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Re: Normal Brain vs Abnormal Brain Why?

Posted by cybercafe on October 18, 2003, at 2:00:03

In reply to Re: Normal Brain vs Abnormal Brain Why? cybercafe, posted by mattdds on October 17, 2003, at 18:25:16

> >>i have good reason to believe that about 8/10 pdocs are idiots :) and the other 2 are damn busy.... but all 10 seem quite apathetic
> Is this the result of an objective survey you did? :)

yes :)

> I understand that you weren't calling any particular individual an "idiot", but I have a problem with labels like "idiots", because I don't really know they mean. They fail to accurately describe the problem with a person, therefore depriving the recipient of helpful feedback, and do nothing except make people feel inferior or inadequate.

that's cool.... it's totally understandable that you have a problem with my somewhat offensive claim, and i can only assure you that if i wasn't so strongly convinced that my doctors are morons i wouldn't say so....... example.... would be spending 3 years not getting better because while every visit i mention "doc, i'm pretty sure i'm bipolar" i get told "no you're not" ... someone competent would INVESTIGATE a claim before dismissing it.......... i also spent another 3 years suggesting to doctors that i was suffering from ADD and getting the same run around .... eventually i tried a LOT of caffeine and diagnosed myself........ a LOT of the improvements in my case have come from my research + tips from ASDM, psychobabble etc ............ i have many times said "this doc is an idiot, i need to find someone who knows more about psychiatry - or at least TRD- than me", got myself a new doctor, and been pleasantly surprised that in fact this new doctor knows 100 times more about these disorders than my old doc who for example would say "nobody knows ____" whereas my new doc would explain ____ in detail and save my butt
and then there are the doctors that LIE to me to get me to go away .... yeah perhaps i am a bit annoying with my "hey i'm REALLY depressed, i need an antidepressant" but gee, when someone is really depressed perhaps if you are not an idiot or totally apathetic you would address their problem

but enough ranting.... basically my situation is this

1) doctor gives up on me.. i'm operating at 30%
2) people on the net or VERY CLEAR STANDARD REFERENCES like "the canadian psychiatric association clinical guidelines for depression" or "the american psychiatric association practice guidelines for the treatment of depression" suggest
many many many alternatives
3) i somehow convince my stubborn doc to take this STANDARD treatment and i feel better.... duh!

or how about this

me - "hey buddy i think gabapentin is good for anxiety"
doc - "no it isn't"
doc 2 years later - "i've just come back from a conference, and i heard that gabapentin is good for anxiety... i want you to try it".... THANKS BUDDY you're a genius!

dude i hope my old docs FEEL INFERIOR.... FEEL SOMETHING.... then maybe they will be motivated to care about their patients ... to learn... etc....
i am sick and tired of coming into my docs office and knowing more about xxxxx than he does (note my new doc actually knows MUCH more than me, and i respect that) ... it's ridiculous...

if i know more than a doc in one particular area, i expect that if he has run into a dead end, he will at least
1) take the time to listen to me
2) say "gee this patient managed to educate himself on xxxx and it may be the only thing that can help him.... maybe i should take the time to educate MYSELF on xxx... after all, i'm getting paid $xxx hundred a visit and he gets paid NOTHING" ... hell i may even go to the trouble of printing out official government treatment methods that my doc has not considered........ if he doesn't know them, i would expect him/her to feel responsible to at least read them

> Perhaps the pdoc is just human too, and subject to the same errors you and I are (e.g. frustration, stress, even mental illness) which happens to interfere with *your* immediate goals.

perhaps some are not "idiots" but just very poorly up to date ... and to that i blame apathy... and a total lack of a regulating body ...

> With something as complicated as mental illness, it's too simplistic to just conclude that the reason we don't get better is that the people treating us are "idiots", whatever that means.

yep.... but i'll throw in apathy, time constraints and arrogance and i think that will about cover it :)

> Now that I'm done preaching, apathetic is a bit better. However, if I were a pdoc in practice solely prescribing medications, I would likely get frustrated and apathetic too! In other words, are you so sure you could do a better job?

nope i'm not sure i can do a better job.... but that doesn't mean i'm going to stop pointing out that THE SYSTEM NEEDS FIXING

> Don't get me wrong, I've had my frustrations with psychiatrists, but I feel it's more productive to say things like "X psychiatrist didn't address my chief complaint", or "Y psychiatrist is too heavily influenced by marketing of big pharmaceutical companies". Calling someone an "idiot" does nothing to describe the problem, it just obfuscates it.

how about "inability to absorb pertinent information in a timely manner" or "inability to recognize the obvious"

> Anyhow, I was referring not so much to psychiatrists (clinicians) as the researhers in the fields of neuro and cognitive science. I do believe that there are some very capable people researching the brain.

yeah..... i get off topic easily because it's a subject i feel very passionate about

> But, who knows, maybe I'm just a "moron". LOL.

hey that's cool.... as long as you don't let arrogance or apathy prevent you from vastly improving the quality of a patients life :)




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poster:cybercafe thread:270265