Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 116217

Shown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.

 

Foul mouth taste and no sleep -- Help! (long)

Posted by menolly57 on August 12, 2002, at 21:45:08

I have this foul taste in my mouth that I have been dealing with off and on for several weeks now, and I'm sure it's related to my medication. The problem is that I've changed my medication combo several times now and the bad taste keeps coming back. And I'm having a lot of trouble sleeping too. (Sorry -- this is gonna be long and complex.)

I was on Effexor XR for several years without problems, and for about a year and a half I was also on Trazodone to help me sleep, also without problems. (I should also say that I've been on Claritin-D-24 Hour and Flonase for many years now without problems.) However, when the Effexor seemed to stop working I changed to Paxil, which helped me sleep but also facilitated a weight gain of 20 pounds.

So I went on a combination of Prozac and Desipramine with Trazodone at night. All seemed to be well for about a month, but then I started getting this foul taste in my mouth which built up slowly but became constant and unbearable. Thinking it might be the Trazodone but wanting to sleep, I started taking only half a pill. The taste went away for a couple of days, but then it came right back. So I stopped the Trazodone completely, but the same taste came back and now I could not sleep either.

I told my doctor about this and he said he thought it was the Desipramine, and he replaced it with Wellbutrin, keeping the Prozac in place and putting me back on the Trazodone. Again, the taste subsided for a few days but came back. So I stopped the Trazodone and went on Ambien (on which I got only half a night's sleep) and then Temzepam (which worked for about two weeks but now only works half the night). The taste went away for several days this time, and I hoped maybe I was rid of it. But then I started noticing it flare up after I ate a meal, and it got progessively worse until now I have the awful taste full strength, all day, every day.

I'm seeing my shrink on Thursday, but I think I already know what he's going to say -- that none of the medications that I am on are known to cause bad taste in the mouth (including the Prozac, which is the only medication left from the original troublesome combo). But this taste is very strong and very real. It is damaging my quality of life because it is so strong I can barely think of anything else. (I have to find a job AND a new housemate, and this is very inconvenient to deal with as well.) I have a persistent urge to eat and drink so I can mask the taste, but the relief it gives me only lasts between a few seconds and a few minutes. A "3 Hour" Arm & Hammer breath mint only gives me 10 minutes of relief, if I'm lucky. Same with lemon drops. I try not to think about it but I haven't succeeded so far. I have this constant feeling like something died in my mouth and that is hard to ignore (for me, at least).

I've looked at this board a bit, and I've only seen one or two people complain about taste, and if there is helpful info here, I haven't seen it. I am getting desperate, and I sometimes worry that my body chemistry has changed permanently and I'll be stuck with this for life. That's a pretty bleak prospect, and I hope I'm wrong. I also wonder how I'll ever be able to get a full night's sleep when the only medication that allows me to do so gives me this awful sensation. I also worry because the Prozac/Wellbutrin combo seems to work well for me in terms of my mood, but the constant bad taste almost negates the benefits.

I don't know if anyone will respond to this post or if anyone here knows anything that might help me. I just felt like I had to tell this to someone other than my psychiatrist, who seems to be somewhat opinionated and set in his ways, though he does care and tries to help.

I don't know what to do and I need advice. If you don't have any, thanks anyway for listening to my babbling. (This is my first post here, so please be nice to me!)

 

Re: Foul mouth taste and no sleep -- Help! (long) » menolly57

Posted by nikioct73 on August 13, 2002, at 21:42:57

In reply to Foul mouth taste and no sleep -- Help! (long), posted by menolly57 on August 12, 2002, at 21:45:08

Hi..have you tried to tell you Primary MD about this issue??...maybe seen and ENT?..(ear's nose and throat)..If you trust you Pdoc and what he thinks in reguards to it not being your med's..(did he schedule blood work and/or drug levels..to rule out toxicity..)...maybe it is time to look at other things being the cause. ..You could try looking up side effects online through a search engine..( I like Google the best..)You sound miserable..and that sucks..:(
I wish you Good luck..

