biggest proponent of ECT in America also sells the machines for giving it. I know that permanent damage to the brain is far from a rare event. And I know enough to have a "do not ECT" contract on file with my doctors. No matter how bad I get, even if I lose the capacity for consent and a substitute decision-maker steps in to consent to treatment, they may not use ECT. It is a document similar to a DNR "do not resuscitate" document. I have weighed the benefits and the risks, and for me, no ECT will be considered, under any circumstances.
>
> Lar
>so in other words youre a chicken shit wussy who would rather starve to death from catatonic depression than have ECT, right? It is used all the time in the USA, I have relatives there and I know for fact it is used a lot in USA.
Shalom
Posted by gromit on November 18, 2004, at 19:19:01
In reply to Re: ECT, posted by Shalom34Israel on November 18, 2004, at 18:58:12
> so in other words youre a chicken shit wussy who would rather starve to death from catatonic depression than have ECT, right? It is used all the time in the USA, I have relatives there and I know for fact it is used a lot in USA.
Wow your posts range from abrasive to downright offensive. Why are you flaming people who are just seeking some relief?
Rick
Posted by jujube on November 18, 2004, at 19:30:37
In reply to Re: ECT, posted by Shalom34Israel on November 18, 2004, at 18:58:12
You need to learn to respect people's opinions and their views on the best course of treatment for them as an individual, and stop being so antagonistic, judgemental and demeaning. That type of behaviour defeats the purpose of this board, which is to support and educate.
Posted by Shalom34Israel on November 18, 2004, at 20:27:32
In reply to Re: ECT » Shalom34Israel, posted by jujube on November 18, 2004, at 19:30:37
> You need to learn to respect people's opinions and their views on the best course of treatment for them as an individual, and stop being so antagonistic, judgemental and demeaning. That type of behaviour defeats the purpose of this board, which is to support and educate.
blah blah blah. Some of these people hang out on these boards for years. Most of them just need a lot of ECT, plain and simple. Cut thru the crap for a change, sometimes being supportive means being honest and telling people things they dont want to hear.Shalom
Posted by linkadge on November 18, 2004, at 20:46:51
In reply to Re: ECT, posted by Shalom34Israel on November 18, 2004, at 20:27:32
For starters. Having ECT or not having ECT does not determine the degree of courage that a patient has.
We all know that the greatest suffering in depression is not the side effects of ECT, but rather the suffering of depression itself.
So if you want to be completely logical, you are being more cowardly than me by having ECT done and eliminating your depression symptoms.
Secondly, calling people names such as wimpy or
cowardly says more about your own mental state than it does about anybody else's.This is not a contest, it is about weighing the risks and benefits of any treatment with your own specific symptoms.
There are medication combination that I want to still try before resorting to ECT.
As Larry informatively stated, ECT is certainly not the cure for depression.
In fact, I'd rather have a Steriotactic Subcaudate Tractonomy before I'd have ECT.
Linkadge
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 18, 2004, at 21:16:59
In reply to Re: ECT, posted by Shalom34Israel on November 18, 2004, at 20:27:32
S34I,
You wrote,[...blah blah blah...some of these people ...on these boards for years...most of them ...need a lot of ECT...].[...cut through the (expletive)...].
What were the facts, if any, that you use to state that ,[...most of them need a lot of ECT...].? If you could identify the factors that you used to make that conclusion that {...most of them need a lot of ECT...}, then I could have the opportunity to respond accordingly.
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 18, 2004, at 22:03:10
In reply to Re: ECT, posted by Shalom34Israel on November 18, 2004, at 20:27:32
S34I,
You wrote,[...being supportive means sometimes to be honest and tell people things they don't want to hear...].
I believe wholeheartedly in {honest} discussion. But I also believe that conclusions are better able to be received by others if there are facts to support the conclusion. Could you cite some research articles about ECT that could support that[... ECT is needed for most people that hang out on these boards...]? If you could, then I could have the opportunity to respond accordingly.
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 18, 2004, at 22:18:00
In reply to Re: ECT, posted by Shalom34Israel on November 18, 2004, at 20:27:32
S34I,
Below is a link to some research on ECT. I would like for anyone interested to take into consideration some of the medcal citations in the article for possible discussion here.
Lou
http://www.psycom.net/depression.central.ect.memory.html
Posted by gardenergirl on November 18, 2004, at 22:55:14
In reply to Re: ECT, posted by Shalom34Israel on November 18, 2004, at 20:27:32
> sometimes being supportive means being honest and telling people things they dont want to hear.
Um, this is not one of those times.
gg
Posted by Dr. Bob on November 19, 2004, at 1:01:51
In reply to Re: thanks, posted by Shalom34Israel on November 18, 2004, at 18:09:47
> he's scared like most are. Scared to get better. Stuck in nowheresville.
Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down. You've been asked to be civil before, so now I'm going to block you from posting for a week.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration. They, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by SLS on November 20, 2004, at 10:33:53
In reply to Lou's response to Shalom34sraeI-vyio3 » Shalom34Israel, posted by Lou Pilder on November 18, 2004, at 22:18:00
> S34I,
> Below is a link to some research on ECT. I would like for anyone interested to take into consideration some of the medcal citations in the article for possible discussion here.
> Lou
> http://www.psycom.net/depression.central.ect.memory.html
Hi Lou.What did you think?
I received a series of 15 treatments in 1991. I suffer from poor short term memory, but have long thought that it was a symptom of depression rather than a side-effect from ECT. I might be in denial that my decision to undergo ECT has resulted in permanent cognitive impairment. I really don't know. The treatments didn't work for me.
- Scott
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 20, 2004, at 11:35:33
In reply to Re: Lou's response to Shalom34sraeI-vyio3, posted by SLS on November 20, 2004, at 10:33:53
Scott,
I have some great research citations and reports concerning your question. It will take me some time to locate them and be able to cite them to you. I lookforward to getting back to you
Best regards,
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 21, 2004, at 13:37:55
In reply to Re: Lou's response to Shalom34sraeI-vyio3, posted by SLS on November 20, 2004, at 10:33:53
Scott,
Below is a report as you requested.
Lou
http://www.ect.org/effects/testimony.html
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 21, 2004, at 14:41:30
In reply to Re: Lou's response to Shalom34sraeI-vyio3, posted by SLS on November 20, 2004, at 10:33:53
Posted by SLS on November 21, 2004, at 16:43:08
In reply to Lou's reply to Scott-ect-memryloss?-2 » SLS, posted by Lou Pilder on November 21, 2004, at 14:41:30
This is the end of the thread.
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