Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 64287

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Navane and Paranoid Schizophrenia

Posted by Thrud on May 25, 2001, at 22:22:59

Hi all.

My mother suffers from paranoid schizophrenia and has been on the drug Navane for over a year. I cannot remember the drugs she was on before that, but they were antipsychotics.
She has tardive dyskenesia and I think it is getting progressively worse. Is Navane known to cause this? If so, are there other effective drugs that do not cause TD? Many people on this board extol Zyprexa. Is it used for paranoid schizophrenia? What options does she have?
Thank you very much.

Thrud

 

Re: Navane and Paranoid Schizophrenia

Posted by willow on May 26, 2001, at 20:55:29

In reply to Navane and Paranoid Schizophrenia, posted by Thrud on May 25, 2001, at 22:22:59

Thrud

I've met another lady on this board who has a mother with schizophrenia. My father has had this illness for about 25 years. I don't know how much advice I can give because my understanding is that men and woman are treated with different dosages. My dad is getting up in age and his illness mostly only shows the negative symptoms now, plus severe TD after years of meds. Having said this he swears by Zyprexa. He is on a low dose, maybe 10 or 15mg. He was switched from the one psych to another because of his TD. He also has a nurse who he has seen for many years at a mental health clinic. How much support does your mom have in her community?

I've never heard of Navane.

Willow

 

Re: Navane -Willow

Posted by Thrud on May 27, 2001, at 4:17:24

In reply to Re: Navane and Paranoid Schizophrenia, posted by willow on May 26, 2001, at 20:55:29

Hi Willow.

Navane is one of the older "typical" antipsychotics. Apparently it has a reputation of being "powerful" which is probably why it has been prescribed. She has been on various antipsychotics for over 25 years but I was very surprised to hear that she has not been tried on one of the newer "atypical" ones like Zyprexa.It breaks my heart to see her trembling, and hear that it even interferes with her sleep. I am trying to get my Dad to take her to the pdoc and try one of the atypicals. He is hesitant though for good reason: part of my mothers paranoia is that people are out to "put her in a mental home" and regards any attempt to change medication as a move in that direction.
Do you know which of the atypicals is best for paranoid symptoms? Navane controls the hallucinations but not the paranoia. She also seems depressed. Do any of these have an antidepressant effect as well?
Thanks.

Thrud

 

Cam please help? (np)

Posted by Willow on May 27, 2001, at 21:20:10

In reply to Re: Navane -Willow, posted by Thrud on May 27, 2001, at 4:17:24

> Hi Willow.
>
> Navane is one of the older "typical" antipsychotics. Apparently it has a reputation of being "powerful" which is probably why it has been prescribed. She has been on various antipsychotics for over 25 years but I was very surprised to hear that she has not been tried on one of the newer "atypical" ones like Zyprexa.It breaks my heart to see her trembling, and hear that it even interferes with her sleep. I am trying to get my Dad to take her to the pdoc and try one of the atypicals. He is hesitant though for good reason: part of my mothers paranoia is that people are out to "put her in a mental home" and regards any attempt to change medication as a move in that direction.
> Do you know which of the atypicals is best for paranoid symptoms? Navane controls the hallucinations but not the paranoia. She also seems depressed. Do any of these have an antidepressant effect as well?
> Thanks.
>
> Thrud
>

 

Re: Navane -Willow

Posted by Willow on May 27, 2001, at 21:22:11

In reply to Re: Navane -Willow, posted by Thrud on May 27, 2001, at 4:17:24

Thrud
I'll post again tomorrow. A wild thunderstorm has hit and I'm shutting down my PC.

Weeping Willow

 

Re: Navane » Thrud

Posted by Cam W. on May 27, 2001, at 22:23:09

In reply to Re: Navane -Willow, posted by Thrud on May 27, 2001, at 4:17:24

Thrud - I have no clinical experience with Navane™ (thiothixene). I believe that it is a high potency neuroleptic, along the lines of Haldol. I think I remember that it is not commonly used because of it's propensity to cause tardive dyskinesia, especially in elderly women. I am not totally sure of this, as I have no books here to look up the info.

All of the atypical antipsychotics are effective in paranoid schizophrenia, the best being (of course) Clozaril™ (clozapine), but it has the most side effects, too. That said, I have also seen Clozaril stop a very severe case of TD, but it took almost a year to do this.

Another option would be Zyprexa™ (olanzapine), except it's antimuscarinic effects may affect her ability to walk. OTOH Zyprexa has been recently reported to treat TD, although I doubt it will prove as effective as Clozaril. Both Clozaril and Zyprexa can cause excessive weight gain and can cause a person to become a Type II diabetic.

Risperdal™ (risperidone) has less propensity for causing weight gain or diabetes, but doses above 6mg/day can aggrevate TD. Also, in certain people, it can increase prolactin levels, but the long-term clinical significance of this is still being debated.

Maybe you could ask your mom's doc why they haven't tried an atypical, yet. There could be a logical reason. Navane is not a first line drug, so the doc must have a reason for using it.

All of the atypicals seem to have some mood stabilizing activity and they do work as adjuncts for people who have partially responded to antidepressants. Your mom, if clinically depressed, should probably be taking an antidepressant, as well.

Sorry that I cannot comment more, but there has to be reasons why your mom is being treated with this regimen. I would not be able to tell without seeing her file.

An apologetic - Cam

 

zyprexa - Thrud

Posted by Willow on May 28, 2001, at 11:06:14

In reply to Re: Navane » Thrud, posted by Cam W. on May 27, 2001, at 22:23:09

the zyprexa helped my father with depression almost immediately, or it may be that it helped with the negative symptoms.

My dad became ill about the same time as your mother, and the treatment she recieved initially was probably similar to his experience which wasn't productive. He was put into a coma, etc.

Is there anyone that she trusts. When my father was in an active stage he would still communicate with me and we would seek treatment together. You or your dad could assure her that you will not let them hospitalize her.

Talk with her care provider.

Keep in touch
Willow

 

Re: zyprexa - Willow

Posted by Thrud on May 30, 2001, at 1:00:52

In reply to zyprexa - Thrud, posted by Willow on May 28, 2001, at 11:06:14

Hi Willow,

It is good to hear that Zyprexa has some effect on depression, too.
I will see what I can do about getting her to try it, but it will be difficult to get her to overcome her suspicions. I may have a better chance than anyone else to succeed since I am the only other family member who must take medication for mental illness: she regards me as somewhat "on her side" because of this fact. But her paranoia is extremely strong and there is no one she really trusts in this matter. Still, I must try for her sake.
Seeing full blown paranoid schizophrenia makes me feel lucky that I "only" have depression. It is a living nightmare for these people, but I know I don't have to tell you that.
I'll keep you posted on what happens, though it may take some time.

Thrud


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