Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 1440

Shown: posts 1 to 21 of 21. This is the beginning of the thread.

 

female sexual dysfunction w/ treatment for depress

Posted by emma on December 2, 1998, at 13:20:00

I'd like to keep this open for the whole month for any
females out there w/ success stories on switching meds/
adding meds/ or anything to overcome SSRI-induced
anorgasmia.

 

Re: sex, work and a life with depression?

Posted by Nancy on December 2, 1998, at 18:32:04

In reply to female sexual dysfunction w/ treatment for depress, posted by emma on December 2, 1998, at 13:20:00

How can all you people be having sex, going to work, and having a life. My bipolar depression has been both, totally incapacitating and treatment resistive. Except for being in the hospital, I haven't been able to go anywhere or do anything for a year and a half.

Are all of you sure that you really suffer from depression???

Mind Over Madness, !>)
Nancy

P.S. I hope that I didn't offend anyone by being so open about personal issues.

 

It's possible...

Posted by janey on December 4, 1998, at 21:58:01

In reply to Re: sex, work and a life with depression?, posted by Nancy on December 2, 1998, at 18:32:04

Nancy,

During the worst of my depression (which is
revisiting itself now), I was in a day treatment
program at a hospital, and getting up everyday was
a struggle, but it was either that or be an inpatient.
something I NEVER EVER want to do or be again.

I have had sex since my depression came on, but
with an "old" friend, I'm not ready for a "relationship"
yet, whatever the heck that word means anymore.
It was nice to see that the parts still worked.

If I don't work, I don't eat, have a home, have my
pets, and so on. For the past three weeks it's been
all I can do to go to work. I was almost grateful
for the intestinal virus I have had this week so
I had a "real" excuse not to face the world. I
have no one to depend on, no one to "let" me crash
and burn. The idea of going on public assistance
is abhorent to me.

It's possible to have a life with this disease.
I'm of the unipolar depression variety. I am
living though, and I'm getting along. I see my
doctor, and I'm doing my "mood logs" again.
I take my medicine, I meditate and I pray. I cry
and I laugh. I bleed and I heal. I have to.

janey

 

Re: It's NOT possible for one's who really are ill

Posted by Nancy on December 5, 1998, at 16:36:00

In reply to It's possible..., posted by janey on December 4, 1998, at 21:58:01

Janey,
Do you really believe people with a physical illness like Manic-Depression "crash" out of choice??? One day, they just get sick and tired of being beautiful, wealthy and successful. So, they decide to have a chemical imbalance as an excuse to dismantle their lives and careers. It's not enough to just feel miserable. They want to be completely, physically incapacited; unable to just lift even an arm off the bed or to open the eyes for days at a time. A time where the body is shut down so far that going to the bathroom is no longer a bodily function. Oh. Sorry. They are CHOOSING to not have this physical function, because they just WANT to CRASH, right, Janey!

Are you always arrogant and self-righteous, or did you not think coherently and logically before you made such callous and preposterous comments.

The Mad Scientist,
Nancy


> Nancy,
> During the worst of my depression (which is
> revisiting itself now), I was in a day treatment
> program at a hospital, and getting up everyday was
> a struggle, but it was either that or be an inpatient.
> something I NEVER EVER want to do or be again.
> I have had sex since my depression came on, but
> with an "old" friend, I'm not ready for a "relationship"
> yet, whatever the heck that word means anymore.
> It was nice to see that the parts still worked.
> If I don't work, I don't eat, have a home, have my
> pets, and so on. For the past three weeks it's been
> all I can do to go to work. I was almost grateful
> for the intestinal virus I have had this week so
> I had a "real" excuse not to face the world. I
> have no one to depend on, no one to "let" me crash
> and burn. The idea of going on public assistance
> is abhorent to me.
> It's possible to have a life with this disease.
> I'm of the unipolar depression variety. I am
> living though, and I'm getting along. I see my
> doctor, and I'm doing my "mood logs" again.
> I take my medicine, I meditate and I pray. I cry
> and I laugh. I bleed and I heal. I have to.
> janey

 

are you sure you're suffering from depression?

