Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 4030

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Re: the weight gain issue

Posted by Matt on April 3, 1999, at 3:43:31

In reply to Re: the weight gain issue, posted by DALE on April 2, 1999, at 11:15:51

There's some discussion of SSRIs affecting exercise drive on psych tips--the upshot is just what you say, Dale, that some people who were compulsive about their exercising no longer are on SSRIs.

Harry had referenced an interesting article on the possible biology of SSRI weight gain, btw.

Matt

 

Re: the weight gain issue

Posted by laura on April 3, 1999, at 10:53:19

In reply to Re: the weight gain issue, posted by Matt on April 3, 1999, at 3:43:31

> There's some discussion of SSRIs affecting exercise drive on psych tips--the upshot is just what you say, Dale, that some people who were compulsive about their exercising no longer are on SSRIs.
>
> Harry had referenced an interesting article on the possible biology of SSRI weight gain, btw.
>
> Matt

Hi Matt--

I have a problem getting started when I work out. What I've found that works for me is--When I'm at home working out, I set an egg timer for 10 minutes and tell myself that I'll only work out for the 10 minutes and if I want to quit after the timer goes off I can. I don't think I've ever quit after the timer goes off, by then I'm into it. When I go to the gym, I just promise myself that I'll go, change and at least walk around and if I want to go home I can. That works for me too.

Hey, which article were you refering to about the SSRI and weight gain?
Thx,
laura

 

Re: the weight gain issue

Posted by mary on April 5, 1999, at 19:48:17

In reply to Re: the weight gain issue, posted by laura on April 3, 1999, at 10:53:19

I am so distraught. I was on wellbutrin for eight months. I could see a direct weght loss from the time I started it since I was going to WW at the time. However, I could go no higher on the dosage and came off in November. I went on
Effexor. By March 4th, I had gained 24 pounds. Nothing different in my eating habits or exercise patterns (which was nothing to begin with. Point is everything was the same including the fact that I didnt get any antidepressant effect.) Ive been off effexor for two weeks and on Celexa for one of those two weeks and I lost three pounds but those three are back plus two more one week later. I still dont have any AD relief and wonder at the moment if I ever will. I spent my youth being underweight. I always championed being fair to the person not the looks. I hate that I''m not thin. I hate that I know I should move and I hate that I don't make myself but it really seems impossible. I know it's not but I don't make it change. The thought that i'll never see 150, never mind 125 lbs, is so earthshattering I can barely type about it. Maybe I shouldnt even bother... At any rate, Laura, your idea (think it was yours,) about the timer is one I'll try. Meanwhile what is the experience for Celexa with people who have been taking it? thanks for any info.
> >
> > Harry had referenced an interesting article on the possible biology of SSRI weight gain, btw.

>
> Hi Matt--
>
> I have a problem getting started when I work out. What I've found that works for me is--When I'm at home working out, I set an egg timer for 10 minutes and tell myself that I'll only work out for the 10 minutes and if I want to quit after the timer goes off I can. I don't think I've ever quit after the timer goes off, by then I'm into it. When I go to the gym, I just promise myself that I'll go, change and at least walk around and if I want to go home I can. That works for me too.
>
> Hey, which article were you refering to about the SSRI and weight gain?
> Thx,
> laura

 

Re: the weight gain issue

Posted by Nancy on April 5, 1999, at 20:42:38

In reply to Re: the weight gain issue, posted by pej on March 26, 1999, at 5:40:38

Hey, Phil. How's it draggin'? Nanc, here. There was quite a long while that the bipolar-1 deep deppression was totally incapacitating for me. You know, can't even lift an arm off the sheets no matter how hard you concentrate and will that arm to move. There's just no response. OH! Yea, and trying to walk?! Ha! I was 30y goin' on 107y old if you looked at the way I shuffled about, holdin' on to everything I passed by for support. BTW, for this type of misery, I HIGHLY BENEFITTED FROM ECT!!! Damn straight!

Today, Bro! Miracle of miracles I was finally able to start the walk-jog thing!!! AND (as if that weren't enough) I've been riding my recumbent bike (of course, it helps that it's in my bedroom with a large TV and VCR in front of it) for over three miles a day for the last THREE DAYS!!!

