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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 8 of 8. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Michael Bell on May 21, 2004, at 18:59:43
I know this has been addressed before, but I'm trying to get a handle on everything. So this is a poll. For those who have tried both Dexedrine and Adderall, I have the following question. I have rather social phobia, the anxiety symptoms of which are controlled by klonopin. Now, I currently supplement with adderall as I heard the combo is quite prosocial, but it just makes me hyperfocused and somewhat less social for some reason.
How did the dexedrine make you feel compared to adderall?
Also, if adderall is prosocial for you, what other meds are you taking with it?
Finally, random question. Why the hell does only two or three beers make me EXTREMELY social and fix the whole reward deficit issue? I mean, I know alcohol has effects on many different neuro systems, but what do you think is the primary reason for it's prosocial effects? (I'm thinking opioids)
Sorry to throw so many questions at you. Good luck to you all.
Posted by chemist on May 21, 2004, at 22:44:38
In reply to adderall and dexedrine - poll, posted by Michael Bell on May 21, 2004, at 18:59:43
> I know this has been addressed before, but I'm trying to get a handle on everything. So this is a poll. For those who have tried both Dexedrine and Adderall, I have the following question. I have rather social phobia, the anxiety symptoms of which are controlled by klonopin. Now, I currently supplement with adderall as I heard the combo is quite prosocial, but it just makes me hyperfocused and somewhat less social for some reason.
>
> How did the dexedrine make you feel compared to adderall?
>
> Also, if adderall is prosocial for you, what other meds are you taking with it?
>
> Finally, random question. Why the hell does only two or three beers make me EXTREMELY social and fix the whole reward deficit issue? I mean, I know alcohol has effects on many different neuro systems, but what do you think is the primary reason for it's prosocial effects? (I'm thinking opioids)
>
> Sorry to throw so many questions at you. Good luck to you all.
>hello there, from chemist....think GABA, not kappa, mu, or other opiod receptors in re: ethanol. i am a fan of dexedrine, and have not bothered with adderall. ethanol hits many, many receptors and the entire mechanistic scheme remains an unsolved mystery. but it's GABA flooding that is likely the answer (i qualify this with evidence of dopaminergic agonism, if memory serves).....all the best, chemist
Posted by btnd on May 22, 2004, at 1:47:56
In reply to Re: adderall and dexedrine - poll » Michael Bell, posted by chemist on May 21, 2004, at 22:44:38
> > I know this has been addressed before, but I'm trying to get a handle on everything. So this is a poll. For those who have tried both Dexedrine and Adderall, I have the following question. I have rather social phobia, the anxiety symptoms of which are controlled by klonopin. Now, I currently supplement with adderall as I heard the combo is quite prosocial, but it just makes me hyperfocused and somewhat less social for some reason.
Yeah, amphetamines do have that effect on me too. That's why my regime is adding GHB every 2-3 hours to Adderall - it increases sociability 1000x .
(+ also Klonopin 2mg)
> > Also, if adderall is prosocial for you, what other meds are you taking with it?Well I'm still taking Amisulpride, at 25mg/day, although since it pooped out some time ago - it has no effect on me. But I still have hopes for it (I keep changing the doses and use NDMA antagonists)
> > Finally, random question. Why the hell does only two or three beers make me EXTREMELY social and fix the whole reward deficit issue? I mean, I know alcohol has effects on many different neuro systems, but what do you think is the primary reason for it's prosocial effects? (I'm thinking opioids)
> >
> > Sorry to throw so many questions at you. Good luck to you all.
> >
>
> hello there, from chemist....think GABA, not kappa, mu, or other opiod receptors in re: ethanol. ethanol hits many, many receptors and the entire mechanistic scheme remains an unsolved mystery. but it's GABA flooding that is likely the answer (i qualify this with evidence of dopaminergic agonism, if memory serves).....all the best, chemist
I totally disagree. Alcohol's prosocial effect can't be simply explained by GABA action - it must be few things combined - GABA, some dopamine stimulation maybe or opioid. Why do I think GABA isn't the only reason? Because benzodiazepines, even the most potent, which are potent GABA agonists and increase GABA levels - have nowhere near the effect that good old alcohol has on person's prosociability. Also Picamilon/Phenibut are GABA-like substances, which although treat anxiety, once again: they are not pro-sociable as alcohol. The only thing that is comparable to alcohol's action is GHB(Xyrem) - but there are 2 mechanisms involved: dopamine and GABA.
Mike - I wish too that I knew alcohol's mechanism! 3 beer effect is still the best thing on earth for social-anxiety, pro-sociability etc.