Posted by Kris on December 5, 1998, at 18:51:51

In reply to Re: sex, work and a life with depression?, posted by Nancy on December 2, 1998, at 18:32:04

Nancy: I would not say that I was exactly offended, but I was stung by the tone of your post, and especially by the implication that those who are suffering from different and less severe forms of depressive illness are not "really" depressed. I have dysthymia which periodically blossoms into major depression. My sister was bipolar (like you, treatment resistant), and I know how she suffered, and I know that I'm fortunate that the meds work for me, that I have been able to benefit greatly from psychotherapy, and that I have continued to function even when the depression was worse than it is now. But I still have a chronic form of depression; of that I am quite sure. Nobody who has ever experienced depression believes that it is possible to will oneself out of it. Sometimes it is possible to cope and function, sometimes not. But struggling to do so and succeeding does not negate the pain beneath. I can understand your anger but I don't believe that the intensity of your suffering (which I am not questioning) somehow trivializes the experience of those of use who have struggled with less serious forms of illness.

> How can all you people be having sex, going to work, and having a life. My bipolar depression has been both, totally incapacitating and treatment resistive. Except for being in the hospital, I haven't been able to go anywhere or do anything for a year and a half.
> Are all of you sure that you really suffer from depression???
> Mind Over Madness, !>)
> Nancy
> P.S. I hope that I didn't offend anyone by being so open about personal issues.

 

Re: It's NOT possible for one's who really are ill

Posted by Janice on December 5, 1998, at 22:33:58

In reply to Re: It's NOT possible for one's who really are ill, posted by Nancy on December 5, 1998, at 16:36:00

> Janey,
> Do you really believe people with a physical illness like Manic-Depression "crash" out of choice???
Janey only spoke of her own experience with unipolar depression. She made that clear. She wasn't talking a manic depression.

One day, they just get sick and tired of being beautiful, wealthy and successful. So, they decide to have a chemical imbalance as an excuse to dismantle their lives and careers. It's not enough to just feel miserable. They want to be completely, physically incapacited; unable to just lift even an arm off the bed or to open the eyes for days at a time. A time where the body is shut down so far that going to the bathroom is no longer a bodily function. Oh. Sorry. They are CHOOSING to not have this physical function, because they just WANT to CRASH, right, Janey!
People come in all colors, shapes, and sizes. There are high functioning manic depressives, low functioning manic depressives. Some manic depressives are able to have careers, sex, families...it just depends on the severity of the illness. Because high functioning manic depressives are able to function does that mean that they are not really ill? I don't think so.

> Are you always arrogant and self-righteous, or did you not think coherently and logically before you made such callous and preposterous comments.
Janey was only relating her experience with unipolar depression. I don't think she was making a blanket statement for all people with mood disorders. I admire Janey for fighting back against her depression, for doing the best she can with what she has to deal with. Mental illness is not an excuse for not trying; everyone can do something, make some type of contribution. Nancy, what are you doing with your life? I don't think Janey was being arrogant or callous; I think she was just relating to us what she has chosen to do, and she wasn't passing judgment on others who aren't willling or can't do the same.
> The Mad Scientist,
> Nancy
>
> > Nancy,
> > During the worst of my depression (which is
> > revisiting itself now), I was in a day treatment
> > program at a hospital, and getting up everyday was
> > a struggle, but it was either that or be an inpatient.
> > something I NEVER EVER want to do or be again.
> > I have had sex since my depression came on, but
> > with an "old" friend, I'm not ready for a "relationship"
> > yet, whatever the heck that word means anymore.
> > It was nice to see that the parts still worked.
> > If I don't work, I don't eat, have a home, have my
> > pets, and so on. For the past three weeks it's been
> > all I can do to go to work. I was almost grateful
> > for the intestinal virus I have had this week so
> > I had a "real" excuse not to face the world. I
> > have no one to depend on, no one to "let" me crash
> > and burn. The idea of going on public assistance
> > is abhorent to me.
> > It's possible to have a life with this disease.
> > I'm of the unipolar depression variety. I am
> > living though, and I'm getting along. I see my
> > doctor, and I'm doing my "mood logs" again.
> > I take my medicine, I meditate and I pray. I cry
> > and I laugh. I bleed and I heal. I have to.
> > janey

 

Don't even go there

Posted by janey on December 5, 1998, at 22:58:22

In reply to Re: It's NOT possible for one's who really are ill, posted by Nancy on December 5, 1998, at 16:36:00

Nancy,

If you go back to your original note that I responded
to, I quite got the impression that YOU were the
one who thought "we" weren't really "ill" or had
"depression" because "we" (whoever "WE" are?)
managed to go to work, have sex and whatever.