It took (let's see...jan, feb, mar...) ECT (in early Jan. '99), Effexor XR, Seroquel and 3 months of butt-kicking determination. But, after ECT knocked out most of my depression, my body finally responded to my butt-kicking determination!!! Now, after looking completely rediculous, shuffling around outside on the sidewalk, parading about like the derranged lunatic that I was, before the eyes of my neighbors I steadily increased in both my ability to walk and the length of my journeys. I'm walking 1.2miles a day and have done so for the past two weeks.

Gotta rest, now.
Nancy

> > It is clear that all AD's cause weight gain to some degree in most people. One can play with AD's to find the one that has the least effect....for me it is Effexor.
> >
> > There is a simple answer here....eat better and excercise. It is ez to do something about the weight
> > but the dperession is the reason you take the meds. If you make weight gain a litums test all AD's will fail.
> > I wish doctors would push to see that patients on long term meds get on an excercise program. Even though the answer is simple its application is tuff knot...I still don't excercise.
> >
> > james
> >>
> >>james,
> Wishing doctors would tell us to exercise? If we want to get well, we must take responsibility for our actions and not wait for someone in authority
> to 'make us'.
> I've just realized recently,again, how much I want to find the perfect med or combo and just let it turn my life around. The other day I started a walk-jog thing again(depressed and all)
> did 3 miles and felt better for it. I didn't feel great yet but damnit I will be back out this a.m. etc.
> If we are not totally incapacitated with this illness, if we know certain activities make us feel better, then let's just get our sad-assed faces and big butts in some warmups-screw what others think. Shake it, baby!
>
> ~phil~

 

Re: the weight gain issue-Nancy

Posted by pej on April 5, 1999, at 21:12:20

In reply to Re: the weight gain issue, posted by Nancy on April 5, 1999, at 20:42:38

> Hey Nancy, Very nice to hear from you again. After several hours of hell in the ER a few weeks ago, I now seem to be returning to a moderately dysfunctional semi-moody occasionally hopeful baseline sort of existance, you know...normal.
I'm a' doin' 300mg of Wellbutrin, 2mg Klonopin(as long as I don't forget and take, like, six :-)
and doc just added 10mg Prozac. Oh yeah, if I want to be engaging I add a 10mg dash of Ritalin.
Let me see, what have I left out. Several cigarettes a day and , of course I exercise. I think I've gone from 212 lbs. to 211lbs. but that was probably lung tissue and liver loss due to overwork. Here's to a pill-poppin '99. Phil
ps-really glad you are back in form! I guess I'm doing okay too, despite it all!

hey Hey, Phil. How's it draggin'? Nanc, here. There was quite a long while that the bipolar-1 deep deppression was totally incapacitating for me. You know, can't even lift an arm off the sheets no matter how hard you concentrate and will that arm to move. There's just no response. OH! Yea, and trying to walk?! Ha! I was 30y goin' on 107y old if you looked at the way I shuffled about, holdin' on to everything I passed by for support. BTW, for this type of misery, I HIGHLY BENEFITTED FROM ECT!!! Damn straight!
>
> Today, Bro! Miracle of miracles I was finally able to start the walk-jog thing!!! AND (as if that weren't enough) I've been riding my recumbent bike (of course, it helps that it's in my bedroom with a large TV and VCR in front of it) for over three miles a day for the last THREE DAYS!!!
>
> It took (let's see...jan, feb, mar...) ECT (in early Jan. '99), Effexor XR, Seroquel and 3 months of butt-kicking determination. But, after ECT knocked out most of my depression, my body finally responded to my butt-kicking determination!!! Now, after looking completely rediculous, shuffling around outside on the sidewalk, parading about like the derranged lunatic that I was, before the eyes of my neighbors I steadily increased in both my ability to walk and the length of my journeys. I'm walking 1.2miles a day and have done so for the past two weeks.
>
> Gotta rest, now.
> Nancy
>
> > > It is clear that all AD's cause weight gain to some degree in most people. One can play with AD's to find the one that has the least effect....for me it is Effexor.
> > >
> > > There is a simple answer here....eat better and excercise. It is ez to do something about the weight
> > > but the dperession is the reason you take the meds. If you make weight gain a litums test all AD's will fail.
> > > I wish doctors would push to see that patients on long term meds get on an excercise program. Even though the answer is simple its application is tuff knot...I still don't excercise.
> > >
> > > james
> > >>
> > >>james,
> > Wishing doctors would tell us to exercise? If we want to get well, we must take responsibility for our actions and not wait for someone in authority
> > to 'make us'.
> > I've just realized recently,again, how much I want to find the perfect med or combo and just let it turn my life around. The other day I started a walk-jog thing again(depressed and all)
> > did 3 miles and felt better for it. I didn't feel great yet but damnit I will be back out this a.m. etc.
> > If we are not totally incapacitated with this illness, if we know certain activities make us feel better, then let's just get our sad-assed faces and big butts in some warmups-screw what others think. Shake it, baby!
> >
> > ~phil~