Niki

 

Try a tongue scraper

Posted by Christina on August 14, 2002, at 14:02:45

In reply to Foul mouth taste and no sleep -- Help! (long), posted by menolly57 on August 12, 2002, at 21:45:08

I can't help with the insomnia, but give this a try for the bad taste...

I get serious dry mouth and a bad taste in my mouth from my meds.

I use a tongue scraper to help remove some of the white film on my tongue, that for some reason a toothbrush will not remove.

I use it twice a day, and rinse with a mouthwash that does NOT contain alcohol, as alcohol can be very drying.

You may need to go to a health food store to find both of these products.

Good luck!

 

Re: Try a tongue scraper

Posted by sleepy lizard on August 14, 2002, at 22:15:34

In reply to Try a tongue scraper, posted by Christina on August 14, 2002, at 14:02:45

True, I use a (stainless steel) tongue scaper too and it works great. Also I use neem oil or neem toothpaste, which is slightly bitter, but it helps too, and less tooth tarter. (Sweet encourages saliva and tooth tarter.) You can order these things from www.ayurveda.com

 

Re: Try a tongue scraper

Posted by DiscoPuppy on August 16, 2002, at 11:00:42

In reply to Re: Try a tongue scraper, posted by sleepy lizard on August 14, 2002, at 22:15:34

I can sooooooooooooo relate to this!!! I have the same problem. I've tried tongue scrapers, artificial antibacterial saliva, brush my teeth a million times a day, mouthwash. . . everything. Nothing seems to work.

I have dry mouth and icky mouth taste associated with the use of Dexedrine (it was worse when I was on Adderall).

It's very frustrating because chewing gum is not really professionally appropriate at times when I'm at work.

Please let me know if anyone has other ideas.

 

Re: Try a tongue scraper

Posted by sleepy lizard on August 17, 2002, at 6:39:50

In reply to Re: Try a tongue scraper, posted by DiscoPuppy on August 16, 2002, at 11:00:42

Yes, the tongue scraper only help a little, the bad taste is still there. After reading a little about AD medications, I've discovered that taste perversion is one of the side effects for some of them. It sounds like it is due to an action in the brain. I get a feeling that it will only go away with discontinuation of the drug or with use of an antidote. I don't know of any antidote.

 

Re: Try a tongue scraper

Posted by Seamus2 on August 17, 2002, at 10:02:51

In reply to Re: Try a tongue scraper, posted by sleepy lizard on August 17, 2002, at 6:39:50

http://www.rxlist.com/cgi/generic3/salagen_ids.htm

You might be able to find Jaborandi (Pilocarpus jabora), the herb from which it's derived, at a health food store.

A long time ago I made what I called "spitty tea" out of it for cotton mouth induced by, well, you know.... <g>

 

Re: Try a tongue scraper - Thanks!

Posted by menolly57 on August 18, 2002, at 17:05:24

In reply to Re: Try a tongue scraper, posted by sleepy lizard on August 17, 2002, at 6:39:50

Thanks guys! I thought for a while that maybe my post was too long to get much of a response.

I could try the tongue scraper, but I doubt it will help very much because it feels like this bad-tasing substance is being secreted from all over the inside of my mouth, and not just from the tongue. (How can I tell? I just can.) But I should probably have one of those scrapers anyway.

Sleepy lizard, which meds did you find have bad taste as a side effect? I know about Desipramine and Trazodone, but I don't know about Prozac, Wellbutrin, or Claritin for that matter. Do you know anything more about this "action in the brain?" Might it have something to do with food?

I have also tried mouthwashes, mints, tooth brushing and Italian ice (yes -- that helps too!), but all of these only provide temporary relief. I was hoping to get to the bottom of the problem, but it looks like I may be stuck with it for the time being. As I said, my present combo seems to do well for me in terms of mood, so I don't want to try something else until I at least get a job and a housemate.

I think I am going to go back on the Trazodone. I'm getting the bad taste anyway, and I might as well take something that lets me sleep.

Thanks again and take care everyone! :)

 

Re: Try a tongue scraper - Thanks!

