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Re: hanging in there shelliR

Posted by Lorraine on September 26, 2001, at 10:26:56

In reply to Re: hanging in there Lorraine, posted by shelliR on September 24, 2001, at 22:58:07

Hi Shelli:
> My therapist and I try to work on things as basic as organization, both in how I live and in how I work.

Oh, that wouldn't work for me because I have read about 30 books on organization. I know the principles well enough to teach, but not follow, them. Or I follow them half way (I do have the folders):-) I'm trying to get some structure into my life (i know that this is not your issue--so how quickly I learn?) So one of the things that I want to have is a day where I close projects b/c all i want to do is open them--it's my nature.

> > >I am totally focused on the computer so it doesn't bother me, but when I really look I am appalled.

We have dinner parties occassionally--which means that I have to clean up from time to time. Once a friend who had been here for dinner when things were "neat" came to the house and looked at my office and said "is that what the inside of your mind looks like?" It gave me pause.

> > Your pdoc might be able to make your partial response work. I read his article. It sounds so simple and full of hope. Do they really believe what they write or is it just the need to have a strong thesis without words like "I believe" thrown in to muddy it up.
> That's really funny. I think he probably believes what he writes and when things don't work out with someone, it probably breezes right out of his consciousness, so he can keep his theories in tact. Like I think he really didn't anticipate that I would get habituated to the oxy, and he's not sure how to play it yet. Sometimes he's reassuring; other times he sounds like he's quite annoyed that my body didn't do it's job to conform to his plan.

I find that whole thing irritating--sort of the "i live in my world with my books, don't you muck it up with your humanity". I think all doctors should be forced to go through a depression caused by depletion of that enzyme for a spell just to "taste" it.

> > > Also, did you notice how he dismissed MAIOs and tricyclics because of their side effects. As as there aren't a milllion side effects from the other ADs.

To me, it sounded like it wasn't convenient for him to stray from his chosen list that he knows

> > The Ambien is working well for me now.
> I know I've tried Ambien but I don't remember what happened--it was a long time ago.

I like Ambien a lot. I sleep soundly and refreshingly. When I take it with valium (which I don't anymore), I actually dream. Isn't that nice? But I like to wake up with the sleepy head and roll out of bed with the option of drifting off to sleep again.

I think I'm going to ask my pdoc of ten years to give me a copy of all my files. When I asked her last time, she had her nurse practioner go through all my records and write what meds I had tried, when, how much, and why I went off. I can't find those sheets (surprise, surprise), but I think she missed things anyway, (I mean it was ten years). I'd like to see the whole thing and I want a copy, even if I have to pay. I don't think she can refuse in Maryland unless seeing them would create a danger to myself.

This is a really good idea. I have some long term charts that I am creating for myself based on my review of my files. If you'd like and become serious, I'll send you a copy of the file so you can have a template for yours.

> >
> > > > >And it will be in combination with wellbutrin which will help with the tiredness, if the depression lifts. And the oxy might stay if the AD stops me from having to keep going up.
> > Your oxy seems pretty ambitious about assuming a larger part of your life.

I mean it wants to own you by making you ever more dependent. I'm having fun by assuming that the oxy has a will of it's own:-)

> > > > > Have you tried the other MAOs? You had a positive response to one. My pdoc says until you have tried all of the MAOs you haven't tried MAOs--meaning that they are all different.
> > > Well. remember I tried parnate just after you. So there's really just one non-reversible MAOI that I haven't tried.
> > Which one are you thinking of? Marplan? I hadn't compiled a serious list. Somehow I thought there was more on the list than just one or two more.
> I think that's all in the US.

Oh no, that is scarey b/c the Nardil is giving me no mood support, it is making my hyperventilation worse (hence the Neurontin); it is making me sedated. I drop off a cliff in terms of energy about 8 o'clock (so I'm trying to adjust my times). I'm increasing my dose to 45 mg today. I'll see my pdoc next week and we'll see what we think. I'm not real positive. My best response so far was the (don't laugh) Moclobemide, but the anxiety and loss of sleep made me hyperventilate and wake up unrefreshed. Maybe now I could temper that with what? Ambien for sleep. Anxiety, I don't know. Marplan is supposed to be hard to get (limited manufacture).

> > Are you continuing on the neurontin as you build up the nardil?

Hyperventilating has caused me to use the neurontin during the day.

> > > I don't know if that's a good idea to add the adderal yet; it's probably best if you can to see what the nardil exactly does if you can. Why do you want to add the neurontin now? I guess maybe the waiting period is feeling too hard right now?

the waiting period is very trying. i haven't felt this low in a long time. no mood support at all.

> > > > > > >
> > > > I don't understand that. Because you can experience pleasure sometimes, that is a roller coaster? I think of a roller coaster as Bipolar II, which I realize you think you may have, but I don't get the imagine of a roller coaster when you describe your days.

OK. Hard to describe but a bit like ricocheting off of events. I don't begrudge the pleasure. I just "buy into" it and start to believe that it is saying something about what is going on with me when it is not. Hence, is it working. Is it not? All becomes much more muddled. I distrust my sense of my own body and mental state. I walk in and say I feel great. The next day, I'm hitting bottom. Do I change my meds? Are they working? Is this just my pattern?

> > > I didn't really understand how bad your ratio was. But then my bads are worse than your bads, and my ratio is better, so the overall result could be close. (I just realized how competitive that sounded. :-) Really, I am just trying to understand. (I always want to understand. It can drive me and others crazy at times.)

You aren't driving me crazy, just making me think.

> >
Shelli, have you seriously tried drugs?
> No, only the vicodin and now the oxy.
> The life of an addict is not attractive or pleasant. Reality peeks in.
> Okay, the plan is : get high, go to France, have fun and spend all my money; when I become poor and an addict, *then* kill myself. But why not use money and drugs in excess first.
> However. It's only a plan if I decide to kill myself, and that, as we have discussed, is not an option. So it's more like a perverse fantasy.
> Or black humor.

I like black humor. When I was a very young I experimented with enough drugs to know that I do not want anything to do with that way of life.

I'm up to 45 on Nardil now. I'm not optimistic though. We will see. Side effects of hyperventilating are a trial and the lack of mood support does not make this look promising.





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