 

Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?

Posted by Terry on April 5, 1999, at 21:15:13

In reply to Re: the weight gain issue, posted by Nancy on April 5, 1999, at 20:42:38

Hello? Is anybody listening to me? All I've read so far on this thread is people complaining about gaining weight on psychotropic meds. I've gained 25 pounds on Depakote and I hate the weight gain, but I'm trying to learn to live with it! I'm better than ever mentally. As for eating right and exercising, EVERYONE should do that, fat or thin, on meds or not. I get tired of people laying guilt trips on themselves and others about their weight. Try to love yourself as you are and DON'T GET OFF YOUR MEDS if they're helping you! As I said before, isn't it better to be fat and happy than thin and depressed/manic/psychotic? If you're on meds, eating right and exercising and still remaining fat/gaining weight, it's out of your control, so why worry about it? We're all too obsessed with our looks. And don't talk to me about weight being a health issue. It's not if you manage to eat reasonably well and exercise and otherwise take care of yourself. Doesn't anyone else out there see this issue as I do? Terry

> Hey, Phil. How's it draggin'? Nanc, here. There was quite a long while that the bipolar-1 deep deppression was totally incapacitating for me. You know, can't even lift an arm off the sheets no matter how hard you concentrate and will that arm to move. There's just no response. OH! Yea, and trying to walk?! Ha! I was 30y goin' on 107y old if you looked at the way I shuffled about, holdin' on to everything I passed by for support. BTW, for this type of misery, I HIGHLY BENEFITTED FROM ECT!!! Damn straight!
>
> Today, Bro! Miracle of miracles I was finally able to start the walk-jog thing!!! AND (as if that weren't enough) I've been riding my recumbent bike (of course, it helps that it's in my bedroom with a large TV and VCR in front of it) for over three miles a day for the last THREE DAYS!!!
>
> It took (let's see...jan, feb, mar...) ECT (in early Jan. '99), Effexor XR, Seroquel and 3 months of butt-kicking determination. But, after ECT knocked out most of my depression, my body finally responded to my butt-kicking determination!!! Now, after looking completely rediculous, shuffling around outside on the sidewalk, parading about like the derranged lunatic that I was, before the eyes of my neighbors I steadily increased in both my ability to walk and the length of my journeys. I'm walking 1.2miles a day and have done so for the past two weeks.
>
> Gotta rest, now.
> Nancy
>
> > > It is clear that all AD's cause weight gain to some degree in most people. One can play with AD's to find the one that has the least effect....for me it is Effexor.
> > >
> > > There is a simple answer here....eat better and excercise. It is ez to do something about the weight
> > > but the dperession is the reason you take the meds. If you make weight gain a litums test all AD's will fail.
> > > I wish doctors would push to see that patients on long term meds get on an excercise program. Even though the answer is simple its application is tuff knot...I still don't excercise.
> > >
> > > james
> > >>
> > >>james,
> > Wishing doctors would tell us to exercise? If we want to get well, we must take responsibility for our actions and not wait for someone in authority
> > to 'make us'.
> > I've just realized recently,again, how much I want to find the perfect med or combo and just let it turn my life around. The other day I started a walk-jog thing again(depressed and all)
> > did 3 miles and felt better for it. I didn't feel great yet but damnit I will be back out this a.m. etc.
> > If we are not totally incapacitated with this illness, if we know certain activities make us feel better, then let's just get our sad-assed faces and big butts in some warmups-screw what others think. Shake it, baby!
> >
> > ~phil~

 

Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?