Posted by sleepy lizard on August 20, 2002, at 1:15:53

In reply to Re: Try a tongue scraper - Thanks!, posted by menolly57 on August 18, 2002, at 17:05:24

I read that Prozac, Wellbutrin, and Effexor will cause taste perversion. I have experienced it with the combination of Effexor with Wellbutrin so I'm not sure which causes it. I've also got dry mouth (the two together, yuk!) so i've been chewing jucy fruit gum, and getting jaw cramps. You know...it's always something.

 

Re: How to Help with Dry Mouth » sleepy lizard

Posted by IsoM on August 21, 2002, at 13:46:12

In reply to Re: Try a tongue scraper - Thanks!, posted by sleepy lizard on August 20, 2002, at 1:15:53

Try Biotene toothpaste - it counters dry mouth from meds. Avoid Juicy Fruit gum, it'll ruin your teeth, use a xylitol gum like Trident Caries Control instead - increases my saliva secretion too.
http://www.biotenekits.com/products.html

 

Re: How to Help with Dry Mouth

Posted by Seamus2 on August 21, 2002, at 22:53:53

In reply to Re: How to Help with Dry Mouth » sleepy lizard, posted by IsoM on August 21, 2002, at 13:46:12

Does that Biotene toothpaste have SLS in it?

Alas, here in US it might be formulated differently.

A friend gets mouth ulcers at the drop of hat under a wee too much stress (it's so completely predictable it's funny) and I noted your aversion to SLS in another thread. Thought it might be worth trying...

(and no, the hat isn't under too much stress, but the author has had a couple drinks!)

 

Re: How to Help with Dry Mouth » IsoM

Posted by sleepy lizard on August 22, 2002, at 22:35:13

In reply to Re: How to Help with Dry Mouth » sleepy lizard, posted by IsoM on August 21, 2002, at 13:46:12

Thanks, Iso, for the tip on the Biotene, it looks like a good solution. I was chewing sugar gum because the artificial sweetners give me gas. I'm looking for gum with stevia.

 

Re: Gas and Gum » sleepy lizard

Posted by IsoM on August 23, 2002, at 0:53:56

In reply to Re: How to Help with Dry Mouth » IsoM, posted by sleepy lizard on August 22, 2002, at 22:35:13

Glad to help. I doubt that xylitol sweetened gum will give you gas. Xylitol is a natural sugar-alcohol (the -ol ending is a dead giveaway) that is known to prevent dental caries. Even if you chew it for a brief while & then spit it out, it'll help remove that dry mouth feeling for quite a while. Give it a try - just look for Trident's Caries Control gum.

 

Re: Try a tongue scraper - Thanks!

Posted by BLPBart on August 23, 2002, at 1:31:59

In reply to Re: Try a tongue scraper - Thanks!, posted by menolly57 on August 18, 2002, at 17:05:24

> Thanks guys! I thought for a while that maybe my post was too long to get much of a response.
>
> I could try the tongue scraper, but I doubt it will help very much because it feels like this bad-tasing substance is being secreted from all over the inside of my mouth, and not just from the tongue. (How can I tell? I just can.) But I should probably have one of those scrapers anyway.
>
> Sleepy lizard, which meds did you find have bad taste as a side effect? I know about Desipramine and Trazodone, but I don't know about Prozac, Wellbutrin, or Claritin for that matter. Do you know anything more about this "action in the brain?" Might it have something to do with food?
>
> I have also tried mouthwashes, mints, tooth brushing and Italian ice (yes -- that helps too!), but all of these only provide temporary relief. I was hoping to get to the bottom of the problem, but it looks like I may be stuck with it for the time being. As I said, my present combo seems to do well for me in terms of mood, so I don't want to try something else until I at least get a job and a housemate.
>
> I think I am going to go back on the Trazodone. I'm getting the bad taste anyway, and I might as well take something that lets me sleep.
>
> Thanks again and take care everyone! :)
>

