Posted by Phil on August 26, 2002, at 7:03:50
In reply to Re: maybe this should be on psycho-psycho - ? » Phil, posted by Medusa on August 26, 2002, at 1:00:50
>
>
> > I would have beat that guy to death if I was in the family.
>
> Thanks. Reading this makes me feel better.
>
>
> > What are your sisters feelings about this?
>
> We talked about it some during breaks when I came home from uni, and she used to say things like "I try to remember it's not my fault." She was five!!! at the time of those remarks, three-four when it happened.
>
> We haven't talked about it in the last years. She's almost 17 now. She still talks with the perpetrator, who's still allowed to visit and be alone with the kids. Our youngest sister is 7. Excuse: "he prefers adults." He's almost crashed vehicles with the kids in them. I don't talk with him though, or as little as possible when I can't avoid seeing him. Our father invited him to my wedding - we had a huge blow-out about that.
>
>
> >Has she been to therapy?
>
> No - unless you count the interrogations by our mother, and the sessions with our parents' pastor, in which he decided that the perp was "going through a stage".
>
>>>Oh. This pastor is very dumb. Gee pastor, what happened to ,"Whoever harms one of these, it would be better to have a millstone tied around them and throw them in the sea." Misquoted that one bad but Jesus was pretty clear on this point..don't hurt children because THAT makes me angry.
> >Is she acting out in negative ways?
>
> None obvious. Her confidence is low. She's one of the most intelligent persons I know. I hope she gets out of the patriarch's domain SOON - she's applying to colleges but the Patriarch is intentionally screwing with the financial aid forms so that she doesn't get much need-based grant, and he knows she won't take loans. Have I mentioned I hate the b@stard?
>
>
> >Would she go to a few sessions with you if you
> >thought it would help you?
>
> Yeah, she'd probably do anything for me. She thinks I'm a bit off for taking so much of this on myself.
>
>
> >How angry is she?
>
> No idea. She hates men, that's for sure. My marriage was a huge, huge, huge betrayal for her. She gets along with my DH, and thinks he's a good guy, but says he must be an ogre, if he could convince me to marry. If it would win her respect back, I would divorce (although stay with him) as soon as our papers are worked out. (USA-EU issues)
>
> > Is there any way to bring charges against him
> >at this point?
>
> I doubt it. He was under 18 at the time, it's been over a decade, and everyone would deny it anyway. Social Services threw out a complaint that I filed against my parents (for a later aggravation) merely on my parents' word.
>
>
> >If I had a chance to throw him in prison for a
> >few years, I would do it.
>
> So would I. if I had thug friends and enough money, I'd hire a private prison experience for him.
>
>
> > I know you've been through this in therapy but
> > would you have stopped him if you knew it was
> >happening?
>
> Yeah. I was in her room once when he came in, he didn't see me, and I screamed bloody murder at him when he started talking to her - of course he acted like it was no big deal.
>
>
> > This is a sick person you were dealing with.
>
> Yeah. I just found a letter I wrote to our mother, railing at her for the abuse she doled out on him when he was little. She was pretty cold. He's pretty screwed up.
>>>One big cycle.
>
> >If he has kids now, I wonder what they are
> >living through.
>
> None I'm aware of. One issue I have is whether I have any duty or freedom to tell his eventual fiancee what she's getting into. Not that she would believe me. He's glowing mr nice guy to people he needs.>>>That's a tough call. He will probably attract someone with abuse in their past. Weird how it all works.
>
>
> > John Bradshaw's book, Healing the Shame That Binds You, might be a book for you to read.
>
> Thanks, I'll check it out.
>
>
> > so I had one on one experience with this insanity way too early.
>
> Man, I'm really sorry you had to go through that.Me too. It sucked.
>>>My mom got sober when I was 22 or so and had 19 years sobriety when she passed away in '93. We were best friends and I loved her immensely. She was sick when I was growing up. I was incredibly proud of her beating booze. She was a low bottom drunk and she knew it. She's probably looking down here telling me to stop using her as an example! I've got 2 older brothers and we all miss her tremendously.
>
> > Somewhere inside of me, I've believed that her
> >drinking was my fault.
>
> It's hard not to feel responsible - in our logic, you were the closest party, maybe she loved you the most, if anyone could influence her, it would seem that you could. Not true - but compelling.>>I think being the youngest, she and I were close. She credited me with saving her life twice. That's never really sunk in with me.
>
> >I'm 49 now, never even very close to marriage,
> >not good at seeing to my own needs,
>
> This will sound bad, but good for you for not marrying. I'm sure you'd like a close relationship (not that marrying needs to play in this picture) but there are so many guys out there who take out so much anger against their mothers, and expect women to cater to them, and then throw the women away when it doesn't work out like the perfect mommy they fantasize. When I was single, working in Boston, I felt like a magnet for the oops-I'm-50-and-forgot-to-breed crowd who really believed a 25-year-old would jump at the chance and they'd live forever young. This experience was a big factor in me marrying DH - he's a good guy, but I was just not interested in marrying anyone. But the pressure from him, and the annoyance and predictability of exactly which needy narcissists were going to eye my curves as mommy material, it all got to me. So Phil, although I'm sure it isn't easy or what you want (or you wouldn't have mentioned it) I admire your awareness and the realism that precludes being serially close-to-marriage.>>>I've done the right thing for me.
>
> >I learned to be concerned about others while at the same time, never knowing how to get my needs met.
>
> Dang, can you write a book on solving this and sign a copy for me?
>
>
> > It's hard to get beyond this; for some, it
> >will never really be over.
>
> So how do you reconcile moving on, and living with this, and accepting that it's not going to be over?
>
>>>The key word is acceptance. Then therapy, ACA meetings. Whatever.
> > How would you say your and your sisters
> >relationship is now?
>
> I think we're both afraid. She's tired of being punished for my sins (her appearance and many of her mannerisms remind our parents of me), and the scoldings, "M USED TO DO EXACTLY THAT, YOU'RE SO MUCH LIKE HER!!!" I want to help her get Out of the patriarchy, but she's fiercely independent. Probably better for her in the long run. Her next-older sib is also applying to unis now, and he's going to try to get our father to do _his_ paperwork properly, and submit that to schools where my sis is applying, and try to get her not to submit the screwed up paperwork.
>
> It's weird, our parents haven't figured out that they lose every single kid - they kept having more little ones for a while, but the next-to-youngest is already leaving the fold emotionally, and ... anyway I'm rambling.
>
> Phil, thanks for your input. I find it really helpful and comforting.
>>>>Thanks for letting me ramble.
> M
poster:Phil
thread:29250
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20020820/msgs/29291.html