Posted by harry on April 6, 1999, at 12:11:38

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?, posted by Terry on April 5, 1999, at 21:15:13

Terry,
There are references here regarding ideas and hope of dealing with the weight gain issue.

It is YOU who are not "listening"

This is plainly visible by all the whipped about almost usesless advice unaccompanied by your OWN individual experience...the only true "teacher".

You ADD to people's pain wth these kinds od postings.

 

Re: I'm glad that Harry knows how to listen. :)

Posted by Nancy on April 6, 1999, at 15:06:49

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?, posted by harry on April 6, 1999, at 12:11:38

> Terry,
> There are references here regarding ideas and hope of dealing with the weight gain issue.
>
> It is YOU who are not "listening"


Amen to that!! Way to tell it straight up, Harry!!
All I wanted, was to share MY LONG TIME IN ARRIVING achievement! I'm FINALLY able to MOVE! Darn it! This is a really BIG DEAL FOR ME! Then, someone thought that it was in all of our BEST INTEREST to poop on my parade.

That's for speaking up, Harry. I'm going to move on from this and keep fighting to get my life back.

Thanks,
Nancy :)


>
> This is plainly visible by all the whipped about almost usesless advice unaccompanied by your OWN individual experience...the only true "teacher".
>
> You ADD to people's pain wth these kinds od postings.

 

Re: the no longer an issue; weight gain-Phil

Posted by Nancy on April 6, 1999, at 15:59:08

In reply to Re: the weight gain issue-Nancy, posted by pej on April 5, 1999, at 21:12:20

> > Hey Nancy, Very nice to hear from you again.

***********************************
Hey, I missed you, too. You know how it goes. Here today, then, gone to the hospital, tomarrow. I saw in the New Year with my DOA at the ER after an OD on Seroquel. Between you and me, since my ECT, I'm really glad to still be around. So, I thought I'd drop in and hang out with all you folks, again. That is, if you don't mind the company of me(the lunatic fringe)...LOL :)
##################

After several hours of hell in the ER a few weeks ago, I now seem to be returning to a moderately dysfunctional semi-moody occasionally hopeful baseline sort of existance, you know...normal.

**********************
Yea, I'm with ya...I know...the lifestyle of the sick and outrageous. Hey, it's okay that we go through this STUFF. It shows, you have an enormous amount of courage. You have great strength and self-determination, because you are still alive. You are not a quitter. We sometimes break, but noone would dare call us weak.
################

> I'm a' doin' 300mg of Wellbutrin, 2mg Klonopin(as long as I don't forget and take, like, six :-)
> and doc just added 10mg Prozac. Oh yeah, if I want to be engaging I add a 10mg dash of Ritalin.

> Let me see, what have I left out. Several cigarettes a day

*******Hee, Hee, Hee...ME, TOO! Do all severely manic-depressives smoke? Maybe, just the ones I know.########


and , of course I exercise.

**********as you've read, I'm back to butt-kickin' form. Still gotta lose another 20Lbs to be a 110-115Lb lean-mad-as-a-hatter-dancin'-machine, once again.##########


I think I've gone from 212 lbs. to 211lbs.

*********oooooh...somebody stop me...
###########


but that was probably lung tissue and liver loss due to overwork.

*************Overwork? What, are you a tissue donor??? ...kidding...are meds a problem?
#############


Here's to a pill-poppin '99. Phil

****************Hey, if one is good, two will do ya better! ...LOL...:)
###########

> ps-really glad you are back in form! I guess I'm doing okay too, despite it all!