I responded on how I am able to perservere.

NOW, in response to your last note, I can't help but
tell you to kiss my ass. I have never been (and I quote
from your note) been, "beautiful, wealthy and successful."
Frankly, the beauty thing and successful (in relationships anyway),
happen to be two subjects very sensitive to me.

I am an ugly, disgusting human being in appearance.
I barely make $23,000 a year. My medicine costs me
close to $300 a month. When I "crashed and burned"
last November (attempting suicide) and again this
past summer, I was scared to death I was going to
lose my job. I have never, ever taken more than
a week off from work for illness and even that was
rare. When I was hospitalized for gall bladder
surgery last year, I didn't get a raise this year
because of the week I was off, AND I went back to
work before I was released from the surgeon.
My current revisited major depression has got me
scared, too, for job reasons. And I'm a good
employee.

I handle my illness the best I can and I spoke for
myself only. When you speak of "arrogant and self-
righteous .... callous and preposterous comments"
take a look in the mirror first.

janey

 

One last thing

Posted by janey on December 5, 1998, at 23:01:30

In reply to Don't even go there, posted by janey on December 5, 1998, at 22:58:22

And when in the heck, Nancy, did you become the
diagnosis god, deciding who's "really ill" and
who isn't?

j

 

Re: It's possible...

Posted by Victor on December 5, 1998, at 23:55:40

In reply to It's possible..., posted by janey on December 4, 1998, at 21:58:01

> Nancy,
> During the worst of my depression (which is
> revisiting itself now), I was in a day treatment
> program at a hospital, and getting up everyday was
> a struggle, but it was either that or be an inpatient.
> something I NEVER EVER want to do or be again.
> I have had sex since my depression came on, but
> with an "old" friend, I'm not ready for a "relationship"
> yet, whatever the heck that word means anymore.
> It was nice to see that the parts still worked.
> If I don't work, I don't eat, have a home, have my
> pets, and so on. For the past three weeks it's been
> all I can do to go to work. I was almost grateful
> for the intestinal virus I have had this week so
> I had a "real" excuse not to face the world. I
> have no one to depend on, no one to "let" me crash
> and burn. The idea of going on public assistance
> is abhorent to me.
> It's possible to have a life with this disease.
> I'm of the unipolar depression variety. I am
> living though, and I'm getting along. I see my
> doctor, and I'm doing my "mood logs" again.
> I take my medicine, I meditate and I pray. I cry
> and I laugh. I bleed and I heal. I have to.
> janey

Thankyouverymuch Janey!
I needed to "hear" that. I guess the great philosopher was
right. It is all relative.

Love You All

Victor

 

Please be civil

Posted by Dr. Bob on December 6, 1998, at 0:42:18

In reply to Re: It's NOT possible for one's who really are ill, posted by Nancy on December 5, 1998, at 16:36:00

Please, everyone, be civil, no matter how much someone else's post upsets you.

Maybe I should install a button that helps people count to 10. Not that I question anyone's mathematical abilities... :-)

Bob

 

Re: It's possible, unless treatment resistive

Posted by Nancy on December 6, 1998, at 14:15:37

In reply to It's possible..., posted by janey on December 4, 1998, at 21:58:01

> Nancy,
> During the worst of my depression (which is
> revisiting itself now), I was in a day treatment
> program at a hospital, and getting up everyday was
> a struggle, but it was either that or be an inpatient.
> something I NEVER EVER want to do or be again.

**I completely understand your distaste for the inpatient routine. My illness has consistently been diagnosed as Treatment Resistive Bipolar 1 with ultra-rapid cycling, mixed states and psychosis (the type you see in severe mania and severe depression). Although, my doctor is a renowned mood disorder specialist, the type of bipolar illness I've experienced is one of the more difficult to successfully treat. So, I'm familiar with inpatient episodes. I have never wanted to go back, but it happens to some us more often than to others. I hope that you remain free of the hospital.