This is sounding somewhat familiar. I used to take prozac and wellbutrin but quit the wellbutrin after having some severe side effects. I then started a combination of wellbutrin and dexedrine. Everything was going well for a few months and then suddenly (this was early June) I started having what appeared to be severe post-nasal drip. I went back on my claritin which I only take when needed but it didn't help at all. I found that I was feeling inundated with post nasal drip and then my tongue got extremely painful (I described it to my husband like I had used acid for mouthwash). The top of my tongue got inflamed and all of the tastebuds, particularly on the back of my mouth were white and swollen. I tried experimenting with my meds to see if I could see what was causing it. I eventually came to the conclusion that it was due to the wellbutrin/dex combo. Either one alone caused some dry mouth but it was manageable. The combination was too much. My doc took me off the wellbutrin a few weeks ago and we're waiting to see if the dex alone will do the trick for me. Now I'm having a little problem with the post nasal drip and some dry mouth but I've used some of the ideas in the earlier posts - I use Biotene toothpast, suck on sugarless candy at work or chew sugarless gum and use a non-alcoholic mouth wash.

BTW, when you mentioned the claritin it made me wonder if you could possibly be suffering from a sinus infection. I've had these in the past and you'll have a horrible taste in your mouth from it and can also cause bad breath.

 

Re: Gas and Gum » IsoM

Posted by sleepy lizard on August 23, 2002, at 10:07:13

In reply to Re: Gas and Gum » sleepy lizard, posted by IsoM on August 23, 2002, at 0:53:56

I guess it depends on the amount of xylitol and the sensitivity of the person. Those sugar alcohols bother me a lot. This comment is from: http://www.pharmcentral.com/sugars.htm

"The sugar alcohols include sorbitol, mannitol, xylitol, maltitol, and lactitol, and other similar open-chain compounds. Sugar alcohols are linear poly alcohols, as opposed to cyclic poly-alcohols (formal sugars). The linear form affects the ability of the body's enzymes to oxidize or "burn" the molecule; hence these compounds typically havefewer calories per gram than their cyclic brethren. Chemically, what this meas is that the energy stored in the ether bond and the strain energy of the chair configuration has been spent before the enzyme sees the molecule. (Absorption into the blood probably also plays a role.) Because taste is a function of molecular structure, and because evolution has favored animals who preferred more calorific compounds, the sugar alcohols are also less sweet than their cyclic counterparts."
"Sugar alcohols are found naturally in fruits and other foods and are often used as "low-calorie" sweeteners in dietetic foods and as bulking or "texturing" agents. Foods high in these compounds often produce abdominal gas and diarrhea."

 

VERY important- dry mouth strategies

Posted by utopizen on August 23, 2002, at 14:41:57

In reply to Re: How to Help with Dry Mouth » sleepy lizard, posted by IsoM on August 21, 2002, at 13:46:12

Salagen works, most of the time. Particular drugs, like Adderall, may require more of a fight in popping them- but generally 3-4 times a day could work. GET SALAGEN, or it's newer competitor, I forgot the name. TAKE IT! It's expensive, my insurance charged me $25 for it, which it never did before- and I get many pills!

Just remember to make sure you brush your tongue, and only use biotene toothpaste and a flouride rinse.. and biotene mouthwash.

Get Colgate Flouride Rinse from your pharmacy. Yes, it's expensive, but my dentist said I really need it, or my teeth will rot. It's like $12, for a big bottle. Rinse once every other night.

And the Harvard Medical Journal DISPROVED the tongue scraper theory. It is proven NO MORE EFFECTIVE than a toothbrush on your tongue. And this is coming from the foremost expert on bad breath. Eww. Anyway, good excuse now not to have just an embarassing tool in your bathroom! =)

 

Re: Gas and Gum » sleepy lizard

Posted by IsoM on August 23, 2002, at 15:42:18

In reply to Re: Gas and Gum » IsoM, posted by sleepy lizard on August 23, 2002, at 10:07:13

Thanks for the link. It's probably because it's used in bulk in some foods that it causes gas & intestinal problems. Any additives to food that's not digestible tends to do so, like fibre for people used to bland diets. So even small amounts like that found in gum will give you gas? You may be more sensitive to it or me, less so.

 

Re: Gas and Gum » IsoM

Posted by sleepy lizard on August 24, 2002, at 18:57:47

In reply to Re: Gas and Gum » sleepy lizard, posted by IsoM on August 23, 2002, at 15:42:18

Yes, I couldn't believe it. Everytime I chewed Peelu or Carefree sugarless gums (two pieces usually) I got gas. When I chew regular gum, no gas.


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