************Thanks! I hope you feel good. I'm happy to be, here, again.
Nancy :) ;) :)
######################
>

>
>
>
>
>
>
> hey Hey, Phil. How's it draggin'? Nanc, here. There was quite a long while that the bipolar-1 deep deppression was totally incapacitating for me. You know, can't even lift an arm off the sheets no matter how hard you concentrate and will that arm to move. There's just no response. OH! Yea, and trying to walk?! Ha! I was 30y goin' on 107y old if you looked at the way I shuffled about, holdin' on to everything I passed by for support. BTW, for this type of misery, I HIGHLY BENEFITTED FROM ECT!!! Damn straight!
> >
> > Today, Bro! Miracle of miracles I was finally able to start the walk-jog thing!!! AND (as if that weren't enough) I've been riding my recumbent bike (of course, it helps that it's in my bedroom with a large TV and VCR in front of it) for over three miles a day for the last THREE DAYS!!!
> >
> > It took (let's see...jan, feb, mar...) ECT (in early Jan. '99), Effexor XR, Seroquel and 3 months of butt-kicking determination. But, after ECT knocked out most of my depression, my body finally responded to my butt-kicking determination!!! Now, after looking completely rediculous, shuffling around outside on the sidewalk, parading about like the derranged lunatic that I was, before the eyes of my neighbors I steadily increased in both my ability to walk and the length of my journeys. I'm walking 1.2miles a day and have done so for the past two weeks.
> >
> > Gotta rest, now.
> > Nancy
>
> > > If we are not totally incapacitated with this illness, if we know certain activities make us feel better, then let's just get our sad-assed faces and big butts in some warmups-screw what others think. Shake it, baby!
> > >
> > > ~phil~

 

Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?

Posted by Terry on April 6, 1999, at 20:02:15

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?, posted by harry on April 6, 1999, at 12:11:38

Harry -- Sorry to offend. I'll get off my high horse and just say that I want people to think about staying on their meds and not worrying so much about how they look. Theresa

> Terry,
> There are references here regarding ideas and hope of dealing with the weight gain issue.
>
> It is YOU who are not "listening"
>
> This is plainly visible by all the whipped about almost usesless advice unaccompanied by your OWN individual experience...the only true "teacher".
>
> You ADD to people's pain wth these kinds od postings.

 

Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?

Posted by v on April 6, 1999, at 20:43:38

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?, posted by Terry on April 6, 1999, at 20:02:15

> Harry -- Sorry to offend. I'll get off my high horse and just say that I want people to think about staying on their meds and not worrying so much about how they look. Theresa

it's just not that easy... that's like telling people not to be depressed

i think we deserve meds that make us feel good about living and about ourselves... i'm not able to feel that way when i am overweight...and as a cyclist, i don't perform as well

that said, is there anyone who hasn't gained weight on their meds?
specifically effexor since that is what i'm taking...
i haven't experienced weight gain on it but having been overweight when i began (as a direct result of my depression), i seem to be having alot of trouble getting the weight off despite feeling better - which is unusual for me

thanks for listening

v

 

Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?

Posted by harry on April 7, 1999, at 1:26:14

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?, posted by v on April 6, 1999, at 20:43:38

agree with v...why would anyone want "people to think about staying on their meds and not worrying so much about how they look"...since the way we think and feel are part and parcel OF depression.
In fact, this kind of attitude aimed at, and internalized by people, CAUSES depression.
That's scarey terry.

 

Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?

Posted by Terry on April 7, 1999, at 12:22:37

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?, posted by harry on April 7, 1999, at 1:26:14

Harry -- Listen, can you not understand that people who are helped by their medications psychologically should consider staying on them, despite weight gain? I'm not saying people shouldn't acknowledge their feelings or their depression! I'm simply saying that from my own experience, it's more important for me mentally and emotionally to be helped by the Depakote I take than to get off the Depakote and lose weight. I'd rather be fat and feel better. Please stop berating me for what I'm saying because it makes perfect sense to me. I can understand how horrible weight gain is, because I've been through it, but it's nothing compared to the hell of untreated bipolar disorder. I exercise, I eat right, and still I gain weight. It's out of my control, I'm trying to be healthy, and that's the best I can do. Many of the postings I've seen on this thread about weight gain have been about stopping medications because of people's concern about weight gain. Don't you agree that's not a good idea? Terry

> agree with v...why would anyone want "people to think about staying on their meds and not worrying so much about how they look"...since the way we think and feel are part and parcel OF depression.
> In fact, this kind of attitude aimed at, and internalized by people, CAUSES depression.
> That's scarey terry.

 

Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?

Posted by mary on April 7, 1999, at 16:03:17

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?, posted by v on April 6, 1999, at 20:43:38

v:

I just came off of effexor in March having started in November,1998. In that short time, I regained 23 of the 26 pounds it had taken me 16 months prior to lose(and I stil had thirty more to go). Im on celexa now and it doesn't look any better (up two more pounds) nor is my mood improved. Good luck. Everybody's differenet.