> I have had sex since my depression came on, but
> with an "old" friend, I'm not ready for a "relationship"
> yet, whatever the heck that word means anymore.
> It was nice to see that the parts still worked.
> If I don't work, I don't eat, have a home, have my
> pets, and so on. For the past three weeks it's been
> all I can do to go to work. I was almost grateful
> for the intestinal virus I have had this week so

***Hold on to everything you can. Not every depressed person, including myself, has been as lucky as you. Like you, however, I have always been driven to be independent and have succeeded. That is until, at the age of 29, when my bipolar illness ceased being a liveable companion.

> I had a "real" excuse not to face the world.

***If you were too ill to function in society with a few days of the flu, then you have an excuse? But, what if you are too ill to function in society, because a biochemical disorder takes you down, then, you are what? Not excused? Punishable? Lazy? Free-loading? Self-destructive? Don't want to be beautiful, wealthy, and successful anymore? Just decided one day that you want to go live on the sidewalk instead of a nice home?
I don't REALLY think that you feel that way. I don't believe that you think anyone would want to lose everything, because of her illness. I don't want to think that you believe everyone who has tried medication gets well. I don't think we have a choice in the matter. A medication either works for you or you go on to the next thing.
Hopefully, the trial and error doesn't go on and on and on...

>I have no one to depend on, no one to "let" me crash
> and burn.

***Thankfully, I'm not a mother or a wife. I don't see how anyone's family can go through all this craziness. So, like you, no one said, "Honey, take some time off until you get well. I'll pay the bills".
I lived off of my stocks investments for the last couple of years. I have been too incapacitated to return to my one-hundred-thousand dollar a year job. But, I still have my convertible corvette.


>The idea of going on public assistance
> is abhorent to me.

***I, too, was disgusted with this option. But, my investments could only hold out so long. So, you can imagine at this point I was REALLY happy about life, right? Yea, RIGHT. Now at this point, I'm still miserably sick, unable to work, and finally, broke. To top that off, I had to get medicaid. So, I could continue seeing a doctor and trying drugs that were supposed to have ALREADY gotten me better. ha. It all makes me laugh. It's comical. I'd tell myself again and again that it can't get any worse. Don't ever say that! ha ha. Because, IT CAN! It REALLY can! ha ha.

> It's possible to have a life with this disease.

***For a long time, I've been nearly bed-ridden. But, this last month, I've been able to sit up at the computer. Also, it's been possible to ride a little bit on the exercise bike. I started Celexa on September 16th, while in the hospital. Since taking the maximum recommended dosage of Celexa, starting November 2nd, I think I'm showing some improvement.
But, the doctor has just recommended ECT (a treatment that he claimed is 95% effective). He said that my illness has gone on too long. Perhaps, after recieving sessions of ECT, that are scheduled in a couple of weeks, my life will be back to normal (minus the time and small fortune I've lost). He said that he has only one other patient that is treatment resistive like me. ECT brought her back into life. She goes once a month to get her ECT session as a maintenance therapy. He thinks that I might have to do that same thing. I've been creeped out about it for a few days. But, I know it's what I have to do.


> I'm of the unipolar depression variety. I am
> living though, and I'm getting along. I see my
> doctor, and I'm doing my "mood logs" again.
> I take my medicine, I meditate and I pray. I cry
> and I laugh. I bleed and I heal. I have to.
> janey

***As long as you're praying, pray that you never become treatment resistive. That's where you don't want to go.
Nancy

 

back to the original question

Posted by emma on December 7, 1998, at 7:21:30

In reply to Re: It's possible, unless treatment resistive, posted by Nancy on December 6, 1998, at 14:15:37

I am just not interested in debating whose illness is
the worst. Unfortunately, there are many types of suffering.

I'll just try to repost the original questions,
which was if there are any females out there who
had total inability to reach orgasm on prozac, zoloft
or paxil and found another anti-depressant or
combination that did not have this side effect
I would really appreciate hearing from you.
Thank you. emma

 

Re: back to the original question

Posted by MrZest on December 8, 1998, at 11:24:30

In reply to back to the original question, posted by emma on December 7, 1998, at 7:21:30

> I am just not interested in debating whose illness is
> the worst. Unfortunately, there are many types of suffering.
> I'll just try to repost the original questions,
> which was if there are any females out there who
> had total inability to reach orgasm on prozac, zoloft
> or paxil and found another anti-depressant or
> combination that did not have this side effect
> I would really appreciate hearing from you.
> Thank you. emma