Although my new combo of Adderall+GHB is doing rather well, I'd say at 75% level of alcohol's action. (one substance potentiates the other)
Posted by btnd on May 22, 2004, at 1:54:56
In reply to Adderall, Alcohol, GHB(Xyrem), Benzos and GABA » chemist, posted by btnd on May 22, 2004, at 1:47:56
Also, if adderall is prosocial for you, what other meds are you taking with it?
Well, to be perfectly honest, besides Amisulpride I'm also experimenting recently with 900mg of St.John's Wort, but mostly for smoking cessation, although it does have some nice studies showing GABA(A)/(B) agonism and cortisol lowering. 16 days on it, not really feel effects as far as anxiety and mood, but I've finally dropped the cigs after 4 yrs! ;-)Oh, and Selegiline (Deprenyl) 5mg/every other day. For its anti-aging purposes.
Posted by chemist on May 22, 2004, at 2:06:01
In reply to Adderall, Alcohol, GHB(Xyrem), Benzos and GABA » chemist, posted by btnd on May 22, 2004, at 1:47:56
> > > I know this has been addressed before, but I'm trying to get a handle on everything. So this is a poll. For those who have tried both Dexedrine and Adderall, I have the following question. I have rather social phobia, the anxiety symptoms of which are controlled by klonopin. Now, I currently supplement with adderall as I heard the combo is quite prosocial, but it just makes me hyperfocused and somewhat less social for some reason.
>
>
> Yeah, amphetamines do have that effect on me too. That's why my regime is adding GHB every 2-3 hours to Adderall - it increases sociability 1000x .
> (+ also Klonopin 2mg)
>
>
> > > Also, if adderall is prosocial for you, what other meds are you taking with it?
>
> Well I'm still taking Amisulpride, at 25mg/day, although since it pooped out some time ago - it has no effect on me. But I still have hopes for it (I keep changing the doses and use NDMA antagonists)
>
>
> > > Finally, random question. Why the hell does only two or three beers make me EXTREMELY social and fix the whole reward deficit issue? I mean, I know alcohol has effects on many different neuro systems, but what do you think is the primary reason for it's prosocial effects? (I'm thinking opioids)
> > >
> > > Sorry to throw so many questions at you. Good luck to you all.
> > >
> >
> > hello there, from chemist....think GABA, not kappa, mu, or other opiod receptors in re: ethanol. ethanol hits many, many receptors and the entire mechanistic scheme remains an unsolved mystery. but it's GABA flooding that is likely the answer (i qualify this with evidence of dopaminergic agonism, if memory serves).....all the best, chemist
>
>
> I totally disagree. Alcohol's prosocial effect can't be simply explained by GABA action - it must be few things combined - GABA, some dopamine stimulation maybe or opioid. Why do I think GABA isn't the only reason? Because benzodiazepines, even the most potent, which are potent GABA agonists and increase GABA levels - have nowhere near the effect that good old alcohol has on person's prosociability. Also Picamilon/Phenibut are GABA-like substances, which although treat anxiety, once again: they are not pro-sociable as alcohol. The only thing that is comparable to alcohol's action is GHB(Xyrem) - but there are 2 mechanisms involved: dopamine and GABA.
> Mike - I wish too that I knew alcohol's mechanism! 3 beer effect is still the best thing on earth for social-anxiety, pro-sociability etc.
> Although my new combo of Adderall+GHB is doing rather well, I'd say at 75% level of alcohol's action. (one substance potentiates the other)
>
chemist here....the most commonly used class of medications for alcohol withdrawl are benzodiazepines. barbituates are a second-line therapy, and that does indicate that opiod receptors are important, but not in the way you assert: they are targeted to relieve physical symptoms of alcohol withdrawl. while i am in the dark about dopaminergic effects, all signs point to the ligand binding domain in the GABA receptor in question.....all the best, chemist
>
>
Posted by Caper on May 22, 2004, at 3:23:18
In reply to adderall and dexedrine - poll, posted by Michael Bell on May 21, 2004, at 18:59:43
Just couldn't help noticing your post had a "self-medicating" aspect to it (your remark that 2 or 3 beers helped your social issues a lot). You didn't say you used alcohol regularly for that, but (just in case) I still just had to say.....
Please, please, do not turn to alcohol for that. I'm currently trying to get my alcoholism under control (and I only started drinking regularly 16 months ago and I'm 31!) and it is so hard. Sometimes I feel I'm in hell. So please don't get into the habit of using alcohol to loosen your social inhibitions. Maybe you won't become addicted but it is easier to develop a dependence than you might think (it really sneaks up on you) and it is absolutely horrible to be an alcoholic.