Note to Terry: If I'm going to be fat and sad on meds because Im not helped mood-wise, I'd rather be sad and thin till i wish i were dead and then i'll try the meds again but after a while whats the use? weight comes on (That part works) and there's no relief!!! I read here hoping I'll get some glimmer of something that will help. I hope you understand what i'm trying to say to you. good luck.


Harry -- Sorry to offend. I'll get off my high horse and just say that I want people to think about staying on their meds and not worrying so much about how they look. Theresa
>
began (as a direct result of my depression), i seem to be having alot of trouble getting the weight off despite feeling better - which is unusual for me
>
> thanks for listening
>
> v

 

Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?

Posted by v on April 7, 1999, at 17:55:05

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?, posted by mary on April 7, 1999, at 16:03:17

> I just came off of effexor in March having started in November,1998. In that short time, I regained 23 of the 26 pounds it had taken me 16 months prior to lose(and I stil had thirty more to go). Im on celexa now and it doesn't look any better (up two more pounds) nor is my mood improved. Good luck. Everybody's differenet.

mary:
thanks for replying... i hope it all works out for you.
i've only been on effexor for about 5 months. i'm giving it another couple of weeks and then will probably taper off. as it needs to be done slowly anyway, i'm hoping that i may start losing the weight at a lower dose BUT i am still afraid of the eventual weight gain that so many have written about. i actually only even tried it because i had been assured that weight gain would be an unlikely side effect... :(

and it's a shame too, as the effexor really seems to help

but for me fat and happy is a contradiction in terms... polar opposites in my life

like you said, everyone's different... i don't expect everyone to feel as i do - but i don't think i should be expected to feel like anyone else either

i said it before, we all deserve to feel better... but without having to compromise ourselves in the process... if we stop tolerating what is intolerable, maybe they'd come up with something that worked... or am i only dreaming...

my dreams are sometimes all i have...

v

 

Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?

Posted by Terry on April 7, 1999, at 22:04:58

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?, posted by v on April 7, 1999, at 17:55:05

I'm sorry to have offended so many people with my postings on weight gain and psychotropic drugs. This will be my last posting on PsychoBabble, and I won't be checking in anymore for responses, so please don't send any more negative messages my way. Good luck to all. Terry

> > I just came off of effexor in March having started in November,1998. In that short time, I regained 23 of the 26 pounds it had taken me 16 months prior to lose(and I stil had thirty more to go). Im on celexa now and it doesn't look any better (up two more pounds) nor is my mood improved. Good luck. Everybody's differenet.
>
> mary:
> thanks for replying... i hope it all works out for you.
> i've only been on effexor for about 5 months. i'm giving it another couple of weeks and then will probably taper off. as it needs to be done slowly anyway, i'm hoping that i may start losing the weight at a lower dose BUT i am still afraid of the eventual weight gain that so many have written about. i actually only even tried it because i had been assured that weight gain would be an unlikely side effect... :(
>
> and it's a shame too, as the effexor really seems to help
>
> but for me fat and happy is a contradiction in terms... polar opposites in my life
>
> like you said, everyone's different... i don't expect everyone to feel as i do - but i don't think i should be expected to feel like anyone else either
>
> i said it before, we all deserve to feel better... but without having to compromise ourselves in the process... if we stop tolerating what is intolerable, maybe they'd come up with something that worked... or am i only dreaming...
>
> my dreams are sometimes all i have...
>
> v

 

Re: IS ANYBODY BEING CONSIDERATE?

Posted by Dr. Bob on April 8, 1999, at 0:29:20

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?, posted by harry on April 6, 1999, at 12:11:38

Hi, everyone,

Please remember to try to be civil. You may disagree with what someone said, but take a minute and read it over again. Maybe there's a kernel of truth, at least, to what they said. That's an advantage of an online forum; you have time to think through what to say.

People here are either in need of support, or trying to provide support, or both. It doesn't help any of them to be treated disrespectfully.

Bob

 

Re: IS ANYBODY BEING CONSIDERATE?

