Posted by Ken Blades on March 16, 2007, at 0:46:16 [reposted on March 24, 2007, at 22:46:33 | original URL]
In reply to Re: Scientology, Homosexuality, and its tentacles » Ken Blades, posted by Quintal on March 15, 2007, at 16:39:38
>>>> Thank you for the reassurance Ken, but I'm very relaxed about the whole issue - that's why I feel comfortable bringing this stuff up for discussion.<<<<<
If you're that comfortable with this 'stuff',
then there's not much reason to bring it up
for discussion, is there? Unless you just
want to litter the board pointlessly. If
you want to indulge in self-analysis,
you don't have to tell the whole world.
>>>>How would you know what's best for my mental health? It doesn't depress me to hear statements like those made by Hubbard, I find them interesting and liberating.<<<<<<I don't know what's best for your mental health;
I only meant that adherence to what you're
finding interesting and liberating looks IMHO
part of the self-loathing you mention. Hardly
liberating.
>>>>I don't know anyone who has had the sort of upbringing I had and still turned out a normal, well adjusted heterosexual man.<<<<<<
Of course you don't, and neither do I. That's
the point. We only know ourselves and maybe
a very few close friends who share their
personal stories; there are lots of people in the
world, and as they say, there ain't much of
anything new. It is amazing that there is such
a wide variability in the ability of human beings to adapt to/tolerate awful life circumstances; some are seemingly little traumatized while growing up but are nevertheless severely mentally ill and the converse can be true. Your statement is pretty much a non sequitur.
>>>>No, I don't think they do. A lot of the depression and anxiety (particularly social anxiety) homosexual men suffer is directly due to their sexuality and the problems it causes adjusting to society. I'm confused by the results of the Hooker study because it's always been clear that rates of depression and suicide are much higher among gay men than their heterosexual peers. Gay men make up the majority of male mental health consumers as far as I'm aware, and it is always likely to be that way no matter how tolerant society becomes because afterall few people want to be gay, and beneath all the veneer and bluster of Gay Pride self-loathing still runs deep.<<<<<
The depression and anxiety/social anxiety is NOT
due to one's homosexuality...it is due to SOCIETAL/parental response TO it...at least
this seems theoretically possible. There are
plenty of gay men who have endured the same
ridicule/rejection/loathing from family/society
who are anything BUT socially anxious! Rates of
depression and suicide are higher in gay people,
especially teens who have not as yet had time to
accept themselves and reject the negative messages
they receive from the greater society. Given time,
experience and maturity, the drive to suicide is
much less. Not eliminated though, certainly.
Whether it is gay male psychopathology that
makes them the greater proportion of male mental
health consumers has not been proven; 'as far as
you're aware' doesn't quite cut it. Also, 'and it is always likely to be that way no matter how tolerant society becomes' seems like wishful thinking; what sense does it make to think that no matter how tolerant society becomes gay men will
always be the majority of nuts on the couch? If
society no longer puts pressure on gays to change,
judges them as sick or sinful, what would be the
origin of those feelings that you say society
inflicts upon us which drive us to therapy?That 'because afterall few people want to be gay'
goes without saying; most people tend to want to
be like their peers[meaning heterosexual]; if only
because it is generally less difficult a life as
it exists in society at present. Some gay men
may seek psychological or lay counseling in the
quest to be 'normal', but I doubt if the larger
proportion would, especially these days. There are lots of qualities that humans posess that they would like to change that cause them anguish; most
adjust to the reality of the situation.And 'beneath all the veneer and bluster of Gay Pride self-loathing still runs deep' might be
reflective of your own phase on the way to
[hopefully] self-acceptance, but that self-loathing still runs deep in the greater gay community is quite a stretch on your part. 'Veneer and bluster of Gay Pride' is an odd observation.
>>>Again, thank you for the support, but I'm not OK or I wouldn't be here.<<<<<I said you were a nut like the rest of us; if THAT'S ok then you misinterpreted something.
If you consider yourself NOT ok because you
are gay, then you don't belong here but on
a gay crisis board. This board is SUPPOSED to be about medications, not rambling on about your
sexuality, self-loathing and some loony sci-fi
writer's opinions about homosexuality, right?
>>>>>I don't think denial helps solve the problem at all.<<<<<
You're in denial if you think there IS a solution
to the 'problem'!
poster:Ken Blades
thread:743844
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20070322/msgs/743875.html