I'm not saying don't drink, but just be careful and try not to substitute alcohol for the proper medication, even if it takes some more experimentation to find the right med.
Sorry if I sound preachy, but I just don't want anyone to fall into the trap I did.
Good luck!
Caper
P.S. My brother had success with a combo of Paxil and Klonopin for his social phobia.
> I know this has been addressed before, but I'm trying to get a handle on everything. So this is a poll. For those who have tried both Dexedrine and Adderall, I have the following question. I have rather social phobia, the anxiety symptoms of which are controlled by klonopin. Now, I currently supplement with adderall as I heard the combo is quite prosocial, but it just makes me hyperfocused and somewhat less social for some reason.
>
> How did the dexedrine make you feel compared to adderall?
>
> Also, if adderall is prosocial for you, what other meds are you taking with it?
>
> Finally, random question. Why the hell does only two or three beers make me EXTREMELY social and fix the whole reward deficit issue? I mean, I know alcohol has effects on many different neuro systems, but what do you think is the primary reason for it's prosocial effects? (I'm thinking opioids)
>
> Sorry to throw so many questions at you. Good luck to you all.
>
Posted by Michael Bell on May 25, 2004, at 23:37:49
In reply to Adderall, Alcohol, GHB(Xyrem), Benzos and GABA » chemist, posted by btnd on May 22, 2004, at 1:47:56
Thanks for the response. Does the Xyrem wear off that quickly that you have to take it every two-three hours? Have you experienced any tolerance to it?
Also, how does adderall+xyrem compare with Nardil for social phobia?
> > > I know this has been addressed before, but I'm trying to get a handle on everything. So this is a poll. For those who have tried both Dexedrine and Adderall, I have the following question. I have rather social phobia, the anxiety symptoms of which are controlled by klonopin. Now, I currently supplement with adderall as I heard the combo is quite prosocial, but it just makes me hyperfocused and somewhat less social for some reason.
>
>
> Yeah, amphetamines do have that effect on me too. That's why my regime is adding GHB every 2-3 hours to Adderall - it increases sociability 1000x .
> (+ also Klonopin 2mg)
>
>
> > > Also, if adderall is prosocial for you, what other meds are you taking with it?
>
> Well I'm still taking Amisulpride, at 25mg/day, although since it pooped out some time ago - it has no effect on me. But I still have hopes for it (I keep changing the doses and use NDMA antagonists)
>
>
> > > Finally, random question. Why the hell does only two or three beers make me EXTREMELY social and fix the whole reward deficit issue? I mean, I know alcohol has effects on many different neuro systems, but what do you think is the primary reason for it's prosocial effects? (I'm thinking opioids)
> > >
> > > Sorry to throw so many questions at you. Good luck to you all.
> > >
> >
> > hello there, from chemist....think GABA, not kappa, mu, or other opiod receptors in re: ethanol. ethanol hits many, many receptors and the entire mechanistic scheme remains an unsolved mystery. but it's GABA flooding that is likely the answer (i qualify this with evidence of dopaminergic agonism, if memory serves).....all the best, chemist
>
>
> I totally disagree. Alcohol's prosocial effect can't be simply explained by GABA action - it must be few things combined - GABA, some dopamine stimulation maybe or opioid. Why do I think GABA isn't the only reason? Because benzodiazepines, even the most potent, which are potent GABA agonists and increase GABA levels - have nowhere near the effect that good old alcohol has on person's prosociability. Also Picamilon/Phenibut are GABA-like substances, which although treat anxiety, once again: they are not pro-sociable as alcohol. The only thing that is comparable to alcohol's action is GHB(Xyrem) - but there are 2 mechanisms involved: dopamine and GABA.
> Mike - I wish too that I knew alcohol's mechanism! 3 beer effect is still the best thing on earth for social-anxiety, pro-sociability etc.
> Although my new combo of Adderall+GHB is doing rather well, I'd say at 75% level of alcohol's action. (one substance potentiates the other)
>
>
>
Posted by btnd on May 26, 2004, at 5:10:54
In reply to Re: Adderall, Alcohol, GHB(Xyrem), Benzos and GABA » btnd, posted by Michael Bell on May 25, 2004, at 23:37:49
>Does the Xyrem wear off that quickly that you have to take it every two-three hours?
Exactly.
>Have you experienced any tolerance to it?
Nope. Same 3g dose works every single time.
> Also, how does adderall+xyrem compare with Nardil for social phobia?
I've no idea, since I've never tried Nardil. But it definitely has no side-effects which Nardil has. Actually I experience no side-effects at all with adderall+xyrem combo.
This is the end of the thread.
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