Posted by v on April 8, 1999, at 6:31:18

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY BEING CONSIDERATE?, posted by Dr. Bob on April 8, 1999, at 0:29:20

> Please remember to try to be civil. You may disagree with what someone said, but take a minute and read it over again. Maybe there's a kernel of truth, at least, to what they said. That's an advantage of an online forum; you have time to think through what to say.
>
> People here are either in need of support, or trying to provide support, or both. It doesn't help any of them to be treated disrespectfully.

actually, i am surprised that anything i wrote would have offended anyone - i deliberately reiterated the point that we're all different and that i begrudge noone their stance

i never meant to hurt anyone's feelings... but it angers me that because i am managing to stay (yes, i too, feel the risk of posting here and can be oversensitive about responses), i am being called on the carpet for expressing myself... so should i leave too?

i have written terry privately and truly hope she decides to stay - i don't want to leave here either but i'm angry and hurt.

it's often very hard for me to reach out to this forum... now i wonder... oh, what's the use of trying to explain...

 

Re: recovery

Posted by harry on April 8, 1999, at 8:30:53

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY BEING CONSIDERATE?, posted by v on April 8, 1999, at 6:31:18

Being "brought to task" in regards to the effects of one's words and actions is an ESSENTIAL part of GROWING UP.
All to often i see postings in "support forums" that allude to the idea that "support" means expressing kindly sweet remarks regardless of the
context of anothers writing/actions.
This is life without accepting PAIN as an intergral part of the learning process...and..is IMHO....a recipe to psychopathology.

A great part of "recovery", eg:change and development as a person..is recognizing our OWN selfishness and self-centeredness..and acting in a way that will reduce and eliminate these actions and traits.

And...this is true in every instance i have ever seen, in myself and others (exceptions include genuine "spiritual" revelation)....."SELFISHNESS and SELF-CENTEREDNESS respond ONLY to THEIR OWN PAIN"....NEVER to that of others.

Attempting to dispense with this ESSENTIAL aspect of life...hearing that certain actions we take are INJURIOUS to self and others....is insanely self-serving...and ends up with a dead friend, family memeber, and loved one.....who thinks WE are "SO NICE".

TRUE LOVE invloves DISCIPLINE.
It effects life to "cease and desist" action that causes pain and sufefering to self and others.
And gives us the divine space to reevaluate ourselves.

Does it hurt?..You bet. It hurts when we get any "abscess" drained. And then a sense of healing and well being ensue.
The other way..we get an ever increasing "abscess" the pain of which can only be relieved by greater and greater amounts of medication...while the "patients" relives the "pressure" by expressing its contents everywhere they go.

 

Re: recovery

Posted by harry on April 8, 1999, at 8:39:41

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY BEING CONSIDERATE?, posted by v on April 8, 1999, at 6:31:18

BTW..i think "v"'s posting are excellent...express where she is at..how she is feeling..and the effects anothers actions have on her.
THIS is a basic ability leading to being a healthy adult.

 

Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?

Posted by Nancy on April 8, 1999, at 11:15:54

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY LISTENING?, posted by Terry on April 7, 1999, at 12:22:37

Harry has not been advocating stopping one's meds just to "lose weight".

> Harry -- Listen, can you not understand that people who are helped by their medications psychologically should consider staying on them, despite weight gain? I'm not saying people shouldn't acknowledge their feelings or their depression! I'm simply saying that from my own experience, it's more important for me mentally and emotionally to be helped by the Depakote I take than to get off the Depakote and lose weight. I'd rather be fat and feel better. Please stop berating me for what I'm saying because it makes perfect sense to me. I can understand how horrible weight gain is, because I've been through it, but it's nothing compared to the hell of untreated bipolar disorder. I exercise, I eat right, and still I gain weight. It's out of my control, I'm trying to be healthy, and that's the best I can do. Many of the postings I've seen on this thread about weight gain have been about stopping medications because of people's concern about weight gain. Don't you agree that's not a good idea? Terry
>
> > agree with v...why would anyone want "people to think about staying on their meds and not worrying so much about how they look"...since the way we think and feel are part and parcel OF depression.
> > In fact, this kind of attitude aimed at, and internalized by people, CAUSES depression.
> > That's scarey terry.

 

Re: listen

Posted by harry on April 8, 1999, at 11:42:33

In reply to Re: recovery, posted by harry on April 8, 1999, at 8:30:53

terry..you aren't listening to ANYTHING people are saying here.
as evidenced in infancy..we LISTEN..THEN we learn to speak.