I hope you will excuse this male interlope into your thread, emma. I just couldn't resist posting a personal opinion about the thread, or more precisely, a couple of it's parts. As payment, I will include my own libido changed experiences with paxil. To wit: the experience I had was that all the plumbing worked beautifully, (I mean that exactly as it sounds, no little blue pills needed, thank you. LOL) But the problem was that it just went on and on and on and on, with no ending possible.
I would get right to the very point where it was supposed to 'end'..... and nothing. If I pushed it at this point, my whole chest and abdomen would clench up. It would become hard to breathe. The longest we tried was a bit more than 4 hours one day, and the third time my chest clenched I almost blacked out. This was too scary and we quit. This was way too frustrating for me and I discontinued the paxil.
Funniest thing is that I was informed of the possible libido side-effect before taking the paxil, and I thought it would not be a problem for me. (You never know what you've got till it's gone. LOL) This is the first I have talked of it 'publicly', not only because of the embarrassment, but because I thought I was 'strange'. I guess I thought they meant I would be able to 'do it', or not, period. With no in-betweens.
OK, so, bottom line, orgasm itself was impossible, but there were no other limits. I also experienced a bit of 'bouncing' from manic to depressive and back. Stronger changes, and faster than normal, but of no consistent pattern.

Now, as for the posts within the string. I don't think that anyone was trying to say that anyone else was 'less sick' than anyone else. I respect and admire anyone willing to write publicly of thier problems/experiences here. I am low to mid functioning bi polar, starting to show itself treatment resistant. In my early 40's. I have been unable to function in any really helpful way for more than 2 years. I look back and I can't even remember what it was that made me able to function back then.

I may be wrong, but I get the sense of two factors in Nancy's responses. 1. 'The bigger they are, the harder they fall.' It sounds like Nancy had a lot farther to fall than many. I have never earned more than 30 thousand a year in my life. When I 'crashed' I was a lot closer to the dirt. The argument could be made that she has had a lot better buffer between her and the bottom, that her fall has probably been less harsh and mine a lot faster. But I think the most important factor is 'in the eye of the beholder'. In the material centered eye of society, she had more to lose than I, for instance. And I think a lot of the anger seen in her response, though misplaced, is to be expected of someone who has lost so much.
Add to that the second factor, 2. 'Pick yourself up by the bootstraps and carry on'. I don't think there's a single person reading this that hasn't heard that from a relative or friend at some time. When I think of all the years I spent masking my problem and doing just that, I wonder why I cannot do that now. If I, in my own shoes, feel somewhere inside me that I should be somehow able to just pick myself up and get on with life, how can I expect anyone outside myself to understand that it just isn't going to happen no matter how much either of us want it to ? I have spent countless hours being frustrated in trying both to understand how I used to be able to do that, and in trying to do it anyway. Putting myself in the shoes of those who care for me, I can understand how they can get so frustrated on thier side of it all. They have seen me living and being responsible for so long, why can't I do it now ? Even the most understanding of the bunch had to admit that although they could understand a chemical imbalance being to blame, they expected me to somehow become back to the same old normal me as before, once I started the meds.
I still find myself getting caught up in this vicious circle all on my own, from time to time. I don't need someone outside myself saying it to bring it on. But I also constantly run into people, even professional people, who expect that of me, whether out loud or by inference. There are some who run on that old protestant work ethic way of thinking, and who think anyone who cannot just do as they do, is being a slacker, a slug and a drain on society. There are those who actually are lazy, they will take the time to 'diagnose' you, and to prescribe meds, thereapy, et al, because that is how they earn a living, but who become tired of 'dealing' with you very quickly. These people want you to pick yourself up, not for your own good, but because they don't want to have to deal with you anymore. And there are those who want you to pick yourself up because they care for you very much and they want the best for you. They want you to be better, but they know there's nothing they can do to get you there. Yet some part of themselves tells them that if they could just somehow support and push you enough, you might just get up and get on with life. This is not usually somthing thought about, but felt. Nevertheless, the result is the same. Also, the result is for us, the patient, cumulative. The result is frustration of our own, and even more frustration at the frustration of those around us. Frustration leads to anger. Nancy is frustrated not only by her loss, but by the bootstrap thing, and is understandably angry. She just hasn't learned to stop letting that anger control her.

