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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 7 of 7. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Frustrated in PA on August 5, 1999, at 11:57:49
Has anyone ever read this book? Some seriously convincing arguments against medication. I'd love to hear from anyone who'd like to comment on the book (hopefully only those who have read the book; I already know what the pro medicine camp has to say about taking medicine).
Posted by Andy on August 5, 1999, at 13:42:41
In reply to TALKING BACK TO PROZAC, posted by Frustrated in PA on August 5, 1999, at 11:57:49
> Has anyone ever read this book? Some seriously convincing arguments against medication. I'd love to hear from anyone who'd like to comment on the book (hopefully only those who have read the book; I already know what the pro medicine camp has to say about taking medicine).
I read the book. The author undoubtedly believes all this stuff but he's got a real "attitude". I find much of his analysis biased toward his preconceived conclusion. I also doubt he has ever been depressed. I started the book about two weeks after starting prozac, which was the first AD I had ever taken. Thinking about how much better I felt (astonishingly--beyond my wildest expectations) and reading about this "toxic psychiatry" stuff made me think this guy's way off the mark.
Posted by Paul on August 5, 1999, at 15:29:42
In reply to Re: TALKING BACK TO PROZAC, posted by Andy on August 5, 1999, at 13:42:41
> > Has anyone ever read this book? Some seriously convincing arguments against medication. I'd love to hear from anyone who'd like to comment on the book (hopefully only those who have read the book; I already know what the pro medicine camp has to say about taking medicine).
>
> I read the book. The author undoubtedly believes all this stuff but he's got a real "attitude". I find much of his analysis biased toward his preconceived conclusion. I also doubt he has ever been depressed. I started the book about two weeks after starting prozac, which was the first AD I had ever taken. Thinking about how much better I felt (astonishingly--beyond my wildest expectations) and reading about this "toxic psychiatry" stuff made me think this guy's way off the mark.I had much the same opinion after reading it as Andy. It seems to be just a greedy attempt to exploit other's fears and sell books by pointing out every terrible side effect occurrence, and using that as an argument that these meds should not be used. Using Breggin's logic, aspirin would have been banned long, long ago. I recommend reading, and rereading the outstanding book he "attempts" to refute(by p. kramer).
Posted by Andy on August 5, 1999, at 16:53:52
In reply to Re: TALKING BACK TO PROZAC, posted by Paul on August 5, 1999, at 15:29:42
> > > Has anyone ever read this book? Some seriously convincing arguments against medication. I'd love to hear from anyone who'd like to comment on the book (hopefully only those who have read the book; I already know what the pro medicine camp has to say about taking medicine).
> >
> > I read the book. The author undoubtedly believes all this stuff but he's got a real "attitude". I find much of his analysis biased toward his preconceived conclusion. I also doubt he has ever been depressed. I started the book about two weeks after starting prozac, which was the first AD I had ever taken. Thinking about how much better I felt (astonishingly--beyond my wildest expectations) and reading about this "toxic psychiatry" stuff made me think this guy's way off the mark.
>
> I had much the same opinion after reading it as Andy. It seems to be just a greedy attempt to exploit other's fears and sell books by pointing out every terrible side effect occurrence, and using that as an argument that these meds should not be used. Using Breggin's logic, aspirin would have been banned long, long ago. I recommend reading, and rereading the outstanding book he "attempts" to refute(by p. kramer).Reading it now. It's excellent. I'm impressed with Kramer's scholarship and insights. Orders of magnitude above alot of the junk out there on this subject.
Posted by Elizabeth on August 6, 1999, at 3:12:55
In reply to Re: TALKING BACK TO PROZAC, posted by Andy on August 5, 1999, at 16:53:52
I got bored with _TBTP_ really fast, but I've heard Breggin speak; he came to Harvard and plugged his books last fall. (Just for the record, he was invited by an undergraduate student group, not by anyone affiliated with the medical school.) He's not very bright, as you can probably tell from reading his book. He just sort of stood there and went "duh" when I asked him a couple of fairly straightforward questions. (As I recall, he didn't know a thing about atypical antipsychotics and couldn't explain why it was safe for my dad to be on 4 different antihypertensives, since his "arguments" about why antidepressants haven't "really" been shown to work would apply just as well to other drugs. There are a million other holes in his arguments.)
Breggin claims that he has "cured" people with talk therapy. I suspect he's actually not a very good therapist...spends too much time talking back, not enough time listening in the first place. He seems like he would be the sort of therapist who invalidates and belittles patients.
Posted by Sean on August 6, 1999, at 13:52:14
In reply to TALKING BACK TO PROZAC, posted by Frustrated in PA on August 5, 1999, at 11:57:49
> Has anyone ever read this book? Some seriously convincing arguments against medication. I'd love to hear from anyone who'd like to comment on the book (hopefully only those who have read the book; I already know what the pro medicine camp has to say about taking medicine).
I have read most of this book. The interesting
things is that *some* of what he says is more or
less correct for a small subset of people. And I
think the drug companies are not paragons of moral
integrity either, so we should question everything
equally.All the same, I found the language in the book to
inflammatory, negatively biased, and some of it
really way off base. I recall one discussion where
SSRI's are compared to cocaine in terms of side
effects etc... and I just laughed my ass off. I
mean anybody who has done cocaine and an SSRI
can tell you they are not even on the same planet
in terms of their subjective impact. I've also
never heard anything about SSRI's and vasopressin
which is one of the key centers of cocaine action.
The whole implication of this discussion is really
misleading and could actually do harm to a person
who might benefit from an AD by confusing them or
delaying treatment.The fact is, we are just at the beginning of brain
science. Whatever his concerns are, I think we can
all forsee a time, probably within 20 years, where
all of his arguments will be dead. The advance of
technology is never perfect, but we as humans seem
deeply compelled to fight disease; this is a life
affirming struggle, not some evil cop-out.Also, compared to Kramer, his prose sucks...
Sean.
Posted by TBTP on August 9, 1999, at 19:19:38
In reply to Re: TALKING BACK TO PROZAC, posted by Sean on August 6, 1999, at 13:52:14
I know one thing for sure. He aint never had depression! He has no clue.
This is the end of the thread.
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