 

celexa didn't work for me as well a prozac

Posted by learn to forget on April 8, 1999, at 14:39:21

In reply to Re: recovery, posted by harry on April 8, 1999, at 8:30:53

I switched to celexa from prozac because of hand tremor that interferes with playing music. My hands stopped shaking by about 75%, but you know what, celexa just isn't as good against the terrible triangel of anger, fear and saddness.
So now I'm back where I started: playing well or being well. I did learn one thing, however. I now know hell is not the absence of free-will is some burning pit, rather its having free will to choose between heinous options. >

Being "brought to task" in regards to the effects of one's words and actions is an ESSENTIAL part of GROWING UP.
> All to often i see postings in "support forums" that allude to the idea that "support" means expressing kindly sweet remarks regardless of the
> context of anothers writing/actions.
> This is life without accepting PAIN as an intergral part of the learning process...and..is IMHO....a recipe to psychopathology.
>
> A great part of "recovery", eg:change and development as a person..is recognizing our OWN selfishness and self-centeredness..and acting in a way that will reduce and eliminate these actions and traits.
>
> And...this is true in every instance i have ever seen, in myself and others (exceptions include genuine "spiritual" revelation)....."SELFISHNESS and SELF-CENTEREDNESS respond ONLY to THEIR OWN PAIN"....NEVER to that of others.
>
> Attempting to dispense with this ESSENTIAL aspect of life...hearing that certain actions we take are INJURIOUS to self and others....is insanely self-serving...and ends up with a dead friend, family memeber, and loved one.....who thinks WE are "SO NICE".
>
> TRUE LOVE invloves DISCIPLINE.
> It effects life to "cease and desist" action that causes pain and sufefering to self and others.
> And gives us the divine space to reevaluate ourselves.
>
> Does it hurt?..You bet. It hurts when we get any "abscess" drained. And then a sense of healing and well being ensue.
> The other way..we get an ever increasing "abscess" the pain of which can only be relieved by greater and greater amounts of medication...while the "patients" relives the "pressure" by expressing its contents everywhere they go.

 

Re: IS ANYBODY BEING CONSIDERATE?

Posted by Victoria on April 8, 1999, at 14:46:17

In reply to Re: IS ANYBODY BEING CONSIDERATE?, posted by v on April 8, 1999, at 6:31:18

At the risk of stepping into this particular mine field, can I suggest that, on issues like this, we try to focus on communicating our own experience and not telling other people what to do? I know I find that more useful; one of the great things about this site is appreciating the complexity and diversity of us all. Although we share much, everyone's problems and solutions are individual and may be completely different from our own. (It also helps me not be offended to remember that everyone is really expressing only their own experience, even when it's worded as advice or a pronouncement.)


> > Please remember to try to be civil. You may disagree with what someone said, but take a minute and read it over again. Maybe there's a kernel of truth, at least, to what they said. That's an advantage of an online forum; you have time to think through what to say.
> >
> > People here are either in need of support, or trying to provide support, or both. It doesn't help any of them to be treated disrespectfully.
>
> actually, i am surprised that anything i wrote would have offended anyone - i deliberately reiterated the point that we're all different and that i begrudge noone their stance
>
> i never meant to hurt anyone's feelings... but it angers me that because i am managing to stay (yes, i too, feel the risk of posting here and can be oversensitive about responses), i am being called on the carpet for expressing myself... so should i leave too?
>
> i have written terry privately and truly hope she decides to stay - i don't want to leave here either but i'm angry and hurt.
>
> it's often very hard for me to reach out to this forum... now i wonder... oh, what's the use of trying to explain...

 

Re: recovery

Posted by v on April 8, 1999, at 16:31:30

In reply to Re: recovery, posted by harry on April 8, 1999, at 8:30:53

i still maintain that i was not behaving in a selfish or injurious way towards anyone... all i ever stated was my position and in no way demeaned anyone elses

you may not agree with me... that is your perogative

if i am to be called to the carpet when i voice my way of seeing things, then this may not be the place for me to express myself

terry and i have no problem with each other - we respect each other's opinions... but we both now seem to be having a problem here

i wish you well...


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