My best friend once told me something he said was a zen principle or something. I don't remember the who or when, (the nutshell), but I remember the meat of the nut. Anger always comes from frustration. Frustration comes from wanting something that you can't have. Whether you want that guy in the fast lane to speed up or get over into the slow lane; or you want to get a wage commensurate with your worth at work; or you want that red convertible; or you want to stop being depressed; or you want your sister to stop crying all the time about all her boyfriends. When you find yourself becoming angry, stop for a few minutes. Take time out to think. You are getting angry because you are frustrated. What are you frustrated about ? Take enough time to try and figure out exactly what it is. Once you have figured out what exactly it is that is frustrating you, you need to think about your chances of changing the circumstances, etc to get the results you wanted. If there is no way to do so, (and the chances are nil to none at all if what you want is for someone else to change what they are saying, thinking or doing), then you need to come to grips with it in the only way you can. That is to accept the fact that this is something you can do nothing about, leave it be, and go around it. When it comes to people it's going to mean that you are going to have to just stop being around certain people. For others, you will have to just make up your mind that they are sometimes idiots or assholes, and just ignore them when need be. If you just absolutely want someone to change in some way, find a way to present your argument in an orderly and logical manner, present your best argument, and accept the results whichever way it goes.
It's also possible that you are frustrated because you don't really know what it is you want. Once you have taken the time to figure out the frustrating factor from above, you may find that you have been getting frustrated by not getting something which, when you think about it, you either don't really want, or don't really need like you thought you did. For instance, Nancy, maybe you are angry because of the understandably huge frustration at the expectancy, in yourself, and from around you, for you to somehow pick your chin up and get on with life. Because you haven't faced the frustration yourself, and put it behind you, you see, hear and read all around you that which feeds the frustration. Whether it is there or not. Reading your posts and hers together, I can see where you could come away with the feeling that was what she was saying, even though she didn't say anywhere that you should just get over it, etc. She was simply sharing her own experiences.

No matter what, I think you will find that it is surprisingly empowering when you learn to let something go that you really really want. If you can learn to let ANYTHING go, whether deserved or not, whether paid for or not, (in cash or misery), you can learn to become happy with only yourself. YOU as you are now. The more you become comfortable with who you are now, as opposed to who you used to be, the easier it will become to figure out what is helpful to you, and what works against the best interest of who you are now. And the easier it becomes to let go of things that are not good for you, or good things which the 'getting' of is not good for you.

As I have already said, I have a problem with this bootstrap thing myself. I keep catching myself becoming frustrated before I know it, all on my own, and/or because of outside influences. Over time it has become painfully obvious that I am not going to wake up someday and suddenly be able to cope with all the things I was able to cope with in my twenties. Therefore I am daily working on accepting that fact for and within myself. I am finding that the more I accept it myself, the less it matters what someone else thinks or even says on the subject. I am even learning to accept the fact that there will always be those who will have that chin up attitude. I don't have to take each instance personally. I don't have to educate everyone about the difference between attitudes and chemicals. I don't have to make sure that everyone I come into contact or even conflict with is made aware of the real facts at hand. And I most certainly do NOT have to let myself be frustrated and angry every time the subject surfaces in some way.


Our plight is not an easy one. It is difficult enough on the face of it. Lashing out at those around us only makes it unnecessarily more difficult. If the lashing out goes on long enough it can become not just difficult, but impossible for anyone involved to make any headway. Yourself included. There will always be conflicts enough for us all. Learn to choose your battles instead of letting them choose you. Letting yourself become frustrated over and again about the same things will at best waste your time, and at worst, waste your lifetime.

 

Re: back to clarification, again

Posted by Nancy on December 13, 1998, at 16:57:22

In reply to Re: back to the original question, posted by MrZest on December 8, 1998, at 11:24:30

> > I am just not interested in debating whose illness is
> > the worst.

Read again. There is no debate about severity of illness. Unipolar Depression and Manic Depression are both different and disasterous. Neither of these diseases do I regard trivial. Also, Janey's suffering, like others, is real and not to be taken lightly! I did not wish to minimize anyone's tragedy!

Read it all again very carefully. The problem is with the misconception that many people have. That is, they are ABLE and FUNCTIONING, because "THEY HAVE TO BE" or "CHOOSE TO BE". My anger with careless dogmatic declarations of this DELUSION is reasonable and justified. It was very well stated in your description of those infamous "bootstraps". Bravo.

My losses are inconsequential. I'd gladly give it all to be well and capable again. I have no problem handling success. It's easy for me to achieve many fruits of my labor. You could say that I'm as driven to succeed when I'm well, as I am debilitated when I'm having a severe bipolar episode.

The only fact that remains is, I just don't handle loss of complete control over my life very well in the face of anyone telling ME that I should be ABLE just by WANTING to be. It's a senseless thing to say.

Finally, my recent thoughts on the subjet are that this was NOT what Janey intended to say. That is, I don't believe that Janey was saying that we can make our chemical imbalance less severe by deciding such. I think that via perception through my illness, that this is what I extracted from her post. Also, thank you, MrZest, for letting me know that after my last entry, there was still some lack of clarity regarding this situation.

The Mad Scientist,
Nancy

 

Re: sex, work and a life with depression?

Posted by Elizabeth on December 13, 1998, at 19:44:11

In reply to Re: sex, work and a life with depression?, posted by Nancy on December 2, 1998, at 18:32:04

> How can all you people be having sex, going to work, and having a life. My bipolar depression has been both, totally incapacitating and treatment resistive. Except for being in the hospital, I haven't been able to go anywhere or do anything for a year and a half.
> Are all of you sure that you really suffer from depression???

Nancy, without getting involved in the flaming that has followed :-), let me say that some people are able to carry on their daily activities and enjoy simple pleasures (such as food and sex) to some extent while depressed. They may have "reactive mood," where they are able to be "cheered up" to some extent when good things happen. This does not mean they do not have depressive illness. (They may, indeed, use work, food, sex, etc. as an escape from the despair they feel.)

Hope this explains a little bit.

Elizabeth

 

Re: female sexual dysfunction w/ treatment for depress

Posted by Elizabeth on December 13, 1998, at 19:46:27

In reply to female sexual dysfunction w/ treatment for depress, posted by emma on December 2, 1998, at 13:20:00

Emma, I've never had this problem personally, but people have said that a number of things work for them. One is adding or switching to Wellbutrin. Another is ginkgo biloba. Adding BuSpar or switching to Serzone or Remeron may also help.

Elizabeth

 

Re: back to the original question

Posted by Sarah on December 15, 1998, at 18:24:21

In reply to back to the original question, posted by emma on December 7, 1998, at 7:21:30


In looking for a site where I could find some support and sharing, I was disappointed to find antagonism among fellow sufferers. At risk to my fragile psyche, I will still try to share. I suppose I am fortunate because, though I suffer from deep episodes of clinicl depression, I have a good reason to keep moving through the pain, suffering and tears. That reason is my son who suffers from an incurable disease. I am a single parent. When he is doing well, I have been known to hide under the covers, lethargic and pained. But when needs attention, like an alcholic, I sober up immediately. Amazing but true. I have heard that Winston Churchill was fine during a war, but suffered severe depression during times of peace. It is said that it is a shame he lived so long for he spent the last of his days in deep depression. Anyway, I am also fortunate in that I do respond to antidepressants. I have recently gone off of Zoloft after 2 years because the side effects became intolerable, namely muscle and joint pain. I also operated in a somewhat spacey frame of find. The aches and pains were the worst, especially in my neck and back. I have just started Celexa and am hoping for the best. On Zoloft, I did not experience any sexual dysfunction.


> I am just not interested in debating whose illness is
> the worst. Unfortunately, there are many types of suffering.
> I'll just try to repost the original questions,
> which was if there are any females out there who
> had total inability to reach orgasm on prozac, zoloft
> or paxil and found another anti-depressant or
> combination that did not have this side effect
> I would really appreciate hearing from you.
> Thank you. emma

 

Re: back to the original question

Posted by Mary-Anne on December 17, 1998, at 14:21:02

In reply to Re: back to the original question, posted by Sarah on December 15, 1998, at 18:24:21

Prozac interfered with sleep.
Zoloft interfered with sex.
Wellbutrin worked fine, but I lost my temper
and didn't get housework and paying bills
done well, and still experienced some anxiety.
Wellbutrin plus really low dose Depakote
let me keep my temper, although I still
sometimes felt odd.
Wellbutrin SR worked better than original
Wellbutrin. Did not feel odd as often.
Sex was okay but not nearly as much fun as
when I was younger.
Wellbutrin SR plus low dose Effexor
(I think, now I am unsure if it IS Effexor)
seems to work better for getting housework
done, but I still live in a mess. And my sex
drive seems to be getting stronger, although
still not what it was at age 19 or so.

Your mileage may vary.

 

Re: female sexual dysfunction w/ treatment for depress

Posted by Shelley on December 17, 1998, at 21:24:40

In reply to female sexual dysfunction w/ treatment for depress, posted by emma on December 2, 1998, at 13:20:00

> I'd like to keep this open for the whole month for any
> females out there w/ success stories on switching meds/
> adding meds/ or anything to overcome SSRI-induced
> anorgasmia.

anorgasmia....I did not know there was such a word, but I experienced that for two years! I am currently taking no anti-depressant and no mood stabilizers while I change doctors. It is grinding and painful, up and down, I am surviving but glad to have had a respite from 'anorgasmia', tho' I may have to accept it back into my life soon, as my new doc will probably want me on meds....sigh!! I don't want to belittle anyone. I am a single Mom raising a wildly spirited child. I was devastated by the diagnosis, and even more so in discovering that I too am resistant to treatment. There is no shame in being dependent on the "system" for support. Our illnnesses, collectively, are disabling and dibilitating
We must take help where we can get it. I am determined to live through my entire natural life being "bipolar type one and a half, rapid cycling', sex or no sex. I wish I had some clues for you, Emma.

 

Something helped for me...

Posted by racer on December 26, 1998, at 21:06:48

In reply to back to the original question, posted by emma on December 7, 1998, at 7:21:30

I had orgasmic difficulties on Paxil. I wanted to -- you know, but once started I never finished. Not with a partner, not by myself. (Meantime, the dang Dr was saying, "no, no that's only men." Like the circuitry is different!) After a few months, I bought a vibrator, and some latex sex toys. (Thank heavens you can't see me! I can't believe I'm telling anyone this!) Guess what? Experimenting, especially with things like anal stimulation, all alone, taught me what might work. I did end up bringing it into the relationship I was having then, and it continued to work.

So, even though it's much harder to do, it may still be possible to find a way to orgasm on the nasty pills.

As for anti-depressants that don't do it, I'm on Serzone now and that's not one of the side effects for me... (though there are other drawbacks... aas you may know if you've read anything else I've posted...)

 

THE "BOOTSTRAP" THING

Posted by KATIE on April 22, 1999, at 11:36:24

In reply to Re: back to the original question, posted by MrZest on December 8, 1998, at 11:24:30

> My problem isn't coping w/ the bootstrap thing so much as with the talent thing. All my peers were so disappointed when I threw away my one talent. In thier opinion I just flushed 'em ALL down the toilet. I know better now, tho. I know that with each talent I create another one is added so in actuality I have more talents than I know what to do with in this lifetime. Unfortunately, my peers probably still think I threw away my one and only talent worth keeping. But, hell..if I lived life according to my peers I would have to look at the same horizon every day of my life...and that's pretty damn dull, dont ya think?

> As I have already said, I have a problem with this bootstrap thing myself. I keep catching myself becoming frustrated before I know it, all on my own, and/or because of outside influences. Over time it has become painfully obvious that I am not going to wake up someday and suddenly be able to cope with all the things I was able to cope with in my twenties. Therefore I am daily working on accepting that fact for and within myself. I am finding that the more I accept it myself, the less it matters what someone else thinks or even says on the subject. I am even learning to accept the fact that there will always be those who will have that chin up attitude. I don't have to take each instance personally. I don't have to educate everyone about the difference between attitudes and chemicals. I don't have to make sure that everyone I come into contact or even conflict with is made aware of the real facts at hand. And I most certainly do NOT have to let myself be frustrated and angry every time the subject surfaces in some way.
>
> Our plight is not an easy one. It is difficult enough on the face of it. Lashing out at those around us only makes it unnecessarily more difficult. If the lashing out goes on long enough it can become not just difficult, but impossible for anyone involved to make any headway. Yourself included. There will always be conflicts enough for us all. Learn to choose your battles instead of letting them choose you. Letting yourself become frustrated over and again about the same things will at best waste your time, and at worst, waste your lifetime.


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